Baldur's Gate Series

[King_of_GRiffins]

So, whom here has played Baldur's Gate, The Sword Coast, Shadows of Amn, and/or Throne of Bhall? It's one of the best games I've ever played, and was my first role-playing experience. I've been thinking of playing it again, but would be curious if anyone here would like to do the whole campaign as a group. Thoughts?

[ArtifexFelicis]

I have, and I love the series. I'm in the middle of plowing through the Throne of Bhaal right now actually. Yay for special classes that aren't actually in there, but modded in!

It was also one of the first touches with DnD for me, though I didn't know what the hell DnD was until several years later. I loved it because of the sheer control you hjad with everything. Though I will say I ALWAYS went with a fighter or a barbarian or something, simply because after a while nothing worked for the wizard spell list. Or I just went Bounty Hunter and laid out eight bajillion traps abd watched everything die trying to get me. Or conjuration of lots and lots of little monsters. Fun times.

As for a campaign, the idea of being Bhaalspawn might be a very fun one as well. After all, Bhaal was something of a player, and it would be rather fun to play out a "lesser" bhaalspawn happening somewhere else.

How the hell did a bunny rabbit become a werewolf anyway?

[EvilElitest]

I've played them all and along with Planescape, it should be held as the game all other RPGs should drawn inspiration from
from
EE

[King_of_GRiffins]

I have, and I love the series. I'm in the middle of plowing through the Throne of Bhaal right now actually. Yay for special classes that aren't actually in there, but modded in!

It was also one of the first touches with DnD for me, though I didn't know what the hell DnD was until several years later. I loved it because of the sheer control you hjad with everything. Though I will say I ALWAYS went with a fighter or a barbarian or something, simply because after a while nothing worked for the wizard spell list. Or I just went Bounty Hunter and laid out eight bajillion traps abd watched everything die trying to get me. Or conjuration of lots and lots of little monsters. Fun times.

As for a campaign, the idea of being Bhaalspawn might be a very fun one as well. After all, Bhaal was something of a player, and it would be rather fun to play out a "lesser" bhaalspawn happening somewhere else.

How the hell did a bunny rabbit become a werewolf anyway?

Perhaps it was a wolf-were rabbit? Or Rabbit-were wolf? They had stuff like that...

And while the idea of starting a campaign is one thing I'd look forward to, I actually meant starting up BG, getting a few people together, and playing through it's campaign online. :smallredface:

[Cristo Meyers]

Side note: how well do these run on XP? Saw a copy of Baldur's Gate II (I think) at a local resale and thinking about picking it up.

[King_of_GRiffins]

Side note: how well do these run on XP? Saw a copy of Baldur's Gate II (I think) at a local resale and thinking about picking it up.

My desktop has XP and runs it as well as it runs anything else. There shouldn't be anything special you need to do.

[ArtifexFelicis]

Perhaps it was a wolf-were rabbit? Or Rabbit-were wolf? They had stuff like that...

And while the idea of starting a campaign is one thing I'd look forward to, I actually meant starting up BG, getting a few people together, and playing through it's campaign online. :smallredface:

Don't mind me, I enjoy the taste of my own foot.

Still, I love that game. Mostly because you can get so lost in the side quests.

[Pronounceable]

I lost a few years of my life to BG.


How the hell did a bunny rabbit become a werewolf anyway?

I think it was a rabbitwere bitten by a werewolf.


The "bestest evar" in BG is the noob adventurers in Abazigal's lair who attacked Charname. Cute guys.

[Blayze]

My desktop has XP and runs it as well as it runs anything else. There shouldn't be anything special you need to do.

Actually, you might need to turn down the Hardware Acceleration for the graphics and/or sound, depending on how awesome your hardware is.

[Tom_Violence]

Never heard of it.

[Cespenar]

I recently played it on xp as well, and it worked quite nice too.

Anyway, it was a great game with lots of attributes, but what I like most about it is the voice acting. Especially Irenicus'.

[poleboy]

Never heard of it.

Liar.

I love the BG games, but the pseudo-2nd edition D&D rules tick me off when I play it now. Out of combat though, it's still as awesome as ever. Same goes for Torment.

[Cespenar]

It's not very complicated, actually. Assuming you meant this, you subtract the 2nd edition value of ac or thaco from 20 and you find the 3rd edition value.

[Jube]

BG II is the reason I love 2nd edition and can't really like/get 3rd. It's just, tooo good.

That said BG I hasn't aged half as well. Playing the original after playing the second just feels like an exercise in frustration. Better to just start with II and act as though you beat I (ie Give yourself those tomes <.<)

[Prustan]

Clocked BG and Tales of the Sword Coast once with a Paladin, and 'cheated' (saved the Attribute Tomes, and did some creative stuff with importing and exporting characters) to get her to 25 all stats. Got to start her in BG2, then had to leave the computer for 2 years. When I got back, she was gone. Haven't been able to get a character up to Spellhold since.

As for playing online, probably never happen. The Internet connection isn't on my computer.

[Blayze]

BG II is the reason I love 2nd edition and can't really like/get 3rd. It's just, tooo good.

That said BG I hasn't aged half as well. Playing the original after playing the second just feels like an exercise in frustration. Better to just start with II and act as though you beat I (ie Give yourself those tomes <.<)

There's a couple (At least, there were two when I last checked) of mods that let you play through the entire saga with magic ToB-vision. The first is "BGTuTu" and the other is "Baldur's Gate Trilogy".

[Cristo Meyers]

Well, just picked up a collector's set that has Shadows of Amn and Throne of Bhaal. Now I just need to actually finish Jade Empire and I can finally get in with all the cool kids...

[King_of_GRiffins]

I've recently booted up the 1st of the series, and I'm going to play through it on Insane (Monster have double health and do double damage). Wish me luck! :smallbiggrin:

If anyone is still interested in playing through Shadows of Amn and Throne of Bhall as a group, please send me a PM.

[SolkaTruesilver]

Hmm.. if I remember right, the best main class choice for BG2 is Rogue, since there isn't any full-fledged rogue in the game, right?

How do you feel, people, about the Rogue's quests? I always felt they were.. uncomplete..

[King_of_GRiffins]

Hmm.. if I remember right, the best main class choice for BG2 is Rogue, since there isn't any full-fledged rogue in the game, right?

How do you feel, people, about the Rogue's quests? I always felt they were.. uncomplete..

I believe Yoshimo was a Bounty Hunter, a subset of rouge, but I don't recall there be any true rogues running about. I've rather forgotten what the rouges quest was. I remember the planar spheres and the keep, but that's that.

[Nerd-o-rama]

Played it a while back, and recently restarted it with the BG TuTu "ToB-vision" mod for BG1, mentioned above (getting to play with Kits in BG1 = awesome. BG2-style weapon proficiencies = not so awesome, but that may actually be from a different mod, I forget).

Anyway, BG2 doesn't really have a best main-character class, since all needed archetypes are pretty well-represented by NPCs. Thieves are rare, but you only need-need low-level thief abilities, which can be got from Yoshimo, Imoen, and/or Nalia with ease.

I can guarantee that at least two of these are always available at a given time...

The traditional "overpowered" setup, and the one I used on my original playthrough, is a human Kensai (unarmored fighter with spiffy bonuses) dual-classed to Mage at level 7 or 9. Lots of damage, lots of utility, nigh-unhittable, and helpful, because you need high-end mage spells and probably want two mages in your group. Dual-classing is a moderate hassle, though.

And the Rogue stronghold is a branch of the Shadow Thieves guild, actually.

[EvilElitest]

Well, just picked up a collector's set that has Shadows of Amn and Throne of Bhaal. Now I just need to actually finish Jade Empire and I can finally get in with all the cool kids...

OH i love Jade Empire,Bioware is a great company
from
EE

[SurlySeraph]

Baldur's Gate II is approximately the best game in the history of games. And I can't find my damn CDs for it anywhere...

[SmartAlec]

BG2 also had Jan Jansen, who amongst his many talents was a first-class trapfinder and lockpicker (a dualclassed Thief/Illusionist). Capable of unlocking or disarming almost anything you'll encounter. Opens everything in the Thieves' Guild with ease, even at Level 10-or-below.

Only way you'd be forced to be a Thief was if you were planning an all-evil characters party; with only 3 evil characters available at the beginning (a Fighter, a Wizard and a Cleric), they were a bit short on sneakiness. I do recommend that for advanced players, however - the Evil characters make up for their limiting specialisation by being first-class examples of their chosen classes, and the Us-against-the-World camaraderie of the Evil characters is surprisingly cool, especially as many good characters don't get on. Despite their radical differences in temperament, the Evil characters are professionals and don't let it get in the way of causing mayhem as a team in the name of personal gain or profit.

[BooTheHamster]

I have all three games, and they're really the entire reason I even know about D&D. The interface is really easy to use, as well, unlike NWN's which was just counter-intuitive. And I love the art in it. Graphically, I personally think it looked way better than the NWN's 3D, which looked choppy and crude.

Frankly, I can't stand 3rd edition rules after playing the Baldur's Gate series. I played Neverwinter Nights and just HAD to cheat because I couldn't make sense of anything in it. Too many darned skills and messy point distributions, and damage reduction(I hate that so much) and spell resistance... grr... And I miss THAC0.

Probably the best thing about these games are the character interactions. The NPC's are funny and have amazing voice actors(Minsc and Edwin are my personal favorites). The story is also really well paced and thought out, and really made me feel like I was in another little universe as my character. I'm also a huge fan of the NPC romances because they give the game a more complete, realistic feel. I've had the games for about 5 years and never get tired of playing.

The level and spell progression is amazing as well. Irenicus becomes a joke once those 9th level spells and HLAs come into play... Heh... First time through, though... not so much funny when he's killed 3 of your party members (the mages, no less), and his protections wont wear off.

I personally like playing as an Inquisitor Paladin the most for BG2, simply because he can use one of the best weapons available, has excellent magic resistance and anti-mage bonuses, and makes for a good enough back-up fighter. It's also a perfect choice for taking out mages, which are honestly overpowered against low-level PCs. Plus, I really like being a Paladin. I've also played a Kensai, straight Kensai without dualing to mage, and, to be honest, that thing is a freaking death machine when used properly. I had him dual-wielding Crom Faeyr and Adjadtha the Drinker, and usually didn't even need to my party. I mean, sure, spell-casting is a nice bonus, but there are so many NPCs that can take care of that, and too many good weapons to pass up. Currently, I'm playing a fighter/mage multiclass because I've never been an arcane caster before, but I really didn't want to give up being able to just kill baddies with the good weapons. He's mostly an archer and spellcaster, but I put him in the fray with Crom Faeyr pretty often.

I will admit, however, that I have modded the hell out of BG2 and ToB after the 500th time playing through. As if it didn't already have a million side-quests, right? There are alot of good mods out there, too, so I'm working my way through those at the moment.

[SurlySeraph]

Despite their radical differences in temperament, the Evil characters are professionals and don't let it get in the way of causing mayhem as a team in the name of personal gain or profit.

Except when Viconia says she wanted to push Korgan off the boat while he was vomiting, or when Edwin mutters about how much he hates those imbeciles, or when Korgan threatens to gut everyone, or when Korgan gives that memorable speech about burning down Viconia's house and relieving himself on the embers, or when Korgan...

[Shikton]

Except when Viconia says she wanted to push Korgan off the boat while he was vomiting, or when Edwin mutters about how much he hates those imbeciles, or when Korgan threatens to gut everyone, or when Korgan gives that memorable speech about burning down Viconia's house and relieving himself on the embers, or when Korgan...

Ah yes, the evil party is fun :D I like tossing Jan in there too, just for laughs. He's got the most awesome dialogues in the game imo.

[Pronounceable]

Towards the end, the most obscenely powerful class is the thief. One word: Use Any Item (OK, that's 3 words). Wield Crom Faeyr and any most damaging other weapon, drink haste potion, activate Assasination HLA. Not much can conceivably live after one round of pounding, especially for an assasin. Wield Staff of Magi every few seconds to eliminate the need for invisibility spells/potions. Wear the cloak of magic immunity (from Sahuagin city) and laugh at high level mages. Wear stuff untill more than half of your character portrait on rooster is obscured with various status effects...

I got all the way to final fight on insane with a solo assasin. Only reason I couldn't finish the game was because Ascension's (a mod that increases the final ToB fight to over 9000) difficulty adjusts with game difficulty First, Irenicus and Bodhi plus TWO fallen solars. Then 3 hordes of über demons from the pools. Then the whole Five at once. When you drop one or two, Melissan (who's literally invincible) joins in. Gotta drop the Five (repeatedly) to weaken her to the point of defeatablility. She occasionally resurrects the ones you drop, which weakens her. I *could* finish on normal though. Fear the power of assasin kit.

