[4E] Channel Divinity for the Evil

[mikeejimbo]

Note: These are mostly only appropriate for NPC adversaries to the group.

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Flame of Asmodeus
Prerequisite: Channel Divinity class feature, worship Asmodeus
Channel Divinity: Flame of Asmodeus ; Feat Power
The ruler of the Nine Hells punishes those who attack his followers
Encounter * Divine, Fire
Immediate Reaction; Ranged 5
Trigger: You or an ally is hit by a critical melee attack.
Effect: The attacker takes 5 fire damage and 5 ongoing fire damage (save ends)
Special: You must take the Flame of Asmodeus feat to use this power.

Bane's Conquest
Prerequisite: Channel Divinity class feature, worship Bane
Channel Divinity: Bane's Conquest ; Feat Power
Calling on the power of Bane to smite your foe, you unleash a terrible attack
Encounter * Divine, Necrotic, Weapon
Minor Action
Effects: You may add your Wisdom modifier to your next damage roll with a weapon, and it deals Necrotic damage.
Special: You must take the Bane's Conquest feat to use this power.

Gruumsh's Warcry
Prerequisite: Channel Divinity class feature, worship Gruumsh
Channel Divinity: Gruumsh's Warcry ; Feat Power
Slaying a foe, you let out a fierce cry, backed with the power of Gruumsh
Encounter * Divine, Implement
Minor Action ; Close burst 1
Trigger: You reduce an enemy to 0 hitpoints or below with a Melee weapon attack
Effect: You make an attack as below
Targets: All enemies in burst
Attack: Strength vs. Will
Hit: Target is dazed until the end of your next turn.
Special: You must take the Gruumsh's Warcry feat to use this power.

Lolth's Strike
Prerequisite: Channel Divinity class feature, worship Lolth
Channel Divinity: Lolth's Strike ; Feat Power
Lolth reaches out and strikes those near you
Encounter * Divine, Implement
Standard Action ; Close burst 1
Targets: Up to 8 creatures in area
Attack: Wisdom vs. Reflex
Hit: Target is dazed until the end of your next turn.
Special: You must take the Lolth's Strike feat to use this power.

Cloak of Tiamat
Prerequisite: Channel Divinity class feature, worship Tiamat
Channel Divinity: Cloak of Tiamat ; Feat Power
Tiamat protects you...sometimes
Encounter * Divine, and Acid, Cold, Fire, Lightning or Poison
Immediate Interrupt ;
Trigger: You are hit by an attack that deals Acid, Cold, Fire, Lightning or Poison damage
Effect: You gain resist 5 to the energy type by which you were damaged until the end of your next turn. This affects the attack you just took.
Increase to resist 10 at 21st level
Special: You must take the Cloak of Tiamat feat to use this power.

Torog's Grasp
Prerequisite: Channel Divinity class feature, worship Torog
Channel Divinity: Torog's Grasp ; Feat Power
Torog reaches from below, grabbing your enemy and holding him still
Encounter * Divine, Implement
Standard Action ; Ranged 5
Targets: One creature
Attack: Wisdom vs. Reflex
Hit: Target is immobilized (save ends)
Miss: Target is immobilized until the end of your next turn
Special: You must take the Torog's Grasp feat to use this power.

Vestige of Vecna
Prerequisite: Channel Divinity class feature, worship Vecna
Channel Divinity: Vestige of Vecna ; Feat Power
You temporarily become like unto an undead creature yourself, immune to much that would harm a mortal
Encounter * Divine
Minor Action
Effect: Your next saving throw gains a +2 power bonus
Special: You must take the Vestige of Vecna feat to use this power.

Zehir's Poison
Prerequisite: Channel Divinity class feature, worship Zehir
Channel Divinity: Zehir's Poison ; Feat Power
Zehir smites a foe with a deadly poison
Encounter * Divine, Implement, Poison
Standard Action ; Ranged 5
Targets: One creature
Attack: Wisdom vs. Fortitude
Hit: Target takes ongoing 5 poison damage (save ends)
Special: You must take the Zehir's Poison feat to use this power.

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The following two powers are really intended for NPCs only.

