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expirement10K14
2008-08-11, 11:26 AM
I am new to ToB, well, I am just actually starting to use it.

Campaign-
Level 1
Stat Generation Unknown

I just got permission to use ToB so I wanted to play an Unarmed Swordsage. I wanted to specialize in Shadow Blade, although any works. I am getting IUS at level 1, and I was thinking of taking a flaw in order to take Light Armor Proficiency, although I may drop this and take Shadow Sun Ninja Later.

My question is what races/stances/maneuvers/feats are good for an Unarmed Swordsage?

Books allowed-
Magic Item Compendium
Monster manual 1-4
PHB 1,2
DMG 1,2
Players Guide to Faerun
Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting
Races of Faerun
Complete Divine and Arcane
Magic of Faerun
Tome of Magic
Tome of Battle
Unearthed Arcana
Arms and Equipment Guide


And possibly a few others.

Neon Knight
2008-08-11, 01:15 PM
The neat thing about ToB is that the vast majority of the stuff is entirely competent right out of the book. Most maneuvers are solid and useful and employing them is straight forward and easy to accomplish. It's hard to make a ToB character that can't pull its own weight without engaging in purposeful sabotage.

First, feats. Adaptive Style is sort of the "Natural Spell" for Swordsages. Any Swordsage can benefit immensely from taking this feat, and have no good reason not to take it. It allows you to change out your readied maneuvers in one turn, instead of the normal 5 minutes. It will greatly increase your versatility.

If you're going Shadow Blade, make sure you have a solid Dex modifier, but don't sacrifice STR to do it or add Weapon Finesse to let you use you Dex for both. To be honest, I've always felt that most of ToB classes damage comes from the maneuver, not from any plusses attached to the maneuver, and thus maneuver accuracy is of higher concern than damage modifiers, but whatever floats your boat. Plenty of people would argue with me on that, and maneuvers/builds employing multiple attacks (Time Stands Still, Wolf Fang Strike, basically some Tiger Claw/Diamond Mind moves) can benefit greatly from them.

You can take maneuvers from any discipline available to you and be okay. The Desert Flame fire maneuvers should be taken extremely sparingly, however. An unarmed Swordsage is little different from a normal Swordsage, really. Just like the difference between a long sword using Warblade and a great axe using Warblade are extremely slight.

There are all sorts of neat combos you can make. For instance, take the 3rd lvl Shadow Hand stance Assassin's Stance, which grants you sneak attack. Combine with Distracting Ember, a lvl 1 Desert Flame boost that summons a flanking fire elemental. Delicious, no? Add a multi-attack maneuver to rack up the sneak attack.

Race and equipment matter less, so long as you can keep your to-hit and AC high enough.

Darrin
2008-08-11, 01:23 PM
I am getting IUS at level 1, and I was thinking of taking a flaw in order to take Light Armor Proficiency, although I may drop this and take Shadow Sun Ninja Later.


I wouldn't bother with Light Armor Proficiency. If the light armor has no armor check penalty (and mithril, which reduces the armor check by 3, is only +1000 GP for light armor), you can wear it without the proficiency. There are also lots of other classes/prcs that offer better armor proficiencies.

Also, Shadow Sun Ninja is a horrible PrC... lousy BAB, lousy maneuver progression, and some rather wonky class abilities. The only thing it really has going for it is some interesting flavor, and it advances some monk abilities like unarmed damage. However, keep in mind that an Unarmed SwordSage is not the same thing as a monk, and SSN won't improve a monk ability you don't have, such as your unarmored speed bonus or Stunning Fist uses. Also, while it will eventually reduce your Flurry penalty to zero, you won't get Greater Flurry, which is an exclusive monk class ability.



My question is what races/stances/maneuvers/feats are good for an Unarmed Swordsage?


It depends on what you're trying to do. SwordSages are a bit like Formula-1 racecars... they need to be designed and fine-tuned for a specific purpose, while a Warblade is more like a camaro and a Crusader is more like a pick-up truck. So far, it sounds like you want to optimize unarmed damage, which is fine. Some general recommendations in that direction:

Pick up Superior Unarmed Strike and Improved Natural Attack ASAP. Check if your DM will allow Magic of Incarnum, since there's another feat in there that will boost your unarmed damage by another size category (Shape Soulmeld and Open Lesser Chakra, binding Totem Avatar to your shoulder slot).

Get big, either via Enlarge Person or Expansion. While there is a belt of growth in the MIC, 3000 GP for 3/day is a rip-off. A command-word 1st level spell item with unlimited uses should only cost 1800 GP, or 4000 GP for use-activated/continuous. Getting bigger increases your reach, unarmed damage, and your grapple bonus, and if you're into all those Setting Sun throws, allows you to throw larger opponents.

Picking up pounce is also good, either with Spirit Lion Totem Barbarian, Lion Tribe Warrior, or Incarnum again (Shape Soulmeld + Open Least Chakra, Sphynx Claws = full attack on charge w/ natural weapons).

Race: Human, Strongheart Halfing, or Snow Elf should be fine for most purposes. Whisper Gnome for anything stealthy, but avoid the Setting Sun/grappling maneuvers if you're small.

Stances: Island of Blades will make the party rogue extremely happy. Assassin's Stance at SwordSage 5 turns you into something of a rogue, as well as help you qualify for Staggering Strike. If you're going Shadow Blade, then you'll spend 99% of your time in one of these two stances. Shifting Defense, depending on how the DM interprets it, might make you nigh-unhittable.

Maneuvers: Again, it depends on what you're trying to do. They get the best pick of the disciplines, and they get the most maneuvers, but unless you know beforehand what you're doing, they may come off as an underpowered mess.

Your strongest disciplines will most likely be Diamond Mind and Tiger Claw. Desert Wind is a bit too preoccupied with burning things, and after a few CRs everybody and their dog tends to have fire resistance. Setting Sun has a few good counters, but is otherwise pretty lousy, particularly those throws that won't work on anything two sizes larger than you are. Shadow Hand has some great stances and the three Shadow Jump maneuvers, but most of the strikes require a lot of easy saves before you can even consider them as mediocre. Stone Dragon has Mountain Hammer and then you can ignore the rest of it.

Eldariel
2008-08-11, 01:32 PM
Shadow Sun Ninja is actually awesome - best maneuver progression, incredible class features, the ability to heal a lot, Monk-features without the suck inherent to the class, etc. 2 levels of Monk + 9 levels of SSN = full Flurry; just take 2 levels of Monk at some point (2 feats, evasion, flurry - it's worth it) and you're fine.