Theoretically, being a fighter/thief and activating Greater Whirlwind and Assasination at the same time can lead to unparalleled destruction. But I haven't tried it. Optimization with dualling a kensai into thief will probably create the überest close combatant. Shame you can't be kensai/assasin.

[Archonic Energy]

Baldur's Gate II is approximately the best game in the history of games. And I can't find my damn CDs for it anywhere...

*waves DVD at screen tauntingly*

I've got mine :smallamused:

i really should play an evil PC...

[SmartAlec]

Except when Viconia says she wanted to push Korgan off the boat while he was vomiting, or when Edwin mutters about how much he hates those imbeciles, or when Korgan threatens to gut everyone, or when Korgan gives that memorable speech about burning down Viconia's house and relieving himself on the embers, or when Korgan...

Ah, but they never actually do it. Each one is prepared to put up, shut up, and continue through the game in the company of the other two. Considering the kind of people we're dealing with here, that's an amazing display of team spirit. Viconia, especially, is not afraid to start fights with party members she doesn't like - Keldorn (thinks he's a git), Valygar (claims he's gay), Aerie (hates little mice like her)... all that 'Gods I hate everyone in this party' trash talk is just part of being an evil character, and I think each of them knows it well enough not to start anything.

[Tengu]

Baldur's Gate was a milestone in the history of western RPGs that... didn't age very well.

Baldur's Gate 2 is a very good game with an interesting BBEG, good plot and gameplay (although some fights can get tedious) and a cast of some memorable characters, several boring ones and a few really irritating ones. I prefer jRPGs and Torment though, as they generally bear a lot more emotional impact on you.

[Triaxx]

Crom Faeyr with a Thief? Bah. Play an Assassin, and use the +6 Staff of the Ram. It's a single class thief weapon. Which means it's eligible for Backstab. Assassin has an x7 multiplier. The 2e version of a smite button.

[H. Zee]

I must be the only person in the entire universe who preferred BG1 to BG2, although only just - I thought both were bloody brilliant. Best games ever. Except Planescape: Torment, of course.

I usually like to play a big ol' Half-Elf Fighter in BG1, with party members Edwin, Minsc, Viconia, Coran and Kivan.

In BG2, I like to go for a Human Kensai/Mage, with Minsc, Viconia, Edwin, Imoen/Yoshimo, and Mazzy. In Throne of Bhaal, I replace Mazzy with (warning: spoiler!) Sarevok. Though I like to have all characters in my party at some point or other, so I can see the various interactions and sub-plots they have, these are usually the 'permanent' ones.

[Morty]

Ah, good ol' Baldur's Gate. I played Shadows of Amn several times, althout I finished it only once. But I had loads of fun every time. My "main" character has been Human Sorcerer at the first attempt, then Half-Elf Mage for the second two, second one succeeding. I also tried a Human Kensai and Halfling Swashbuckler, both being Evil. Unfortunaetly, playing an Evil character is hard because of the trouble with gathering your party members, not to mention that being evil in BG equals being bloodthirsty maniac most of the time.
The party I finished the game with consisted of my character, Minsc, Mazzy, Keldorn, Aerie and Jan Jansen later replaced with Imoen.

[Triaxx]

Mazzy is infinitely superior to Captain Cranky. I loved BG 1, it was fantastic. I preferred to wander around the world before going on though, and I can recall being level 7 before even starting the first mines.

[Wraith]

It still makes me giggle, every single time I get to the Final Battle in Hell and kill Irenicus in about 10 seconds.

Time Stop + Shapechange (Mindflayer). Is there anything you can't achieve? :smallbiggrin:And then there's 'accidentally' disintegrating a Dragon. That was fun...

Ah, I love BGII - I've played it so much it almost cost me a year of University, I got so little else done :smallredface:
I don't suppose anyone here has access to a Mazzie-Romance Mod, do they? I have one for just about everyone but her and Minsc, and I'd really like to complete the collection!

[Mr. Scaly]

Hehe. Let's just say that Jon Irenicus is one of the two reasons why I always play a caster of some kind in my games.

[Om]

Baldur's Gate was a milestone in the history of western RPGs that... didn't age very wellThe game engine didn't but you can actually use a mod to play BGI with the sequel's engine. Personally I find the original game to be superior, particularly with regards to the plot

[SolkaTruesilver]

Hmm.. I think I will start a new evil party, with a thief..

but I am hesitating between an assassin or a bounty hunter..

also, I wonder what race to take? Elf? Half-Elf? Half-Orc? I won't dual- or multi-class, so I won't bother with human. Half-Orc sounds nice for the damage bonus.. hehe..

[Tam_OConnor]

Be a traditionalist. Half-orc assassin all the way.

I haven't seen a Mazzy romance mod. The Imoen romance mod was so terrifying I stopped looking for them. I mean: ewww. But if you want a Mazzy mod, this (http://www.sorcerers.net/Games/BG2/index.php) is probably the best place to get it. At least as an index.

[SolkaTruesilver]

Half-Orc assassin? All right. thanks for the tip.

I will take the romance with viconia. I downloaded the fix batch from baldurdash, and it allows Half-Orc/Vico romances. Here comes the Quarter-Orc/Quarter-Human/Half-Drow baby!!!

[Jube]

Be a traditionalist. Half-orc assassin all the way.

I haven't seen a Mazzy romance mod. The Imoen romance mod was so terrifying I stopped looking for them. I mean: ewww. But if you want a Mazzy mod, this (http://www.sorcerers.net/Games/BG2/index.php) is probably the best place to get it. At least as an index.

The Imoen relationship mod really irked me. There was another mod coming out at the time that I don't know if ever completed but it was meant to completely expand upon your options with Imoen.Basically a Banter pack that spiralled wildly and awesomely outt'a control. I know the author didn't originally intend to add romance but since it was requested he added it as a possible natural progression (Optional being the most important part).

Anyhow so that was being worked on and in the way of the modding community it sounds good so you assume it'll never actually happen. In the meantime the Imoen relationship mod comes out, has some really bad tropes some annoying writing and a few really good ideas that weren't implemented well.

It's a shame really, it could make for quite an interesting tale. More importantly it irks me the people that seem to assume Irenicus raped Imoen, I mean it's possible but it doesn't seem like it'd add anything, he was so busy with psychological torture it seems wierd to have him do something so base that wouldn't even help... Bhaal was the lord of Death/Murder not sex afterall, It's so pointless. Plus turning Imoen into the Slayer is well, utterly retarded, least imo.

Anyhow the Nalia relationship mod amuses me but I still prefer just the basic Jaheria/Viconia.



The game engine didn't but you can actually use a mod to play BGI with the sequel's engine. Personally I find the original game to be superior, particularly with regards to the plot


Completely disagree. I found the twists in the first one too predictable and the story didn't really go anywhere, add on a completely unbalanced last boss and meh. The bit when you had no choice but to fall into a ridiculously obvious trap (with a Wis of 18... QQ) really put me off. Saverok just didn't do for me what Irenicus did I guess, I HATED Irenicus. Was great.

I adored the epic feel of 2. The plot had suspense and mystery, Irenicus was always one step ahead, so cocky and so vague. He didn't reveal his master plan you had to go all over the world uncovering it, little by little. Reaching epic levels, destroying his ambitions and laughing in his face as you dragged him to hell to finish him for good was the icing on a very sweet cake.

Then in ToB, not quite as good a story but it's so fun being so ungodly powerfull. Especially the part where you get to give out quests rather than just being someone's patsy (Plus it's nice that fame and fear has spread ahead of you, you really do feel like an entity shaping the world).

I guess what I'm trying to say is BG1 annoyed the everloving spit outt'a me with traps that'd kill half my party in one hit and no way to ****ing ressurect till way way too late in the game.

Walking, detecting traps.
TRAP SPRUNG 3 PEOPLE DEAD
*Reload*
Walking, detecting traps....... Finally find it. Disarm
Repeat forever.

God that needed to be ****ing toned down.

[Triaxx]

Main quest? Who bothered with the main quest until everything else was finished? The map was packed with places to go, people to talk to, and wilderness to wander. And if you wanted to be strong enough to face the final fight, you needed the items and experience the wandering afforded you.

BG2 stripped that all out, and just afforded considerably larger rewards for the quests. As a level appropriate encounter, the dragon cave is about on par with the mines from the first game. But the experience reward is out of wack.

[Om]

Irenicus was always one step ahead, so cocky and so vague. He didn't reveal his master plan you had to go all over the world uncovering it, little by littleSee, this is what I hated about Irenicus - he was almost completely tangential to the game. He'd drop in every now and again to lead you to another chase/area but all in all he had very little screen time for a the primary villain. Honestly I didn't have any real feelings towards him

In contrast Sarevok, despite his early nameless cameo, isn't revealed until the late game but discovering his identity was always the primary purpose of the plot. Slowly traversing the coast and unravelling the layers of the conspiracy/plot is handled very well. I found Sarevok to be the far more menacing/dangerous character, in comparison to Irenicus, despite almost all his interaction with the PC occurring through proxies and lieutenants

[SolkaTruesilver]

BG2 stripped that all out, and just afforded considerably larger rewards for the quests. As a level appropriate encounter, the dragon cave is about on par with the mines from the first game. But the experience reward is out of wack.

I am sorry to contradict you outright, but the quality of side-quests in BG2 is simply superior on all terms of those in BG1! Dragon, temples of the Sun, Harpers, Druids, Trademeet, Blinded Cult, Thiefs, Planar Prison, Planar Sphere, etc...

A DROW CITY!!!

[King_of_GRiffins]

I guess what I'm trying to say is BG1 annoyed the everloving spit outt'a me with traps that'd kill half my party in one hit and no way to ****ing ressurect till way way too late in the game.


Actually, most temples offered ressurection for 200 gold. Playing on Insane, I find that quite handy post-party explosive death :smallbiggrin:

[Triaxx]

I nevery said the quests weren't awesome, but the map felt compressed. There wasn't much exploration involved.

[SolkaTruesilver]

Agreed, but on the other hand, I didn't had to stumble for 25 minutes on everymap to find what I was looking for. I always felt that BG1's maps were way too big..

[Triaxx]

I had the opposite thought. I wanted BG1's maps to be bigger still. And finding things? That wasn't hard, once you realized Clarivoyance worked underground as well as above it.

Pity they fixed that in BG2.

[SurlySeraph]

Be a traditionalist. Half-orc assassin all the way.

I haven't seen a Mazzy romance mod. The Imoen romance mod was so terrifying I stopped looking for them. I mean: ewww.

Were you aware that there is a (ToB spoiler) Sarevok romance mod?

[SmartAlec]

The game engine didn't but you can actually use a mod to play BGI with the sequel's engine. Personally I find the original game to be superior, particularly with regards to the plot

There are also supplementary mods to this; one to allow you to keep the look of the BG1 interface, and another (the BG1 NPC Project) to give BG1 a similar level of inter-party banter that BG2 had.

[Quxelopqr]

I'm thinking of playing these games and my main question is this: Should I start with the first one? A friend of mine said I should start with the second so I got confused.

Also, are the games hard to find? I remember somewhere hearing that they were.

[Jube]

Actually, most temples offered ressurection for 200 gold. Playing on Insane, I find that quite handy post-party explosive death :smallbiggrin:

Yeah. So my choices are, Drag my party back to a town/temple to res anytime I even think about getting near a Trap which one hits half my goddamn party.

Or Reload. Breaking immersion but only losing about 10seconds.

Yeaahh... BG I was Quicksave every 10sec, Quickload every 30. The traps were retarded and some of the enemies horribly unbalanced (I'm looking at you Sarevok and Fireball arrows).


I nevery said the quests weren't awesome, but the map felt compressed. There wasn't much exploration involved.

Not as many pointless filler zones sure (They kind'a implemented them with the meaningless "You have been waylayed and must defend yourself") but Exploration? Far far more.

Instead of just traipsing 'round the countryside you go to a deserted Island, you sink beneath the waves to a sunken city, you freaking go to the Underdark and the hidden city of the Elves. Hell the final battle takes place in Hell >.>


I had the opposite thought. I wanted BG1's maps to be bigger still. And finding things? That wasn't hard, once you realized Clarivoyance worked underground as well as above it.

Pity they fixed that in BG2.

Honestly even BG II annoyed me with finding things, I LOVED that in ToB you could just press Tab and see everything you could select. Saved pixel hunting and didn't really ruin any secret areas. Finding stuff in PS:T, BG I or even BG II could at times be a huge exercise in frustration (Depending where they died).

I think the maps thing is just a personal preference though, I found the getting from A -> D through A -> B -> C -> D when B and C literally had NOTHING but a few weak enemies endlessly frustrating. This was only made worse since I'd played 2 and ToB (Holy awesome, teleporting) and was used to the streamlined transportation.