Rebuke Undead
Prerequisite: Channel Divinity class feature, Evil or Chaotic Evil alignment
The following power replaces your Turn Undead class feature.
Channel Divinity: Rebuke Undead ; Feat Power
Undead foes are stunned or even dominated by your harsh, evil commands
Encounter * Divine, Implement, Necrotic
Standard Action ; Close burst 2 (5 at 11th level, 8 at 21st level)
Target: Each undead creature in burst
Attack: Wisdom vs. Will
Hit: Target is dominated (save ends)
Miss: Target is immobilized (save ends)
Special: You must take the Rebuke Undead feat to use this power

Bolster Undead
Prerequisite: Channel Divinity class feature, Evil or Chaotic Evil alignment
Channel Divinity: Bolster Undead ; Feat Power
You strengthen your undead allies or minions with your unholy powers
Encounter * Divine
Standard Action ; Close burst 2 (5 at 11th level, 8 at 21st level)
Target: Each undead creature in burst
Effect: Target receives a +5 power bonus to Will until the end of your next turn.
Sustain Standard: The effects persist for each undead creature within range (if new undead creatures enter the range, they too gain a +5 power bonus to Will)
Special: You must take the Bolster Undead feat to use this power.

[Colmarr]

Cool. Did these grow from our discussion in the "Critique my cleric" thread?

Anyway, comments on the feats that immediately caught my eye:


Flame of Asmodeus
Prerequisite: Channel Divinity class feature, worship Asmodeus
Channel Divinity: Flame of Asmodeus ; Feat Power
The ruler of the Nine Hells punishes those who attack his followers
Encounter * Divine, Fire
Immediate Interrupt ; Melee 1
Trigger: You are hit by a melee attack
Effect: The attacker takes 5 ongoing fire damage (save ends)
Special: You must take the Flame of Asmodeus feat to use this power.

This one strikes me as overpowered. It'll likely come up in every combat and it's almost an automatic 5 damage to someone that attacks you. I'd suggest that you make the trigger a melee critical against "you or an ally" and the effect be 5 fire damage and 5 ongoing fire damage (save ends). It should also perhaps be a reaction instead of an interrupt.


Bane's Conquest
Prerequisite: Channel Divinity class feature, worship Bane
Channel Divinity: Bane's Conquest ; Feat Power
Calling on the power of Bane to smite your foe, you unleash a terrible attack
Encounter * Divine, Necrotic, Weapon
Standard Action ; Melee or Ranged Weapon
Targets: One creature
Attack: Strength or Dexterity vs. AC
Hit: 1[W] + Strength or Dexterity modifier + Wisdom modifier necrotic damage
Increase to 2[W] + Strength or Dexterity modifier + Wisdom modifier necrotic
damage at 11th level and 3[W] + Strength or Dexterity modifier + Wisdom modifier necrotic damage at 21st level
If the weapon is melee or heavy thrown, it uses your Strength modifier for damage. If it is ranged, it uses your Dexterity modifier for damage.
Special: You must take the Bane's Conquest feat to use this power.

This one seems off-balance in the paragon tier. I'd recommend simplifying it by making it a minor action power that allows you to add your wisdom bonus to damage from any weapon attack. There's precedent for that sort of Channel Divinity (see Power of Amaunator from Erais the Sunlord in the D&DXP pre-gens).


Lolth's Strike
Prerequisite: Channel Divinity class feature, worship Lolth
Channel Divinity: Lolth's Strike ; Feat Power
Lolth reaches out and strikes those near you
Encounter * Divine, Implement
Standard Action ; Ranged 10
Targets: Up to 8 creatures within range
Attack: Wisdom vs. AC
Hit: Wisdom modifier necrotic damage
Special: You must take the Lolth's Strike feat to use this power.

Holy crap! You do realise that this feat will likely allow your cleric's group to ignore minions altogether. While you might rightly say that a PC will never get the chance to use it in that manner, it nevertheless allows a cleric to simultaneously hit 8 targets within a 21x21 area with no risk of collateral damage. I think this one needs major work. I see the symbolism you want to use, but I'm not sure what the suggest.

[DiscipleofBob]

Holy crap! You do realise that this feat will likely allow your cleric's group to ignore minions altogether. While you might rightly say that a PC will never get the chance to use it in that manner, it nevertheless allows a cleric to simultaneously hit 8 targets within a 21x21 area with no risk of collateral damage. I think this one needs major work. I see the symbolism you want to use, but I'm not sure what the suggest.

I'm a little too tired to do a full critique, but one immediate idea comes to mind: If the current idea for the Lolth divinity feat falls through, why not use a slightly more powerful version of one of the Drow's racial encounters? It seems appropriate enough.

[mikeejimbo]

Cool. Did these grow from our discussion in the "Critique my cleric" thread?

Pretty much so. I realized that the evil clerics got the short end of the stick.


