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celestialkin
2008-08-13, 09:24 AM
http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e189/Celestialdragon100/40elves.png
http://wizards.com/

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e189/Celestialdragon100/untitled-2.png
http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/burningcrusade/townhall/bloodelves.html


http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e189/Celestialdragon100/blood_elves.jpg


Hmmm...

Burley
2008-08-13, 09:28 AM
Oh my gosh! I see it. Both of their elves have pointy ears! And...cloaks? What? This is ridiculous! I demand that we... Wait... Is that... No! No, they didn't. How dare they imply that elves can use magic! This is a travesty wrapped in a trajedy.

Seriously, though: World of Warcraft is based on D&D. Who cares if they use similar color schemes for elves...which are both based on LotR.

Prophaniti
2008-08-13, 09:31 AM
Well, yeah. Everyone knows 4e is WoW played on a table top.

Seriously, though, elves are elves. We expect a similarity between them, and are often bothered when the elves in setting X are not like the elves in setting Y. This particular artwork is strikingly similar, but all you can infer from that is the possibility that the artist was inspired by WoW's BE artwork.

Eladrin were a lousy excuse anyway. What exaclty makes them different from Elves again? Oh, they live in the faerie dimension still. So I guess Eladrin are the brits and Elves are americans? or something like that. All analogies are flawed anyway.

Jimp
2008-08-13, 09:33 AM
Three images of stereotypical elves in red clothing?
Well then. I think we can throw science out the window and just fall to our knees and pray for redemption.

Tormsskull
2008-08-13, 09:34 AM
So I guess Eladrin are the brits and Elves are americans? or something like that. All analogies are flawed anyway.

ooooooo. U started it. It is so on now! :smalltongue:

SpikeFightwicky
2008-08-13, 09:39 AM
Oh my gosh! I see it. Both of their elves have pointy ears! And...cloaks? What? This is ridiculous! I demand that we... Wait... Is that... No! No, they didn't. How dare they imply that elves can use magic! This is a travesty wrapped in a trajedy.

Seriously, though: World of Warcraft is based on D&D. Who cares if they use similar color schemes for elves...which are both based on LotR.

Technically, it's not an elf being pictured in the 'D&D Insider' pic. I'm pretty sure it's an Eladrin. Also not that the D&D dude's ears are about 1/4 the length of the WoW Blood Elf's hyper-ears.

So I guess pointy eared humanoids wearing red are the sole property of Blizzard now?

UglyPanda
2008-08-13, 09:45 AM
The face is much more gaunt in the D&D picture, the poses don't match, the eyes are a different color, and the eyebrows are realistic compared to the World of Warcraft antennae.

You can't be thinking that they're ripping off the artwork, since that seems unlikely. If you're implying that they ripped off the design, then that's like saying gnomes are ripped off of Munchkins from The Wizard of Oz. Just because two things are similar does not mean that one is ripped off of the other. Just because two things might have had the same inspiration does not mean one is ripped off the other.

PnP Fan
2008-08-13, 01:09 PM
All analogies are flawed anyway.

All absolute statements are flawed as well.
4. . 3. ..2. ..1. .



oh wait. .dangit!
;-)

TopRamen
2008-08-13, 01:18 PM
All absolute statements are flawed as well.
4. . 3. ..2. ..1. .



oh wait. .dangit!
;-)

"Everyone generalizes from a single example. At least I do."

(probably misquoted from Steven Brust's Issola)

Fiendish_Dire_Moose
2008-08-13, 01:20 PM
All absolute statements are flawed as well.
4. . 3. ..2. ..1. .



oh wait. .dangit!
;-)

Only a sith deals in absolutes....CRAP!

Anyway, it's an elf. WHOO! OMG IT MUST BE WOW AS BLIZZARD INVENTED ELVES LLLOLOLLOLOLOLOLL!!!

In all seriousness when I got the 4e books I kind of noticed the striking similarities between Eladrin and Blood Elves. The blonde hair, the glowing green eyes, the poor excuse of an elf. SO, yes there are definite similarities, but you still have to understand, D&D, was here first. So, if anyone is ripping off of anyone, D&D gets the win.

