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Dunesen
2008-06-22, 01:49 AM
Ketchup...Catsup. Ketchup...Catsup. Oh, I'm in way over my head here.

***

If this question has been asked and answered before, please forgive my ignorance and just point me to the right answer.

***

I am by any definition a newbie to D&D. I ordered the three core manuels for 4e a couple days ago to start learning (I figure I'll go with the new system, so that by the time I've learned enough to try playing there will be enough people out there using the new edition; oh, and I'll be back in America by that point, that helps), and I was looking at other manuels on Amazon just to get an idea of what all there is.

I came across the Complete... line of books for specifics on certain character classes. Last year at basic training I was friends with a guy who was really into D&D and he taught me a little (very little) about the different character classes (in addition to what I've been able to glean from reading OotS, naturalmente). I came up with character ideas for a rogue and a cleric, hoping to get into the game, but I didn't keep contact with my friend after we left basic.

Here I am over a year later about to try again, and I still have my ideas for the cleric and rogue. I'd like to start with one of those characters when I eventually begin playing, so here's my question (after the superfluous backstory):

The Complete Divine and Complete Adventurer books are supplements to 3.5e. Will they become completely obsolete with 4e, or (the conclusion my logic leads me to) will parts of them not apply to 4e, but there will still be things of value? Certain feats or prestige classes that carry over to the new edition.

In other words, if I'm going to learn the 4e system, would it be useful for me to get any 3.5 supplements? I don't want to spend 40-50 dollars getting a couple books and then learn "Oops, they're pretty useless with 4e now."

I don't know what happens when a new edition comes out, and I think Mr. Burlew said something in his news section about some character classes not being redefined for a year or so. Will the Player's Handbook give me enough to go on with making a new character? Should I start just start with that?

Dhavaer
2008-06-22, 01:54 AM
3.5 books will be almost completely useless to you if you intend to play 4e. Some of the fluff might still be applicable, but probably not much.

The Player's Handbook contains all you need to make a character.

AmadeusWindfall
2008-06-22, 02:07 AM
As Dhavaer said, everything you need to make a character and play the game is in the Player's Handbook - unless you want to DM, you won't need to buy any other books.

You won't be able to use any of the rules - such as classes, item, feats, etc. - from any book earlier than 4th Edition, such as the Complete series, and there's not that much fluff in them really, so they'd be useless to you.

Myatar_Panwar
2008-06-22, 02:15 AM
What they said. And you might be happy to know (if you didn't) that Cleric and Rogue both made it to 4.0

Chronos
2008-06-22, 02:16 AM
Even in 3rd edition, the Complete books weren't necessary. If you wanted to make a rogue, for instance, you could do that with nothing but the PHB. If you got Complete Adventurer and Complete Scoundrel, there wouldn't necessarily be any change to that rogue, either. They would just open up new options (feats, prestige classes, etc.), which, from those particular books, would probably be appealing to a rogue-type character.

Dunesen
2008-06-22, 02:16 AM
I appreciate both of your answers, you just saved me a nice chunk of change.

So does this mean there will be 4e versions of Complete Divine and Complete Adventurer coming out down the road? Something to look forward to if I do get a chance to really get into the game.

Dunesen
2008-06-22, 02:20 AM
What they said. And you might be happy to know (if you didn't) that Cleric and Rogue both made it to 4.0

Didn't know, just assumed. They seem like basic enough character types that they'd be carried over, whereas some kind of really specific type like "Dragonriding Black Mage Monk" (or whatever D&D has, I'm veering off into Final Fantasy now) might be dropped.

Dunesen
2008-06-22, 02:23 AM
Even in 3rd edition, the Complete books weren't necessary. If you wanted to make a rogue, for instance, you could do that with nothing but the PHB. If you got Complete Adventurer and Complete Scoundrel, there wouldn't necessarily be any change to that rogue, either. They would just open up new options (feats, prestige classes, etc.), which, from those particular books, would probably be appealing to a rogue-type character.

I figured the PHB would be enough to give me a start, but once I've played a while and have a better grasp of the ins and outs of the game I might want to start doing some more special stuff. So if there are 4e versions of the Complete... books I might buy a couple of those for use down the line.

Once I actually get the core manuels (should only be a couple days now) I can get a better idea of what I can do with a character at the start. It could very well be more than enough for someone just starting.

Myatar_Panwar
2008-06-22, 02:36 AM
As for your question about the complete series comming to 4e.... It looks like that there will be some kind of variation, just found "Martial Power", a 4e supplement devoted to the martial classes. So essentially Complete Warrior.