I'm thinking of playing these games and my main question is this: Should I start with the first one? A friend of mine said I should start with the second so I got confused.

Also, are the games hard to find? I remember somewhere hearing that they were.

The first one has aged a LOT over the years. I started with the second and you miss almost nothing. Chances are if you've read much about BG II then you already know the shocking/awesome twist from I and who the final boss is (Which is meant to be a secret/twist too).

There's a few cameos from the first game but they mostly kill off a huge portion of 1's cast (Those that return at least). There is a slight advantage to playing 1 though

Your main character will be slightly more powerful if you run through I and import to II than if you make one in II because he can get Tomes in I that give +Stat boosts above what you could create by rolling stats.

The problem is, there's very few classes in I compared to II and no kits. So, if you're not gonna play a Mage or a Paladin there's no point in playing I. Your character will be a LOT weaker, the Kits in II are awesome. (Thief has subclasses, Fighter has subclasses, Mage/Paladin subclasses suck though).

So! I'd reccomend playing II first and if you like it playing I -> II -> ToB/III
If you start with I

Choose a class -> Get as many tomes as possible ONLY GIVE THEM TO YOUR MAIN CHARACTER. EVERYONE ELSE LOSES THEM -> Import -> Use Shadowkeeper to Edit your character to become whatever kit you'd like to be in II.

Afterall Cleric of Talos > Cleric. Assasin > Thief and Kensai > Fighter.

EDIT: I might be hard to find II and ToB are easy though.

[Prustan]

Never having my Paladin holding (let alone using) a bow, I found the Cavalier kit absolutely awesome. A bunch of bonuses, and she can't use ranged weapons - who cares? Kensai is about the only other kit I've used - though Wild Mage has so much potential...

[SolkaTruesilver]

Well, I'm playing an assassin right now. Huge Hide in Shadow + Move silently is really fun so far. And the poison weapon ability is really useful with, let's say, a Tuigan Short Bow (3 shot/round, 4 rounds of poison. Make the math)

The Wizards/clerics are completely incapacitated by the constant poison flow :smallcool:

I can't wait to x7 Backstab + Assassination..

[Cespenar]

Never having my Paladin holding (let alone using) a bow, I found the Cavalier kit absolutely awesome. A bunch of bonuses, and she can't use ranged weapons - who cares? Kensai is about the only other kit I've used - though Wild Mage has so much potential...

I agree with the Cavalier kit. In one game I went with a trio of "holy men", namely the main character as a Cavalier, Anomen, and Keldorn. Surprisingly, it was even easier than the time I went with a 6 men band with the main char as a Kensai/Mage.


Well, I'm playing an assassin right now. Huge Hide in Shadow + Move silently is really fun so far. And the poison weapon ability is really useful with, let's say, a Tuigan Short Bow (3 shot/round, 4 rounds of poison. Make the math)

The Wizards/clerics are completely incapacitated by the constant poison flow

I can't wait to x7 Backstab + Assassination..

That's one little flaw I find in this game. No matter what class you pick, you somehow rock. I even tried soloing with a Fighter/Mage/Thief, and found the difficulty increasing only to what I call average.

On the other hand, mods like Tactics seem to get this idea from the wrong end, and try to compensate with cheap buffs that doesn't make much sense (though I like Ascension and the Improved X mods).

[SolkaTruesilver]

That's one little flaw I find in this game. No matter what class you pick, you somehow rock. I even tried soloing with a Fighter/Mage/Thief, and found the difficulty increasing only to what I call average.

On the other hand, mods like Tactics seem to get this idea from the wrong end, and try to compensate with cheap buffs that doesn't make much sense (though I like Ascension and the Improved X mods).

I have to admit I have read a lot of things about rogues in BG2 in order to make it worthwhile. And also, don'T worry: my character is still a ***** that can't take 2 hits without backing off. That's why Kurgan/Valygars are always close to take the brunt of whatever problems I might have.

I just solo-ed the Sewer mage that kept Haer-Dalis as a slave. But I needed, like, +40 move silenty/hide items to pull it off, and Edwin to cast haste at me. I had to sneak-attack, leave, re-hide while I am behind closed door, rinse and repeat. The guy had Stoneskin (never seen more annoying spell), so I had to do about 300 damage to him before he too 1 real hit. But when he took 1 real hit, he died about instantly. Pure Joy!!!

[Siosilvar]

I absolutely LOVE the Baldur's Gate series. Unfortunately, I have BG1 for Macintosh and my BG2 Disk 2 is scratched to the point where I can no longer equip weapons without crashing the game.
Sadly, this means I can no longer enjoy everyone's favorite ranger and miniature giant space hamster.

[Blayze]

Ah, the Cavalier. One of several simple classes. Along with the Swashbuckler, the Berserker, the Barbarian, the Shapeshifter (If I remember correctly) and the Wild Mage (Just point him in the direction of the enemy and watch bad stuff happen - to everybody), the Cavalier has benefits without real penalties.

Huh. I might try that group next. The Berserker and Barbarian are there for pure combat, the Shapeshifter and Cavalier for combat and Divine spellcasting, the Wild Mage for pure Arcane - and for the laughs - and the Swashbuckler for Thief skills and combat.


That's one little flaw I find in this game. No matter what class you pick, you somehow rock.

I... don't see how that can be a problem. Surely the whole point of the game *is* to rock. :P Hell, try a solo Jester run if you're that tired of rocking. ;)

[Pronounceable]

I find the less party members mean easier gameplay, especially on very tough battles (like the various mods). I had quite a lot of trouble with Improved Bodhi using my party of 6, but got her easily one on one. And less members mean faster levels. Soloing gets you ToB abilities before you finish Ch2, which means the majority of the game is cakewalk.



I just solo-ed the Sewer mage that kept Haer-Dalis as a slave. But I needed, like, +40 move silenty/hide items to pull it off, and Edwin to cast haste at me. I had to sneak-attack, leave, re-hide while I am behind closed door, rinse and repeat. The guy had Stoneskin (never seen more annoying spell), so I had to do about 300 damage to him before he too 1 real hit. But when he took 1 real hit, he died about instantly. Pure Joy!!!

Assasin is awesome. If you really like that kind of gameplay (and mildly sadomasochistic), I suggest you try soloing. It's awesome. Taking on a group of tough enemies (like the damned Twisted Rune) is so much fun.

Not to mention the gibbing of scary things (like vampires and greater wolfweres) with a crit.

And flay them pesky mages with bows. Stand at the edge of visibility, click once on the mage. The moment you see attack roll in lower window run a pixel back and rehide. They won't see you 9/10. Even if they see you shooting (window says enemy attacking or even better casting), you'll hide in a moment and they'll blithely come stand where you were (or even better waste a spell). If that happens with the shot that finally removes stoneskin, you won't even have to walk up to them to stab them in the kidneys. That is what may be termed pure joy.

Wait till you get Use Any Item and the Staff of Magi (unlimited instant invisibility FTW!). Equip SoM for a moment, then equip Celestial Fury (and dual Crom Faeyr from inventory) and immediately Sneak Attack Bitch! The moment you see attack roll in the window reequip SoM. I said, Sneak Attack Bitch!

And assasin poison (thanks to an oversight on programmers' part) works on the nigh invulnerable adamantine golems. Keep it in mind.

[SolkaTruesilver]

Wait till you get Use Any Item and the Staff of Magi (unlimited instant invisibility FTW!). Equip SoM for a moment, then equip Celestial Fury (and dual Crom Faeyr from inventory) and immediately Sneak Attack Bitch! The moment you see attack roll in the window reequip SoM. I said, Sneak Attack Bitch!

And assasin poison (thanks to an oversight on programmers' part) works on the nigh invulnerable adamantine golems. Keep it in mind.

I always tought trapping my way to victory for the golem..

Anyway, I'm not... sure I understood 100% what you said. I dual-weild Crom Faeyr (25 str is understandable). Then, why equip SoM for a moment? then why equip Celestial Fury?

[Driderman]

I absolutely LOVE the Baldur's Gate series. Unfortunately, I have BG1 for Macintosh and my BG2 Disk 2 is scratched to the point where I can no longer equip weapons without crashing the game.
Sadly, this means I can no longer enjoy everyone's favorite ranger and miniature giant space hamster.

You ought to be able to worK around that problem pretty easily, if I remember correctly. You can simply copy the contents of all CDs to your hard drive and edit the config file or somesuch to read from the HD rather than the disk drive. Of course, you'll have to be able to copy from the disks but that might be possible if you're able to install.
Of course, I'm of the persuasion that if you bought it and broke it, it's alright to download it from the net since you already paid for it...

[Inhuman Bot]

Hey, anyone think it might work on vista? I used to have a copy, and There's one at my local game shop, so...

[Pronounceable]

Nope, adamantine golems are immune to everything except +5 or higher weapons. And they take about 2 damage per hit from a +5 weapon. Even the monstrous spike traps deal dishearteningly small damage AFAIR.

SoM grants invisibility upon equipping. One such dose of invisibility lasts 6 more seconds after you unequip SoM (instantly reequipping SoM every time invisibility is dispelled makes you immune to True Sight as well). And Celestial Fury has the highest base damage in backstabbable blades. Offhanded Crom Faeyr's 25 str is (I think) +14 damage, so you deal 1d10+17 per hit. Which translates to 7d10+119 on backstab (14d10+238 on a backcrit).

Combining it with a haste potion and the other all important HLA "Assasination", plus being a sneaky bastard and pausing the game after each attack roll to switch the weapons, you may get 4 or 5 consecutive backstabs off with Celestial Fury. Things will die faster than you can say 28d10+479 damage per round.


I absolutely LOVE the Baldur's Gate series. Unfortunately, I have BG1 for Macintosh and my BG2 Disk 2 is scratched to the point where I can no longer equip weapons without crashing the game.

The only disc you need to run either BG is disc1. The rest can be copied into HD and modifying directory paths baldur.ini will solve scratched disc problems assuming they can be copied.

It's also possible that I'm wrong and the necessary disc is actually disc2. In that case, you need to get it off the net (or from someone you know).

[SolkaTruesilver]

Nope, adamantine golems are immune to everything except +5 or higher weapons. And they take about 2 damage per hit from a +5 weapon. Even the monstrous spike traps deal dishearteningly small damage AFAIR.

SoM grants invisibility upon equipping. One such dose of invisibility lasts 6 more seconds after you unequip SoM (instantly reequipping SoM every time invisibility is dispelled makes you immune to True Sight as well). And Celestial Fury has the highest base damage in backstabbable blades. Offhanded Crom Faeyr's 25 str is (I think) +14 damage, so you deal 1d10+17 per hit. Which translates to 7d10+119 on backstab (14d10+238 on a backcrit).

Combining it with a haste potion and the other all important HLA "Assasination", plus being a sneaky bastard and pausing the game after each attack roll to switch the weapons, you may get 4 or 5 consecutive backstabs off with Celestial Fury.

Oh.. lol. Staff of Mage.. I tough SoM meant Sword of Mask, since I have Throne of Bhaal. I think I prefer the Sword of Mask to Celestial Fury. +4 FTW

(Valygar has a lot of fun with CF)

thanks a lot!

[BooTheHamster]

There's actually a mod that lets Cespenar and Cromwell update even more items, the Celestial Fury being one of them. In case you want to kick even more ass. It actually goes well with some of the difficulty enhancing mods out there IMO.

[SolkaTruesilver]

There's actually a mod that lets Cespenar and Cromwell update even more items, the Celestial Fury being one of them. In case you want to kick even more ass. It actually goes well with some of the difficulty enhancing mods out there IMO.

Hum... looks like that way is the way of the Munchkin. I am not sure to want to travel on that path... It is something to find a good legit in-game build, but to download actual more powerful weapons? To the mere purpose of having more powerful ennemies..?

[Cespenar]

Though the item upgrade mod (if it's Weidu's mod we're talking about) naturally makes the game a bit easier, it is by no means any close to the "way of the Munchkin". In fact, the new upgrade ideas are pretty rational and not over-the-top, like combining the rings of Air, Fire and Earth Control to a new ring that includes the old abilities and just a few more. Most of them make sense, at least in my opinion, but it'd be better if you play it clean once, and compensate this mod with mods like (as I've said) Ascension and Improved X.

[Arang]

And Celestial Fury has the highest base damage in backstabbable blades. Offhanded Crom Faeyr's 25 str is (I think) +14 damage, so you deal 1d10+17 per hit. Which translates to 7d10+119 on backstab (14d10+238 on a backcrit).


But the Holy Avenger is two-handed. How would you wield it and CF without having three hands? Does UAI let you use two-handed weapons in a one-hand slot?