This one strikes me as overpowered. It'll likely come up in every combat and it's almost an automatic 5 damage to someone that attacks you. I'd suggest that you make the trigger a melee critical against "you or an ally" and the effect be 5 fire damage and 5 ongoing fire damage (save ends). It should also perhaps be a reaction instead of an interrupt.

I like this suggestion. I think I'll use it.



This one seems off-balance in the paragon tier. I'd recommend simplifying it by making it a minor action power that allows you to add your wisdom bonus to damage from any weapon attack. There's precedent for that sort of Channel Divinity (see Power of Amaunator from Erais the Sunlord in the D&DXP pre-gens).

Duh, that WOULD be a lot simpler. I wish I had thought to do that. Oh well, that's why we post things!


Holy crap! You do realise that this feat will likely allow your cleric's group to ignore minions altogether. While you might rightly say that a PC will never get the chance to use it in that manner, it nevertheless allows a cleric to simultaneously hit 8 targets within a 21x21 area with no risk of collateral damage. I think this one needs major work. I see the symbolism you want to use, but I'm not sure what the suggest.

Oh, that's a good point. I didn't consider minions. I could just be cheesy and say "Special: Does no damage to minions" Or maybe reducing the range drastically? To like, close burst 1? So that to hit everyone, the cleric would have to be totally surrounded, which is a dangerous situation in itself.

Of course, again these feats are mostly appropriate for NPCs, and PCs don't have minions. :smalltongue:

[Colmarr]

Some further comments:


Gruumsh's Warcry
Prerequisite: Channel Divinity class feature, worship Gruumsh
Channel Divinity: Gruumsh's Warcry ; Feat Power
Slaying a foe, you let out a fierce cry, backed with the power of Gruumsh
Encounter * Divine, Implement
Minor Action ; Close burst 1
Trigger: You reduce an enemy to 0 hitpoints or below
Effect: You make an attack as below
Targets: All enemies in burst
Attack: Strength vs. Will
Hit: Target is dazed until the end of your next turn.
Special: You must take the Gruumsh's Warcry feat to use this power.

Should the trigger for this be "You reduce an enemy... with a Melee Weapon attack"? That seems more in tune with Gruumsh's philosophy. I don't really agree with the Str v Will attack, as it's the warcry that causes the stun. Perhaps Wis (representing connection to Gruumsh) or Cha v Will is a better fit and would go some way to controlling the power level of the feat.


Breath of Tiamat
Prerequisite: Channel Divinity class feature, worship Tiamat
Channel Divinity: Breath of Tiamat ; Feat Power
Tiamat provides you with a potent weapon against your foes
Encounter * Divine, Implement, and Acid, Cold, Fire, Lightning or Poison
Standard Action ; Close blast 3
Targets: All creatures in area
Attack: Wisdom vs. Reflex
Hit: 1d6 + Wisdom modifier damage of acid, cold, fire, lightning or poison (chosen at time of use)
Increase to 2d6 + Wisdom modifier damage at 11th level and 3d6 + Wisdom modifier damage at 21st level
Special: You must take the Breath of Tiamat feat to use this power.

This is roughly equivalent to a per-encounter dose of "Flask of the Dragon's Breath" from Dragon issue 365, or otherwise is similar to the Dragonborn racial ability. I'm hesitant to introduce feats that grant racial abilities. Maybe an alternate feat might be one that 1/encounter allows the cleric to get Resist 5 to one of the Tiamat energies (Fire, Cold, Acid, Electricity, ?) when hit by an attack that does that type of damage, scaling at level 21 to resist 10?


Torog's Grasp
Prerequisite: Channel Divinity class feature, worship Torog
Channel Divinity: Torog's Grasp ; Feat Power
Torog reaches from below, grabbing your enemy and holding him still
Encounter * Divine, Implement
Standard Action ; Ranged 5
Targets: One creature
Attack: Wisdom vs. Will
Hit: 1d4 + Wisdom modifier damage, target is immobilized (save ends)
Miss: No damage, target is immobilized until the end of your next turn
Special: You must take the Torog's Grasp feat to use this power.

I like this one but don't think it should cause damage. I don't have the PHB in front of me, but I can't recall any channel divinity effect that is an attack in and of itself and that causes damage. I'd recommend either making this an immobilise effect that can be added to another attack (perhaps only on a critical) or leave it as it is but remove the damage. I'm also unclear why it targets Will. Unless it's an illusion, shouldn't it target Fort or Ref?