CASTLEMIKE
2008-08-13, 01:35 PM
http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e189/Celestialdragon100/40elves.png
http://wizards.com/

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e189/Celestialdragon100/untitled-2.png
http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/burningcrusade/townhall/bloodelves.html


http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e189/Celestialdragon100/blood_elves.jpg


Hmmm...

Nice catch. :smile:

Tormsskull
2008-08-13, 01:46 PM
Spoilers are your friends people, seriously:



image links here

Chronicled
2008-08-13, 01:52 PM
Aragorn sees a similarity!

http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb177/ClericofPhwarrr/notquite.png

(courtesy DM of the Rings)

Edit: Some people seem to have missed the sarcasm. To clarify: I disagree with the OP.

nagora
2008-08-13, 02:44 PM
So I guess Eladrin are the brits and Elves are americans? or something like that.
No: elves are generic and attract no licensing fees; Eladrin are trademarked and copyright and are thus a way of forcing 3rd parties to pay up for publishing 4e-compatible products. That's the real difference.

celestialkin
2008-08-13, 08:57 PM
Oh, and don't forget the new look thieflings have been given to reseble that other race.


Tiefling:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4UqFPujRZWo

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e189/Celestialdragon100/1342872.jpg
http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e189/Celestialdragon100/224847_88550779_wycgpazf.jpg


Can anyone still deny a connection?

Eldariel
2008-08-13, 09:29 PM
Sorry, I was way too busy looking at the pictures to notice anything. This confirms, beyond the shadow of a doubt, the theory of "the less clothes, the more powerful" that was presented on female characters aeons ago.

UglyPanda
2008-08-13, 09:33 PM
Two things: What's the source of the picture on top? The Tiefling in the video you linked to is red, not blue. Are you trying to say that they're intentionally changed the color? I don't think Tieflings have ever had an official color.

Edit:
http://jennieyuen.cgsociety.org/gallery/523131/

After a bit of searching, I found the bloody source. That's rather deceptive to have two pictures of the same thing when your first post had the first picture of something different.

Then again, I may have been the only person confused. However, Tieflings have had horns for practically forever. Look at the 3.5 picture:
http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/MM35_gallery/MM35_PG209.jpg

shadow_archmagi
2008-08-13, 09:34 PM
Eldarin were a way of settling the elf-conflict. In some generic fantasy things, elves are magic-centric people who live in gurt big towers and cast spells all day and HATE going outside except in their magically perfect garden.

In others, they're nature-lovers who sleep in a tree and eat their meat raw and are stealthy and fast and stuff.

Previously, we called them "Wood elves" and "High elves" because one slept in trees and one thought he was better than everyone else. Now for some reason we need to invent long, hard to spell names.

Neon Knight
2008-08-13, 09:36 PM
Oh, and don't forget the new look thieflings have been given to reseble that other race.
Can anyone still deny a connection?

Yup. Horned humanoids are an old, old, oooooooooooollldddd thing. Almost something of a recurring cultural motif. Satyrs, anyone?

Stereotypical contemporary demons are somewhat humanoid figures with bestial features, usually including horns, webbed wings, tails, and red skin. Tieflings look like that. They do not have hooves or back-canted legs. They are not blue.

Counter picture:
http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/wowwiki/images/thumb/0/0b/BlessingoftheNaaru.jpg/433px-BlessingoftheNaaru.jpg

Also, the use of thieflings instead of tieflings is slightly chuckleworthy. Even if no thievery has occurred.

monty
2008-08-13, 09:40 PM
Sorry, I was way too busy looking at the pictures to notice anything. This confirms, beyond the shadow of a doubt, the theory of "the less clothes, the more powerful" that was presented on female characters aeons ago.

To quote Chainmail Bikini (too bad it died):
"Male fighters envelop their bodies in bulky, clanking plate mail. Female fighters favor stiff metal underwear.

A male rogue will wear dark leather armor with little metal studs all over it, because nothing says "stealth" like a bunch of glittering bits of metal all over the place. Ladies in the same profession lean towards the skin-tight catsuit look, because the first step in being stealthy is apparently to make sure every able-bodied man within a hundred paces is staring at you with his mouth slightly open.

