The Vampire A look into Hunting the Hunter(inpsired partly by Max Brooks and threads)

[black dragoon]

This (I hope) will become a ZSG-esque take upon the vampire. These however are not the Nymphomaniacs portrayed nowadays rather they are brutal and vicious hunters of man caused by a virulent parasite or virus that radically changes the hosts physiology. So please comment and post what you think should be here and if you're willing to help please leave a post and/or PM me saying so!:smallsmile:

Introduction: The Vampyre a monster of myth like the Zombie and werewolf has taken root in our minds and cultures. Many relegate this creature to mere myths and superstition however, there truths behind this ancient terror. The Nosferatu is real and it preys upon the the unwary. It is a bestial creature consumed by a never ceasing hunger. More cunning than any animal these beasts lurk in the night and pursue those who dare to hunt them.

[black dragoon]

The origin of The Vampire

Contrary to popular belief the vampire is not some form of mystical creature. Rather it has succumbed to a strange and virulent disease that brings forth this monster. This disease until recently had never been isolated. Genetic analysis traces it to a common ancestry with the common bacterial infection known as Rabies. This more deadly strain however has increased virulence and a short painful incubation as it rapidly changes the host into a monster. Carriers of this disease in he animal kingdom typically only display symptoms like that of rabies or even non at all. The most common carriers are those associated with the vampire of myth. The wolf,Bat,the rat and other similar species. This does not include the other more obvious carrier the vampire itself.
How the infection spreads:

The culprit of this disease a unique variety of bacteria that as far as anyone can tell carries within it either a retrovirus or a totally new method of tampering with the hosts' genetic structure lives primarily in the bodily fluids of the hosts. Exposure to air does not kill outright nor does typical methods such as boiling. However, direct exposure to ultraviolet radiation immediately triggers a series biochemical reactions that break down the cell structure destroying the bacteria.
As with it's common cousin bites can and often do spread the infection. Other means are possible however, contact with bodily fluids such as blood,saliva and others can leave the bacteria upon the skin and if exposed to an open wound an all to easy vector to infection. This virus also is found around areas of a vampires body that have succumbed to it's unusual changes. Sub dermal portions of the skin carry the virus in small enough amounts to cause infection. The G.I. tract one of the most heavily modified structures of the vampire is loaded with the bacteria which thrives. The Heart,Lungs and Liver also contain high concentrations. The heart and liver also have been modified extensively during the 'turning' however the lungs for many years remained a mystery. That was till the case of Antwone Bernat. A young Parisian vampire hunter who had apparently started to turn without reason. It was later revealed that young Antwone had apparently suffered the infection First in his Lungs as a respiratory disease. It appeared that he had somehow contracted the virus in an airborne form. This probaley occured when he had encountered a vampire in the early stages of it's infection or during a period of vampirism known as the carrier stage(detailed later).

What happens During Infection:

Though the rate at which a given individual becomes a vampire is variable. It normally takes approx. one to weeks before any obvious signs occur.
During this incubation period the host in theory may be treatable. But, there are known cures that do not cause a massive shock to the victims body. At this stage a victim may live as normal going out into sunlight without fear or any adverse reaction.
Start Of symptoms: Infected individuals begin to show symptoms around a week to two weeks after being exposed. The symptoms are reminiscent of the common cold though the victim suffers from extreme hunger as the disease prepares for it's coming change. These cold-like symptoms progress steadily till they become more like that of a respiratory infection(three to four days)
The victim still has an extreme hunger and does not seem to have any trouble eating. After another week or so the victim begins to start down the path of actual changing. In the times before modern medicine it would seem to anyone curious as if the victim finally succumbed to the trouble they were having with their lungs, however modern medicine notes that in reality they have entered into a deep coma. The victim at this point begins to become a vampire.
The large amount of food consumed is intended to allow the victim to more easily change without losing much of their body mass. The bacteria which had been slowly changing the body begins the transformation in earnest wreaking havoc upon the poor person's DNA.
Stage one transformation- The bones and muscles of an individual become far more resilient and durable. The joints also become steadily more cushioned and resistant to shock. This is also when a vamp. develops the infamous pronounced canines and carnivore like teeth, and incredibly strong jaw muscles as well as the start of the unique structures that allow it to drink blood.
Stage Two- The Sensory organs of soon to vampire reconfigure themselves. The olfactory bulbs become incredibly sensitive. The eyes become more feline and actually research reveals better than any nocturnal hunter. The ears also become acute allowing it hearing similar to that of canine or feline. The heart muscle and circulatory also strengthen to take the steadily changing chemistry of it's new blood or ichor. The brain chemistry also changes. The frontal lobes become flooded with endorphins and testosterone along with several other hormones that normally are not present in large quantities. The Nervous system also changes developing by consuming pain pain receptors a dense network that heightens response time and 'fast twitch' reactions.
Stage Three- The final phase and by far the most extreme before the vampire awakens. The digestive tract becomes lined with specialized cells and able to extract nearly every ounce of available protein, fat, and other necessary chemicals from it's food. This includes blood which using it's semi-modified tongue can now lap up like a vampire bat. The creature's saliva now secretes a cocktail of anti-coagulates, antiseptics and natural pain killers that create a euphoria in their victims. the lower layers of skin become thick flexible and durable (dermal armor). The nails become harder and more like claws and the heart which for the past ten-twenty days. Rekindles itself from an almost undetectable heartbeat into a rapid pounding rhythm that stirs the newborn thing from it's coma.


