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View Full Version : A question about AoE's in 4E



The J Pizzel
2008-07-20, 06:42 PM
So, in 4E when you make an AoE you make a separate attack roll for each person in the damage area. Then you make one damage roll for everyone.

This is in stark contrast to the method in SW: SAGA. Which isn't a big deal, except I really, really like that method and am wondering if I could just use that rule.

Simply put; if you're using an AoE power, you roll one attack roll and compare it to everyone's defense. So you roll a 24 and whomever that beats takes the effect and whomever it doesn't beat, won't take damage. Some of those AoE's can get pretty big and I really don't want to have to roll attacks on everyone in the effected area if this would work.

Is there any mechanical reason I can't do this?

jP

Myatar_Panwar
2008-07-20, 06:48 PM
Probally. As I am fairly sure that there are many buffs related to "Gain X bonus on your next role", and getting that bonus against one target is drastically less powerful than getting that bonus against many targets. Powers such as Elven Accuracy.

The New Bruceski
2008-07-20, 07:16 PM
And rolling against each target, I can hope he rolls low against me (the tank in the middle of everyone) without praying he misses everyone.

Mewtarthio
2008-07-20, 07:23 PM
Plus, when used against minions, AoE attacks would either slaughter everyone in one hit or have absolutely no effect.

Viruzzo
2008-07-20, 07:39 PM
Which in general is the difference between 1 roll and multiple rolls: 1 roll is much more random, since a high result provides lots of hits and a low result provides probably none, whereas multiple rolls average out on your real hit chance. If you want to increase the randomness go on (but keep in mind that as a rule of thumb more randomness = disadvantage for PCs). It also doesn't make any sense fluff-wise: a "vs Reflex" attack represents the enemies trying to avoid the area of effect, and it's clearly something they do by themselves, not influencing each other's result (and it's not your wizard that can "miss" them, it's an area attack!).

erikun
2008-07-20, 08:05 PM
Is there any mechanical reason I can't do this?

"Hey, wow! I just rolled a nat-20 and criticalled everyone in my fireball!"

Well, that's basically the idea. If you roll low on a single roll, then you've just wasted your big AoE against the entire group. Conversely, one lucky roll can destroy an entire section of enemies - and minions only make matters worse. Seeing as the reflex saving throw is gone (and turned into a static defensive stat), the multiple attack rolls are a chance for each person affected to "get out of the way".

The J Pizzel
2008-07-20, 10:22 PM
Yeah, well I feel a bit sheepish. Guess I didn't look at it in some of those views. Thanks. I'll quit trying to be smart and just play the game the way the damn rules tell me to. :smalleek:

LOL. Thanks for the feedback. That's why I love these boards.

jP

Mando Knight
2008-07-21, 08:35 AM
Probally. As I am fairly sure that there are many buffs related to "Gain X bonus on your next role", and getting that bonus against one target is drastically less powerful than getting that bonus against many targets.

Wait... there are powers that make you stat out a new character in order to benefit from them?:smalltongue:

On topic: yeah, Erikun's probably right about why AoEs need multiple attack rolls.

skywalker
2008-07-21, 10:38 AM
Yeah, well I feel a bit sheepish. Guess I didn't look at it in some of those views. Thanks. I'll quit trying to be smart and just play the game the way the damn rules tell me to. :smalleek:

LOL. Thanks for the feedback. That's why I love these boards.

jP

I thought it was a pretty good question. I've often wondered what it would be like to go back to saving throws within the framework of 4e. IE: The save for my AoE is equal to 10+(my attack bonus), and they make saves with a bonus of (their reflex(or other) defense)-10.

Anybody got ideas about how that would work out?