Male wizards wrap themselves in thick shapeless woolen robes that would - let's face it - collect odors at an astounding rate. These robes would most likely be heavy, and itch like a fiberglass jockstrap. On the other hand, females who practice the arcane arts wear little strips of translucent gauze over their naughty bits.

It's nice to see that when it comes to apparel, roleplaying games have a lot of equality: Everybody dresses like an idiot."


So I guess Eladrin are the brits and Elves are americans? or something like that. All analogies are flawed anyway.

How dare you compare those pansies to the noble British and American people?

celestialkin
2008-08-13, 09:47 PM
Two things: What's the source of the picture on top? The Tiefling in the video you linked to is red, not blue. Are you trying to say that they're intentionally changed the color? I don't think Tieflings have ever had an official color.

Edit:
http://jennieyuen.cgsociety.org/gallery/523131/

After a bit of searching, I found the bloody source. That's rather deceptive to have two pictures of the same thing when your first post had the first picture of something different.

Then again, I may have been the only person confused. However, Tieflings have had horns for practically forever. Look at the 3.5 picture:
http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/MM35_gallery/MM35_PG209.jpg

Oh, wait. You thought it was a tiefling? Hmm....I wonder why...

And yes, the tieflings have had horns and have been around longer. However, the tiefling's look in 4.0 is (supposedly) new. Plus they were never a Core race before, and the assimar still isn't for some strange unmentioned reason.


And I am sorry if you were confused. I did not mean to be deceptive. However, your confusion and automatic assumption that it was a tiefling might reflect/support what I was trying to get across there.

UglyPanda
2008-08-13, 09:50 PM
It wasn't because they were similar, it was because you put them one after another and didn't source the first one. The first one isn't even official art for either game.

Covered In Bees
2008-08-13, 09:51 PM
Are you people serious?

"Look, 4E has tall, pretty, blond, magical elves! CLEARLY THEY RIPPED THIS OFF FROM WORLD OF WARCRAFT OMG4EISAMOREPIG"

Come on.

Neon Knight
2008-08-13, 09:51 PM
It wasn't because they were similar, it was because you put them one after another and didn't source the first one. The first one isn't even official art for either game.

And neither happen to show the Draenei from the waste down, which kinda blows a big hole in his argument.

celestialkin
2008-08-13, 09:56 PM
Yup. Horned humanoids are an old, old, oooooooooooollldddd thing. Almost something of a recurring cultural motif. Satyrs, anyone?

Stereotypical contemporary demons are somewhat humanoid figures with bestial features, usually including horns, webbed wings, tails, and red skin. Tieflings look like that. They do not have hooves or back-canted legs. They are not blue.

Counter picture:
http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/wowwiki/images/thumb/0/0b/BlessingoftheNaaru.jpg/433px-BlessingoftheNaaru.jpg

Also, the use of thieflings instead of tieflings is slightly chuckleworthy. Even if no thievery has occurred.


True, but isn't it odd that they were made to look somewhat similar (at least the females) to the WoW ones, and placed in the Core PHB selection of races, yet the Assimars weren't, and all at a time when the WoW fanbase is huge and there were already many rumors going around of a WoW theme/rip-off taking place by WotC?

Also, please forgive any spelling mistakes. I have some difficulties with spelling going back all my life.

monty
2008-08-13, 09:57 PM
Would it kill you all to at least try to use spoiler tags?

Deth Muncher
2008-08-13, 09:58 PM
Seriously, has no one heard the phrase "There are no new ideas" ? I mean really! You're playing games in the fantasy genre. THERE ARE GOING TO BE OVERLAPS.

Deal with it. That's what happens in Fantasy RPGs. The saw few races are used, over and over, with minor changes to avoid incurring fees.

Myatar_Panwar
2008-08-13, 10:03 PM
Oh carp yo. Did you also know that 4e also has gnomes, dwarfs, and humans. WOW. 4e is totally WoW. Completely.

Oh, and freaking swords and bows. Damn.

All sarcasm aside, what is the point of this all? I want to know why you decided to post this.

celestialkin
2008-08-13, 10:08 PM
Oh carp yo. Did you also know that 4e also has gnomes, dwarfs, and humans. WOW. 4e is totally WoW. Completely.