Awakening-

A vampire upon the end of it's metamorphosis is effectively jolted back to a waking state. No one is entirely sure of the exact mechanism, though many believe it may have to do with a final shot of endorphins and other hormones directly into the sleep centers of the brain.
The resultant jolt causes the vampires heart rate to skyrocket to nearly a hundred and forty beats per minute, causing the altered blood now called ichor to forcefully push through it's body. If buried a Vampire shall begin to dig it's way out of the ground fueled by an unnatural rage and a now constant hunger. If in a modern hospital however It may simply begin to feed upon any living thing it comes upon. The first instinct of a 'newborn' vampire is to find nourishment. In a natural environment this takes the form of any wild animals it can catch at first, in an urban environment however this all to often is the homeless or anything that contains a large amount of protein and is nearby.

[black dragoon]

Vampire Stages:



A vampire goes through four distinct developmental stages as it ages. The first being the most easily dispatched and the final an elusive hunter intent on creating more of it's kind. There are few apparent physical changes to a vampire however and much of the changes that occur are within the creature's brain chemistry and thought processes.


Stage One: Newborn

A newborn vampire is just coming out of it's coma. weaker than a the rest of it's kin a newborn primarily lives like a feral animal and will kill anything that it perceives as a food source, this includes other vampires...It also is learning the limitations of it's abilties and commonly appear almost clumsy as they adjust to their strength and dexterity. Newborns look very much like a regular human though extremely gaunt due to the nature of their transformation.


Stage Two: Beserker
This stage occurs roughly within a week of awakening. The Beserker is the most common variety of vampire and also the most active. It has gained comprehension of it's new body and knows the surrounding area that it claims as it's own. Thankfully, a beserker is more intent on feeding than spreading it's disease and will normally outright kill it's prey. It has been shown however that certain specimens have an apparent malicious streak and will 'play' with their food by means such as stalking, torture and attacks against those that it thinks are connected to it's primary quarry. Beserkers thankfully are not very intelligent and act mostly off of animal instinct due to the brain still being flooded with high concentrations of hormones, This also is the source of their name. Many hunters have claimed that even for a vampire these creatures seem to feel no pain what so ever. further study however is difficult at best since the creatures are next to impossible to capture and in the rare instances they have been will try to starve themselves or attack anything that gets within a few feet of them.


Stage Three: Pack hunter

The third and longest lasting stage, roughly between three and five years into a vampire's new life they begin to almost instinctively form a group with which to hunt prey. This disturbing behavior is only reinforced by a sharp and rather dramatic rise of intelligence as the vampires begin to develop a rudimentary form communicating and begin to coordinate with disturbing proficiency. There has also been some evidence that the vampires begin to attempt to mimic human behavior in crude attempts to fool their prey of choice. This includes waving hands and dressing in more than simple tattered clothes that they had from before changing. Some Hunters have also reported tool using amongst the vampires a disturbing trend that eventually culminates with a stage four.

Stage Four: Nightmaster

The rarest form of Vampire. The Nightmaster is an entity shrouded in mystery and wrapped in secret. It is believed that possibly not every vampire becomes a nightmaster and rather only certain individuals reach this point. A nightmaster is different from other vampires it goes out of it's way to spread the infection. It preys upon animals or upon the sick or dying. It is believed to be at least as intelligent as a regular human being and able to nearly seamlessly blend into everyday life. The few encounters with a nightmaster have shown that it seems to be able to at lest understand the local language and also seems to avoid combat. Beyond this however little is known though.