[Blayze]

There's also the Ruad mod for item upgrades, although that takes the "combination of items" thing to a bit more of an extreme, and then it costs you lots in terms of money and/or potions, scrolls, arrows, whatever.

As for modding the game extensively, you might want to wait until the Big Picture mod is sorted out properly. Then you can get the Baldur's Gate Trilogy mod working completely and all of the additions to it via BP (BGT is basically "Let's go through the entire saga in BG2!").

As for me though, I'll continue installing more mods than I need and managing to break the game in a variety of interesting ways - all of which render it unplayable).

[Nerd-o-rama]

But the Holy Avenger is two-handed. How would you wield it and CF without having three hands? Does UAI let you use two-handed weapons in a one-hand slot?Celestial Fury is a bitchin' one-handed katana, not the Holy Avenger. The Holy Avenger's subtitle is Carsomyr. Crom Faeyr is, of course, a one-handed warhammer.

Personally, what I'm doing right now in terms of mods is just BG TuTu (playing Baldur's Gate in the BG2 engine) and the Baldur's Gate Fix Pack, which has all kinds of useful little tweaks like letting you get every stronghold with one character (I don't have the patience to play through the game 7 times to see all the content, sorry) and minor rules tweaks most of which I forget now. Also considering the big BG1 NPC mod to make everyone less boring.

[Jube]

Heh, seriously for the Stronghold Mod. That's one'a the ones I always add (Even if it does mean you get an unfair amount of XP >.>), always gotta have

-All Strongholds Mod

-Relationship Mod: So you can have Viconia and Jaheria and still see em fight with each other/Aerie if you take her too (Which I do on occasion). Moar XP, good stories, some fun =D

-The Viking Horn Mod. Small, fun, just a little tweak that makes a small difference but makes an item usefull.

-Collectors Edition Mod. Because they fixed that cape you get in the Sunken City and I'll be damned if I'm gonna Fight Beholders without some form of Anti Magic Weaponry. Plus wielding Dhak'kon's gear is awesometastic.

-Bhall Powers Mod. Makes the tests you take in ToB far more fun when you get (semi) Awesome rewards for completing them.

-BG Tweak pack. Awesome since you can just turn off the OP ones or the ones you don't like.

-The XP Cap remover. This is awesome if you're going SoA -> ToB since it means you can get some epic levels in before you start ToB. 'Course then you have the problem of Irenicus being too easy (My god Spike Traps are overpowered).

Then some other Misc NPC ones sometimes if they seem good or interesting. Not often though.

[Siosilvar]

It's also possible that I'm wrong and the necessary disc is actually disc2. In that case, you need to get it off the net (or from someone you know).


You ought to be able to worK around that problem pretty easily, if I remember correctly. You can simply copy the contents of all CDs to your hard drive and edit the config file or somesuch to read from the HD rather than the disk drive. Of course, you'll have to be able to copy from the disks but that might be possible if you're able to install.
Of course, I'm of the persuasion that if you bought it and broke it, it's alright to download it from the net since you already paid for it...

I can install the non-full version (that is, the one where you need the discs for the movies & such), but one file on Disc 2 gives me a "cyclic redundancy check" whenever I try to install the full version or copy that file onto my computer (it's inside one of the CAB files).

[Driderman]

But the Holy Avenger is two-handed. How would you wield it and CF without having three hands? Does UAI let you use two-handed weapons in a one-hand slot?

Celestial Fury is a katana. The Holy Avenger is called "Carsomyr".

[Sensate]

Hello people. This memory-filled thread made me start playing Baldur's Gate saga again. I have only completed Baldur's Gate II + ToB, and I was never an "expert" at it, I simply enjoyed playing it without getting into the game mechanics too much. Of course, this could be due to the fact that I was a lot younger back then.

The funny thing is (and I curse myself now for being so daft), I also bought Baldur's Gate 1 last year, intending to complete the saga. Never did.

So now I am willing to give it another shot: I've already started playing BG1+TotSC with a Ranger, a class I've never tried before so I don't get bored in the process. Anyway, so far I'm really enjoying it. How could I ever even think of playing anything else but Black Isle's games? No synthetic junk RPGs could ever go near it...just hearing the music made me all warm inside. This time, I hope to play through the entire saga with this one character; that's bound to be one heck of an experience. It will take some getting used to the inferior interface of BG1, but I won't resort to any mods on the first play.

[Jube]

Hello people. This memory-filled thread made me start playing Baldur's Gate saga again. I have only completed Baldur's Gate II + ToB, and I was never an "expert" at it, I simply enjoyed playing it without getting into the game mechanics too much. Of course, this could be due to the fact that I was a lot younger back then.

The funny thing is (and I curse myself now for being so daft), I also bought Baldur's Gate 1 last year, intending to complete the saga. Never did.

So now I am willing to give it another shot: I've already started playing BG1+TotSC with a Ranger, a class I've never tried before so I don't get bored in the process. Anyway, so far I'm really enjoying it. How could I ever even think of playing anything else but Black Isle's games? No synthetic junk RPGs could ever go near it...just hearing the music made me all warm inside. This time, I hope to play through the entire saga with this one character; that's bound to be one heck of an experience. It will take some getting used to the inferior interface of BG1, but I won't resort to any mods on the first play.


Well mods should ideally only enhance the gameplay rather than make it too easy. Check out some'a the ones I listed, things like the Collectors Edtion or the Stronghold change just make life a little easier. More streamlined.

Anyhow, what I really wanted to say was:

A) I'd play BG1 in BG2 with the mod were I you
2) Avoid ToTSC. It's easily the weakest expansion, I really don't see the point in it, besides maybe buffing your character a little more before BGII but that's hardly nescessary. I guess I was eager to leave BG 1 when I'd finished it, still meh to ToTSC!

[Arang]

Celestial Fury is the sweet stunning katana. Slipped my mind completely.

I started a new game with an all-evil party and an Assassin PC. Slightly hurt for skills at the beginning, but now I think I'm sitting on the best party I've ever had, and I'm not even out of Athkatla. Korgan just chews up everything that comes at us. If only there were some proper long swords to be had ...

[SolkaTruesilver]

Celestial Fury is the sweet stunning katana. Slipped my mind completely.

I started a new game with an all-evil party and an Assassin PC. Slightly hurt for skills at the beginning, but now I think I'm sitting on the best party I've ever had, and I'm not even out of Athkatla. Korgan just chews up everything that comes at us. If only there were some proper long swords to be had ...

forget Celestial Fury if you have Throne of Bhaal. Go buy the Sword of Mask for 14k (I think), a +4 short sword with 0 speed. Perfect for backstabs, and can get trough a lot of defences.

The only non-evil (and non-neutral) member is Valygar, and I gave HIM Celestial Fury. He.. kicks asses. He does less damage than Kurgan does, but he strikes just quickly, and CF's abilities is awesome with him.

Sword of Mask's special abilities is also great, with the possibility to Entangle (no save) 15% of your strike. Perfect for hit-and-run..

[Cainen]

In fact, the new upgrade ideas are pretty rational and not over-the-top, like combining the rings of Air, Fire and Earth Control

If only they had rings of Water and Heart Control in BG2.

[Miklus]

Ah yes, great games. I played them all the way through. I had an evil party, let's see:

In BG1:
That dwarf...Kargan?
The violent halfling...Monteran or something? Xzar was useless, left him to the spiders :smallamused:
Virconia
That man-hating redheaded woman...Sonia I think.
And a "guest spot" :smallbiggrin:"What is that? You want us to help you kill a vyrvern? OK, you can join our group! Lead on! Yes, please take the front spot. Ah, here is the cave. Charge! *crash* *bonk* *slash* *poke* Victory! Why are you lying on the floor? Oh, dear. He must have been stung. Oh well, onwards to new adventures!"

IN BG2:
Korgan aka "Nasty Dwarf"
Virconia (again)
Edwin FTW
Yoshi (well, part time...)
Imoen (part time)
Amonen (Yes Amonen! He is not as bad as he looks. He can fight AND heal. And he is ok once you drive him CN :smallamused: At first he was a temp, but then he went on a killing spree and later KILLED that self-rightous paladin. I could not kick him out after something that awesome, could I? Besides, having two clerics kicks butt. Giant skeletons FTW!)

[Cespenar]

If only they had rings of Water and Heart Control in BG2.

Heart Control. I like the sound of it.

[Arang]

It appears (Trademeet quest)

Lord Logan does not take kindly to me massacring the druids and ruining the grove. That's what being evil is all about. Ah well, that halfling paid me well.

I never knew until now you can break into the Farrahd estate and kill the guards for something like 30k XP and the loot that's inside (nothing big, though). I can't believe I've been missing out on this AND those divine casters in the Bridge District. If I keep this up I'll be able to go to Watcher's Keep before Spellhold.

[SolkaTruesilver]

It appears (Trademeet quest)

Lord Logan does not take kindly to me massacring the druids and ruining the grove. That's what being evil is all about. Ah well, that halfling paid me well.

I never knew until now you can break into the Farrahd estate and kill the guards for something like 30k XP and the loot that's inside (nothing big, though). I can't believe I've been missing out on this AND those divine casters in the Bridge District. If I keep this up I'll be able to go to Watcher's Keep before Spellhold.

Divine casters??!! where?

[EvilElitest]

I must be the only person in the entire universe who preferred BG1 to BG2, although only just - I thought both were bloody brilliant. Best games ever.

No i agree, but i love BB2
from
EE

[Sensate]

Oh, I've just remembered one thing: some time ago I read about an easter egg "Pantaloons Enigma" that spans throughout the BG series. Has anyone here managed to complete it, maybe on it's own? It's supposed to be one of the most interesting easter eggs ever, there is even a fiendishly hidden code pertaining to the solution or something.

[SurlySeraph]

Oh, I've just remembered one thing: some time ago I read about an easter egg "Pantaloons Enigma" that spans throughout the BG series. Has anyone here managed to complete it, maybe on it's own? It's supposed to be one of the most interesting easter eggs ever, there is even a fiendishly hidden code pertaining to the solution or something.

Read this (http://www.planetbaldursgate.com/bg2/walkthrough/bmu/).

[BooTheHamster]

Ah, the pantaloons... I have to say, that prize was quite interesting, as was the wonderful history of the pantaloons. Quite punny... er, amusing.

[Prustan]

If only they had rings of Water and Heart Control in BG2.

Old Captain Planet reference hmm?

As for Anomen, he really bugs me. Clerics are good, but I'd rather not have that arrogent jerk. No romance for the female PC is by far preferable to listening to Anomen's pompous whining.

[Arang]

Divine casters??!! where?

From the rightmost pier, go up the stairs and into the house shaped like a bridge. There's four of them, relatively powerful. I had to get them outside to kill them.

[Sensate]

From the rightmost pier, go up the stairs and into the house shaped like a bridge. There's four of them, relatively powerful. I had to get them outside to kill them.

They aren't that hard to find or kill. Though I agree their power could come as a surprise for a new player.

[Arang]

They aren't that hard to find or kill. Though I agree their power could come as a surprise for a new player.

I might have been able to beat them inside, too, but I didn't know how powerful they were, and I had no buffs at all, so I opted for caution. Plus, they had what seemed to be a Gate. That's never good.

[SolkaTruesilver]

I might have been able to beat them inside, too, but I didn't know how powerful they were, and I had no buffs at all, so I opted for caution. Plus, they had what seemed to be a Gate. That's never good.

indeed. But protection from evil always makes that spell backfire.. hehe...

[Arang]

PfE would have been awesome if I had ever bothered to memorize it.

[SolkaTruesilver]

PfE would have been awesome if I had ever bothered to memorize it.

Vicky always have the 5-foot version of it in mind. It's a long-lasting buff spell, that grants a few +s against evil opponent.

The great news is: most ennemies at evil anyway :smallbiggrin:

[Triaxx]

Just recently while playing a LAN game of BG2, we sent the thief (my sister) into the Crooked Crane after Daystar. We'd forgotten to grab PfM, but she went in anyway. This is shortly after starting the game mind you, so she's the only one with enough points to do it. (Straight thief, the other guy was a multi-class.) She goes in, the Lich sees her and starts attacking. She grabs the sword, throws it on, and attacks. Works fine, right up until he casts GATE. The demon comes, and still gets spanked. I have no idea why.

[EvilElitest]

so what is the deal with the phonix warriors in BGI?
from
EE

[SmartAlec]

Always wondered about that Lich. Was there once, long ago, an arrogant human necromancer who got dead drunk in the Crooked Crane and didn't have any coin to pay, so got walled up by the unscrupulous barman at the time?

[Sensate]

Always wondered about that Lich. Was there once, long ago, an arrogant human necromancer who got dead drunk in the Crooked Crane and didn't have any coin to pay, so got walled up by the unscrupulous barman at the time?

