Harem Manga endings?

[Krytha]

I just finished reading Ichigo 100% on a whim, and it murdered me. It was also kind of this way for Suzuka (havent finished it yet though) and Love Hina (but not reaaaally).

I just feel like these manga can only end in disappointment for both the characters and the readers. A lot of people genuinely fall in love with one person, and that person HAS to break hearts (unless they subscribe to polygamy - *ahem* can someone point me in the direction of a manga like that). Is that fun to read about? I definitely don't think so anymore.

How do you feel when a character (or characters) you really wanted to have a pleasant ending get their feelings massacred over and over again?

[Nerd-o-rama]

I haven't actually watched it, but most Tenchi Muyo stuff apparently ends in implied polygamy, and explicit polygamy in one side-story. I think it's even legal for the aliens...

And I agree, mostly because the haremy stuff I have seen has ended up going against my personal preferences in the end. Isn't it sad, Ryoko?

...Rutee would know what I'm talking about...

[Krytha]

I was mostly joking about finding polygamy manga. I dunno, maybe I should just swear off the genre, since it is basically a long sequence of teasing and not very fun at the end.

[Rogue 7]

I've only read Love Hina (and thoroughly enjoyed it), so I may not be in the best position to judge, but I didn't get a sense of disappointment from any of the girls, at least nothing that they hadn't really come to grips with. Keitaro and Naru (and I really don't feel the need to spoiler that) was set up from pretty much day 1. Keitaro never really did anything more than tease the other girls, and most of that came out of cluelessness. Now, I see quite a lot of myself in Keitaro, so I'm sympathetic, but he was going after Naru pretty much exclusively, and everyone knew that. Meaning no offense to the ladies, but they really only have themselves to blame. And they seem to realize that and let it go.

(As an aside, personally I'd have gone for Motoko, but that's just down to taste.)

[Jayngfet]

Apparently not only does Tenchi Muyo end with polygamy, but there's actually a list of what order they got married in.

[Belteshazzar]

Yeah Tenchi's cousin is a twerp (I think I resented that series for practically killing off the character Erma), I think by the end I was actually pulling for the pink haired noble.
I think Tenchi actually had to chose in at least one of the two series (in Universe, I think its a given that he chose Ryoko.) Of course I refuse to even acknowledge the existence of Tenchi in Tokyo so take that as you will.

[Frosty]

I hate Junpei everytime he had hurt Toujo... :smallfurious:

[Krytha]

I hate Junpei everytime he had hurt Toujo... :smallfurious:

I keep expecting people to say things like "Lighten up, its just fiction/a story", but you really get a feel for characters and the disappointments become real.

And when there's like 4 different characters (or more) losing out, I think it's practically unbearable.

[Blayze]

The general rule is "First girl wins", although I'm willing to extend that to "First girl to abuse the guy wins" in the case of characters like Naru and Chidori.

I take pleasure in watching nasty characters in a harem break down emotionally (It's beautiful to watch characters get what's coming to them) although they always get rebuffed gently if they admit to the protagonist that they've "come to like them". That's a problem, and one that needs to be sorted.

"Oh, so you like me? And that's supposed to make up for all the times you've assaulted me? Get out of my sight."

That would be a *beautiful* thing to witness.

[Closet_Skeleton]

I keep expecting people to say things like "Lighten up, its just fiction/a story", but you really get a feel for characters and the disappointments become real.

And when there's like 4 different characters (or more) losing out, I think it's practically unbearable.

Yay! I'm not the only person who liked Ichigo 100%.

Though it was only 2 characters who lost out from my opinion since the Yui relationship turned out quite well in a nonromantic way and I refused to acknowledge the late comers as being worth emotionally investing in.


and it murdered me.

So true...


I hate Junpei everytime he had hurt Toujo... :smallfurious:

It really isn't Junpei's fault.

The really sad thing about Ichigo 100% is that the people who don't get Junpei don't get him because they're too shy. If Satsuki stopped acting like an overbearing slut and Aya actually confessed they would've had an equal chance of winning. Tsukasa only wins because she actually spends time with him.

[Oslecamo]

Sensei Negima has around 30 girls fighting for a single male.

But since those 30 girls are all good friends between them they come up with all kind of crazy planes to "share" the male.

BTW, the lead male is a magician 10 year old boy who defeats dragons with his bare hands to warm up in the morning later in the series.

I highly recomend the series, specially because it's really really light hearted and positive. So you really will never have an reason to feel bad about any of the characters, but still get LOTS of harem action. Plus shoujo combat.