Oh, and freaking swords and bows. Damn.

All sarcasm aside, what is the point of this all? I want to know why you decided to post this.

I honestly wanted to know if anyone else saw the similarities I did. It just surprised me when I first saw that image on the WotC site today.

I actually did not know about the Eladrins (I believe that is the correct spelling) until I saw it mentioned in this thread. However, from their fluff I briefly looked up I now see a few more (down to the glowing eyes, yellow/gold hair, etc).

Neon Knight
2008-08-13, 10:08 PM
True, but isn't it odd that they were made to look somewhat similar (at least the females) to the WoW ones, and placed in the Core PHB selection of races, yet the Assimars weren't, and all at a time when the WoW fanbase is huge and there were already many rumors going around of a WoW theme/rip-off taking place by WotC?

Also, please forgive any spelling mistakes. I have some difficulties with spelling going back all my life.

Well, they've pretty much always looked like that. They really didn't change tieflings up that much. Really, all 4e gave them was a background with lost empires and a generations old fiendish pact of some sort instead of making them the children of demons. And implied rape. (Because, you know. Demons.)

They've always been popular. Despite the fact that they weren't a PHB race I've seen plenty of them. Like, almost as many as I've seen Warforged. It made sense to put them in. The lack of Assimar is due to the inclusion of dragonborn. They already had a good leaning race; why bother with another?

Really, female draenei (freakish legs aside) look like every other horned, odd skin colored race. I bet I can find some more creatures they resemble in 3.E. Their appearance isn't that distinctive (freakish legs aside.)

And those rumors I hear were mostly people like, well...

I won't name names, but I consider them slightly irrational and perhaps a bit inclined to dislike and attempt to discredit 4e.

I don't even play or own 4e, mind you. Currently, I'm trying to find out how many other sentient beings have heard of Savage Worlds in Wichita, Kansas, or are willing to give it a try. So far, it is depressingly few.

The_Werebear
2008-08-13, 10:10 PM
True, but isn't it odd that they were made to look somewhat similar (at least the females) to the WoW ones, and placed in the Core PHB selection of races, yet the Assimars weren't, and all at a time when the WoW fanbase is huge and there were already many rumors going around of a WoW theme/rip-off taking place by WotC?

Also, please forgive any spelling mistakes. I have some difficulties with spelling going back all my life.

...Or, y'know, it could be because Tieflings have looked like that for quite a while.


http://dnd4.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/03/tiefling.jpg

http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/Tiefling_Aasimar_72.jpg

Other than the fact that the 4.0 ones looks like they have bulked up a bit, I would say that that's a clear derivation of the previous style. Which came well before the Dranei were in WoW. And before WoW itself.


Humanoids with Horns and Tails. It's not exactly an exclusive club. It covers both Tieflings, Dranei, and....

http://images.elfwood.com/art/j/e/jennybrook/anthrounicorn.jpg

http://www.avians.net/~hawthorn/muntjac.jpg

http://www.deism.com/images/bible%20monsters%20satyr.jpg

http://home.earthlink.net/~bronzedragon/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/minotaur.gif

monty
2008-08-13, 10:10 PM
And implied rape. (Because, you know. Demons.)

That's the best kind of rape. Implied, that is.

Myatar_Panwar
2008-08-13, 10:16 PM
If anything, the Dranei originated from Satyr (http://www.deism.com/images/bible%20monsters%20satyr.jpg). Thus the Satyr came first, not the Dranei.

Edit: Sudo-ninja'd

Deth Muncher
2008-08-13, 10:16 PM
That's the best kind of rape. Implied, that is.

Wow. I'd so sig that if it wasn't so...just...terrible.

celestialkin
2008-08-13, 10:16 PM
Well, they've pretty much always looked like that. They really didn't change tieflings up that much. Really, all 4e gave them was a background with lost empires and a generations old fiendish pact of some sort instead of making them the children of demons. And implied rape. (Because, you know. Demons.)

They've always been popular. Despite the fact that they weren't a PHB race I've seen plenty of them. Like, almost as many as I've seen Warforged. It made sense to put them in. The lack of Assimar is due to the inclusion of dragonborn. They already had a good leaning race; why bother with another?