Social Structure Of the Vampire

Though it may seem that the vampire has little in the way of a mind this is sadly far from the truth. A vampire is a vicious cunning predator from the very first day. It may seem to be a mindless beast at first but, this is a subtle illusion. The chemicals that flood the brain of the vampire at 'birth' and during feeding frenzies cause it to enter a state of incredible rage and anger. Newborn vampires and the slightly older beserkers are nearly constantly in this state due to their severe malnutrition after the change. By stage three a vampires brain chemistry has balanced itself out to more a stable level when it is not threatened. Nightmasters seem however to be completely incapable of entering this state resulting in yet more questions about the strange life cycle of the vampire.
The question of a vampire being a social creature is not a question in all truth. They were human and like humans by nature are social animals. By stage three a vampire has developed a complex social hierarchy with it's fellow hunters and adheres to their rules. By stage four a vampire seems to take a dramatic turn and becomes something utterly unexpected. Nightmasters seem fueled by the urge to spread the disease and gifted with a frighteningly high capacity for learning. It is rumored that nightmasters actively seek out new victims by a variety of methods including possibly seduction considering the legends of succubi, inccubi and vampires that seduced mortals before consuming them. It has also been thought that nightmasters may have entire packs of vampires under their control. Weather this is through pure brute force or other methods remains a mystery. Some scientists however have suggested that it may be a form of pheromone or other subtler methods due to the distinct nature of the nighmaster and it's rarity.
The typical vampire pack ranges between three-twenty individuals who claim a swath of territory as their own hunting ground. Within this territory are typically three to five 'crypts' or areas that are protected from bright,direct daylight. This is duel purpose. The first being to prevent the bacteria that caused their transformation from breaking down flooding their bodies with painful metabolic toxins and to prevent their extremely sensitive eyes from being overloaded from the bright light. Within these lairs a vampire pack will enter into a coma like sleep waiting for the darkness.
As night falls upon a packs territory it awakens their bodies becoming supercharged and temperatures skyrocketing to around a hundred and three degrees core body temperature. A pack will begin by searching the surrounding area for any small game or going to a place they have previously hunted and found successful during past hunts. A pack leader will designate their next target or targets in the case of larger packs and begin to instruct it's fellows to set up a trap or ambush. Typically one vampire will scare the targeted prey and drive it towards it's kin. As the prey enters the kill zone the slaughter begins. Anyone unfortunate enough to stumble upon the remains of kill will find a mangled corpse ripped apart and drained of it's blood and missing organs with high iron and protein.

habits and characteristics of each phase.

Stage One- The newborn stage is noted for it's ravenous appetite and almost animalistic mindset. Newborns have a one track mind focused upon feeding till they can satisfy their incredible hunger caused by their transformation. Newborns are rarely seen with other vampires and tend to have very simple minds in a fight. They focus solely on killing and eating the enemy.

Stage Two- The beserker is little different form the previous stage save for the fact that it's no longer obsessed with simply eating. A Stage two vampire is a cunning predator that hunts at leisurely pace or attacks with a ravenous hunger and fury. Stage twos also have gained a better comprehension of their capabilities and will employ surprising strategy when confronted with a strong opponent. Beserkers also have been known to use weapons such as clubs or pieces of re-bar to beat an armored foe to death.

Stage Three- For many decades considered the 'adult' form of the vampire stage threes are highly intelligent and assuredly pack animals. Threes employ concepts such as ambush hunting, tool using, disguising themselves as regular humans, baiting and switching, and weapon and tool using.

Stage Four- The most mysterious of the vampires the nightmaster seems to be fully able to blend into human society surprisingly well. There have been reports of nightmasters across the globe all of which seem to avoid combat as much as possible as they slowly spread the disease amongst the populace. They oddly however do not perform this act in a conventional bite normally. Rather it's primary method is an act known as the Death Kiss. A Nightmaster will 'kiss' normally with a small cut in it's mouth and spread the bacteria orally. This may explain the high concentrations within a vampires lungs save the fact it seems to be present even in specimens that have been bitten. Nightmasters are rarely seen with stage fours and rather seem to keep a pack of stage threes which will follow there commands unerringly.

[Innis Cabal]

Its Vamp-ire. keep it that or change it to Vampyre through out

But looks good otherwise.