From the same author of Love Hina. Things are a little slow in the first 2 books, but the real action starts on the third.

You can check it all out in www.onemanga.com

[Krytha]

Sensei Negima has around 30 girls fighting for a single male.

But since those 30 girls are all good friends between them they come up with all kind of crazy planes to "share" the male.

BTW, the lead male is a magician 10 year old boy who defeats dragons with his bare hands to warm up in the morning later in the series.

I highly recomend the series, specially because it's really really light hearted and positive. So you really will never have an reason to feel bad about any of the characters, but still get LOTS of harem action. Plus shoujo combat.

From the same author of Love Hina. Things are a little slow in the first 2 books, but the real action starts on the third.

You can check it all out in www.onemanga.com

This was less of a request thread and more of a gripe thread. I started reading Negima after LH, but it kinda dropped off my radar (somewhere around chapter 120 or so-)

See, maybe that's the difference here. Everyone knows how Negima is going to end, everyone knew how LH is going to end, and no one really ends up feeling too bad about the outcome because they saw it a mile away.

[WarriorTribble]

Heh, this is why the only harem manga/anime I can stand is Ranma 1/2. There be an equal opportunity harems with one or two near gay/lesbian attachments. And until the very end, you got the sense that the two main leads didn't care much for the other making the whole "dance of the warring horny/honor bound" a joy instead of something depressing.

[Oslecamo]

This was less of a request thread and more of a gripe thread. I started reading Negima after LH, but it kinda dropped off my radar (somewhere around chapter 120 or so-)

See, maybe that's the difference here. Everyone knows how Negima is going to end, everyone knew how LH is going to end, and no one really ends up feeling too bad about the outcome because they saw it a mile away.

In that case, I say it's a typical case of "Damned if you do, Damned if you don't"

Someone or something has got to pay the price. For there to be suspence, there needs to indecision, and where there is indecision there is the possibility of error.

I would say that people like to suffer. Otherwise, why would someone producing sad stories?

In the world of entertainment there are lots of works wich have no other purpose but tobring bad feelings on the viewer. Sadness, hate, despair, fear, envy, etc, etc.

And people pay for it. What can I say? We all have an emo side.

[Tengu_temp]

Would Fate/Stay Night count as harem? At the end all the female characters are either living in Shiro's house, or dead.

Poor Saber. Sob.

[Rogue 7]

This was less of a request thread and more of a gripe thread. I started reading Negima after LH, but it kinda dropped off my radar (somewhere around chapter 120 or so-)

See, maybe that's the difference here. Everyone knows how Negima is going to end, everyone knew how LH is going to end, and no one really ends up feeling too bad about the outcome because they saw it a mile away.

That's certainly true for Love Hina, but Negima's still up in the air, especially because it isn't a Harem manga anymore (and barely was, ever). It's a shonen action series with lots of fanservice. Asuna isn't guaranteed to get the kid- right now, if I had to put money on it, it'd be on Nodoka. All that is secondary right now to defeating the villain (see? Shonen.) and, more importantly, humor.

You're right in that everyone knew how Love Hina would end, including the characters themselves. That was where half the drama came from, especially later on in the series. Which is why Keitaro came through that pretty well- the girls knew he was dedicated to Naru, and there was nothing they could really do about it.

[Oslecamo]

That's certainly true for Love Hina, but Negima's still up in the air, especially because it isn't a Harem manga anymore (and barely was, ever). It's a shonen action series with lots of fanservice. Asuna isn't guaranteed to get the kid- right now, if I had to put money on it, it'd be on Nodoka. All that is secondary right now to defeating the villain (see? Shonen.) and, more importantly, humor.


Excuse me, but having your own personal army of perfectly sculpted girls with special powers wich you can summon whenever you want and obey most of your wishes fills the criteria of harem manga.

For god's sake, the current story arc is Negi going trough all things of trouble to get his harem personal army class togheter.

[Krytha]

Based on the author's track record, and Negima's "feel", I think many people would agree that Asuna will be the end result.

[Rogue 7]

Excuse me, but having your own personal army of perfectly sculpted girls with special powers wich you can summon whenever you want and obey most of your wishes fills the criteria of harem manga.

For god's sake, the current story arc is Negi going trough all things of trouble to get his harem personal army class togheter.

