Star Wars RPG Tabletop-Game: Any Good? If, "Yes," then which Version should I get?

[Conners]

As the title suggests, I'm wondering whether I should try the Star Wars game (ironically enough, I use to not like Star Wars--although I had only seen the Episode 1 and 2). I don't know much about the system -- or how many versions there are -- besides the fact there are similarities to DnD (is there an existing a tabletop RPG WITHOUT parts copied from DnD :smalleek:?)
So, I ask you... should I get the Star Wars RPG, and what version if so (assuming there are several versions)?

This thread is also for convincing other people whether they should or should not get the Star Wars RPG, and which books they should get if they are getting it.

[Dhavaer]

I've never played it myself, but I understand there is a d6 version which isn't related to D&D, and I've heard the Saga edition is the best.

[Knaight]

(is there an existing a tabletop RPG WITHOUT parts copied from DnD :smalleek:?)

Saga, the better one, is made by wizards of the coast, so it is very similar to D&D, sort of between third and fourth edition. Oh, and Fudge doesn't have any parts copied from D&D by default.

[ZekeArgo]

Yes, the Star Wars d6 game has nothing to do with DnD, was made by West End Games IIRC, and was actually a pretty fun little system to make star wars characters with.

[Swordguy]

The real question is "does your group insist on only playing d20 games"? If yes, then go with Saga - it is legitimately good for a d20 game. If not, go with the d6 stuff, it's very good.

[DMfromTheAbyss]

The star Wars table top game is excellent.

And by that I mean all of them. Though some have more to offer some playstyles than others.

For Starters the West End Starwars D6 had excellent space combat, fairly lethal (but realistic) personal combat, and THE most broken force powers out of all of the star wars RPG's to date. If your playing with Jedi, try to make the whole party force sensitive, if you have no jedi the system works well, if your playing with jedi expect and plan for superheroics.

The original d20 Starwars was a bit rough, a good system but suffered from instantly lethal crits. (if a PC has a 12 con and a crit does 3d8+ con damage...) Again if your looking for a scifi feel where one well placed laser blast can kill you, not neccessarily bad, makes it hard to do very heroic campaigns though. The starship combat though in my experience is terrible.
Also obviously Jedi are the favored class of the rules... they're jedi, it's in the rules that they have cool powers and can be as tough as soldiers, only with scaling damage so by level 8 the non-jedi feel a bit overshadowed... then again this is starwars... no-one should be shocked by this.

Revised added a bit and fleshed out the original. Techie characters and masterwork gear added a bit of depth to the game. Still had most of the inherant flaws from the original,(horrible space combat,pro-jedi class imbalance,) but at least you got a few more options. Notable however they did try to gimp the jedi a bit by making lightsaber deflect a defence bonus instead of a save.

Saga changed things up into a "we're trying out 4rth edition D&D game mechanics" kind of way. You had a bit more options and play balance, everyone got scaling damage and you saw the non-jedi get a lot more competitive. They took a lot of the complexity away though, so if your a hardcore min-maxer 3.5 officianado you might not like it over the previous edition.

Personally I liked the West End d6 the most mechanically, but for people more familiar with D&D the d20 system isn't that bad if you can wrestle out any parts you dislike.

Just my opinions. And for reference my Personal experience is from both running and playing the WEd6, the d20, and the revised editions. The Saga edition I haven't tried yet, but my opinion is based on heresay and playing with the rules a bit (I tried transfering some characters to get a feel for the system)

[Pendragonx]

well, I've played both the Revised 3.5 version and the new SAGA edition.. I'd vote for the SAGA edition between the two. ...Also, if you want to play things related to the prequels the SAGA edition is the one to get.

[Waspinator]

SAGA also recently got an excellent campaign guide for the Knights of the Old Republic era, with Force Unleashed and Clone Wars guides coming soon. Due to the timing and age of the various systems, you'd have to homebrew that stuff for a lot of the past ones.

[Mad Wizard]

I like Saga edition quite a bit, but if you're just looking for a sci-fi game, not specifically star wars, Traveler might be worth checking out.

[Waspinator]

Yeah, Saga Edition (or any SW game) is emulating the Star Wars universe, which is not a very "hard" sci-fi setting. For that, I'd do GURPS or something.