Really, female draenei (freakish legs aside) look like every other horned, odd skin colored race. I bet I can find some more creatures they resemble in 3.E. Their appearance isn't that distinctive (freakish legs aside.)

And those rumors I hear were mostly people like, well...

I won't name names, but I consider them slightly irrational and perhaps a bit inclined to dislike and attempt to discredit 4e.

I don't even play or own 4e, mind you. Currently, I'm trying to find out how many other sentient beings have heard of Savage Worlds in Wichita, Kansas, or are willing to give it a try. So far, it is depressingly few.

You make some very good points.

I did not want to troll with this thread, I just wanted to discuss what I believed I saw. Sadly those internet rules are true.


Also, I know how difficult it is to try and get people interested in different systems. I tried it twice, with little success. Just don't give up!

p.s. I believe I did play two games of that system (I had forgotten it's name until now), and it was pretty from during my brief experience. Wish you were around here in Central Florida. I'd jump at the chance for a game of it.

Neon Knight
2008-08-13, 10:18 PM
If anything, the Dranei originated from Satyr (http://www.deism.com/images/bible%20monsters%20satyr.jpg). Thus the Satyr came first, not the Dranei.

You know, thinking about the Draenei as shaved satyrs cosplaying as smurfs is better than Blizzard's retcon. I'm gonna do that from now on.

monty
2008-08-13, 10:21 PM
Wow. I'd so sig that if it wasn't so...just...terrible.

What, would you rather have the rape described to you in detail? I'll have it implied to me, thank you.

Neon Knight
2008-08-13, 10:22 PM
Also, I know how difficult it is to try and get people interested in different systems. I tried it twice, with little success. Just don't give up!



Thanks for the encouragement. Though, my problem is getting them to try a system at all, rather than just a different one.

Deth Muncher
2008-08-13, 10:35 PM
What, would you rather have the rape described to you in detail? I'll have it implied to me, thank you.

Crap. Now I need to figure out how to multi-quote, because this conversation now DESERVES to be sigged.

monty
2008-08-13, 10:35 PM
Crap. Now I need to figure out how to multi-quote, because this conversation now DESERVES to be sigged.

Just nest the quote tags. Nothing fancy.

Collin152
2008-08-13, 10:43 PM
Just nest the quote tags. Nothing fancy.

Recommend you nest the thing within a spoiler tag, too.

Chronos
2008-08-13, 11:00 PM
True, but isn't it odd that they were made to look somewhat similar (at least the females) to the WoW onesYou mean, unrealistically big breasted? Because that's the most distinctive feature I see in the art from both games.

celestialkin
2008-08-13, 11:07 PM
You mean, unrealistically big breasted? Because that's the most distinctive feature I see in the art from both games.

Sadly true. And you forgot their taste in attire.

Sometimes I feel how women are depicted in fantasy art would put IRL strippers and such to shame.

I worry that I might be the only gaming nerd/geek who feels women should be respected a little more than this. That, or I am not as sad/lonely/pathetic/etc as the average stereotypical nerd/geek (and this is coming from a virgin who turned 22 a few hours ago).

Knaight
2008-08-13, 11:17 PM
Its because most gamers are male. Talk about a self fulfilling prophecy meeting a vicious cycle.

Neon Knight
2008-08-13, 11:22 PM
Sadly true. And you forgot their taste in attire.

Sometimes I feel how women are depicted in fantasy art would put IRL strippers and such to shame.

I worry that I might be the only gaming nerd/geek who feels women should be respected a little more than this. That, or I am not as sad/lonely/pathetic/etc as the average stereotypical nerd/geek (and this is coming from a virgin who turned 22 a few hours ago).

Well, I'm kinda with you, but its because I don't find large breasted women all that attractive.

I don't think that it is disrespectful of women at all. They're not really women, you see. I see depictions such as this emphasizing the sexual characteristics to such a degree that we no longer associate them with the idea of woman at all; they're almost pure sexual stimulus, like a grope or something.

Also, I could talk about stereotypical male action hero/super hero physiques, but that ground has been well tread, so I'll only mention it.

OneFamiliarFace
2008-08-13, 11:25 PM
Sadly true. And you forgot their taste in attire.