Nakama. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Nakama)* A good three quarters of those girls have zero romantic interest in the kid. They're his friends and students first and foremost. That's all the reason he needs to go through hell to help them out- they're all Nakama. The focus of the manga is most decidedly not on the "Love Dodecahedron" between Negi, Asuna, Yue, and Nodoka, but on, as you said, gathering the members of his Nakama back together. Sure, all but three of the group happen to be female (Negi, Kotarou and Chamo), but that doesn't make it a harem-type situation.




*An amusing side note- searching for "Nakama" on TV Tropes turned up Ken Akamatsu in the title results.

[Shadrin]

Quote from TV Tropes


Rumor has it that when planning out Negima! Akamatsu wanted to do a shonen fighting manga. However, his publisher (wanting to cash in on the success of Love Hina, Akamatsu's previous work) insisted on another romantic harem comedy. So Akamatsu created a fighting story that looked superficially like a harem comedy in order to fool the publisher. The story has since changed into a action comedy/drama with a huge cast (30+ 'regulars') and an expanding Back Story.

Yes there is harem-ish elements in Negima, but that's not really the focus of it, it's more about the shonen action. As stated before, most of the girls aren't even romantically interested in him.

[Oslecamo]

Nakama. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Nakama)* A good three quarters of those girls have zero romantic interest in the kid. They're his friends and students first and foremost. That's all the reason he needs to go through hell to help them out- they're all Nakama. The focus of the manga is most decidedly not on the "Love Dodecahedron" between Negi, Asuna, Yue, and Nodoka, but on, as you said, gathering the members of his Nakama back together. Sure, all but three of the group happen to be female (Negi, Kotarou and Chamo), but that doesn't make it a harem-type situation.


Ok, maybe it isn't the main focus(the action/fanservice are, I admit it), but still Negi has something around a dozen girls wich are literally ready to fight to see wich one gets to sleep with him tonight because they heard a rumor that Negi hugs and kisses whatever female form is nearby when he sleeps.

Or that the class representative painted his face on his personal jet, and is literally willing to follow Negi to hell and back again just so they can be near each other(and also because she couldn't stand to her rival Asuka being alone with Negi so much time)

Or that Nodoka considered that sleeping togheter with Yue and Negi.


The author still keeps harem. Not the main focus, but it's still there. Girls with exceptional powers fighting for a single male. It's the TV tropes definition and all.

[turkishproverb]

Apparently not only does Tenchi Muyo end with polygamy, but there's actually a list of what order they got married in.

Where did i miss this?

[Rogue 7]

Words

The author still keeps harem. Not the main focus, but it's still there. Girls with exceptional powers fighting for a single male. It's the TV tropes definition and all.

You miss that at least two thirds of that is played solely for humor, including all the examples you cited.

[Talkkno]

Somewhat off tangent, and feel free to call me crazy but i wanted Ranma to end with Shampoo *Dives into a well*

[Jayngfet]

Where did i miss this?

I think that it was in a book if I'm interpreting tv tropes (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TenchiSolution) correctly (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/BetterThanCanon).

Huh, who new Tenchi'd marry an unintelligible catgirl(albeit last).

[Closet_Skeleton]

The anime adaptation of Kimi kiss pure rouge (an h-game/gal-ge) was quite good in that they invented new male characters so they could do every girl's story. Instead of going down the normal gal-ge adaptation route of adapting the most boring story arc or (for the truly terrible adaptations) starting the story afresh every episode.

[Oslecamo]

You miss that at least two thirds of that is played solely for humor, including all the examples you cited.

Of course it's played for humor. That's the objective of the manga. To entertain the reader.

2/3 of Love Hina was played for humor as well. Are you gonna say Love Hina isn't an harem manga?

By that argument, I could say that there are no harem mangas, because whenever there are a lot of girls hiting in a single guy, it's "played" for romance/drama/perversion/ect.

[Rogue 7]

Of course it's played for humor. That's the objective of the manga. To entertain the reader.

2/3 of Love Hina was played for humor as well. Are you gonna say Love Hina isn't an harem manga?

By that argument, I could say that there are no harem mangas, because whenever there are a lot of girls hiting in a single guy, it's "played" for romance/drama/perversion/ect.

Alright, bad reasoning on my part. I suppose what I meant to say is that the girls cooing over their cute little ten-year-old teacher (with some exceptions) doesn't drive the plot at all, wheras the relationships and the consequences therof were the prime focus of Love Hina. The plot and the focus is on the action. If you're reading this for the harem antics, once they start into the Festival and tournament arcs, you're going to be sorely disappointed for the most part. That, in my view, disqualifies it from being a "harem manga".