[black dragoon]

The physiology of The Vampire

physical characteristics-
A vampire looks much the way it did before it changed into a monster. hair, and skin color stay the same as does height. However do to it's incredible energy demands a vampire appears nearly always gaunt. The exception being after it has fed in which case it's face and cheeks in particular appear ruddy and filled with blood. This probably is a method to single to other vamps of a food source. The bodily composition of a vampire is different from the human as well. The fatty layer beneath the skin is almost non-existent and is replaced along the long bones, sections of the chest, spine, feet and hands by chitin like scales that are hidden beneath the skin. If the vampire is of considerable age this chitinous layer is visible beneath the skin of the ankles and feet leading to the legends possibly of harpies and other bird-men creatures. The nails of a vampire have also changed. The keratin in the nails has been blended with a similar chitin-like material that is found beneath the skin allowing for incredible durability, this has allowed many vampires to easily stalk prey from trees and rooftops and kill a man easily with it's bare hands.

Senses- During the transition into becoming a vampire a human being develops Surprisingly specialized senses. The eyes become far more photo-sensitive(nearly five times that of a human being) allowing for accurate and rather impressive night vision. The ears of a vampire become similar to a canines even developing a distinctive point. The sense of smell of a vampire is also enhanced. Hunters who have had the tables turned have recounted how vampire's blinded and deafened have still tracked down their prey using their sense of smell alone. The sense of touch however seems to be slightly deadened allowing for an incredible pain threshold. Their sense of taste has become attuned to a new more carnivorous diet and plants including onions and garlic are repulsive to the creatures taste. It can also be said that certain specimens become blood addicts due to unique euphoria that is induced while feeding in both the victim and the vampire.These senses can be used against it however and will be discussed later.

[comicshorse]

But how do they supernaturally seduce gorgeous Hammer starlets ?

[black dragoon]

You don't you rip out there throats:smalltongue:

[Gavin Sage]

Vampires being monsters and not succubi is one thing, but why does everyone have to attribute the supernatural to some stupid disease these days? Annoys the heck out me, and if anything is less realistic. Throwing retrovirus or the like in somewhere doesn't just let you make major changes to body structure and genetic code. It nothing more then magic wrapped in the modern religion of science.

Sorry nothing personal just a pet peeve of mine.

[FoE]

One would argue that by making vampires simple, ravenous beasts, they're not really that much different than zombies with some degree of free will. I don't mind vampires being vicious killers, but I'm not crazy about making them bestial savages.

[black dragoon]

Only at first, Look at the nightmaster entry, These fit more in line with the modern and typical views of the vampire. Figure it's process of three-five years till they become that. Of course, I understand why you're upset with the concept gavin sage in truth at first I was thinking of using some form of parasite to cause the change. And as for the physiological changes It basically has reworked the muscles and other tissues to work in a slightly different manner. Your body has become a lot stronger and more durable than it was.
The historical vampire (not dracula) were very much raiders in the night. They were vicious creatures that attacked those that were alive and then fled back to their graves before the sunrise. There is historically only a few times the vampire is depicted as blending in amongst the masses.

[Lowkey Lyesmith]

I like the concept. It blend vampires with ghouls and werewolfs abit. Kind of like if you look at old myths of giants, trolls and ogres they are really all the same.

[black dragoon]

True, a lot of mythology tends to have some common origin I just followed the old tales and pieced together the beast they were exaggerating about. Many mythical vampires are described have bird-like claws So I've figured the that a vampire develops rather nasty claw-like nails and stronger musculature to allow for increased speed and strength.

[Texas_Ben]

This (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QNu0sR89_BM) is clearly the ideal solution.

I didn't read all the info provided. Because I was lazy. If it differs significantly from Vampire: The Masquerade let me know. Because I am lazy, and that and Dracula (the book) are my primary sources of information about vampires.

[black dragoon]

If it connects it'll definitely help. Quick tip. A 9mm is'nt gonna do jack sqaut but piss these things off. Their blood has a ridiculous clotting factor when injured. That and the dermal plates don't make the situation much easier. Figure a good shot gun to the face will do the trick.

[Fan]

If it connects it'll definitely help. Quick tip. A 9mm is'nt gonna do jack sqaut but piss these things off. Their blood has a ridiculous clotting factor when injured. That and the dermal plates don't make the situation much easier. Figure a good shot gun to the face will do the trick.
You seem to be almost QUOTING the I AM LEGEND book on this topic, sure you have added some fluff, but this seems VERY similar. I myself go with the Anne Rice version of Vampires, as they've always been more my play style then DnD Stephen King, or other vamps.

