Why Harry Potter can't defeat Voldemort unaided

[Admiral_Kelly]

Without the use of a Deus Ex Machina (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/DeusExMachina) (or Chevok's Gun (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ChekhovsGun), which does not make it any less of a cop-out) Harry cannot defeat Voldemort. Let us review:

Book 1: Harry used the 'power of love' and a trick from Dombledore to defeat Voldemort.
Book 2: Fawks came just when things were at their worst.
Book 3: No Voldemort.
Book 4: The stupid twin Pheonix wands.
Book 5: Harry does overcome Voldemort mentally, but only 'wins' because
Book 6: No Voldemort.
Book 7: Wands act completely differently then anything ever said or done before, to the point where Harry convinces Voldemort's wand to backfire on him.

This does not include the fact he survived the Adava Kedvara twice - a spell which a wizard is suppose to be undefended against except by running out of the way.

So I ask my fellow playgrounders this question: Is there any conceivable way Harry could have beaten Voldemort in a one on one match each armed with a wand and no extraordinary circumstances of any sort such as the ones listed above?

[Texas_Ben]

No. Voldy was one of the most powerful wizards evar, harry was a glorified jock who really can't do much other than play sports.

[Arioch]

No. Which is why he doesn't. In reality, Dumbledore defeated Voldemort over a period of many years using a combination of trickery, a keen understanding of Voldemorte's and Harry's psychology and the careful manipulation of a dupe with special abilities. Even though he died before his plan was completed, it was still his plan.

Harry's not as stupid or worthless as TBAM makes out: he is reasonably intelligent and very brave. Nonetheless, Hermione would have made a much better Chosen One.

[Mr. Scaly]

Only by shooting him in the back or something. Harry's just a student wizard after all.

[Adumbration]

Only by shooting him in the back or something. Harry's just a student wizard after all.

Heh, I can imagine it. There is Harry, pretending to be dead, and Voldemort turns his back. Blam.

Would've made a much better ending. :smallbiggrin:

[Haruki-kun]

I believe in Book 5 Harry himself pointed out that he was not better than Voldemort, and that he had, in fact, been lucky every single time. The fact was that Harry had a plot armor throughout the whole series backed up by the prophecy that either he would kill Voldemort or Voldemort would kill him. (highlight at your own risk)

I don't think it was ever claimed that Harry was in any way more skilled than Voldemort.

[Anteros]

Maybe if they were playing quiddich. Or however you spell it. Harry is no slouch in the books, and it's certainly possible that he could beat V. However there is a huge difference in skill. Harry would need a great deal of luck in order to win. As is demonstrated in the books.

[SurlySeraph]

Yeah, in a straight duel without the Power of Love Harry would die immediately.

[Don Julio Anejo]

Considering that in book 7 Harry became so badass and saved so many people, to make the movie at least a bit plausible, Bruce Willis is going to replace Daniel Radcliffe in Harry Potter and the Deathly Gallows movie.

[TheElfLord]

Harry's not as stupid or worthless as TBAM makes out: he is reasonably intelligent and very brave. Nonetheless, Hermione would have made a much better Chosen One.

I will give you brave, it is one of Harry's defining traits, but can't agree on intellegent. He and Ron either copy off of the best student in the year of actually get her to do their work for them and outside of Defense against the Dark Arts he still only gets average grades. (During the year that is, except for OWLs he always seems to be exempt from end of year exams, and for the OWLs he studied his butt off/got mental plot armor). I agree Hermione would have made a better Chosen One.

It's hard to think I would actually be in a position to say that Voldemort would win in a fight because I think Voldemort is one of the worst written BBEGs I have ever read about, in this one case I have to say without the plot armor Harry doesn't have a chance.

[warty goblin]

It all comes down to what time of year this duel takes place. Remember, in May and June, everything Voldemort tries fails, while in August, September and October it works. Potter runs on an inverse schedule, in May and June he's all heroic and determined, and in the late summer he's usually rather pissy and ineffectual.

Hence I propose that the dual take place in, say, January, since Voldemort will be over his Seasonal Incompetance Syndrome, and Harry will be over his Seasonal Angst Period, so both should be operating at max, erm, powers...

[Fan]

Yeah, in a straight duel without the Power of Love Harry would die immediately.
All you need is love. All you need is love. Love, love is all you need.
Sorry back on topic.
Theres no way in hell harry could have bet him without the power of love.

[Mr. Scaly]

Hmm. You know, in retrospect even without Chosen One status I think harry would do fairly well for himself. He may not be special magicwise but Voldemort's planning is fearsomely...lacking.

[Stupendous_Man]

Without the use of a Deus Ex Machina (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/DeusExMachina) (or Chevok's Gun (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ChekhovsGun), which does not make it any less of a cop-out) Harry cannot defeat Voldemort. Let us review:

Book 1: Harry used the 'power of love' and a trick from Dombledore to defeat Voldemort.
Book 2: Fawks came just when things were at their worst.
Book 3: No Voldemort.
Book 4: The stupid twin Pheonix wands.
Book 5: Harry does overcome Voldemort mentally, but only 'wins' because
Book 6: No Voldemort.
Book 7: Wands act completely differently then anything ever said or done before, to the point where Harry convinces Voldemort's wand to backfire on him.

This does not include the fact he survived the Adava Kedvara twice - a spell which a wizard is suppose to be undefended against except by running out of the way.

So I ask my fellow playgrounders this question: Is there any conceivable way Harry could have beaten Voldemort in a one on one match each armed with a wand and no extraordinary circumstances of any sort such as the ones listed above?

By shooting him.

[LordVader]

Of course not. It's like Luke as a Padawan up against Darth Vader. Sure, Luke's got TONS of raw talent, and he's no slouch at swordfighting either, but Darth Vader is far more skilled and powerful, and utterly pwns him.

Harry's best chance would be some form of firearm. I figure he can get five-six shots off in the time it takes to say Avada Kedavra. :smallcool:

[Texas_Ben]

Harry's best chance would be some form of firearm. I figure he can get five-six shots off in the time it takes to say Avada Kedavra. :smallcool:
I'm pretty sure a wizard of Voldy's calibre won't be bothered by that. Don't forget that spells can be cast without the verbal component (although doing so is harder so the really nasty ones won't work as well if you do that) and I imagine that the spell to stop bullets would be a relatively simple one. Otherwise all the magic folk would be packing.

[Fan]

I'm pretty sure a wizard of Voldy's calibre won't be bothered by that. Don't forget that spells can be cast without the verbal component (although doing so is harder so the really nasty ones won't work as well if you do that) and I imagine that the spell to stop bullets would be a relatively simple one. Otherwise all the magic folk would be packing.
A machine gun can shoot you faster than you can wave a wand.:smalltongue:

[Roland St. Jude]

Sheriff of Moddingham: This thread has been locked for reasons having to do with the OP rather than its content per se.

If someone would like to restart this thread as a discussion (rather than as a vs. thread, which it is not), that would be fine.