[Conners]

Hmmm... I'm thinking with either going with the d6 Starwars or the 4E-style-d20 Starwars... Some of my preferences:

Homebrewing: I don't mind homebrewing and restructuring things (as long is it isn't TOO complex) so I could theoretically use the d6 Starwars rules for Space Battles but use the d20 rules for all the above.

Jedi are MEANT to be Uber: I like to have Jedi as the rare, over-powered Knights of the movies (which is why I decided to NOT try the online game after I discovered they made Jedi a starting class...). I want to have Jedis be great, but I need to keep the game balanced in some way--the main idea I like is the one from the original Starwars Online (before it became, "Stars of Wars-craft") where you had to master five randomly selected (at character creation) skills that the player wasn't told of. Even with the holocron (or whatever it was called) you could only find out what four of the skills were, the last always being a mystery. That system would work wonders for my completely free-roaming Starwars campaign (that I'd like to have should I get the Starwars RPG).
So... any ideas as to which system is best for this, while considering that I'm willing to homebrew something?

In Combat, People Die... and Storm Troopers do NOT miss from six feet away: In other words, I liked the sound of the versions of Starwars where fights were deadly. Also, I do NOT in ANY way want a repeat of the scene -- at the start of Episode IV -- where the Storm Troopers lined up, from wall to wall, in a corridor--with the rebel troopers lining up, also from wall to wall, in the same corridor TEN FEET away (at most from how I remember it) from the Storm Trooper. Both sides aimed their high-tech laser-RIFLES at each other... then missed for the first ten seconds of shooting... W...T...* :smallconfused::smalleek::smallmad::smallfurious:: smallyuk:!?!?!? ... Sorry, needed to get that out of my system (wouldn't be so riled up if Episode II didn't tell you how the Storm Troopers were cloned from a deftly-skilled-mercenary-warrior-from-a-warrior-race and trained to be soldiers from birth... WT*? again.) :smalltongue:.
Is there a way to have balanced combat -- where your chance of instant death is 20% every time you're shot at -- while still having it so that standing a yard away, in the open, from a group of expert riflemen (as Luke Skywalker did after he saw Obi-Wan die--though to give the movie credit Vader wanted to follow them back to the rebel base and wouldn't want them dead) will almost definitely get you slaughtered?

While I like Realism, Fun and the Excitement of Succeeding against Terrible Odds are very Important: ... Just read the title to the left :smallbiggrin:. I like realism, but I don't want to get killed or have my players killed by a little girl accidentally firing a, badly made, pistol, in the general direction of the player(s) while they're behind cover, due to a fluke :smalleek:. The odds should be stacked towards the players (and stacked WELL towards the players if they're sensible and pick their battles well) so that while there's always the risk of dying, it doesn't come to having to make a new character every session.

[DMfromTheAbyss]

Well my suggestion is to go with a modified to your liking d20 system, maybe ditch the vitality wound point system and use D&D style HP. Unless your amazingly high in level Stormtroopers (standard 18 HP +2BAB) are a reasonable threat, especially in large numbers. Even a high level character can be dragged down under enough of them. (just remember you'd need alot more the higher in level you go...)

And remember nearly everyone has weapons that are 3d6/3d8 damage... if you run double damage on crits, that can go through HP really fast.

I still like the d6 system the best, but it's near impossible to find stuff for it without good money and e-bay (and luck).

[JMobius]

For the revised 3.5 edition, the "Jedi Counseling" library on the wizard's page has some really great suggestions for optional rules and errata. There were some really good fixes for the over-lethality of crits, as well as plenty of expansions on possible uses for skills, some updates to put other classes more on par with Jedi, etc..

[warmachine]

Umm... Conners, if you don't like the unrealism of soldiers failing to shoot each other at very close range, why the **** do you want to play Star Wars? The point of Star Wars is heroic space opera with black-and-white morality, ultra-heroic action and mystical claptrap. Realism is a killjoy that is NOT invited to the party.

GURPS even has a rule for this kind of game style (MA132) - Imperial Stormtrooper Marksmanship Academy - where the enemy misses with their first volley.

Maybe you want to play Traveller or Babylon 5.

[turkishproverb]

Yes, the Star Wars d6 game has nothing to do with DnD, was made by West End Games IIRC, and was actually a pretty fun little system to make star wars characters with.

And there was even a tabletop war game WEG made to work alongside it.

