Filled with rage!

[droyer]

First of all, I live in Sweden. A few weeks ago a new law was approved, the FRA-law.
Now, I don't usually care about this. The new law however is EVIL. It basically lets the government listen to any phonecall and read any e-mail you send, Without any suspicion of crime at all!
I think this is an afront to freedom, if anyone agrees, please say so.

[Emperor Ing]

psst, I don't think we talk about this stuff here.
Even if this is allowed, it will escalate to debate about "Bush's wire-tapping program"

@V: heh.

[Spiryt]

Huh? It's rather weird I have always associated Sweden with rather liberal laws.

Anyway, this thread will get locked in no time, I'm afraid. See forum rules.

[Quincunx]

Better get onto the email-your-representative campaign instead. I think they're up to over 2 million emails already (out of a population of 9 million). My Swedish vocabulary doesn't extend to political matters yet, though, so I can't look for a direct link for you.

[Purple Cloak]

We have a simalar law in england, all phonecalls and text messages are recorded and govemental agencys are allowd to look if 'required'.

Aparently its for fighting terrorism or somthing like that.

[Victor Thorian]

Good now the government will know that you cheat on your girlfriend.

[Purple Cloak]

Good now the government will know that you cheat on your girlfriend.

HA! I don't have a girlfreind so that means they.......

Wait thats not a good thing. :smallfrown:

[de-trick]

look on the bright side if your wife phoned your cell and asked you to pickup the grocery's, and you forgot, instead of calling her to ask about the type of milk she wanted, just call your government

as for emails, you dont have to worry about a full inbox cause the government will have a back up

[Dave Rapp]

Okay... so what? Are they going to make big billboards with your personal information on it? Are they going to make all the collected information publicly available online? There's a high chance that your information will NEVER see the light of day. It will just sit there in a computer somewhere for fifty years. That's hardly an invasion of privacy. And if you actually break the law? Well, this information can and probably will make it all the easier to track you down.

Very small downside versus very big upside... I see no issue here.

[Purple Cloak]

I think a bit oposition is due to a problem that happened in england recently.
A lot of personal infomation was kept on disks that were either lost or stolen, these contained the personal infomation of millions of people which could lead to mass identity theft.

Thats one of the major worrys i know about.

[EvilElitest]

Okay... so what? Are they going to make big billboards with your personal information on it? Are they going to make all the collected information publicly available online? There's a high chance that your information will NEVER see the light of day. It will just sit there in a computer somewhere for fifty years. That's hardly an invasion of privacy. And if you actually break the law? Well, this information can and probably will make it all the easier to track you down.

Very small downside versus very big upside... I see no issue here.

It is a step towards authoritarianism and totalitarianism, which is never a good thing ever

Anyways, this thread is going to get locked soon so we should drop the subject
from
EE

[Dave Rapp]

You know, maybe this is just me, but I imagine that if any random person can steal information from the government, I think we have bigger problems on our hands.


It is a step towards authoritarianism and totalitarianism, which is never a good thing ever

Anyways, this thread is going to get locked soon so we should drop the subject
from
EE

The step between controlling what you can do and say and think, and being able to record people's information, is a gigantic step. This isn't the 1930's where a dictator can come out of nowhere and take over a country in a decade.

By the way, all, the thread's been up since about 5AM. If it was going to be locked it would've been locked, oh, probably around 5AM.

[EvilElitest]

a government violating the privacy of the indivisual. Yeah, that is kinda one of the basis of totalitarianism. I admit this is Sweden, but even so, basic rights


can't go further, because i personally just think the mods haven't noticed this as of yet
from
EE

[Dave Rapp]

Totalitarianism (or totalitarian rule) is a concept used to describe political systems where a state regulates nearly every aspect of public and private life. The term is usually applied to Fascist Italy, Nazi Germany or communist regimes, such as Stalinist Russia, Democratic Kampuchea or North Korea. Totalitarian regimes or movements maintain themselves in political power by means of an official all-embracing ideology and propaganda disseminated through the state-controlled mass media, a single party that controls the state, personality cults, central state-controlled economy, regulation and restriction of free discussion and criticism, the use of mass surveillance, and widespread use of terror tactics.

Quoted from Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Totalitarianism), but it makes a good overall definition.

The law could kind of be considered the start of the mass surveilance part... maybe. But I don't think anything the Swedish government is doing meets any of the other requirements.

I could be wrong. I'm not Sweedish.

[Purple Cloak]

The law could kind of be considered the start of the mass surveilance part... maybe. But I don't think anything the Swedish government is doing meets any of the other requirements.

I could be wrong. I'm not Sweedish.


I think EE's point was that it could be interperated as a step in that direction.

[VForVaarsuvius]

Nothing's changed, they clearly could have done that stuff any day just now it's public. Not like their gonna do it unless they suspect you of criminal activity, though.

So unless you plan on breaking the law, you should be good.:smallamused:

[Collin152]

Big Brother is always watching.
He just tells you about it every now and again.