[Oslecamo]

If you're reading this for the harem antics, once they start into the Festival and tournament arcs, you're going to be sorely disappointed for the most part. That, in my view, disqualifies it from being a "harem manga".

I strongly disagree. Let's review the festival-tournament arcs shall we?

1-99% of the events happen are being manipulated by the martian future girl(MFG).

2-The MFG knew that Negi was one of the few people who could stop him, and still choose to study right on front of him. Negi-kun is so atractive that world conquerers risk their plans just so they can be near him.

3-The MFG had lots of chances to win, but choose to give Negi a fighting chance because she likes him. Inspiring the students to fight, giving Negi lots of clues, puting herself in plain view in the final fight, ect, ect. Negi-Kun is too cute for her to go all out on him.

4-The MFG defeats Negi's army by throwing them a book wich speaks of Negi's future personal life, leading them to kock each other out trying to get the book. The fate of the world is less important than knowing who Negi-Kun will marry.


5-Besides, the girls were willing to risk their lifes fighting to save Negi, even when there was a great chance that by not saving him and going back in time the rest of the world could actually end upa much better place if magic was revealed to the common mortals. But of course, it would mean not seeing Negi for years, maybe never again. Negi-Kun is more important than making the world a better place.

6-When Negi goes to not-so-happy-magic-land, the powerless half of the class follows him because they want to stay with him, despite being warned time and time again that it's simply too dangerous. Negi Kun's harem is ready to follow him to hell and back again.

My points is, for that class, nothing else matters as long as they can stay with Negi-Kun and hug/kiss/play with him. Wich is kinda understandable, since they're all geting magic powers for making dates smooch things pacts with him. Hell, what girl wouldn't want a boyfriend like that?

If the girls didn't cooed so much over Negi, the plot would fall apart. There wouldn't be damsels in distress all asking for his atention, or mighty battle maidens ready to lie down their lifes for him, nor vampires ready to spill out the deepest secrets of magic in return for some flirting.

[Rogue 7]

You missed a very important point about the MFG-

You do realize that Chao is his granddaughter or something similar, correct? That casts all your claims in a very creepy light.

Also take into account that a large part of her plans are also based around getting Negi to join her side- and she almost pulls it off. Her moral ambiguity helped her as well- Takamichi hesitated when he could have taken her out, and caused Negi considerable problems. Chao's an interesting entity in the way she tried to accomplish her plans. She needed access to certain people in Negi's class- Chachamaru, Hakase, and Tatsumiya- to pull off her plan, so just up and leaving when Negi showed up wasn't really an option. The tournament was set up specifically to showcase the magical ability of the various contestants, and her reveal of her location at the end nearly had the end result of turning Negi. Also take into account she didn't count on him figuring out the Cassiopiea or being able to defeat her magic tatto-things.

With regards to not going all out- Chao was committed to pulling off her plan without any injuries. Hiring Tatsumiya to snipe Negi after the tournament or something would go against everything she was trying to accomplish. Not to mention, it'd probably piss Eva off something awful, and that would not be good for her.

Point 4- that one was a throwaway joke after she had already lost. If she'd deployed it in the middle of combat, it would not have been as effective.

Point 5- See my above reference to Nakama. They're his friends and comrades, and this is shonen. Of course they'll be willing to do that. The main cast of Bleach would do the same. That does not give it an explicit romantic bent. You seem to be overly hung up on the fact that they're all females. Let's take a look at the group in the magic world. Asuna- up in the air, but at this point firmly on the side of brother/sister. Kaede, Chisame, Haruna, Sayo, Asakura, Ku Fei, Akira, and Yuuna have never expressed any sort of "romantic" interest in the kid. Natsumi's got something going on with Kotarou for whatever reason, and Ako's got a crush on "Nagi" (which we know isn't going to end well.) Makie, Nodoka, Yue, and Chachamaru all do have a crush on Negi, but Chachamaru left for a good portion of the time, and he just met up with Nodoka recently. The other two aren't there yet. Setsuna's gay, and Konoka doesn't seem to mind. Oh, and there's Anya, but she hasn't showed up yet. The non-magic girls followed largely because...they wanted to go to England. These are 15-year old girls here, they're somewhat shallow. The main cast (aside from the admittedly several members with explicit romantic interest in him), follow largely because they're his comrades. Not because they've got a romantic interest in him. A lot of the "cooing" and frankly abuse the poor kid takes isn't romantic or meaningful-it's the girls playing around with the kid. There's the difference, and you fail to get that most of the girls do not, in fact, have a thing for him.