[KillianHawkeye]

I don't know if you are just under-exaggerating for dramatic effect, or maybe you just don't remember the movies that well. The distances you mention are way too short, and nobody ever lined up in rows to shoot at each other.


Also, I do NOT in ANY way want a repeat of the scene -- at the start of Episode IV -- where the Storm Troopers lined up, from wall to wall, in a corridor--with the rebel troopers lining up, also from wall to wall, in the same corridor TEN FEET away (at most from how I remember it) from the Storm Trooper. Both sides aimed their high-tech laser-RIFLES at each other... then missed for the first ten seconds of shooting... W...T...* :smallconfused::smalleek::smallmad::smallfurious:: smallyuk:!?!?!? ... Sorry, needed to get that out of my system (wouldn't be so riled up if Episode II didn't tell you how the Storm Troopers were cloned from a deftly-skilled-mercenary-warrior-from-a-warrior-race and trained to be soldiers from birth... WT*? again.) :smalltongue:.

1) Start of EpIV: Rebel soldiers took positions along the sides of the hallway (in an attempt to use the jutting bulkheads as cover) while the storm troopers charged in through a small doorway that was more like 30 feet away. This was actually a pretty good strategy for the rebels as they were able to pick off some of the Imperials as they came through the door one at a time. They mainly lost because an ISD has thousands of storm troopers just hanging around for stuff like this.


Is there a way to have balanced combat -- where your chance of instant death is 20% every time you're shot at -- while still having it so that standing a yard away, in the open, from a group of expert riflemen (as Luke Skywalker did after he saw Obi-Wan die--though to give the movie credit Vader wanted to follow them back to the rebel base and wouldn't want them dead) will almost definitely get you slaughtered?

2) After Obi Wan dies: Okay that is mostly true, but the distance was far greater. They were in a very large hangar bay at the time, so it was probably more like a couple dozen yards. Also, Luke would've probably been hit if he hadn't been Luke freakin' Skywalker with Main Character Advantage (TM).

[Akisa]

That and they may have been given orders not 2 kill, so the group can lead them to the rebel base.

[Conners]

Umm... Conners, if you don't like the unrealism of soldiers failing to shoot each other at very close range, why the **** do you want to play Star Wars?
The point of Star Wars is heroic space opera with black-and-white morality, ultra-heroic action and mystical claptrap. Realism is a killjoy that is NOT invited to the party.

GURPS even has a rule for this kind of game style (MA132) - Imperial Stormtrooper Marksmanship Academy - where the enemy misses with their first volley.

Maybe you want to play Traveller or Babylon 5. Well, because ignoring the scenes where trained super-soldiers missed each other at close range with high-tech weapons, the Starwars movies were and still are fun to watch and there were bits I really liked (Lightsabers are fun and handy).
I didn't really like the morality of Starwars, where you have to be completely apathetic emotionally or else you'll become a Satan's incarnate, but of recent I've worked out an interesting idea for a campaign based on it, so it's all good. Realism is what allows a player to feel attatchment to their character, if I said, "Your head is blasted off, you'll need to get a new one by tomorrow or else you'll be inconvenienced greatly," then their character would be little more than a joke to them and they wouldn't give a d**n should said character actually get killed. Similarly, if the enemies ALWAYS miss -- when there should be no chance of missing -- then there won't be the excitement of risk and danger.

Interesting idea, but I think I'll have my stormtroopers be proper bad-ass warriors like Episode II said they were.

Don't know what those are and I'm afraid I'm not interested (isn't GURPS meant to be incredibly realistic?).


I don't know if you are just under-exaggerating for dramatic effect, or maybe you just don't remember the movies that well. The distances you mention are way too short, and nobody ever lined up in rows to shoot at each other. Meh, I'm not too good with measuring distances (there wasn't a good distance-measuring angle, from what I can see from some parts).
While they didn't exactly line up from wall-to-wall, now that I look at it again, the rebels still kept missing when the other side of the corridor was filled with Storm Troopers. When you consider the accuracy of a skilled rifleman with an ordinary rifle, you'd wonder if the rebels had as much as seen a gun before.