[Gwyn chan 'r Gwyll]

They know if you are sleeping
They know if you're awake.
They know if you've been bad or good so be good for goodness sake
ooh
you better watch out...

Is it just me, or is that song the creepiest in the world.

[†Seer†]

They know if you are sleeping
They know if you're awake.
They know if you've been bad or good so be good for goodness sake
ooh
you better watch out...

Is it just me, or is that song the creepiest in the world.

Not if you're a voyeur. Then it's kinda exciting. :smallwink:

[Dave Rapp]

Not if you're a voyeur. Then it's kinda exciting. :smallwink:

Santa clause is a voyeur. And the whole naughty/nice thing makes him a total vigilante as well. Downright terrifying.

[Bhu]

You know, maybe this is just me, but I imagine that if any random person can steal information from the government, I think we have bigger problems on our hands.

How often do you see news stories about laptops or drives with government information being misplaced or stolen? If the governemnt employs lazy or corrupt employees (and all of them most likely do somewhere) that makes theft easier and more liekly. Why go through all the trouble of hacking the Pentagon when you can try to sift through their garbage for hard drives, or swipe them from the unlocked cars of idiot employees.

[bosssmiley]

*Awoooooogah! Awooooogah!*

Real world politics in the PlayGround? I give it 3:1 that Mod SMASH! before too long.

semi-related: I'm very disappointed. I hoped this thread was going to be about Haribo's delicious new range of rage-filled Angry Chocs. They're the most knuckle-cracking, tooth-grinding hateful candies ever devised (my favourites are the Caramel Vengeance). :smallamused:

[Lord_Asmodeus]

I am appalled! I was planning on committing some crimes in Sweden, but now it seems like it will be all too easy to track me down... stupid governments smashin my dreams. Also, I concur with EE's sentiment, this is just another baby step toward one total ruler. Now, thats not to say that its a sure thing, or even all that likely, but bringing a government even one small step closer to a totalitarian regime is... not good.

[sun_tzu]

Okay... so what? Are they going to make big billboards with your personal information on it? Are they going to make all the collected information publicly available online? There's a high chance that your information will NEVER see the light of day. It will just sit there in a computer somewhere for fifty years. That's hardly an invasion of privacy. And if you actually break the law? Well, this information can and probably will make it all the easier to track you down.

Very small downside versus very big upside... I see no issue here.

The problem, Dave, is that a law like this opens the door to tons of abuse. Given that the government and law enforcement are rarely bastions of non-corruptionish-ness, how long before a political leader tries to spy on his opponents (heck, Nixon did it without it being legal)? And that's just the first exemple that comes to mind.

[Illiterate Scribe]

I'm loling at the number of people saying 'it's an offence to talk about real world politics on this forum', and then proceed to do just that. :smallwink:

Also, 30 hours, mods? For shame, for shame.

[Spiryt]

I'm loling at the number of people saying 'it's an offence to talk about real world politics on this forum', and then proceed to do just that. :smallwink:

Also, 30 hours, mods? For shame, for shame.

Weeel, I suspect that this thread is now about freedom, what is dangerous to freedom et cetera- not actual politic of some country, so maybe mods decided to let it live, at least to the point when somebody will discuss actuall political preferences, actual parties and so on.

But maybe not.

[Illiterate Scribe]

Weeel, I suspect that this thread is now about freedom, what is dangerous to freedom et cetera- not actual politic of some country, so maybe mods decided to let it live, at least to the point when somebody will discuss actuall political preferences, actual parties and so on.

But maybe not.

Well, I seem to remember Roland locking a thread (Victor Thorian's, I think?) for discussing Plato's 'Republic', so I think 'politics' has a broader remit than you seem to allot it ...

[Spiryt]

Well, I seem to remember Roland locking a thread (Victor Thorian's, I think?) for discussing Plato's 'Republic', so I think 'politics' has a broader remit than you seem to allot it ...

Maybe it was locked beacuse of it's direction....

Or maybe mods have seen this thread and decided to drink from despair. Who knows.

[Illiterate Scribe]

No, it went like this:


Anti-socialism is a religion? Or is it a political movement?


Uh, yes, since Socialism is a political movement, then Anti-socialism would be one too, I suppose. See what I did there?

...


I don't believe anyone with a guide to taking over the world, unless it was written by Alexander the Great, his teacher, his teacher's teacher, or his teacher's teacher's teacher.


Alexander was taught by Aristotle, who was taught by Plato, who was taught by Socrates.

So, you're off to form an ideal Republic, then?


Republic?! But they'll never defeat the Sith! That shot is impossible even for a computer!


Sheriff of Moddingham: Real world politics is not an appropriate topic on this board ... Thread locked.

So, yes, the definition of 'politics' is on the broad rather than the narrow side.

[Moff Chumley]

The problem here is similar to the problem in the Commie-phobic fifties. To quote Jon Stewart's America: The Book, "The government can even look at what you checked out from the library. 'A guide to Islam- how interesting' ".