Maybe. Alternatively, that place wasn't an inn before, but simply a personal property of a sort that then got sold and turned into one. There could have been several owners of the building beforehand.

[SmartAlec]

You know, considering that Athkatla had:

- an awesomely powerful wizard in a secret dungeon below the Promenade
- a secret cult led by Beholders in the sewers
- a very active vampire infestation in the graveyard fighting a war of assassins
- a similar secret organisation of mind flayers, also in the sewers
- the Twisted Rune
- a crazed circus gnome bent on controlling his own personal world
- a Lich in a bar
- a DEMILICH in the docks
- a covert (and sometimes not-so-covert) religious war between Temples
- a temporally-unstable sphere in the Slums

... and probably a whole bunch of other stuff I can't even remember, it's a damn good thing you were there, or else the whole city would have collapsed into blood and fire before very long.

[Jade_Tarem]

You know, considering that Athkatla had:

- an awesomely powerful wizard in a secret dungeon below the Promenade
- a secret cult led by Beholders in the sewers
- a very active vampire infestation in the graveyard fighting a war of assassins
- a similar secret organisation of mind flayers, also in the sewers
- the Twisted Rune
- a crazed circus gnome bent on controlling his own personal world
- a Lich in a bar
- a DEMILICH in the docks
- a covert (and sometimes not-so-covert) religious war between Temples
- a temporally-unstable sphere in the Slums

... and probably a whole bunch of other stuff I can't even remember, it's a damn good thing you were there, or else the whole city would have collapsed into blood and fire before very long.

Of course,

Everything collapses into blood and fire in the expansion anyway. Also, you forgot the massive slave trade, rampant corruption in the government and militia, an extraplanar theatrical troupe that somehow angered one of the dark lords of sigil, an evil wizard and bandit gang in the sewers to go with the beholder cult and the mind flayers, and an order of fallen paladins. Oh, and it also had poverty and sanitation problems. :smalltongue:

[SmartAlec]

Of course,

an extraplanar theatrical troupe that somehow angered one of the dark lords of sigil

I know he sounds really menacing and all that, and is possibly the most avaricious cut-throat bastard in a city filled to the brim with cut-throat bastards, but Duke Rowan Darkwood is in fact Chaotic Good.

Aside from all that, yeah. Come to Athkatla! There were fewer reported murders last year!

[Pagz]

You know, considering that Athkatla had:Whoa... once I think about it like that, that place was a right mess before your party shows up. I feel sorry for the inhabitance :smalleek:.

Minsc fixes that right up though :smallbiggrin:.

[Sensate]

Tell me, does anyone else here get as attached to NPCs as I do? For example: Imoen and Jaheira. I've finished the game with both of them and it's not that they are bad, but I want to try something else. Still, when they start whining and complaining my heart brakes and I can barely get myself to leave them (remove them off my party). Now when my protagonist is evil or neutral, there is a so-so reason to do it, but when he/she is a goodie, I'm really having a moral struggle. What kind of a hero leaves his childhood friend (spoiler... half-sister!) and the person that your stepfather Gorion whom you respect and hold dear thought so highly of and referred you to her in the hour of upmost need? In Baldur's Gate I which I'm currently playing, there isn't that sense of "duty" towards Jaheira; in Baldur's Gate II however, it's like she can't stop getting into trouble and I'm the only friend she has. Dargh! :smallfurious:

[Jube]

Well she did betray her other friends/allies for you. And she did just lose a husband, she really does need someone there =P

I'm not really sure I'd consider Imoen to be your half-Sister though. Godly blood seems to really mess with that reasoning. I mean otherwise you couldn't be a Gnome, Elf or Dwarf. You'd only be able to be a Half-Gnome/Elf/Dwarf. Just saying, chances are you're not even of the same race as her. Sibblings only in divine right.

Regardless I feel the same and I like it since it makes me feel more attached to the game/characters.

[Prustan]

My party is always full of people that I can't seem to ever want to get rid of.
Jaheira - just lost her husband, and travelling companion from BG1
Aarie - kind of whiny with no backbone, but, Mage/Cleric!
Nalia - not sure if I still need her after taking the castle...but better keep her just in case
Yoshimo - I know he betrays the party later, but I like him
Minsc - miniture giant space hamster. Need I say more? :smallbiggrin:

As you can probably tell, no evil party for me.

[Sensate]

My party is always full of people that I can't seem to ever want to get rid of.
Jaheira - just lost her husband, and travelling companion from BG1
Aarie - kind of whiny with no backbone, but, Mage/Cleric!
Nalia - not sure if I still need her after taking the castle...but better keep her just in case
Yoshimo - I know he betrays the party later, but I like him
Minsc - miniture giant space hamster. Need I say more? :smallbiggrin:

As you can probably tell, no evil party for me.
Dang, how could have I forgotten about them?

Aerie - that circus quest is right there for the taking, nicely balanced for my "just-dungeon-hatched" party, therefore it's almost inevitable that she'll wind up in my party early in the game; then it's all about having the guts to shake off an angel-like innocent girl from the party and severing her once-in-a-lifetime chance to travel the Faerun...gosh

Nalia - never had any "clicks" with her though, she's kind of bland for my taste

Yoshimo - he's with me every time, hell of a character

Minsc - what's it like not having him? :smallconfused:

[SolkaTruesilver]

Aerie - that circus quest is right there for the taking, nicely balanced for my "just-dungeon-hatched" party, therefore it's almost inevitable that she'll wind up in my party early in the game; then it's all about having the guts to shake off an angel-like innocent girl from the party and severing her once-in-a-lifetime chance to travel the Faerun...gosh
:

Also, don't keep her too long, or she'll get stuck with Minsc!!!

Transform her into stone, and leave her be, that's all :smallcool: in a few hundred years, an adventuring party will turn her back, and take her into adventuring..

[Sensate]

Also, don't keep her too long, or she'll get stuck with Minsc!!!

Transform her into stone, and leave her be, that's all :smallcool: in a few hundred years, an adventuring party will turn her back, and take her into adventuring..

Well that might as well be the best damned roleplaying solution to the issue I've heard. I could imagine the look on her face when my half-god character she's just met would stone-to-flesh her after a millennium of hibernation and greet her with a smile on his face saying: "Welcome to the worrrrrld of tommorow!" :smallbiggrin:

[Arang]

Minsc - what's it like not having him? :smallconfused:

Since you'd probably replace him with Korgan, pretty unsettling.

Remember when Scagbag claims that Korgan killed three people for absolutely no reason? There just so happened to be three people and Korgan in my party at the time.:smalleek:

[Triaxx]

That's what I do with Sarevok.

PC:Sure join the party!
Sarevok: Hooray!!
PC: Flesh to Stone!
Sarevok: You...

[SolkaTruesilver]

That's what I do with Sarevok.

PC:Sure join the party!
Sarevok: Hooray!!
PC: Flesh to Stone!
Sarevok: You...

What did he do to you? I am so eager to have Sarevy in my party. We're going to slaughter innocents all the way around! Maaan, that would be so fun...

[SolkaTruesilver]

Hum... now, I am stuck in my game with 60k gold pieces and nowhere to spend them (already bought everything I could in Watcher's Keep, and both special vendors in Waukeen promenade)

I think there are disseminated good items here and there in some shops of the game. Do anyone know a good shop list?

[Cespenar]

You can buy heaps of arcane scrolls with that money, which'll effectively net you a fine sum of xp. It's a bit cheap, I know, but you asked for it. :smalltongue:

[BooTheHamster]

@SolkaTruesilver: Been there... I've got upwards of 400k left in my ToB game, and I've gotten over a million before, and I didn't even use cheats. I don't really mind though, since I like knowing that wherever I go, I have the cash to buy anything I want. It's a good feeling. I'll agree with the spell scroll idea, though. Or you could always buy potions. Have you had Cromwell forge new items yet? Or been to Trademeet? Or the Copper Coronet? You could also always donate to the temple for a nice Rep. boost.

How far along are you in the actual story? If you've gone through it once, you could always mod it for even more cool stuff like I did.

[TamerBill]

Anyone tried assigning different classes to the party members? After trying Imoen as a Bard I just can't go back to having her as a Thief/Mage.

[SolkaTruesilver]

@SolkaTruesilver: Been there... I've got upwards of 400k left in my ToB game, and I've gotten over a million before, and I didn't even use cheats. I don't really mind though, since I like knowing that wherever I go, I have the cash to buy anything I want. It's a good feeling. I'll agree with the spell scroll idea, though. Or you could always buy potions. Have you had Cromwell forge new items yet? Or been to Trademeet? Or the Copper Coronet? You could also always donate to the temple for a nice Rep. boost.

How far along are you in the actual story? If you've gone through it once, you could always mod it for even more cool stuff like I did.

Still in chapter 3. But I've done SoA once completely, but never done ToB.

So.. anyone has a good shop complete list?

[EvilElitest]

well the city of Baldur's gate was equally absurd
from
EE

[Om]

well the city of Baldur's gate was equally absurd
from
EECount the liches :smallwink:

[Holammer]

I played The Baldurs gate games (and expansions) even the Icewind Dale ones over LAN with a friend back in the days. We built a custom party, controlled three PC each, it was fun but we missed quite a bit of story and quests that way. But we could create a truly optimized party from scratch that way. I've replayed them solo and Minsc is the favorite. To make it more interesting my buddy is the Chaotic Evil kinda guy and I'm the Lawful Good sort. So we had some struggles.

ohhh.. and raise your hand if you whacked Drizzt and ran away with his swords! Totally worth it :smalltongue:

[Matthew]

Hey, anyone think it might work on vista? I used to have a copy, and There's one at my local game shop, so...

Yeah, it works fine on Vista, as far as I can tell.

On the whole I preferred Baldur's Gate and Tales of the Sword Coast over Shadows of Amn, mainly because of the freedom of exploration. I still haven't gotten round to finishing Throne of Bhaal, but I will one day...

[BooTheHamster]

Yeah, it works fine on Vista, as far as I can tell.

On the whole I preferred Baldur's Gate and Tales of the Sword Coast over Shadows of Amn, mainly because of the freedom of exploration. I still haven't gotten round to finishing Throne of Bhaal, but I will one day...

There were so many unnecessary areas, though. I like moving and exploring, but there were tons of wooded areas that had pretty much nothing in them except one or two encounters, and considering how you have to load after every map, it just seemed superfluous. I liked the map markers in BG2 too, they made finding things like stores and inns easy.

[SolkaTruesilver]

There were so many unnecessary areas, though. I like moving and exploring, but there were tons of wooded areas that had pretty much nothing in them except one or two encounters, and considering how you have to load after every map, it just seemed superfluous. I liked the map markers in BG2 too, they made finding things like stores and inns easy.

not to forget you died easier than fruit flies... lvl 1-5 is very, very fine in RPGs, but horrible in video games

[Triaxx]

Being Max level and still being slaughtered like Fruit flies is why I don't like Sarevok.

Those early levels were among the best parts. It required you to have a fully party, and/or think your way through each encounter.

[DarknessLord]

Heh, I'm currently playing Multi-player with my friend, (which because BG II was not designed to work with modern firewalls was a ***** to set up).
And the game we're playing is a really heavily modded one, which is really fun and all, except for the Immy romance mod, which was installed to fix the problem of the developers deciding to kill her off then changing their minds, but not giving her much more dialog, (and now I find out that there was a super banter pack that does the same thing) and now my female Paladin is having semi-erotic about *Spoilers*[Her sister!] which kinda erks me...

But I have to think one of the funniest mod situations is that we have virtue installed, meaning, if we do something evil there's a good chance I'll fall (well there were chances in the unmodded game as well Virtue just makes it easier), which, humorously, means I ended up falling in to the stereotype Paladin role of having to dictate group morality (or, in this case, dictate that we fallow virtue's sense of Morality)...

[Avaris]

Heh, I'm currently playing Multi-player with my friend, (which because BG II was not designed to work with modern firewalls was a ***** to set up).
How did you manage to get it working in the end? I've tried to set up a lan multiplayer, but while the xp desktop is fine with it the vista laptop isn't, probably due to the firewall, so any pointers would be appreciated.

[Om]

not to forget you died easier than fruit flies... lvl 1-5 is very, very fine in RPGs, but horrible in video gamesI loved that about BG. It was the last RPG I played that was genuinely difficult and combat in general was far more tactical than in the sequel

[Jube]

I loved that about BG. It was the last RPG I played that was genuinely difficult and combat in general was far more tactical than in the sequel

Yeah?

I never wanted to play it again when after dealing with
Trap -> Wipe -> Load -> .... -> Repeat
Coming to the end and
Rawr we are random enemies! -> Fire bomb arrows -> Wipe -> Load -> Repeat
Then finally, at the end Sarevok!