1) Start of EpIV: Rebel soldiers took positions along the sides of the hallway (in an attempt to use the jutting bulkheads as cover) while the storm troopers charged in through a small doorway that was more like 30 feet away. This was actually a pretty good strategy for the rebels as they were able to pick off some of the Imperials as they came through the door one at a time. They mainly lost because an ISD has thousands of storm troopers just hanging around for stuff like this. Yep, after seeing it again that seems to be how it was in general. 30 feet? Let me try walking that distance. Hmm... yeah, I guess it was close to that distance. The main problem is that the rebels were missing when there was little room to miss and the stormtroopers did the same. But meh, it doesn't matter much.


2) After Obi Wan dies: Okay that is mostly true, but the distance was far greater. They were in a very large hangar bay at the time, so it was probably more like a couple dozen yards. Also, Luke would've probably been hit if he hadn't been Luke freakin' Skywalker with Main Character Advantage (TM). Yeah, I guess it was a greater distance. I suck at measuring distances, though an overhead view would've helped. I dislike the "Main Character Glow" in most anything, it generally ruins the excitement and drama of the situation for me.


I'm not diss-ing Starwars, I really like the movies, I just would prefer it if the RPG game didn't follow the trend of extreme inaccuracy for NPCs yet pin-point precision from the main characters. If that isn't the case, then I'll just house-rule it to be so :smallbiggrin:.

[warmachine]

So, Conners, you don't like the morality of Star Wars and that the Imperial Stormtroopers are supposed to be bad-ass warriors but actually suck. These are two of the defining aspects of Star Wars. In other words, you don't want the essence Star Wars in your game.

Also, not everyone uses realism to be emotionally attached to their characters. Some people play to do things that can't do in the real world. Tell them they're playing Star Wars and they're going to expect to be able to shoot a room full of Imperial Stormtroopers, escape from a Death Star without being blown out of space, destroy military fighters with a freighter and generally succeed with plans that are idiotic because that's what's portrayed in the films. If a PC does die, it's in a blaze of glory. A PC would NEVER have his head blown off. As I wrote before, realism is a killjoy who's not invited to the party.

In other words, put realism in a Star Wars game and the players won't know what genre conventions are supposed to apply.

Presumably, you want the space opera feel, lightsabers and mystical claptrap. Lightsabers are a problem because more realistic genres render them unusable. Try parrying a grenade blast. As you won't use Star Wars genre conventions, drop the lightsabers and play Traveller or Babylon 5. Maybe Space 1889.

[Saph]

I've played Star Wars d6 and Star Wars Saga. IMO, both are awesome. They both work in very different ways, but both do a great job of reproducing the Star Wars feel, so check out both and grab whichever your group likes most. Star Wars d6 is point- and skill-based, while Saga is d20/4th-Ed based, so it might be easiest to pick whichever your group is most familiar with.

- Saph

[D Knight]

if you are going to start playing star wars go with the d20 version. thats if you play D&D. i do not know which system i am playing but its fun.

[Amiria]

Isn't the West End Games Star Wars RPG out of print since a decade ?

And it is unlikely that it is ever printed again. So it could be hard/expensive to get it. One of my friends has some stuff from it: the Core Rulebook, the Heir to the Empire Sourcebook and a couple of adventures.

I say go with the current D20 Saga Edition. It is a good system, although I wish that they would publish more stuff for it, especially adventures.

[Waspinator]

They're slowly making published Saga adventures. Dawn of Defiance is creeping out, there's "The Betrayal of Darth Revan" for RPGA members, and supposedly a KOTOR module that was cut from the campaign guide is going to be released soon on the RPG's site.

Also, Star Wars has the lucky fact that there's been a lot of plots thought of for other editions of the RPG that use the exact same settings. You can take one of those, redo all of the enemies stat blocks, and be good to go.

[Ascension]

The thing that's annoying to me about Star Wars RPGs is that apparently they're only available in physical form... and I have yet to find one in good condition. All the SAGA rulebooks I've seen have been very obviously read through, one to the point of having pages ripped out of it. I went to DriveThru, and despite the fact pretty much everything D&D is there in PDF format, there's nary a SW book in sight. I guess I could just order the physical books off the internet, but having to pay shipping annoys me.

Blah.

[Waspinator]

Try Amazon. Free shipping if you order enough at a time.

[SmartAlec]

Could always compromise: use Stormtroopers sparingly, as the elite troops they're generally reputed to be. As they're stationed on Star Destroyers, you won't often see Stormtroopers planetside anyway. Fill in the gaps with Imperial Army troopers, badly-trained COMPNOR security guards, poorly-equipped mercenaries, thugs et cetera. Check out Wookiepaedia for ideas on mooks.