Found it here: http://www.amazon.com/Martial-Power-Supplement-Rules-Expansion/dp/0786949813/ref=pd_sim_b_5

And I would of course assume that WotC will be releasing all that they can fit it with the new series. Money is happiness after all. :smallbiggrin:

Dunesen
2008-06-22, 02:40 AM
As for your question about the complete series comming to 4e.... It looks like that there will be some kind of variation, just found "Martial Power", a 4e supplement devoted to the martial classes. So essentially Complete Warrior.

Found it here: http://www.amazon.com/Martial-Power-Supplement-Rules-Expansion/dp/0786949813/ref=pd_sim_b_5

And I would of course assume that WotC will be releasing all that they can fit it with the new series. Money is happiness after all. :smallbiggrin:

Awesome, appreciate the head's up. Can't buy it for four months, but at least I have the question answered.

Killersquid
2008-06-22, 04:03 AM
Yea, 3.x books will be useless, and if you REALLY want to make your favorite class better, you can get a complete book (being redundant here, everyone else said it, but may as well cement it).

Don't worry about the arguing about what system is better. 4e is still a good system, especially for newer players.

namo
2008-06-22, 05:31 AM
If you end up DMing and don't especially want to create your own campaign setting, the (official) Eberron campaign setting won't change too much* between 3.5 and 4E, so all the background about the world (and its races, its history...) will still be valid. The Eberron books (Eberron Campaign Setting, Five Nations, ...) are thus the only 3.5 books you might be interested in down the road. Just like with the Completes, the mechanics won't be the same though.


*Another setting, Forgotten Realms, will have rather drastic changes.

KillianHawkeye
2008-06-22, 07:09 AM
If you end up DMing and don't especially want to create your own campaign setting, the (official) Eberron campaign setting won't change too much* between 3.5 and 4E, so all the background about the world (and its races, its history...) will still be valid. The Eberron books (Eberron Campaign Setting, Five Nations, ...) are thus the only 3.5 books you might be interested in down the road. Just like with the Completes, the mechanics won't be the same though.


*Another setting, Forgotten Realms, will have rather drastic changes.

While this may be true, it really would make more sense to get the 4e version when it comes out (unless you can't wait), since surely they will reprint the important biographical information.

Dunesen
2008-06-22, 09:43 AM
If you end up DMing and don't especially want to create your own campaign setting, the (official) Eberron campaign setting won't change too much* between 3.5 and 4E, so all the background about the world (and its races, its history...) will still be valid. The Eberron books (Eberron Campaign Setting, Five Nations, ...) are thus the only 3.5 books you might be interested in down the road. Just like with the Completes, the mechanics won't be the same though.


*Another setting, Forgotten Realms, will have rather drastic changes.

DMing is quite a ways down the road for me. Seriously, it could close to a year before I can even find some people to play with (I'm stuck in Baghdad right now), and I'm going to want to get a few dozen or hundred hours of game play before I try taking a DM role.

So all the 4e books may be out by then, or at least the important supplement ones.

Isomenes
2008-06-22, 10:01 AM
One of the useful things about the Complete X books is that you can see the various Paragon paths and the PrCs that they drew from. So if you're minded to go a different road for your Paragon path, the ones that already exist in 4E will suffice to give you a sense of balance for homebrewing your own from the ones in 3E.

Some are obviously harder than others, but I, for one, really liked what they did with the Blood Magus--not so much of a suboptimal path now.

LoopyZebra
2008-06-22, 11:12 AM
DMing is quite a ways down the road for me. Seriously, it could close to a year before I can even find some people to play with (I'm stuck in Baghdad right now), and I'm going to want to get a few dozen or hundred hours of game play before I try taking a DM role.

So all the 4e books may be out by then, or at least the important supplement ones.

Well, even though you're overseas, you could always try playing a game of DnD online. There's a variety of Play-by-Post (forum games) and virtual table games recruiting in other parts of this forum (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=51) and on other (http://www.thetangledweb.net/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=13) forums (http://www.myth-weavers.com/forumdisplay.php?f=141).

EDIT: Added links.

Dunesen
2008-06-22, 03:13 PM
Well, even though you're overseas, you could always try playing a game of DnD online. There's a variety of Play-by-Post (forum games) and virtual table games recruiting in other parts of this forum (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=51) and on other (http://www.thetangledweb.net/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=13) forums (http://www.myth-weavers.com/forumdisplay.php?f=141).

EDIT: Added links.

That idea did occur to me, and I might try it someday soon. But I still want to study the core manuels first, so it'll be a few weeks at least.

Thanks for the links.