One shots anyone not a fighter, two shots any fighter. Insane magic resistance and very fast. Melee was impossible, to beat him I had to single pull him, summon a bazillion mobs and cast Magic Missle over and over and over (Thank god I had a few wands).

Hard fights; ToB Demogorgan, ToB Raveger, SoA Twisted Rune. A few others too but they're the most memorable.

Sarevok was just unfair. It's possible I was underlevelled though, I think I completed something like 99% of the quests but I was kind'a rushing through the game /shrug.

[Om]

Hard fights; ToB Demogorgan, ToB Raveger, SoA Twisted Rune. A few others too but they're the most memorableExactly. There are less than half a dozen fights in the entire sequel (most of them in ToB) that can accurately be described as challenging. That's about the same number as the difficult sections in KotOR (I & II), Jade Empire, Mass Effect, Vampire, and Planescape combined. And most of those (I'm looking at you Malak and Draconis) derive their danger from artificial game modifiers

In contrast BG challenges the player from the very first wolf. There was a real sense of accomplishment completing the after road to Nashkel. In any later game this would be a piddling tutorial level designed solely to level you up by presenting harmless bags of XP to kill. There were parties of bounty hunters wandering the remotest maps/locations on the Sword Coast that presented more of a challenge than anything seen in Spellhold or the Star Forge!


Sarevok was just unfairHe was difficult and required multiple attempts to beat but since when has that been a bad thing?

[SolkaTruesilver]

In contrast BG challenges the player from the very first wolf. There was a real sense of accomplishment completing the after road to Nashkel. In any later game this would be a piddling tutorial level designed solely to level you up by presenting harmless bags of XP to kill. There were parties of bounty hunters wandering the remotest maps/locations on the Sword Coast that presented more of a challenge than anything seen in Spellhold or the Star Forge!


I don't have a lot of fun having my game killed because of the very first wolf, to say the least. What kind of tactic can I do in the forest, tell me? We are level 2!!

I even had my ass wiped by the assassins in Candlekeep. I was a wizard. Magic Missile (or Burning Hand), then I was done for. That does not leave a lot of room for strategy.

The hard fight I had in BG2 were (and I haven'T read the walkthroug to help me): Tazok, the Illithids, the random adventuring party in the sewers, any beholder/beholder group, the random encounter with vampires you had sometime.. etc... etc... there were a lot of them. Perhaps I am not on the same level than you. But I prefer to have more room to plan and strike than having my lvl 3 party being wiped because the ennemy hit two 20s in a row.

And when you died at lvl 2, it was a hell to raise.

[Om]

I don't have a lot of fun having my game killed because of the very first wolf, to say the least. What kind of tactic can I do in the forest, tell me? We are level 2!!Avoid it

What I love about the beginning of BG is that it doesn't feel like you're in a game whereby the earliest challenges are automatically easy and designed to ease you into the experience. In BG your father has been killed and you are alone in the wilderness, not the best of times to start hunting wolves

Of course given that you can have three companions by the end of that very map (if avoiding the wolf is not to your taste) its hardly a gamebreaking encounter


I even had my ass wiped by the assassins in Candlekeep. I was a wizard. Magic Missile (or Burning Hand), then I was done for. That does not leave a lot of room for strategy.Wizards are especially weak to start with. Surely that is to be expected? Although, to be frank, if you're getting beaten by those two clowns then perhaps BGII and KotOR is best for you :smallwink:


Tazok, the Illithids, the random adventuring party in the sewers, any beholder/beholder group, the random encounter with vampires you had sometime.. etc... etc...The one in bold is what interests me. In BGI almost every major challenge was another party complete with wizards, cleric and fighters. That's where the tactics comes in. There were less than a handful of similar party v party encounters in the sequel. Most combat was against hordes of creatures with one or two irritating abilities (such as the vampires and beholders) which makes for, in my opinion, a much less interesting or challenging experience

I mean, beholders became irrelevant as soon as you acquire that game breaking reflective cloak, and by the end game the vampires had to be teleported directly into your party ranks to be a threat. Oh, and Tazok was far more difficult in the first game whenever he was encountered. I got the feel that he'd been reduced to a named monster in the sequel. But surely the fact that BGI is a more difficult game is not in dispute?

[SolkaTruesilver]

Avoid it
Wizards are especially weak to start with. Surely that is to be expected? Although, to be frank, if you're getting beaten by those two clowns then perhaps BGII and KotOR is best for you :smallwink:

Bite my 4 hit points and no armor, man. :smallfurious:




The one in bold is what interests me. In BGI almost every major challenge was another party complete with wizards, cleric and fighters. That's where the tactics comes in. There were less than a handful of similar party v party encounters in the sequel. Most combat was against hordes of creatures with one or two irritating abilities (such as the vampires and beholders) which makes for, in my opinion, a much less interesting or challenging experience

I mean, beholders became irrelevant as soon as you acquire that game breaking reflective cloak, and by the end game the vampires had to be teleported directly into your party ranks to be a threat. Oh, and Tazok was far more difficult in the first game whenever he was encountered. I got the feel that he'd been reduced to a named monster in the sequel. But surely the fact that BGI is a more difficult game is not in dispute?

Indeed. But in you don't read the walktrough, that game breaking reflective cloak isn'T that easy to find, sir. The Unseeing Eyes quest is just head-crashing hard because of it.

And level drainage is always something to fear, specially when you did NOT prepared to face vampires. I mean, the final fight against the vamps wasn't that hard, sure. You *know* where you're going. But an ambushing vampire have reduced Korgan and Valygar to oblivion more than once in my game.

Illithids are also extremely hard if you don't know what coming to you. Insta-paralysis, 4 hits to your average fighter and he's dead.

Also, there is a multitude of liches around the game that also were hard. No, for me, BG2 pre-Walktrought was a game I had to sweat trought.

[Sensate]

Bite my 4 hit points and no armor, man. :smallfurious:
Really now, what did you expect with that starting character :smallsigh:? The reasonable thing to do would be avoiding the fights until you get another character in the party or running+magic missiles at best. Also, ranged weapons are very effective against those first foes you encounter in the game; that's at least how I got through the beginning of the game.


Also, there is a multitude of liches around the game that also were hard. No, for me, BG2 pre-Walktrought was a game I had to sweat trought.

I agree on that - when I played Baldur's Gate II I didn't resort to any walkthroughs nor any discussions on forums - it was just me and the game. The good thing is, I haven't changed much since; even the slightest hints of powergaming make my stomach turn.

[SolkaTruesilver]

Really now, what did you expect with that starting character :smallsigh:? The reasonable thing to do would be avoiding the fights until you get another character in the party or running+magic missiles at best. Also, ranged weapons are very effective against those first foes you encounter in the game; that's at least how I got through the beginning of the game.

True. (note to Om: I wasn't really angry, it was mostly ironic..).

Ranged weapons were the core strategy in BG1 for me. To the effect that none of my fighters ever used shields, since they could not equip bows if they did. So I had a team of 2-handed swordsmen (with the occasionnal cleric and mage). But still..

Sensate, do you have another way to begin a 1st-level mage?!

[Mordokai]

I see I'll have to do some reading, after just finding this topic :smallsmile: So I'll just say that this is by far my favourite game which I played more than any and intend to do so again soon. This time, I'm taking me a wild mage, I hear they are fun :smallbiggrin:

Anybody soloed the game? I know it's not the way game was meant to play, but it can offer an interesting difference if playing stlye. I did it once, with Cavalier and I must say, it was quite fun. Challenging also, not having mages to back you up and thieves to unlock the doors. Still, it got boring, not having anybody to communicate with. But it was a nice change of pace. So, anybody else did it?

[Sensate]

Sensate, do you have another way to begin a 1st-level mage?!

Well don't take me for an expert, I've only but started BG1 several times. What I would do if I were you though:
-try to lure the assassins to nearby allies (guards etc.); although I'm not sure if they follow you outside the buildings like they would in BG2
-use Imoen as an archer to clear out the beasts in the wilderness
-use Imoen's Hide in Shadows to scout the area; there should be a thief and a mage (they're evil though) somewhere nearby that can join you
-when you feel ready, go to the Friendly Arm Inn where you can get more backup (by that I mean Khalid and Jaheira); there is also an assassin there but guards can help you seeing how no fighting is allowed in that outpost and he attacked first

[SolkaTruesilver]

when you feel ready, go to the Friendly Arm Inn where you can get more backup (by that I mean Khalid and Jaheira); there is also an assassin there but guards can help you seeing how no fighting is allowed in that outpost and he attacked first

Oh man, THAT assassin was a pain when you did not knew he was coming...

[Sensate]

Oh man, THAT assassin was a pain when you did not knew he was coming...

Sort of. To me however, the one in Nashkel after you cleared the mines caused a lot more harm - he sweeped my entire party and the only thing that saved my ranger protagonist was his high constitution and help from Amnish guards.

[Jube]

It's all a different way of looking at the same thing I think.

You find BG 1 good 'cause it begins with a difficulty curve enough to rock you and even halfway through the game you're having to pay a lot of attention to random weakling encounters.

But to me (Especially after playing II first) that's all they were. I was struggling against a wolf, or against some pittiful Orcs. Sure I'd 2 hit the damn things most of the time but sometimes they'd just rape me. It was irritating and seemingly senseless, but then again I was looking at them from the point of view as petty annoyances in the path to my ascention to godhood (Really any enemy less challening than a Greater Wolfwere or Beholder/Illithid I find it hard to take seriously in a BG game anymore).

Still TRAP DIE, RELOAD, REPEAT FOREVER made me grit my teeth and I do not think it's fair to completely write off the difficulty of II and ToB. Especially not in relation to party encounters.

Soon as you get outt'a Irenicus's dungeon you've got a party fight
I think there's another one in one'a the other Inns
There's at least 2-3 in the Sunken City
Almost every single Drow Encounter is one
Twisted Rune is a party fight taken to extreme
The final Release Demogorgon is a party fight notched up to 11

The important thing is that none of these party fights have enemies chaincasting Fireball Arrow. Uber cheap tactic, kills their guys too but it doesn't matter since yours die more. But yeah, part of that may be I was underlevelled. Maybe you honestly are meant to just reload a billion times till you finally gib one archer with your Rogue and bumrush the other (That was one very cool thing about BG, it was far more likely you could sneak Imoen ahead and have her 1shot kill an enemy mage to begin combat. BG II had a RIDICULOUS amount of Mage defenses. Half the fights were waiting out/getting rid of their damn stoneskin/blur/magic shields).

Either way, Raveger was challenging. Very hard, something like 500 HP. But he was fair, you had to do it right and had to be carefull but you knew you could beat him. Same with Demogorgon, Kangaxx, Twisted Rune, Irenicus (I found him hard at least <.<) most of the Dragon fights (If you used -Magic Resist a billion times then Finger of Death/Chromatic Orb you're just ruining the game for yourself >.>) and some of the Bhallspawn encounters.

Sarevok just freaking ran around 1 shotting my characters and resisted almost every spell except a rank 1. I hope it was 'cause I was underlevelled and it wasn't meant to be that way but

Kiting him with boots of speed and having everyone else range attack him (instant death if you went melee) or summoning a billion Summon Monster II, III and IV then casting Magic Missile over and over and over... Those're the only tactics I've heard people beat him with. That's not even balanced that's just silly.

[Jube]

Sort of. To me however, the one in Nashkel after you cleared the mines caused a lot more harm - he sweeped my entire party and the only thing that saved my ranger protagonist was his high constitution and help from Amnish guards.

Flooding the mines with slaves still in it was so intensely fun/evil though... Nothing could put me in a bad mood after that bit. Best part in the entire game.

[Matthew]

There were so many unnecessary areas, though. I like moving and exploring, but there were tons of wooded areas that had pretty much nothing in them except one or two encounters, and considering how you have to load after every map, it just seemed superfluous. I liked the map markers in BG2 too, they made finding things like stores and inns easy.

Call me crazy, but I enjoyed that. Wandering around the map with my party was fun, it was world exploration. I didn't find it boring or superfluous at all (but since I had the game fully installed, loading times were generally less than three seconds). There really aren't that many maps with very low encounter rates in any case, many also tend to be a lot more dangerous at night. If you "just want to get on with the story", then I can understand such frustration, but I also found that wandering areas with few encounters often seemed to trigger the 'rare' conversations between NPCs.

I am also with Om on the level of difficulty. That your Mage could be killed by the first assassin he meets was a feature, not a bug. It's pretty unlikely in any case.

[SmartAlec]

For all its' wide open coolness, BG1 did have me having to resort to the cheese to get through some of the fights. The assassins were tricky - anyone who's ever picked a fight with a Sirine will also know how immensely irritating they are.