Another vote for SAGA Edition here. It's got style.

A thought on Jedi: not every Jedi is a badass. Jedi Knights are, and SAGA rightly has Jedi Knight as a prestige class. A low-level Jedi is very much like that girl who takes out a couple of Clone Troopers and then gets shot in front of Bail Organa in Revenge of the Sith. The Jedi are a big organisation, and although they all carry lightsabers, they often have other talents as healers, agricultiral advisors, explorers, teachers etc.

[Conners]

Hmmm... from what you all say, I'd guess Saga would seem the best bet. I'll take your advice, SmartAlec, and use the Stormtroopers sparingly with rookie-type troops in their place (until higher levels). I could always have the Droids from the Trade Federation still be around in my Campaign setting (tougher than the average mook security guard, but much weaker than a stormtrooper)--doesn't make sense for the millions of droids with thousands of factories to just vanish.

Before I leave the thread, any ideas on how I could have a system like in Starwars Online for becoming a Jedi (or at least for obtaining the Jedi Knight Prestige class)? Also, how much more powerful should I make the Jedi?

[Capfalcon]

But, the thing is some people just want to play jedi. And, if you're going to be playing in Star Wars, that's a totally realistic response. I just don't understand the idea of making the player jump through hoops to play the character they want. If they want to play a Jedi, why shouldn't they?

Not to single you out, but this has been bugging me a good bit as of late. People want classes to be better than other classes "Because that's the way they should be." But, to me, that goes against the entire point of a level based game. I beleve that the point of a level based game is that a level 6 ______ should be about as powerful as a level 6 ______.

But, nevertheless, this isn't the answer you want. So, I guess the answer you're looking for is, if you want Jedi to be more powerful, then you just give them more levels than the other characters. That way, you really won't have to do too much more work, but you have Jedi that are Better Than You (TM).

Just be prepared for non-jedi players to complain that it isn't fair.

With good reason, I might add.

[Waspinator]

Exactly. That's how level based games work. If it seems like most of the more powerful Star Wars characters are Jedi, that just means that most of them are higher level than what they're fighting.

[Storm Bringer]

and, I must point out,A 1st level jedi is not much more force-enabled than Luke was at the end of A New Hope: he's got a lightsabre, he can weild it (sorta) can is able to occsisionally do things that he really shouldn't have been able too (deflect stun bolts blindfolded, hit a small hit at very high velocity, etc).

Someone like Obi-wan in the Phantom Menace would be 5th/6th level by the rules (on the verge of being a full jedi knight).

Edit: having played the West End games verison, I can confirm it's pretty neat. I can't comment on Saga edition, but the Rules seem solid.

[Philistine]

Question One: You're referring to the original, widely-despised, system in Star Wars: Galaxies? You are aware that in practice this system was almost universally loathed, yes? Frankly, I don't think it can be done anyway, because in the PnP game skills don't work in anything remotely like the same way.

Luckily, there's a better alternative. One which is easier to implement and makes more sense within the gameworld, too*: simply don't allow anyone to take levels as a Jedi unless and until they've spent some quality time training with an instructor who's already a member of the Jedi Order. That puts access to the class squarely in your hands - you can have them not meet any Jedi NPCs; you can have them meet up with a Jedi NPC in a situation where they just don't have time to get any training in; you can have a Jedi NPC who demands that the PCs prove themselves worthy somehow before... If you really want to add a random element to determine whether or not a given PC will be eligible to take levels as a Force user, just roll percentile dice for each player to determine Force Sensitivity, and anyone who rolls x% or higher can eventually choose to train as a Jedi.

Question Two: Personally, I'd be really really really leery of boosting the power of Jedi PCs over non-Jedi PCs. Especially if you're plannng on restricting the players' access so that only part of the group is even going to be allowed to play Jedi characters. That road leads to all manner of group drama and trauma.

Now, for boosting PCs relative to NPCs, there are lots of options. You could simply lower adversaries' stats, of course. And the ever-popular "throw swarms and swarms of level-1 opponents at a level 15 party" is a time-honored tradition, but it's not necessarily very exciting for the party.