[black dragoon]

I am borrowing heavily off I Am Legend (at least someone read the book) But it's also simple deduction. You can't just stab a vampire in thechest and expect to kill You have to POUND A SOLID WOODEN STAKE THROUGH IT"S HEART! It's not just bang you're dead you have to literally deal enough damage to destroy the brain, the heart or cause it bleed out severely from taking off a limb. When I first did this write up I had never even heard of I am legend. That was three years ago BTW. It's just the logical conclusion like hitting a zombie in the brain.

[Fan]

I am borrowing heavily off I Am Legend (at least someone read the book) But it's also simple deduction. You can't just stab a vampire in thechest and expect to kill You have to POUND A SOLID WOODEN STAKE THROUGH IT"S HEART! It's not just bang you're dead you have to literally deal enough damage to destroy the brain, the heart or cause it bleed out severely from taking off a limb. When I first did this write up I had never even heard of I am legend. That was three years ago BTW. It's just the logical conclusion like hitting a zombie in the brain.
That does alot more sense, ad I think you'll find I'm not the only one who read the I AM LEGEND book on these boards. Anyway back on topic, the reason I've always liked the Anne rice vampires better is because while also going for the harder to kill aspect of the vampires, it also reveals the more human side of their being. Showing that they remember being human even from the begining, and that those crazy blood lust vampires everyone hears about are the ones that have been blood starved, and been driven mad by the thrist.

[black dragoon]

That's stages one and two. Basically starving and chemically imbalances from hell. Stages three and four are more along the lines of the blend into the background vampire. Fours are basically like Dracula and other famous vampires they kill for food and are intent on spreading the disease to anyone they take a liking to.

[Eldan]

The best solution to kill large amounts of vampires is the one from Gantz, obviously. UV Lamp, mirrors, tube...

[black dragoon]

Really with these it doesn't kill them...fast. The bacteria in the skin begin breaking down and releasing really painful chemicals into the body cause it to slowly become poisoned figure keep the light directly on them for about half an hour and they'll die from neuro-toxins a painful slow death compounded by the sensation of someone putting a maglite to your fully dilated pupils. As the light overloads their photoreceptors and blinds them.

[Oslecamo]

Honestly, I prefer the old supernatural vampire who's a creature of darkness and evil and has a thousand diferent weakness to counter his thousand strenghts.

And, with all due respect to the OP, I hate all those "vampirism is just an exotic disease that happens to make you super vulnerable to sunlight".

On the other hand, I also hate the "vampires are actually super sexy misunderstood beings who actually don't have any true weakness".

[black dragoon]

I'm aiming for a balance relax on being uber-weak vs. the sun like I said it's not an outright death. THey have other weaknesses as well. And trust me they are not touchy feely vamps.

[Oslecamo]

I'm aiming for a balance relax on being uber-weak vs. the sun like I said it's not an outright death. THey have other weaknesses as well. And trust me they are not touchy feely vamps.

Yeah, but you're making the vampire some kind of half mindless pack hungry animal.

At this rate, in 50 years we won't have mythical half human monsters anymore like lychantropy or zombification. We will have a pseudo sci-fi diseases that makes you really strong, really tough, and really hungry for flesh and angry.

[black dragoon]

In ancient myth that's what many vampires were. And they do regain intelligence as they age. It just happens that first when you overload a brain with chemicals a person tends to go a little ballistic. Stage three and stage fours are intelligent, they just happen to be brutal and violent. Even Bram stoker showed that in all reality Dracula Which is what i'm basing the Stage fours off of was simply mimicking what he saw and preying upon people like any old predator would.

[Oslecamo]

In ancient myth that's what many vampires were. And they do regain intelligence as they age. It just happens that first when you overload a brain with chemicals a person tends to go a little ballistic. Stage three and stage fours are intelligent, they just happen to be brutal and violent. Even Bram stoker showed that in all reality Dracula Which is what i'm basing the Stage fours off of was simply mimicking what he saw and preying upon people like any old predator would.

No, in ancient myth there are a lot of blood or flesh eating monsters, but they're not vampires.

They're demons or beasts who prey on humans, only a few of them even originating from human beings. The vampire only appears much later, and he normally originates not because he has been infected by an vampire but because he was an evil person who got his soul doomed himself, not some poor bastard who was at the wrong place at the wrong time.

Also, most of the vampires can not only transform into some kind of animal to disguise themselves, but also control non vampire weak willed minions, both things your..eerr..."ghoul" can't do.