[Stormthorn]

I haven't actually watched it, but most Tenchi Muyo stuff apparently ends in implied polygamy, and explicit polygamy in one side-story. I think it's even legal for the aliens...

I prefer polyamorous relationships with no marrying involved. Way less paperwork.

[Krytha]

I prefer polyamorous relationships with no marrying involved. Way less paperwork.

I wonder how often that works out.

[Nerd-o-rama]

I prefer polyamorous relationships with no marrying involved. Way less paperwork.Tax breaks. And in the specific case of Tenchi, like Emperorship of the Galaxy or something.

[turkishproverb]

Tax breaks. And in the specific case of Tenchi, like Emperorship of the Galaxy or something.

lol. priceless. soooo tempted to change my sig.

[Nerd-o-rama]

In my self-deprecating opinion, that one requires too much context. But thanks, and go ahead if you feel like it.

[turkishproverb]

In my self-deprecating opinion, that one requires too much context. But thanks, and go ahead if you feel like it.

STOP SAYING QUOTABLE THINGS!

[Belteshazzar]

For some reason I remember the Empire of Juri controlling significantly less than the entire Galaxy. Somewhat closer to a single arm with possible extensions over an entire quadrant. Fo9r some reason I remember that they were actualy closer to an advanced pirate guild or the mafia only a few generations ago (still a long time with clinical immortality.) In fact the only reason they have as much power as they do is because of the tree ships. I always figured the galaxy was just waiting for interstellar dutch elms disease or something to reduce them back to simple humans.

[Jayngfet]

For some reason I remember the Empire of Juri controlling significantly less than the entire Galaxy. Somewhat closer to a single arm with possible extensions over an entire quadrant. Fo9r some reason I remember that they were actualy closer to an advanced pirate guild or the mafia only a few generations ago (still a long time with clinical immortality.) In fact the only reason they have as much power as they do is because of the tree ships. I always figured the galaxy was just waiting for interstellar dutch elms disease or something to reduce them back to simple humans.

Unlikely considering the sheer distance between planets in the solar system alone, never mind a star cluster, a whole arm of the galaxy is out of the question.

[Closet_Skeleton]

STOP SAYING QUOTABLE THINGS!

Maybe I should put this in my sig just to spite you :smallyuk:

[Nerd-o-rama]

I should probably remind everyone that I haven't actually watched any Tenchi Muyo, I've just picked up the basics from contact with the fandom.

[Oslecamo]

Tax breaks. And in the specific case of Tenchi, like Emperorship of the Galaxy or something.

Have you got any idea the work it takes to control a galaxy?:smalltongue:

With all the rebel groups, alien invasions, sword waving guys and everything else, things can get ugly pretty quickly if you're the Emperor.

[Jayngfet]

Have you got any idea the work it takes to control a galaxy?:smalltongue:

With all the rebel groups, alien invasions, sword waving guys and everything else, things can get ugly pretty quickly if you're the Emperor.

I bet that the 40K emperor's just faking it at this point.

[Belteshazzar]

Unlikely considering the sheer distance between planets in the solar system alone, never mind a star cluster, a whole arm of the galaxy is out of the question.

Wait, Which part is unlikely? That they controlled that much territory or that I predict the end of their empire resulting from a glorified plant virus?

Because, if controlling an arm of the galaxy seems unlikely it is best to remember that Tenchi is set in an Anime Space Opera, so even galactic level empires are well within scale for such action, the plot requires no less (and most SciFi writers have no sense of scale.)

If its about the my feeble attempt at a joke about "space dutch elms disease" that was just my inner biologist pondering why one would want to use a biological spaceship (aside from the cool factor).

[Jayngfet]

I guess a biological spaceship has a few advantiges

Healing.

Growing new bits(tenchi's prison from episode one).

Growing weapons(tenchi).

Reproducing new spaceships.

[Belteshazzar]

Getting cancer

Growing old (may not be a problem for trees)

Rot

Pain (Farscape covered this one)

Fear

Mating ("Okay! Our our ships have closed to boarding range and ceased fire wait whats that... *thing* That's no airlock I've ever seen!..... Nooooooo!"

Aforementioned diseases.

Nutrition

Annoying personality ("stop spying on me!")

Mental problems?

[Jayngfet]

Getting cancer

Growing old (may not be a problem for trees)

Rot

Pain (Farscape covered this one)

Fear

Mating ("Okay! Our our ships have closed to boarding range and ceased fire wait whats that... *thing* That's no airlock I've ever seen!..... Nooooooo!"