Sometimes I feel how women are depicted in fantasy art would put IRL strippers and such to shame.

I worry that I might be the only gaming nerd/geek who feels women should be respected a little more than this. That, or I am not as sad/lonely/pathetic/etc as the average stereotypical nerd/geek (and this is coming from a virgin who turned 22 a few hours ago).

Nah, you're not alone. I am in the same boat. I would rather everyone be in practical armor though. That means that Final Fantasy male leads can stop having random ass items, like pauldrons on only one shoulder or leather armor up only one leg. (Go Squall, even if you were a mite bit whiny.) Just look at Hennet in the 3.5 book. The guy is wearing like 50 belts. Belts? I mean, I admit, he does look moderately cool, but geez.

So I'm throwing my lot in with "Put some clothes on girls," and "Take some off boys."

@OP: Yes. Yes, I do see a similarity. They all look like Legolas if he wore red.

monty
2008-08-13, 11:27 PM
Well, I'm kinda with you, but its because I don't find large breasted women all that attractive.

+1. Never really understood the big (no pun intended) deal.


I don't think that it is disrespectful of women at all. They're not really women, you see. I see depictions such as this emphasizing the sexual characteristics to such a degree that we no longer associate them with the idea of woman at all; they're almost pure sexual stimulus, like a grope or something.

I wouldn't agree with that. I think that the overemphasis tends to reduce the gamer's view of women rather than create a separate association.


Also, I could talk about stereotypical male action hero/super hero physiques, but that ground has been well tread, so I'll only mention it.

True, but then when have there ever not been double standards?

Jack Mann
2008-08-13, 11:38 PM
http://bp3.blogger.com/_jvBFHkK2ZXc/RjXAzOXcwQI/AAAAAAAAAgM/RryNcQE-Fjk/s400/rpg_artwork.jpg

This sums it up fairly well.

UglyPanda
2008-08-13, 11:48 PM
That means that Final Fantasy male leads can stop having random ass items, like pauldrons on only one shoulder or leather armor up only one leg. The most common reason for video game characters being asymmetrical is to show off that the processor can handle it. At least, that's the reason I heard for Tidus and Yuna from FFX as well as Gill and Sagat from Street Fighter 3.

NPCMook
2008-08-14, 12:01 AM
James Wyatt from WotC has openly admitted to D&D 4th Edition being WoW The Table Top on his Blog

Link (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1044100)

Okay, in all seriousness no DnD is not WoW, WoW is DnD. Though yes there is an actual Table top version of WoW

Wiki (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warcraft:_The_Roleplaying_Game)

Waspinator
2008-08-14, 12:11 AM
Nah, you're not alone. I am in the same boat. I would rather everyone be in practical armor though. That means that Final Fantasy male leads can stop having random ass items, like pauldrons on only one shoulder or leather armor up only one leg. (Go Squall, even if you were a mite bit whiny.) Just look at Hennet in the 3.5 book. The guy is wearing like 50 belts. Belts? I mean, I admit, he does look moderately cool, but geez.

So I'm throwing my lot in with "Put some clothes on girls," and "Take some off boys."

@OP: Yes. Yes, I do see a similarity. They all look like Legolas if he wore red.

Yeah, the Final Fantasy clothing does get a little silly at times. I'm looking at you, Tidus, Mr "Too good to choose between pants and shorts"!

Covered In Bees
2008-08-14, 12:18 AM
I don't think that it is disrespectful of women at all. They're not really women, you see.

Oh. Oh, wow.

The facepalm collage does not suffice.

Neon Knight
2008-08-14, 12:22 AM
Oh. Oh, wow.

The facepalm collage does not suffice.

You know what I mean. The image might depict a woman but you do not truly associate that with physical women you meet in real life. You don't associate the image with living breathing human beings, just with sensation and titillation.

Blackdrop
2008-08-14, 12:33 AM
You know what I mean. The image might depict a woman but you do not truly associate that with physical women you meet in real life. You don't associate the image with living breathing human beings, just with sensation and titillation.

Well you can, but you usually end up eating pavement.

BardicDuelist
2008-08-14, 12:33 AM
Oh. Oh, wow.