[black dragoon]

Your talking about the medieval vampire look further back. I'm basing these around a collection of myths. Vampiric creatures date back thousands of years. These combine traits of these creatures into a whole.

[Fan]

Your talking about the medieval vampire look further back. I'm basing these around a collection of myths. Vampiric creatures date back thousands of years. These combine traits of these creatures into a whole.

Once again, I'm a HUGE advocate of the Anne Rice vampires, I feel like vamprism should be treated like a mostly benefical form of cancer, your still human as far as your mind, and soul goes, but your body changes warping to become an enternal trap for your soul.

[Oslecamo]

Your talking about the medieval vampire look further back. I'm basing these around a collection of myths. Vampiric creatures date back thousands of years. These combine traits of these creatures into a whole.

"Vampiric creatures". Not vampires. There's hundreds of them and they all have their own spawning methods and powers. Many of them are not even humanoid for Dracula's sake.

Some of them become our modern devils, other werewolfs, chimeras, etc, etc. Vampires combine only a fraction of those ancient creatures.

[Texas_Ben]

Here is the plan. Build a giant chainsaw, that has chainsaw for teeth. The chainsaws that are teeth on the giant chainsaw will have katanas for teeth. The entire thing will be on fire.

vampires == dead.

[black dragoon]

And you drain the U.S. Defense fund. :smalltongue:
As to the vampires once again They are SENTIENT! I've been elusive because I've been wary to describe A creature such as them as that. The first two stages don't show it Because
A. Stage one you are still being fueled by a shot pure adrenaline, and endorphins TO THE BRAIN! You won't really be thinking considering you're starving and nothing you recognize as food is appealing to you anymore.
B stage two are still getting the hang of things including the whole feeding frenzy effect. Some vampires never 'mature' past this stage yes but many become stage threes which are fully functional minds that may or may not remember they are human( I have yet to decide) and are trying to cope with the fact that for the past six months or so they have been killing anything that moves and have been getting high off it.

[comicshorse]

I'm reminded of the T.V. series 'Ultraviolet' where the hero is shocked to discover the vamp he's meeting had the foresight to turn up in a bulletproof vest

[black dragoon]

Yeah stage four...They are not just mindless killers go figure....

I've already said that three and fours use tactics weapons and try to seem outwardly human till they can strike or the case of the fours till they can get away safely and have infected a sizable number of victims.

[comicshorse]

Hmmm the 'Lost Boys' movie fits this very well, with David and his bunch as the pack of Types 3 under the command of the much smarter Type 4

[black dragoon]

YAY!:smallbiggrin: Someone gets the concept!
That's how I imagine the dynamics working type fours are smarter and possibly tougher and assert this rather effectivley over a pack. They always kill in fact a T-4's biological imperative is to spread to the disease. They force order upon the pack and make sure there is'nt a horde of killing machines roaming about acting like locusts.

[Gavin Sage]

Advancing out of animal state isn't really all that helpful you know. Having one to begin with sets the tone of everything and stretches how these creatures can survive to begin with. Given that this isn't an outright apocalypse disease, right?

Sorry to harp on my pet peeve again, but stripping out the mystical I think very much dimishes the vampire's horror. Dracula is scarier for his utter twisting of humanity into a monster, the deep depths of sin and evil transfiguring a man into something else entirely. Dead to all signs, but animated by unholy power. Something that isn't just twisting of a human but is a not-human in human form.

Murdering and drinking blood isn't terribly scary when you have serial killers in the world. And while wrapping vampiric powers in science is interesting it cuts out a much older and deeper mythos. The vampire is scary for being a monster among monsters, not a poor fellow with a disease that gives him weird eating habits and a tooth disorder.

[black dragoon]

I understand your sentiments but, this is something that I want to do. I need to rationalize things, it's a natural urge of mine Probably the scientist in me trying to get out.:smalltongue:

[Gavin Sage]

I understand your sentiments but, this is something that I want to do. I need to rationalize things, it's a natural urge of mine Probably the scientist in me trying to get out.:smalltongue:

Please don't take this the wrong way but rationalizing it should only make it harder to treat vampires as 'realistic' since there are so very many more problems to conquer this way.