Aforementioned diseases.

Nutrition

Annoying personality ("stop spying on me!")

Mental problems?

1+2: Descended from/ are gods.

3: They're trees none of the bodu parts that feel pain

4: Gods, trained for combat (and most other ships can feel fear too)

7: Sunlight, in space there's lots of it.

There's still a lot of problems but still.

[Closet_Skeleton]

Nuitrition will be no worse than fuel or maintainance costs but ultimately cheaper on labour.

[Talkkno]

1+2: Descended from/ are gods.

3: They're trees none of the bodu parts that feel pain

4: Gods, trained for combat (and most other ships can feel fear too)

7: Sunlight, in space there's lots of it.

There's still a lot of problems but still.

"Captain, I'm picking up an approaching ship."

"What can you tell me about it?"

"Oh my God, it's organic! What are we going to do, Captain?"

"There's not much we can do, Ensign. Organic technology is so far beyond our grasp that we can't even imagine the power they must have. All we have is high-powered guns, nuclear missiles, and our primitive metallic armour. What are you reading from their incredibly advanced bio-ship?"

"Their ship is soft and flexible. Its construction materials are semi-permeable and laced with a network of delicate circulation passages. Instead of using impermeable high-density materials, it's made from countless tiny thin-walled cells which tend to rapidly break down in the presence of corrosive chemicals or radiation."

"What? And we were supposed to be afraid of this? Open fire!"

SQUISH ...

[Jayngfet]

Ahem:

LIGHT HAWK WINGS

That is all.

[SAMAS]

Exactly. They're wooden-bodied ships with big honkin' forcefields.

[SAMAS]

I strongly disagree. Let's review the festival-tournament arcs shall we?

1-99% of the events happen are being manipulated by the martian future girl(MFG).

2-The MFG knew that Negi was one of the few people who could stop him, and still choose to study right on front of him. Negi-kun is so atractive that world conquerers risk their plans just so they can be near him.

By Chao's own admission, half the plan was fighting him in the first place. There was no risk.

Plus, as mentioned before. Great(+?) Granddaughter.


3-The MFG had lots of chances to win, but choose to give Negi a fighting chance because she likes him. Inspiring the students to fight, giving Negi lots of clues, puting herself in plain view in the final fight, ect, ect. Negi-Kun is too cute for her to go all out on him.

As mentioned before, the whole major point of her plan was to fight him, and for them both to go all out. She even told her partner that if she lost the fight, scrub the mission, no matter how close you are to succeeding.

Chao did all that to fight against him. Negi's considerable cuteness had nothing to do with it.


4-The MFG defeats Negi's army by throwing them a book wich speaks of Negi's future personal life, leading them to kock each other out trying to get the book. The fate of the world is less important than knowing who Negi-Kun will marry.


She was already defeated (and the earth thus "saved") when she pulled that stunt.


5-Besides, the girls were willing to risk their lifes fighting to save Negi, even when there was a great chance that by not saving him and going back in time the rest of the world could actually end upa much better place if magic was revealed to the common mortals. But of course, it would mean not seeing Negi for years, maybe never again. Negi-Kun is more important than making the world a better place.

The lasers were clothes-stripping at worst, the bullets only sent you three hours into the future, and the students were wearing protective capes. The only people in danger in that entire battle were Negi and Chao themselves.


6-When Negi goes to not-so-happy-magic-land, the powerless half of the class follows him because they want to stay with him, despite being warned time and time again that it's simply too dangerous. Negi Kun's harem is ready to follow him to hell and back again.

None of the parties involved, Negi included, knew that trip was going to go southwards when they went. Hell, they were supposed to meet one of the members of Ala Rubra (Nagi's squad) when they got there. They had no idea he was gonna blow them off, or that Fate was gonna blow them up.


My points is, for that class, nothing else matters as long as they can stay with Negi-Kun and hug/kiss/play with him. Wich is kinda understandable, since they're all geting magic powers for making dates smooch things pacts with him. Hell, what girl wouldn't want a boyfriend like that?

Chisame? :D

[turkishproverb]

Maybe I should put this in my sig just to spite you :smallyuk:

sorry. I had to sig this.

[Oslecamo]

By Chao's own admission, half the plan was fighting him in the first place. There was no risk.

Plus, as mentioned before. Great(+?) Granddaughter.


So why sending Negi a week in the future? If she wanted so badly to fight him, there was no need to take such an huge risk on her plan, like Negi being unable to return in time.