Vestige of Vecna
Prerequisite: Channel Divinity class feature, worship Vecna
Channel Divinity: Vestige of Vecna ; Feat Power
You temporarily become like unto an undead creature yourself, immune to much that would harm a mortal
Encounter * Divine
Immediate Interrupt
Trigger: You become under an effect that a save ends
Effect: You make a saving throw with a +5 bonus
Special: You must take the Vestige of Vecna feat to use this power.

I quite like this one, but would personally probably change it to granting a +5 on your next save, rather than granting an additional save. The former greatly increases your chance of escaping the effect before taking a second lot of ongoing damage (80% chance). The latter massively affects it (91% chance) and also gives you the opportunity to avoid ongoing damage altogether. The more I think about it, the more this is a must have feat for Vecna clerics, so maybe the bonus should only be +2.


Zehir's Poison
Prerequisite: Channel Divinity class feature, worship Zehir
Channel Divinity: Zehir's Poison ; Feat Power
Zehir smites a foe with a deadly poison
Encounter * Divine, Implement, Poison
Standard Action ; Ranged 5
Targets: One creature
Attack: Wisdom vs. Fortitude
Hit: Target takes ongoing 5 poison damage (save ends)
Special: You must take the Zehir's Poison feat to use this power.

I like this one, and don't think it needs modification.

On a related note it occurs to me that if these powers are not intended for PCs then they shouldn't really be feats. As far as I know (I don't own the DMG or the MM, only the PHB), NPCs don't get feats, do they? If not, these should be written as powers to be added to appropriate monsters. The orc Eye of Gruumsh monster already addresses the Gruumsh "power", but I'm not sure what others are out there...

I wish I'd thought of that before you went to all the trouble of writing them and I went to the trouble of reviewing them. :smallcool:

[mikeejimbo]

Should the trigger for this be "You reduce an enemy... with a Melee Weapon attack"? That seems more in tune with Gruumsh's philosophy. I don't really agree with the Str v Will attack, as it's the warcry that causes the stun. Perhaps Wis (representing connection to Gruumsh) or Cha v Will is a better fit and would go some way to controlling the power level of the feat.

For the trigger, I agree entirely. I overlooked that insight.

Unfortunately, I disagree on the attack type. I modeled it after a Fighter Power that is similar, and it indeed is a Strength vs. Will attack.


This is roughly equivalent to a per-encounter dose of "Flask of the Dragon's Breath" from Dragon issue 365, or otherwise is similar to the Dragonborn racial ability. I'm hesitant to introduce feats that grant racial abilities. Maybe an alternate feat might be one that 1/encounter allows the cleric to get Resist 5 to one of the Tiamat energies (Fire, Cold, Acid, Electricity, ?) when hit by an attack that does that type of damage, scaling at level 21 to resist 10?

Actually it was based off of the Dragonborn Racial ability, down to energy type. (I wasn't aware of Tiamat's energy types, though I should have been. Shame on me!) I like your alternate idea, though I don't don't see as much of a problem with introducing a feat that mimics a racial ability. Consider a Dragonborn Paladin of Tiamat taking this feat, and spitting out two dragonbreaths per encounter!

Then again maybe that's too powerful. I'll consider it when the connection is behaving more. :P



I like this one but don't think it should cause damage. I don't have the PHB in front of me, but I can't recall any channel divinity effect that is an attack in and of itself and that causes damage. I'd recommend either making this an immobilise effect that can be added to another attack (perhaps only on a critical) or leave it as it is but remove the damage. I'm also unclear why it targets Will. Unless it's an illusion, shouldn't it target Fort or Ref?

All right, I'll remove the damage, it wasn't that big of a thing anyway. Perhaps I should add the Illusion keyword, though? I want the effect to be able to occur on any terrain (because nothing in the feat says otherwise, but someone might argue that it can't occur, say, on a bridge), but I guess Torog could open a gate anywhere he wanted. Reflex probably makes more sense in that case.




I quite like this one, but would personally probably change it to granting a +5 on your next save, rather than granting an additional save. The former greatly increases your chance of escaping the effect before taking a second lot of ongoing damage (80% chance). The latter massively affects it (91% chance) and also gives you the opportunity to avoid ongoing damage altogether. The more I think about it, the more this is a must have feat for Vecna clerics, so maybe the bonus should only be +2.

There are a number of feats that grant an extra save, but you're right, +5 is much too much. Oh, I have an idea. You get a bonus on your next save equal to your Wisdom modifier? Nah, that could be too powerful, since saves don't scale with level. (They're always just as hard) How about we just use the blanket +2?