Are you familiar with 4E minions? That might be just the thing for you. Someone else will be better able than I am to discuss it, since I haven't actually played any 4E yet, but as I understand it this creates opponents with normal attack bonus, damage, AC, and saves, but effectively only one hit point. So one good hit puts them away, but they're not abnormally easy to hit... and until you do hit them, they can pose a real danger to your PCs. But like I said, I've only heard about minions and never played with them; and so while I don't know of a reason why you wouldn't be able to adapt them for a SW game, that doesn't mean there isn't one.


* Unless your game is set before or during the Clone Wars, anyway. The vast majority of Jedi in the Republic were raised to it from early childhood, meaning that in game terms there'd be curst few Jedi who didn't have the class at 1st level.

[SmartAlec]

Jedi are pretty seriously capable in SAGA as it is, once they get a few levels under their belt. No need to do much tweaking, really.

SAGA goes a rather interesting way with the whole Force-Sensitive thing, come to think of it, by allowing more or less any class to use the Force at a basic level, as long as they have the Force-Sensitive feat and maybe some points in the Use the Force skill. Simple abilities like small-scale telekinesis, simple one-word telepathy, creepy feelings, sense when the Force is being used nearby. Again, anyone can take Force Feats and Force Powers as long as they meet the prerequisite skill ranks. But the Jedi class, and the subsequent prestige classes (Jedi Master, Jedi Knight) are especially good at it, having Use the Force as a class skill and getting Force Feats and Powers for free as they level.

[Conners]

Hmmm..... this is troublesome. You do make a good point that Jedi may have just been of a higher level, but then there's the question of, "How do non-Force-users reach the same level?" Jedi get more magicky powers that let them move things with their minds, grant them better skill with a lighsabre, increase their physical capabilities and even let them predict the future to a degree (Anakan saw things happen before they did, didn't he?). A soldier though...? They shoot more accurately at the Jedi who deflects their laser bolt...?

I can only think of one solution at present: Prestige classes. The Jedi class would have its name changed to, "Padawan" and would be a basic class (you don't even need to know about your force sensitivity to be the Padawan class, nor do you need a tutor to continue taking levels in it). This class, however, becomes limited at higher levels (especially in force powers), and the character will need to take the Jedi Knight (or a similar PrC) to maximize their power.
Other classes, such as Soldier (or whatever it's called) would take classes PrCs such as Darktrooper and other things, if they wished to keep up with the Jedi Knights.

Something like this...? I'm at a great loss as to how I should do things, now.

[Saph]

Hmmm..... this is troublesome. You do make a good point that Jedi may have just been of a higher level, but then there's the question of, "How do non-Force-users reach the same level?" Jedi get more magicky powers that let them move things with their minds, grant them better skill with a lighsabre, increase their physical capabilities and even let them predict the future to a degree (Anakan saw things happen before they did, didn't he?). A soldier though...? They shoot more accurately at the Jedi who deflects their laser bolt...?

(snip)

Something like this...? I'm at a great loss as to how I should do things, now.

Okay, seriously, just go down to your game shop and take a look at a copy of the Star Wars Saga Edition book. It'll answer all the questions you're listing above. Don't try and homebrew a new system when there's a perfectly good one out there just begging to be used.

To answer briefly how Saga solves the problems you mention: Jedi deflection is based off their Use the Force skill. To deflect a blaster bolt they have to roll higher than the attack roll of whoever's shooting at them, with a hefty penalty for doing it multiple times in a round (-5 per extra shot, stacking). This means a Jedi can deflect poor-to-medium attack rolls fairly reliably, but will struggle to deflect lucky shots, multiple shots, or shots from a high-level Soldier.

As for classes, it's already worked out. The base class is Jedi, and they're really not much more impressive than any other level 1 character. The prestige class (level 8+) is Jedi Knight. The super-prestige class (level 13+) is Jedi Master. Kenobi in Episode III is a Jedi Master; that's why he goes through clone troopers and battle droids (which are level 1-2 enemies) so easily.

Non-force-users have some decent PrCs of their own (like Gunslinger and Bounty Hunter), and can hold their own just fine against Jedi at higher levels.

- Saph

PS - Oh, and re: Stormtroopers automatically missing - they don't. A single Stormtrooper can easily kill a first-level PC, and can even do it in one shot if the PC is unlucky. Standing in front of a bunch of guys with blasters in Saga will kill you unless you're an exceptionally tough Jedi with maxed-out defence skills.