She made Negi fight all sort of oponents before reaching her. If she wanted a fight, why wear him down so much? Or the whole robot army?

Plus she was ready to sacrifice her life just to fight him?

She traveled trough time, raised a robot army strong enough to control the world, corrupted her body with dark magic, binded demons, all only to fight with his great granddad?


Doesn't sound very plausable to me, specially. That or the people of the future have waaayyyyy too much free time in the future.

Or entertaining the readers. Ok, that's a good reason too. Let's make a giant battle between a mechanincal martian robot army and high school magicians because it will be cool!

Excuse me while I go bang my head on the wall for taking mangas so seriously.

[Kojiro Kakita]

Exactly. They're wooden-bodied ships with big honkin' forcefields.

LOL, don't forget people, the LIGHT HAWK WINGS CAN BE USED AS WEAPONS.

But for a harem ending, the Shuffle Manga. It follows Sia's route and since in the god's realm polygamy is possible, well, you can see what happens.

[Fri]

Meh, that's what Fanfiction for. Still, I usually root for the flag pairing, and have a personal favourite for myself (Kitsune and Evangeline respectfully, from Love Hina and Negima).

The only harem-y series that make me think hard is.... School Rumble.

Damnit, I like them both. Not for me, but for the main character. Both girl fits the main character and interact with him very well.

[Pokemaster]

All harem series follow the same basic plot:

1- Lead meets the harem.

2- Lead acts like an inconsiderate jerk for the rest of the series, girls will refuse to tell him that they love him (and demand all his attention anyway) and side characters will create a series of moronic situations to stretch out the series.

3- At the last possible moment, the lead will pick the first girl he saw to be his girlfriend.

The problem is that the entire show sets up a relationship that's never developed or even shown, so it's a disappointment no matter what happens because you never get a real ending.

[SAMAS]

So why sending Negi a week in the future? If she wanted so badly to fight him, there was no need to take such an huge risk on her plan, like Negi being unable to return in time.

She made Negi fight all sort of oponents before reaching her. If she wanted a fight, why wear him down so much? Or the whole robot army?

Because she couldn't just make it easy. This was more than just for a one-on-one fight. This was also a match of wits, skill, leadership, and their respective forces/allies.


Plus she was ready to sacrifice her life just to fight him?

No, that was a miscalculation.



She traveled trough time, raised a robot army strong enough to control the world, corrupted her body with dark magic, binded demons, all only to fight with his great granddad?


Doesn't sound very plausable to me, specially. That or the people of the future have waaayyyyy too much free time in the future.

Or entertaining the readers. Ok, that's a good reason too. Let's make a giant battle between a mechanincal martian robot army and high school magicians because it will be cool!

Honestly, we don't know anything about Chao's present. Although some indications seem to suggest it's not a very happy one.


Excuse me while I go bang my head on the wall for taking mangas so seriously.

Yeah. Shame on you. (BellisariosMaxim) :smallbiggrin:

[SAMAS]

All harem series follow the same basic plot:

1- Lead meets the harem.

2- Lead acts like an inconsiderate jerk for the rest of the series, girls will refuse to tell him that they love him (and demand all his attention anyway) and side characters will create a series of moronic situations to stretch out the series.

Actually, he's usually too clueless to notice their feelings, or too shy to voice his own, rather than being a jerk.


The problem is that the entire show sets up a relationship that's never developed or even shown, so it's a disappointment no matter what happens because you never get a real ending.

My peeve is when they make the Official choice obvious early on, then proceed to drag it out for another twenty episodes or more.

[Closet_Skeleton]

My peeve is when they make the Official choice obvious early on, then proceed to drag it out for another twenty episodes or more.

EVen when they don't, it's still obvious that it will be the annoying Pink haired girl that only the Japanese fans find attractive.

Maburaho had a novel ending, the main character got copied at least 50 times so everyone could end up with him.

[The Evil Thing]

Would Fate/Stay Night count as harem? At the end all the female characters are either living in Shiro's house, or dead.

Poor Saber. Sob.

Yes, she does get the short end of the stick, especially in Heaven's Feel.

If we're going for quantity over quality, the Unlimited Blade Works Good End is probably the best with Shirou maintaining three out of three haremettes and projecting not just Archer's Kanshou and Bakuya but also some of his Gar.