On a related note it occurs to me that if these powers are not intended for PCs then they shouldn't really be feats. As far as I know (I don't own the DMG or the MM, only the PHB), NPCs don't get feats, do they? If not, these should be written as powers to be added to appropriate monsters. The orc Eye of Gruumsh monster already addresses the Gruumsh "power", but I'm not sure what others are out there...

OK, you caught me. I do want the ability for a DM to decide to allow these for Evil/Chaotic Evil PCs. So they should be relatively balanced, at least.


I wish I'd thought of that before you went to all the trouble of writing them and I went to the trouble of reviewing them. :smallcool:

Thanks for the input though, I really appreciate it!

EDIT: Oh yeah, I also changed around Lolth's powers so that it can't be as abused for minion-clearing.

[Colmarr]

Unfortunately, I disagree on the attack type. I modeled it after a Fighter Power that is similar, and it indeed is a Strength vs. Will attack.

...

Actually it was based off of the Dragonborn Racial ability, down to energy type.

I definitely feel that feats should not grant class or race abilities, except on a severely limited basis. For official examples, look at the class-specific multiclass feats. They effectively give an at-will power to another class but convert it into an encounter power. {They also grant a bonus trained skill - assuming you're not already trained it it}

That's a pretty big drop in effectiveness of the "power", but your proposed feat powers don't seem *at first blush* to have the same drop in effectiveness. They're ordinary powers in feat form. As such, they increase the NPCs/PCs power by more than an "ordinary" feat would.

The old rule of thumb still applies. If you can't think of a good reason why someone wouldn't take the feat, it's probably overpowered. Many of your proposed feats, IMO, fall into that category.

That's why most of my suggestions involved toning down your original versions.


There are a number of feats that grant an extra save

There are? I can't think of any off the top of my head, especially not one that applies to any ongoing effect.


OK, you caught me. I do want the ability for a DM to decide to allow these for Evil/Chaotic Evil PCs.

Aha! :smallbiggrin:


Thanks for the input though, I really appreciate it!

No problem. Whatever you do, don't be put off or aggravated by constructive criticism. It's much easier to criticise and destroy than it is to create and I respect the effort you're putting in.

[mikeejimbo]

I definitely feel that feats should not grant class or race abilities, except on a severely limited basis. For official examples, look at the class-specific multiclass feats. They effectively give an at-will power to another class but convert it into an encounter power. {They also grant a bonus trained skill - assuming you're not already trained it it}

That's a pretty big drop in effectiveness of the "power", but your proposed feat powers don't seem *at first blush* to have the same drop in effectiveness. They're ordinary powers in feat form. As such, they increase the NPCs/PCs power by more than an "ordinary" feat would.

I suppose that makes sense. In any event, I did change Tiamat's feat as per your suggestion.


The old rule of thumb still applies. If you can't think of a good reason why someone wouldn't take the feat, it's probably overpowered. Many of your proposed feats, IMO, fall into that category.

Actually there is a very good reason you wouldn't take the feat: You don't worship that god. But I suppose you mean if you do worship that god, why wouldn't you take that feat?


That's why most of my suggestions involved toning down your original versions.

Yeah, that makes sense. I hope I have toned them down a bit, in fact.


There are? I can't think of any off the top of my head, especially not one that applies to any ongoing effect.

Whoops, sorry, I meant powers that grant a save. And since these are powers in feat form, I need to be extra cautious of that. But I did change Vecna's a bit anyway.



No problem. Whatever you do, don't be put off or aggravated by constructive criticism. It's much easier to criticise and destroy than it is to create and I respect the effort you're putting in.

Not at all.

[Nu]

Cloak of Tiamat
Prerequisite: Channel Divinity class feature, worship Tiamat
Channel Divinity: Cloak of Tiamat ; Feat Power
Tiamat protects you...sometimes
Encounter * Divine, and Acid, Cold, Fire, Lightning or Poison
Immediate Interrupt ;
Trigger: You are hit by an attack that deals Acid, Cold, Fire, Lightning or Poison damage
Effect: You gain resist 5 to the energy type by which you were damaged until the end of your next turn. This affects the attack you just took.
Increase to resist 10 at 21st level
Special: You must take the Cloak of Tiamat feat to use this power.


Just one note: the bit about "this affects the attack you just took" is redundant since an Immediate Interrupt always takes effect before the action that triggered it, as I understand it. An Immediate Reaction takes place afterwards.

[mikeejimbo]

Just one note: the bit about "this affects the attack you just took" is redundant since an Immediate Interrupt always takes effect before the action that triggered it, as I understand it. An Immediate Reaction takes place afterwards.

Yeah I thought so, but I threw that in there just to be absolutely clear.