BG2, on the other hand, was forgiving enough for me to play all the way through without once resorting to cheese, constant resting after every fight or anything like that. Most favourable battle memory - taking on the Shadow Dragon at level 13 with a Bard PC (no, no kits, just a Bard) and a half-equipped party (one of us, Mazzy, didn't even have a helmet; we'd only just sprung her from jail) and with a combination of surrounding, tanking, powerful spells, archery and mobile tactics, my team took it down.

[SolkaTruesilver]

I am also with Om on the level of difficulty. That your Mage could be killed by the first assassin he meets was a feature, not a bug. It's pretty unlikely in any case.

Which was exactly the point of what I was trying to say..!

I mean, if it was a bug, then I could have understood. But low-level video games where 1 hit can kill you (and no "auto-raise in town" like Diablo2) was.. frustrating. Specially if you are trying not to be a save scum

[Matthew]

I mean, if it was a bug, then I could have understood. But low-level video games where 1 hit can kill you (and no "auto-raise in town" like Diablo2) was.. frustrating. Specially if you are trying not to be a save scum

But... is frustration a bad thing? I think a certain level of frustration can actually heighten the fun of a game (NetHack). Remember, if you are not purposefully saving all the time, then you are purposefully running the risk of unrecoverable death. If your mage dies and you haven't saved, that's the consequence you invited by doing so. The initial fights are quite exciting because they are potentially deadly.

[Pagz]

I don't have a lot of fun having my game killed because of the very first wolf, to say the least. What kind of tactic can I do in the forest, tell me? We are level 2!!

I even had my ass wiped by the assassins in Candlekeep. I was a wizard. Magic Missile (or Burning Hand), then I was done for. That does not leave a lot of room for strategyStep 1: Cast "Sleep".

Step 2: Stab until candy comes out.

[SolkaTruesilver]

Step 1: Cast "Sleep".

Step 2: Stab until candy comes out.

Well, I think that was a mental blank spot in my thinking abilities at the time. I was 12, and any spell that did not had "damage" in them were useless for me :smallbiggrin:

I really did not went in this game the right way, I understand that now. Still, it leaves a frustrating surge within me..

[Om]

Indeed. But in you don't read the walktrough, that game breaking reflective cloak isn'T that easy to find, sirNo? I think its pretty much impossible to miss unless you skip the underwater city segment. But I digress

What I disliked about BGII was that "tactics" often came down to picking the right strategy for one or two annoying foes. You'd prepare the right spells, equipment, etc, etc to cope with their unique abilities. There's nothing wrong with that of course but its a different sort of tactics to those used in party v party encounters where there were many ways that a battle could pan out. At the end of the day you were still killing monsters that weren't particularly difficult to beat once you'd neutralised their unique attacks

And if a encounter didn't involve a) some type of instagib attack, or b) an all powerful mage with an endless number of protections, then it was a breeze to get through

I should probably stress that I'm by no means an optimising player. I'd like to think that, after years of practice, I'm good but my tactics/strategies have always been suboptimal. Especially true in the sequel where I pretty much ignored potions and many of the more exotic mage spells


But to me (Especially after playing II first) that's all they were. I was struggling against a wolf, or against some pittiful Orcs. Sure I'd 2 hit the damn things most of the time but sometimes they'd just rape meBut in BGI you're not quite on the path to godhood yet. You're a kid fresh into the big bad world and orcs and wolves are a major threat. I liked the way you couldn't take any foe for granted or simply waltz through an army of foes before reaching some Big Bad. Later RPGs seem to cast the PC as some invincible killing machine that nothing mundane can touch


Still TRAP DIE, RELOAD, REPEAT FOREVER made me grit my teeth and I do not think it's fair to completely write off the difficulty of II and ToB. Especially not in relation to party encounters.Hmmm? I never had such problems with traps. Even the final maze wasn't too bad. I'm assuming you had a thief in the party? What part of the game got to you in that regard?


The important thing is that none of these party fights have enemies chaincasting Fireball Arrow. Uber cheap tactic, kills their guys too but it doesn't matter since yours die more. But yeah, part of that may be I was underlevelled. Maybe you honestly are meant to just reload a billion times till you finally gib one archer with your Rogue and bumrush the otherAh, I know that fight - in the ruins below the city before reaching the final fight, right? That was the one encounter in the entire series that I couldn't beat until I went back to the game a few months ago. All the other times I just avoided it by going through the ruined houses to the south :smallsmile:

[Pronounceable]

Sarevok is the FINAL BOSS. It's his job.


Anybody soloed the game? I know it's not the way game was meant to play, but it can offer an interesting difference if playing stlye. I did it once, with Cavalier and I must say, it was quite fun. Challenging also, not having mages to back you up and thieves to unlock the doors. Still, it got boring, not having anybody to communicate with. But it was a nice change of pace. So, anybody else did it?

Yes. Assasins get x7 damage. There's also a solo walkthrough/fanfic of a sorc (named Elmonster) around the net. A wizard can do it as well. Any thief that can solo long enough to get Use Any Item can conceivably finish the game after that.



(Really any enemy less challening than a Greater Wolfwere or Beholder/Illithid I find it hard to take seriously in a BG game anymore).


Your perceptions have been corrupted by Bhaal's unholy power.

[Jube]

Ah I just remembered now I didn't say before.

They actually removed the reflective cloak from the game with one'a the patches. If you install ToB and play through SoA you'll notice it's gone. Well not gone, but very very significantly nerfed. A nice change imo since it was ungodly powerful.

And yeah, that's my point. You're just a guy struggling against some wolves. I didn't really find that fun, I mean it's not horrible but I prefered being strong enough to actually take things on rather than dying against some Orcs, reloading and gibbing them.

It's been a while since I played it so I don't remember any specific area but I do know that the traps pissed me off to no end. Don't detct traps and wait before going down any hallway? Oop lightning bolt, bouncing back and forth and you just lost your team! Grrrr.



Sarevok is the FINAL BOSS. It's his job.


Sure, but Irenicus was a FINAL BOSS and he wasn't nearly as cheap. He couldn't 1 shot me but he did put up a hell of a fight. It was incredibly satisfying seeing him get his deserved beating. Sarevok it was mainly relief that I'd finally finished the game and could move onto II (It must'a taken me 30 tries and a walkthrough to beat him, it ruined what good memories I did have of the game) >.>

Same with (A)Mellisan, she was pretty hard. Especially if you didn't Wish Rest. But she didn't run around 1 shotting everyone and require me to summon a bunch'a trash mobs to keep her busy while I casted a lv1 spell over and over again.

As for being corrupted by the power of Bhall?
Definatly >: D

[Jube]

Ah I just remembered now I didn't say before.

They actually removed the reflective cloak from the game with one'a the patches. If you install ToB and play through SoA you'll notice it's gone. Well not gone, but very very significantly nerfed. A nice change imo since it was ungodly powerful.

And yeah, that's my point. You're just a guy struggling against some wolves. I didn't really find that fun, I mean it's not horrible but I prefered being strong enough to actually take things on rather than dying against some Orcs, reloading and gibbing them.

It's been a while since I played it so I don't remember any specific area but I do know that the traps pissed me off to no end. Don't detct traps and wait before going down any hallway? Oop lightning bolt, bouncing back and forth and you just lost your team! Grrrr.



Sarevok is the FINAL BOSS. It's his job.


Sure, but Irenicus was a FINAL BOSS and he wasn't nearly as cheap. He couldn't 1 shot me but he did put up a hell of a fight. It was incredibly satisfying seeing him get his deserved beating. Sarevok it was mainly relief that I'd finally finished the game and could move onto II (It must'a taken me 30 tries and a walkthrough to beat him, it ruined what good memories I did have of the game) >.>

Same with (A)Mellisan, she was pretty hard. Especially if you didn't Wish Rest. But she didn't run around 1 shotting everyone and require me to summon a bunch'a trash mobs to keep her busy while I casted a lv1 spell over and over again.

As for being corrupted by the power of Bhall?
Definatly >: D

[Sensate]

A question for Baldur's Gate I + TotSC players: I'm trying to run it windowed for it looks much more decent that way. However, the area scrolling stops working that way - the "hand" cursor simply runs over the edge of the window and turns into Windows arrow. :smallannoyed:

[Matthew]

I think you can get the keyboard commands to scroll in windowed mode. You probably won't be able to do much about the mouse scrolling.

[Sensate]

Alas, keyboard scrolling doesn't work either (it doesn't even work in full-screen, makes me think it's something to do with my PC). What's the point in having the option to play in a window if you can't move :smallyuk:?

[Matthew]

Right, the only way it appears you can scroll in windows mode is to go into the map and click on a new part. I seem to remember having this problem once upon a time, but I thought I fixed it somehow. If I remember how to do it, I will let you know.

[edit 1]
Alternatively, double click on a character or press "1" to centre the screen on him.

[edit 2]
Now I remember! You need to put "Number Lock" on, then use the scroll keys.

[Arang]

forget Celestial Fury if you have Throne of Bhaal. Go buy the Sword of Mask for 14k (I think), a +4 short sword with 0 speed. Perfect for backstabs, and can get trough a lot of defences.

The only non-evil (and non-neutral) member is Valygar, and I gave HIM Celestial Fury. He.. kicks asses. He does less damage than Kurgan does, but he strikes just quickly, and CF's abilities is awesome with him.

Sword of Mask's special abilities is also great, with the possibility to Entangle (no save) 15% of your strike. Perfect for hit-and-run..

After trying it out I'm not really all that excited about the Short Sword of Mask. I mean, sure, it's a decent enough backstabbing weapon, but aside from the speed rating there's really no reason why you'd want to get it over CF, and even that is just 1 better. CF has better average damage (8.5 vs. 7.5), the secondary effect are more useful, although less frequent, and there's the stun. Plus, the SSoM is about 35000 GP. Only reason to get it is if you are insanely loaded early in the game, or for taking down demi-liches, and let's face it, your Thief should not be the one killing the DL.

[Sensate]

[edit 2]
Now I remember! You need to put "Number Lock" on, then use the scroll keys.

Thanks for that! Unfortunately, what's known as scroll keys in regular keyboards are accessible via Fn+8,U,I,O,J,K,L keys on the laptop which I'm using; plus, the keyboard scrolling is a bit laggy. Oh well, I've already gotten used to low resolution, now it doesn't look half as bad to my eyes :smallamused:.

[SolkaTruesilver]

After trying it out I'm not really all that excited about the Short Sword of Mask. I mean, sure, it's a decent enough backstabbing weapon, but aside from the speed rating there's really no reason why you'd want to get it over CF, and even that is just 1 better. CF has better average damage (8.5 vs. 7.5), the secondary effect are more useful, although less frequent, and there's the stun. Plus, the SSoM is about 35000 GP. Only reason to get it is if you are insanely loaded early in the game, or for taking down demi-liches, and let's face it, your Thief should not be the one killing the DL.

yhea.. I know. I gave it to Kurgan.. the DL got slowly beaten up with 2 points of damage every round. Until he started to run. Then.. nothing worked anymore..

[SurlySeraph]

Oh, the demilich? Now that was a hard fight. I fought him at near max level with great equipment for every character. I started it by buffing everyone up. As soon as he appeared, I started hammering him with single-target spells and having my meleers with +4 or +5 weapons surround him and start whacking away at him. And it worked, he lost almost half his HP. And then he Mazed Korgan and started actually moving around. And then he paralyzed my PC (a Wizard). And then he Mazed Haer'dalis. And then he hit Imoen with a Meteor Storm. And then, just as I was having her Turn Undead, he hit Viconia with a Meteor Storm. The thing was though, he started running away due to the Turn Undead when this happened. So, with the rest of the party incapacitated, the burden of stopping him fell to... Edwin. Who had just run out of spells. But who still had the Staff of the Magi. I had Edwin use that spell absorption of the Staff to make himself immune to Maze (it just got absorbed) and then had him go up and just whack the demilich for about three minutes, refreshing the spell absorption whenever necessary.
That is the only fight I have played in any RPG ever where I won by having a caster use melee attacks.


ohhh.. and raise your hand if you whacked Drizzt and ran away with his swords! Totally worth it :smalltongue:

*raises hand* My first playthrough was as a Lawful Evil necromancer. It would have been downright dishonorable to let him live after getting to see how nice Drow society is! :smalltongue:

[Mr. Scaly]

Oh, the demilich? Now that was a hard fight. I fought him at near max level with great equipment for every character. I started it by buffing everyone up. As soon as he appeared, I started hammering him with single-target spells and having my meleers with +4 or +5 weapons surround him and start whacking away at him. And it worked, he lost almost half his HP. And then he Mazed Korgan and started actually moving around. And then he paralyzed my PC (a Wizard). And then he Mazed Haer'dalis. And then he hit Imoen with a Meteor Storm. And then, just as I was having her Turn Undead, he hit Viconia with a Meteor Storm. The thing was though, he started running away due to the Turn Undead when this happened. So, with the rest of the party incapacitated, the burden of stopping him fell to... Edwin. Who had just run out of spells. But who still had the Staff of the Magi. I had Edwin use that spell absorption of the Staff to make himself immune to Maze (it just got absorbed) and then had him go up and just whack the demilich for about three minutes, refreshing the spell absorption whenever necessary.
That is the only fight I have played in any RPG ever where I won by having a caster use melee attacks.

