I feel like I'm not doing something...

[Akisa]

When I first joined the group there wasn't any melee so I joined as melee cleric I was having quite a bit of fun. However over time and a few levels more melee started arriving and I felt it was best retire my cleric and bring a bard so they won't be outshined. However I get the feeling I'm a bit a useless even though I have optimized my bard for support.

I know this is not the case as I done a lot to the help group. There was one incident where the pc wanted to break into a prince's home and steal pieces of artifacts that we were collecting to destroy. I managed to convince the group to hold off in breaking and entering and through role playing I was able to convince the prince these artifacts were evil and should be destroyed. And then ultimately also gain info on the next target.

As for combat the other PCs say they enjoy my +6 to hit and dmg. I also cast improve invisibility on the rogue, and haste on the group allowing them to be more effective in combat.

How do I go about shaking this feeling of useless even though deep down inside I know I'm not useless.

[Theodoxus]

Is it because you're not directly contributing to the lowering of hit points on your opponents? I know when I was playing an abjurer in an epic game, I felt that way. Sure, I kept the party alive and buffed everyone nicely, but the only damage I contributed directly was when I pulled out my +5 composite longbow of speed and shot the crap out of baddies.

Sometimes, you just have to remember that you're not the one dealing damage, you're the one helping everyone else. If it helps, keep track of those +6 damage modifiers and at the end of the combat, tally them up. You'll be pleasantly surprised at how much damage you actually did do - even if it was vicariously.

If that doesn't help, then I guess it's time to wade into combat poking with your rapier and singing like a diva.


However, if I'm off base, I apologize - I have nothing for ya.

[de-trick]

your the man behind the scenes, your not taking the big baddys down as in fighting, but you are assisting, your buffing the party and giving bonuses to help them

[Starsinger]

Is it because you're not directly contributing to the lowering of hit points on your opponents? I know when I was playing an abjurer in an epic game, I felt that way. Sure, I kept the party alive and buffed everyone nicely, but the only damage I contributed directly was when I pulled out my +5 composite longbow of speed and shot the crap out of baddies.

Sometimes, you just have to remember that you're not the one dealing damage, you're the one helping everyone else. If it helps, keep track of those +6 damage modifiers and at the end of the combat, tally them up. You'll be pleasantly surprised at how much damage you actually did do - even if it was vicariously.

Of course, if that really is your problem, you could always try 4e, wherein you get to shoot your laserbeams and buff with them too.

Still, it's very possible that you don't want to be the "Wind beneath their wings" type, and that's fine. Playing support from the shadows isn't an easy thing. It's a hard lot, people will blame you when they miss despite your buffs, but rarely will they thank you when they hit only because you gave them +6 to hit. So you have to ask yourself, do you want a thankless job where you know you're contributing but you feel useless?

If the answer to that is no, then the only thing I can suggest is to stop being a support character. The game is primarily about having fun, and if you're not having fun with your character, you shouldn't have to play it.

[Akisa]

Of course, if that really is your problem, you could always try 4e, wherein you get to shoot your laserbeams and buff with them too.

Still, it's very possible that you don't want to be the "Wind beneath their wings" type, and that's fine. Playing support from the shadows isn't an easy thing. It's a hard lot, people will blame you when they miss despite your buffs, but rarely will they thank you when they hit only because you gave them +6 to hit. So you have to ask yourself, do you want a thankless job where you know you're contributing but you feel useless?

If the answer to that is no, then the only thing I can suggest is to stop being a support character. The game is primarily about having fun, and if you're not having fun with your character, you shouldn't have to play it.

actually I have never been blame for missing, but thanked a lot for allowing the group to power attack.

[SoD]

If all else fails, request to your DM that something happens (anything from kidnapping to a simple family problem) that might put your character out of action for a short amount of time, and if you can play a different character, just for a session (or even shorter). Or NPC some of the monsters from random encounters, make it easier for the DM for a little bit. That way, you'll see how your party does without your character, and still have it so you can come back.

This way either: you'll see that really, although you're not the one dealing damage, etc. you're a big help for it, or:

You'll find out that, actually, your character isn't as useful as it could be. This gives you one of two options:

1: retire the character for a more combat orientated character, or:
B: Stick with your current character.

I'd reccomend option B, as DnD isn't all combat orientated, as long as you enjoy playing your character. If you're not enjoying playing your character, I'd suggest going straight to option 1, without seeing how useful it actually was.

Just my 2cp worth.

[SpydersWebbing]

Go 4th or switch out to another character until they start missing the Bard.

[SoD]

For the record, I'd not suggest trying to get the group to go 4e. Please note, I haven't played 4e, and this is NOT me saying that 4e is bad. I haven't played yet, and therefore don't have a valid opinion of it. My reasoning: generally, switching over from one edition mid-campaign can be really difficult, for DM and for players, and it screws with the realalisticness of the setting. If you're happy with this campaign, and also want to try 4e, have 2 campaigns running at once, a 3.5e and a 4e. This is what I'm doing at the moment.

I'm DMing a 3.5e, playing a 3.5e, and about to start playing in a 4e, although I must admit, I'm a bit sceptic about 4e...I'm happy with 3.5e, but, as mentioned earlier, my opinion isn't valid.

[Starsinger]

For the record, I'd not suggest trying to get the group to go 4e.

Sorry, I didn't even consider the fact that I might have came across as suggesting this. I am not advocating switching mid-game either. But I am suggesting if you enjoy playing support characters but despise feeling "useless" because you aren't doing anything noticeable, that you look into 4e.