Since well science really demands more then special enzymes or adrenalin. It one thing to amp up the metabolism, but putting the body in an unnatural state is a great way to kill it. Pushing it beyond normal limits is going to be destructive. Vampires should expect short lifespans as their overcharged bodies run down. And its all well and good to say the body of a vampire produces a narcotic, but what narcotic and how does this drug work. For that matter how is is organically produced. Nevermind getting down to the provoking the rather unnatural act of drinking of blood over simply being carnivorous. You'd have to chemically master psychology perfectly to produce such a specific effect and compell it on a sentient being.

Nevermind the headaches involved with rewriting genes on a large scale, and the complexity of an organism that could possibly manage such a change across different cell structures. Its like growing a million clones, outside a womb, simultaneously, and then merging them. You'd need a disease capable of communicating quasi-intelligently with it copies to manage such a thing across all cell types at once. Something so powerful should dominate the world in short order.

And of course you could still shoot the things dead about as easy as anything else. Because its hard to stay alive when blood is leaving the body and robbing organs of oxygen no matter you feel pain or not. So having hunters specifically devoted to these horrible monsters seems a bit much, in this world it would be treated like well.... rabies mixed with ebola.

Ultimately I find it harder to rationalize along a scientific courses and still result with vampires.

[black dragoon]

Surprisingly some of this is possible. Organisms naturally rewrite there physical makeup in nature very frequently in fact look at the simple butterfly and caterpillar one could say that the process isn't that different. It is true that such an astounding change at that fast a pace could kill the subject( I may rewrite this anyway making it more gradual) Our bodies secrete hormones When we eat specific foods as well. Their anatomy is being keyed to a different set is all. As for the blood craving. Do you crave a steak? how about water? To a vampire it has become instinctive. I now have a college level Library and freetime. I can work out the details now I really can't wait to start the real hammering out.

[Texas_Ben]

Sorry to harp on my pet peeve again, but stripping out the mystical I think very much dimishes the vampire's horror. Dracula is scarier for his utter twisting of humanity into a monster, the deep depths of sin and evil transfiguring a man into something else entirely. Dead to all signs, but animated by unholy power. Something that isn't just twisting of a human but is a not-human in human form.

Murdering and drinking blood isn't terribly scary when you have serial killers in the world. And while wrapping vampiric powers in science is interesting it cuts out a much older and deeper mythos. The vampire is scary for being a monster among monsters, not a poor fellow with a disease that gives him weird eating habits and a tooth disorder.
I agree with this. Zombies work in a semi-sci-fi setting, but Vampires are interesting because of their otherworldliness.

[black dragoon]

Iassume mention of space vampires are out of the question?:smallwink:

[comicshorse]

Completely !

[black dragoon]

darn:smalltongue:
I am reworking the idea as I go along. I first began designing the basic premise when I was in elventh grade and only had a basic understanding and little in the way of research materials. Now I can use a full library that has texts on folklore and biochemistry readily.

[Gavin Sage]

Surprisingly some of this is possible. Organisms naturally rewrite there physical makeup in nature very frequently in fact look at the simple butterfly and caterpillar one could say that the process isn't that different. It is true that such an astounding change at that fast a pace could kill the subject( I may rewrite this anyway making it more gradual) Our bodies secrete hormones When we eat specific foods as well. Their anatomy is being keyed to a different set is all. As for the blood craving. Do you crave a steak? how about water? To a vampire it has become instinctive. I now have a college level Library and freetime. I can work out the details now I really can't wait to start the real hammering out.

Catterpillar to butterfly though is something the creature is well... designed to do . Even larva have the proto-wing structures that exist but at simply not visible yet. Their wings thus can be compared to the sexual organs of human children. Do humans have the bio-mechanical devices nessecary to produce narcotic poison that is simply undeveloped?

And a butterfly and catterpillar are not rewriting their genetic code to change. They don't have to war with the rest of their body while transforming.

[black dragoon]

True. Like I've said it's a work in progress. I will probaley rewrite much of what is here. I need more research still. It is true that we do not have the structures to produce the needed chemicals (I'll probably straight up scrap that one). Do not forget the ability of salivary glands though. anyways continue posting I'll say what I can and start to do some more thorough research. Till the morn then?

[Fri]

Maybe it's the natural morphine? (damn, I forgot what it was called). The virus just make it more potent.

[GoC]

Rapidly clotting blood?
Those vampires are going to have a very short lifespan given that they'll soon develope lethal blood clots.

[hamishspence]

Last I chacked, it wasn't that uncommon for some creatures to have blood that clots fairly rapidly, when exposed to air.

Only danger would be a clotting mechanism that isn't limited only to the area of injury: if I remeber rightly, the disease in The Andromeda Strain novel induced ultra-rapid clotting through the entire circulatory system.