The facepalm collage does not suffice.

I was thinking the same thing. I know what he meant, but it not only came out really wrong but is, sadly, not true for most of the gaming community.

Neon Knight
2008-08-14, 12:36 AM
I was thinking the same thing. I know what he meant, but it not only came out really wrong but is, sadly, not true for most of the gaming community.

I guess that's a sign that I need more sleep.

Covered In Bees
2008-08-14, 12:37 AM
You know what I mean. The image might depict a woman but you do not truly associate that with physical women you meet in real life. You don't associate the image with living breathing human beings, just with sensation and titillation.

YOU don't. Society as a whole does, in fact, associate unrealistically drawn, photoshopped, and otherwise physically impossible women with real women, and holds them up to those standards, often viciously. Saying "oh, they're not really people" does not help.

Knaight
2008-08-14, 12:46 AM
You do need more sleep though.

nagora
2008-08-14, 03:28 AM
YOU don't. Society as a whole does, in fact, associate unrealistically drawn, photoshopped, and otherwise physically impossible women with real women, and holds them up to those standards, often viciously.
Sod "unrealistically drawn": society does that with vacuous, freakishly tall, anorexic, androgynous, drug-addled "super" models. It's no wonder girls feel depressed when they look in a mirror and see, you know, a normal person!

Saying "oh, they're not really people" does not help.
Likewise with supermodels :smallamused:

ZekeArgo
2008-08-14, 03:58 AM
Likewise with supermodels :smallamused:

Or honestly any woman ever, though funny as hell if used in the right situation.

bosssmiley
2008-08-14, 04:19 AM
So I guess Eladrin are the brits and Elves are americans? or something like that.

Well you got that analogy totally backwards.

The Brits are the Elves (the original culture; infamously arrogant, condescending and perfidious in their ingenuity), Americans are the Eladregs (a weird, gimmicky, 'once were hardcore' variation on the original race). :smallwink:

As for the OP's pics. If you removed the logos from the artwork I'd say there's no way you could tell at a glance which was artwork for WoW, and which was for D&D. So much then for distinctive product identity. :smallamused:


James Wyatt from WotC has openly admitted to D&D 4th Edition being WoW The Table Top on his Blog

Link (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1044100)

Wow. Truly the nadir has been reached when even the game designers are trolling on the Gleemax boards. Time for the EMP methinks. :smallannoyed:

Charity
2008-08-14, 04:25 AM
I dunno Bossman...

Eldarin - Cultured, cerebral, and otherworldly
Elves - wild woodsmen that like guns bows

...

Tormsskull
2008-08-14, 05:57 AM
I dunno Bossman...

Eldarin - Cultured, cerebral, and otherworldly
Elves - wild woodsmen that like guns bows

...

This is easy to solve. Just have the two races fight a war, and whichever wins, those are the Americans. :smalltongue:

Hawriel
2008-08-14, 06:19 AM
Sorry, I was way too busy looking at the pictures to notice anything. This confirms, beyond the shadow of a doubt, the theory of "the less clothes, the more powerful" that was presented on female characters aeons ago.

True so true. Im now going to play a paladin that wears nothing but a half plate banana hammock.

Oh and you could see the trend of, be more like wow, start when the 3.0 PHB first came out.

Thurbane
2008-08-14, 08:02 AM
Three images of stereotypical elves in red clothing?
Well then. I think we can throw science out the window and just fall to our knees and pray for redemption.
What's science ever done for us? TV off! :smallbiggrin:

I am no 4E fan....but even I think the original post is a bit of a stretch. You will generally find that elves from various sources are bound to be somewhat similar in a lot of cases...

Telonius
2008-08-14, 08:23 AM
Sigh. Am I seriously the only person on the boards who has never played WoW, and therefore does not care in any way whatsoever what D&D 4E took or didn't take from it? I'll judge the system on its own merits, thanks.

hamishspence
2008-08-14, 08:25 AM
Never played it. There are many other MMOs, so blaming it all on WoW may be a tad unfair.

only1doug
2008-08-14, 08:26 AM
This is easy to solve. Just have the two races fight a war, and whichever wins, those are the Americans. :smalltongue:

Yay for Tormsskull's grasp of history!