[Jack Zander]

Switching editions mid campaign just because one character is unhappy is very sad advice. It's great that you think 4e is the system to end all systems, but switching systems like that is just not feasible.

Edit: Erm... nevermind then ninjas.

[Akisa]

I'm sorry 4e doesn't appeal to me, as it makes everyone including spell casters and melee into ToB or spell casters. But that is another topic...

I also notice people saying taking a break and have other players miss my character. That is not what I'm trying to accomplish, the other players already express my character's usefulness. I'm more concern of shaking the uneasiness of myself feeling useless.


It's like being a sports player of a team and then get hurt and be sent on the sideline as a coach. You pick the plays to win the game but you still wish you were on the field.

[Ranis]

I have been playing a bard in a single game for two years. How do I stay sane? I keep a running total of the damage I've caused in tallys on the backside of my character sheet.

Running total so far is 845 damage. We're about to hit level 9. This number keeps me sane. :)

Hiding in the corner and singing is really not for everyone, but playing a bard in a good game with a very even mix of RP and hack/slash really helps crank out the usefulness of a bard.

If you don't get as much RP, I highly reccommend taking the bard alternate class feature in the PHBII that lets you make all skill checks at half maximum skill ranks; it's more useful than many, many, many, many things.

[tyckspoon]

If you want to get in the front lines again a little, you'll need either feats (most effective, but character-resource intensive) or items (not as good, but much, much cheaper.) The primary relevant feats that I know of are Snowflake Wardance [Frostburn], which allows you to use a Bardic Music use to add your Charisma to your to-hit rolls (with slashing one-handers only, unfortunately- basically the longsword out of the bard's normal proficiency list), and Draconic Heritage + Dragonfire Inspiration [Dragon Magic], which gives you the option of switching your +x Inspire Courage bonus to +xd6 energy damage, defaulting to fire.

Itemwise, there's the Slippers of Battledancing [DMG 2] that have a similar effect to the Wardance whenever you move ten feet or more. And the Gauntlets of Heartfelt Blows [Dragon Compendium/Dragon #314] which add your Charisma bonus as fire damage to your melee attacks.

[Knaight]

Keep track of any damage you do indirectly cause/prevent then. If someone would have missed without you, add all of it. Note down every time you make someone succeed on a skill check. Note every successful skill check you pull off that helps the team. Same thing with spells.

The damage thing has been advised multiple times, but do it, and keep tracking the other stuff too.

[ericgrau]

Ok, then it sounds like you're kinda bored and want more action.

I mean, you shouldn't feel useless. Giving out hastes and +6's makes one heck of a useful and well-played bard, and that's saying something.

I'll help with what I can, and maybe after that you can find more answers if you need them:
1. Eliminate all minor buffing. A small buff during combat not only keeps you away from the action, it really isn't worth spending an entire round on it. I once played a sorceror deciding between greater heroism and another spell. I picked the other spell, because I found out that even if I gave that +4 to the party's best warrior, I could do more damage with a fireball. Try to buff outside of combat. Long duration buffs are great when you don't have enough prep rounds for other buffs. You can do them all in the morning and not worry about them while trying to have other fun during game time. Some mass buffs like haste are still worth using during combat because the damage from several buffed allies will add up. But even a lot of mass buffs aren't enough; I'd even think twice before using your bard songs without a prep round.

Okay, you've gotten rid of your helpful things that were really just a waste of time. Now what can you fill the time with that will let you contribute directly?

2. Find good low level spells: Find the spells that a wizard would still cast, even though he also has 7th level spells. Or try spells that only bards can cast. Even high level wizards like to haste (but that's a buff).

0: detect magic, light, prestidigitation
1: alarm, charm person, feather fall, grease, silent image, unseen servant
2: detect thoughts, glitterdust, heroism, invisibility, minor image, pyrotechnics, silence
3: deep slumber, dispel magic, glibness, haste, invisibility sphere, major image, scrying, slow
4: greater invisibility, legend lore, zone of silence
5: greater dispel magic, persistant image, seeming, mass suggestion
6: find the path, heroes feast, permanent image, programmed image, greater scrying, greater shout, veil

Avoid utility spells and healing spells (most spells that I didn't list). These belong on scrolls and wands, not on your main spell list. Maybe you can talk to your DM, explain your situation and ask if you can swap spells.

3. Try skills: You have a lot of skills, read the skill rules carefully and use them. You mentioned using your skills already.

4. See what else your bard can do: Find obscure things like the whip. You can disarm at a 15 foot range with a whip, you get one attempt per attack, a +2, another +4 if you yank with both hands, bards are proficient and you can trip with it too. On the rare ocassion that you run into a particularily nasty armed warrior, you'll be glad you saved the backup option in your bag of tricks. Try to find other things too.

[mabriss lethe]

well, the bard has a few combat options, some of them decent. whirling blade is a decent spell in the hands of a bard (better in the hands of either a hexblade or a spellthief, but that's not important at the moment.) Ray of the Python is a decent debuff and also only 2nd level.

Shadow conjuration/evocation can do in a pinch to cover a wide variety of spells.

can't think of a whole lot off the top of the head right now

[Jimp]

If your bard takes some ranks in UMD you could, depending on your DM's allowance, pick up some wands and use them to help more in combat. Without going bataman-via-glowsticks on the party, you could pick up simple damaging spells (scorching ray, magic missile, the orb series) or some minor disabling spells (insert endless list here) to further help the party.