Poor Rider, she's the Sacchin of F/SN. ;_; She doesn't so too badly in Fate/Hollow Ataraxia though. :smallredface::smallamused:
Threesome with Shirou and Sakura



Anyway, the whole "first girl wins" thing is in place since harem series are almost invariably comedies and the author probably doesn't want to waste time with a "who's he gonna pick" plotline messing up all the wacky antics that supposedly fuel the comedy.

There are two harem series I'm reading right now that spring to mind where the first girl may not win.

1: Negima - Akamatsu does like to mix things up a little with a particular genre (remember how everyone hated Keitaro at the beginning of Love Hina?) so bear in mind he might choose to keep Asuna's relationship with Negi familial as it is now. Sure, she gets wound up when people suggest romance, but so does Setsuna over Konoka; the two may have some issues to work out but there's no real obvious romance going on here. The way he's built it all up means it's quite reasonable for Nodoka to win in the end (though this could all be a clever ploy).
2: Hayate the Combat Butler - Nagi is the first girl here and she's going to have to jump through a lot of hoops in order for Hayate to even consider her a romantic possibility; he sees her as a little sister right now and has a rather strong crush on Nagi's maid instead. As it stands, unless Hata does some kind of timeskip, a relationship between First Girl and Hayate simply isn't viable. (Poor Nagi, she thinks Hayate is in love with her.)

I haven't read Ranma 1/2 but I heard that none of the girls won since the huge tangle of contracts, promises and whatnot meant he couldn't choose one girl without making a horrible mess.


At the risk of sounding unforgivably cliché, harem manga isn't about the destination, it's about the journey. When it comes down to it, mangaka need to eat, and so they fill up their love story between two inarticulate and shy, impossibly good looking, people with other inarticulate but not at all shy females and so hilarity ensues as misunderstandings pop up with such frequency you'd think everyone would learn to stop and consider what really happened for a few seconds before punching our fearless feckless hero into low orbit. When they (or rather, the publishers*) have had enough, they already have a plot resolution ready to go that won't surprise anyone, but won't leave anything exactly missing, either.

"{Insert character name} no baka~!"
"Iyaa~n, {Insert character name} no hentai!"

Meanwhile, Elfen Lied stands on the sidelines, blowing a big raspberry before going off to conduct more impromptu anatomy examinations.

*RIP Mx0, gone too soon from this world.

[Manga Shoggoth]

She traveled trough time, raised a robot army strong enough to control the world, corrupted her body with dark magic, binded demons, all only to fight with his great granddad?



No. She travelled back in time to reveal the magical world to the mundane world. She succeeded until Negi and company managed to jump back in time by a week and derail her plans.


Doesn't sound very plausable to me, specially. That or the people of the future have waaayyyyy too much free time in the future.

All the hints are that her future is ... not good.


Or entertaining the readers. Ok, that's a good reason too. Let's make a giant battle between a mechanincal martian robot army and high school magicians because it will be cool!

Excuse me while I go bang my head on the wall for taking mangas so seriously.

Entertainment is the whole point (and making money for the author, of course...).

[Aquillion]

I take pleasure in watching nasty characters in a harem break down emotionally (It's beautiful to watch characters get what's coming to them) although they always get rebuffed gently if they admit to the protagonist that they've "come to like them". That's a problem, and one that needs to be sorted.Have you watched Higurashi no Naku Koro ni?

You might like it.

[Blayze]

As it stands, unless Hata does some kind of timeskip, a relationship between First Girl and Hayate simply isn't viable.

That's why there's the Unlucky Childhood Friend (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/UnluckyChildhoodFriend) trope, too.


Have you watched Higurashi no Naku Koro ni?

Not yet, no. I've heard of it, though. In what way does it suit me? (Other than the killing and the like)

[Oslecamo]

No. She travelled back in time to reveal the magical world to the mundane world. She succeeded until Negi and company managed to jump back in time by a week and derail her plans.


That's what I was discussing.

Once Negi went back on time, Chao started going easy on him. She even reinforced the moral of the student army when they were being pushed back, when she could just as easily have made them run away on fear and win the day. If she really wanted to reveal the magical world, well, she must have been really drunk that night, because she seemed a lot more concerned in having a personal duel with Negi.

[Closet_Skeleton]

That's why there's the Unlucky Childhood Friend (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/UnluckyChildhoodFriend) trope, too.

Yeah, the problem with exceptions is that if they get done more than once they stop being exceptions.

[Aquillion]

Not yet, no. I've heard of it, though. In what way does it suit me? (Other than the killing and the like)Mainly because it acknowledges that nasty characters are, well, nasty.