Oh, Kangaxx isn't that hard if you use the right tools. Specifically Scrolls of Protection from Undead (he won't even be able to SEE you!), Protection from Magic (he'll see you but what can he do?), and/or the upgraded Mace of Disruption (One Hit Kill!). :smallbiggrin:

*raises hand* My first playthrough was as a Lawful Evil necromancer. It would have been downright dishonorable to let him live after getting to see how nice Drow society is! :smalltongue:[/QUOTE]

I still haven't worked up the balls for that actually.

[SolkaTruesilver]

Oh, Kangaxx isn't that hard if you use the right tools. Specifically Scrolls of Protection from Undead (he won't even be able to SEE you!), Protection from Magic (he'll see you but what can he do?), and/or the upgraded Mace of Disruption (One Hit Kill!). :smallbiggrin:

*raises hand* My first playthrough was as a Lawful Evil necromancer. It would have been downright dishonorable to let him live after getting to see how nice Drow society is! :smalltongue:

I still haven't worked up the balls for that actually.[/QUOTE]

To kill Drizzt and Co, I used the Illithid's collar on Drizzt to make him kill his own party, then I simply cheese-killed him (you know, mega-buff, all melee around him, strike all at the same time, etc...)

The irony way delicious

[Sensate]

Oh, the demilich? Now that was a hard fight. I fought him at near max level with great equipment for every character. I started it by buffing everyone up. As soon as he appeared, I started hammering him with single-target spells and having my meleers with +4 or +5 weapons surround him and start whacking away at him. And it worked, he lost almost half his HP. And then he Mazed Korgan and started actually moving around. And then he paralyzed my PC (a Wizard). And then he Mazed Haer'dalis. And then he hit Imoen with a Meteor Storm. And then, just as I was having her Turn Undead, he hit Viconia with a Meteor Storm. The thing was though, he started running away due to the Turn Undead when this happened. So, with the rest of the party incapacitated, the burden of stopping him fell to... Edwin. Who had just run out of spells. But who still had the Staff of the Magi. I had Edwin use that spell absorption of the Staff to make himself immune to Maze (it just got absorbed) and then had him go up and just whack the demilich for about three minutes, refreshing the spell absorption whenever necessary.
That is the only fight I have played in any RPG ever where I won by having a caster use melee attacks.


Aah, such victories are truly the most enjoyable. I'd give the "one-hit-kills" and other cheesy ways anytime for one of those memorable fights when there is only one character standing and for some reason you keep pounding away at a superior foe with less than optimum means even though you can reload and probably do better at a keystroke. The silence after the battle feels so soothing and you can't help but smile knowing you rid the world of such a powerful force...

[SolkaTruesilver]

What I hated the most about the DLich was his Emprisonnement. You totally lost the character, unless you had "freedom" memorized. Which, I do think, isn't the easier spell to find around.

Well.. it isn't the character I missed, but all their stuff could have been sold!!!

[Jube]

What's the best part of rolling an assasin you ask?

Most people would answer, "Easy, getting 9x Backstab and running around with Invis pots/Speed boots Backstabbing like crazy"

It's a good answer but while doing that is fun, it's not quite as awesome as "Getting to epic levels, learning to cast spells from Scrolls and casting a Simulcrum of yourself. Sneaking you and a 60% you up to 2 enemy mages and gibbing them both to begin the fight! Or double backstab on one enemy to utterly destroy him (9x Backstab + 7x Backstab mmmmm)"

EDIT: The worst thing about things like Disintergrate, Imprisonment or Flesh to stone imo was if it hit any of the characters you were in romance with then it was all over. Far as I know there's not even been any patches or mods to fix that, so if the enemy has any of those spells I tend to play ridiculously cheaply to stop him getting a chance to use them at all cost.

[Blayze]

I do remember seeing a fix called "Romance friendly Imprisonment". Besides, I prefer to have all those who can in my party cast (Or otherwise use in some manner) Simulacrum, then have their Simulacrums use up their free copies of the spells my party actually has.

Stupid Kangaxx, though. I once tried to throw summons at him. I've never seen so many Imprisonments get fired off.

[BooTheHamster]

I'm more partial to Project Image, myself. 100% of your spell-casting power and item abilities, FTW. And I rarely use my mages for physical attacks, anyways, so they can hang WAAAAAAYYYY back and still be almost fully functional. Plus, once the spell runs out, my mages still have all their spells memorized. Awesome set-up.

For a cheesy way to use this,


I don't know if this happens in the normal game or if my mods caused it, but my projected images have no limits on summoning, so I can summon as many monsters as I want of any kind. It's especially useful with the elemental staves of fire and earth as well as the staff of the woodlands, because the actual item doesn't waste any charges. Now having your projected image cast Simulacrum as well, that's just icing on the Firkraag cake, my friends.

[Cristo Meyers]

Finally got out the first dungeon...that was a bloody trip.

Still having graphics glitches, black boxes that keep appearing around spell-effects, items on the ground, and whatnot. Any way to get rid of those?

[Sensate]

Finally got out the first dungeon...that was a bloody trip.

Still having graphics glitches, black boxes that keep appearing around spell-effects, items on the ground, and whatnot. Any way to get rid of those?

That's Vista right? Well, aside from Googling for a discussion forum that specializes in this game, you might try running it in 16bit colors. That once helped me remove those glitches in PS:T on XP.

[Blayze]

Next time Cristo, get the Dungeon-Be-Gone mod. Anyway, as for your graphical woes...

Right-click on your desktop and click Properties > Settings > Advanced > Troubleshooting. See the slider that says "Hardware Acceleration"? Knock that to the left. My PC needs two notches, my laptop needs none at all. Do what works.

That solved such problems as graphical errors in almost all Infinity Engine games, and the ever-more-dangerous "spellcasting instantly hangs the PC" problem I had with Torment (All with XP).

Doing a similar thing with the sound settings in DXDiag cured sound problems I was having in BG2.

[Cristo Meyers]

Thanks. I'll give that a shot.

The only thing that kept me going through that bloody dungeon was that this is my first playthrough.

[Avilan the Grey]

My party is always full of people that I can't seem to ever want to get rid of.
Jaheira - just lost her husband, and travelling companion from BG1
Aarie - kind of whiny with no backbone, but, Mage/Cleric!
Nalia - not sure if I still need her after taking the castle...but better keep her just in case
Yoshimo - I know he betrays the party later, but I like him
Minsc - miniture giant space hamster. Need I say more? :smallbiggrin:

As you can probably tell, no evil party for me.

When I play there are a number of characters that Must be in my group:
Viconia
Jan
Imoen
That only gives me two slots to play with, and most of the time I have Jaheira in there too.
Other option for her is Mazzy.

I never use Minsc after leaving the start dungeon.

[Avilan the Grey]

What I hated the most about the DLich was his Emprisonnement. You totally lost the character, unless you had "freedom" memorized. Which, I do think, isn't the easier spell to find around.

Well.. it isn't the character I missed, but all their stuff could have been sold!!!

Having Korgan and / or Minsc both berzerking on him solves that problem.

[Theork]

Cristo I have windows vista and I also encounterred massive speech text blocks and black boxes around items dropped on the floor, in both BG 1 and IWD2. I have a step-by-step to fix it for you, (basically the settings are the problem), but you'll have to wait until tommorrow fro me to post it as you have to appreciate it is very late now and I need my sleep :smallsigh:.
If it's what I had it'll be fixed in a jiffy.

[Shikton]

Having Korgan and / or Minsc both berzerking on him solves that problem.

Or just be sneaky and use a Protection from Undead scroll on your best fighter and let him slaughter the lichs. Personally, I used my paladin with Carsomyr.

[Studoku]

I've been playing BGI and I'm planning to go through the whole 'trilogy' (not counting Tales of the Sword Coast). I'm currently using the canon party in BGI- Minsc, Dynaheir, Jaheira, Khalid, Imoen and me (Fighter/Mage). My main strategy is to give Khalid a ridiculous armour class, especially against arrows (It's below -20) and send him ahead. It meant that the skeleton warriors with frost arrows and ridiculously low THAC0 in the maze only got 3 hits in total before they ran out of ammo.

I'm tempted to make a 19 dex elf and find the +1 dex manual so I can make an even more ridiculously armoured character.

[Prustan]

Stu, before moving on to BG2, ensure that you've found and kept at least one of each attribute tome. Give them all to your main character, and export him/her. Start an 'new' game with the character, add a couple of others, and make intelligent use of Import/Export character to have your main character 25 all. It makes the game much easier. I had a 25 all Female Paladin for my first attempt at BG2, but lost her while I was away from home, and have never gotten to the same point since.

[Pronounceable]

That's cheating. And not very smart cheating either. Use the console for tomes on BG or get Shadowkeeper for BG2 if you want those stats.

[Jade_Tarem]

And you don't need to cheat to get through BGII anyhow. Or Throne of Bhaal, for that matter, although I was sorely tempted to during the last fight.

[Studoku]

I just did the final battle. It wasn't hard once I managed to fight Sarevok on his own. (I consider cheese like this to be allowed if an enemy has arrows of detonation).

My tactic was to surround Sarevok with summoned monsters while blasting him with arrows of biting and a wand of the heavens.

[Tam_OConnor]

Hey, random question for all y'all who played Tales of the Sword Coast and Throne of Bhaal. Was it just me, or did the castle in the southeast of BG (never got the name) play a whole lot like Watcher's Keep, elemental riddles and traps galore?

[Triaxx]

Durlag's Tower. And yes, he seemed to have taken a lot of architechtural clues from the Keep. I never managed to get past the first level of the tower though. Perhap I'll try with BGT or the other two games in one mod.

[Theork]

Slightly off topic for the Baldurs gate thread, but have any of you played Icewind dale 2, the similar series black isle also did?
My question is this, have any of you defeated chaupeck the Guardian? It's not even the final fight and my OOTS (Yes I made them!) party can't kill it.
It kills Pets in one hit (auto), causes fear to all near it and releases poison clouds every so often. On Roy, even heavily armoured it does at least 35HP damage a hit!
Having a 50% immunity to spells and immune to slashing, acid, bludgeoning, fire, magic and piercing also means I've never got it past lightly wounded!
I feel like giving up and playing another series, like BG2 for the first time. :smallfurious:

[Om]

Hey, random question for all y'all who played Tales of the Sword Coast and Throne of Bhaal. Was it just me, or did the castle in the southeast of BG (never got the name) play a whole lot like Watcher's Keep, elemental riddles and traps galore?You've got it the wrong way round, Watcher's Keep came after Durlag's Tower. Which is incidentally the best dungeon ever created

[Tam_OConnor]

I've got to admit, the fireball/lightning bolt trap in Durlag's tower was devious. Instantly fatal to pretty much everyone, but devious.

The Guardian? You mean the black dragon? Personally, my pair of mages hammered it with disintegrates and fingers of death until it snapped, but that was about it. Can't recall if I used lower resistance first (can't hurt).

[H. Zee]

To kill Drizzt and Co, I used the Illithid's collar on Drizzt to make him kill his own party, then I simply cheese-killed him (you know, mega-buff, all melee around him, strike all at the same time, etc...)

The irony way delicious

Actually, I've made it a point to kill Drizzt in both BG1 and BG2, even if I'm playing a 'Good' character. In BG1, it's really easy, as long as you're willing to sacrifice a character - simply tell Drizzt you want to kill him, initiating combat, then use said sacrifice to lure him to the side of the lake. The sacrifice will get hacked into peices instantly, but meanwhile, the rest of your party are on the island in the centre of the lake, spamming Drizzt with arrows while he stands there gormlessly, unable to cross the lake to get to you. It takes a good long while, but eventually he goes down, with over a hundred of your arrows sticking out of him. Hee hee, good times.

I've also beaten him through less dishonest means, but that was... difficult. And Minsc perma-died. :smallfrown:

[Studoku]

Does anyone know how to stop the 'You cannot rest at this time' glitch?

[Triaxx]

Try saving and reloading. Or leaving the map. There's a spell effect somewhere that hasn't stopped playing out. Same thing happens when Cloudkill/Stinking Cloud are active. Changing maps is the easiest way to go about it.