[black dragoon]

It's similar to ours in a lot of ways but, when exposed to air(free nitrogen actually) it begins to rapidly clot up. This prevents the whole vampires dying of blood clots issue. Primarily because our bodies don't have a whole lot of gaseous nitrogen in the blood stream. The lungs however do on occasion develop small clots. But thanks to a small amount of anticoagulant that works it's into lungs from the mouth this isn't that common.

[black dragoon]

What I have so far...modified to fit a more 'logical' progression.

The origin of The Vampire

Contrary to popular belief the vampire is not some form of mystical creature. Rather it has succumbed to a strange and virulent disease that brings forth this monster. This disease until recently had never been isolated. Genetic analysis traces it to a common ancestry with the common bacterial infection known as Rabies. This more deadly strain however has increased virulence and a short painful incubation as it rapidly changes the host into a monster. Carriers of this disease in he animal kingdom typically only display symptoms like that of rabies or even non at all. The most common carriers are those associated with the vampire of myth. The wolf,Bat,the rat and other similar species. This does not include the other more obvious carrier the vampire itself.
How the infection spreads:
The culprit of this disease a unique variety of bacteria that as far as anyone can tell carries within it either a retrovirus or a totally new method of tampering with the hosts' genetic structure lives primarily in the bodily fluids of the hosts. Exposure to air does not kill outright nor does typical methods such as boiling. However, direct exposure to ultraviolet radiation immediately triggers a series biochemical reactions that break down the cell structure destroying the bacteria.
As with it's common cousin bites can and often do spread the infection. Other means are possible however, contact with bodily fluids such as blood,saliva and others can leave the bacteria upon the skin and if exposed to an open wound an all to easy vector to infection. This virus also is found around areas of a vampires body that have succumbed to it's unusual changes. Sub dermal portions of the skin carry the virus in small enough amounts to cause infection. The G.I. tract one of the most heavily modified structures of the vampire is loaded with the bacteria which thrives. The Heart,Lungs and Liver also contain high concentrations. The heart and liver also have been modified extensively during the 'turning' however the lungs for many years remained a mystery. That was till the case of Antwone Bernat. A young Parisian vampire hunter who had apparently started to turn without reason. It was later revealed that young Antwone had apparently suffered the infection First in his Lungs as a respiratory disease. It appeared that he had somehow contracted the virus in an airborne form. This probaley occured when he had encountered a vampire in the early stages of it's infection or during a period of vampirism known as the carrier stage(detailed later).


What happens During Infection:

Though the rate at which a given individual becomes a vampire is variable. It normally takes approx. one to weeks before any obvious signs occur.
During this incubation period the host in theory may be treatable. But, there are known cures that do not cause a massive shock to the victims body. At this stage a victim may live as normal going out into sunlight without fear or any adverse reaction.
Start Of symptoms: Infected individuals begin to show symptoms around a week to two weeks after being exposed. The symptoms are reminiscent of the common cold though the victim suffers from extreme hunger as the disease prepares for it's coming change. These cold-like symptoms progress steadily till they become more like that of a respiratory infection(three to four days)
The victim still has an extreme hunger and does not seem to have any trouble eating. After another week or so the victim begins to start down the path of actual changing. In the times before modern medicine it would seem to anyone curious as if the victim finally succumbed to the trouble they were having with their lungs, however modern medicine notes that in reality they have entered into a deep coma. The victim at this point begins to become a vampire.
The large amount of food consumed is intended to allow the victim to more easily change without losing much of their body mass. The bacteria which had been slowly changing the body begins the transformation in earnest wreaking havoc upon the poor person's DNA.

Stage One- The weakest stage of the vampire lifecycle, this is also called the newborn stage. newborns are at the physical level still very human. They are only marginally stronger and faster as teh virus has yet to work through their bodies completely. However they retain little in the way of sanity or humanity and suffer from constant rage as the virus pours a cocktail of chemicals into the brain. A state of constant hunger especially for meat and nutrient dense foods causes these creatures to be ravenous eating machines as they aquire more suplies to fuel their gruesome change. Certain individuals never leave this stage and are commonly referred to as ghouls or renefields by hunters.

Stage Two- After a span of roughly half a month the metamorphis has taken it's next step. A stage one has by now gained considerable strength and dexterity as well as the noteworthy fangs and a thicker platlet rich blood known as Ichor. This is also when a Vampire begins to develop a taste for blood. During stage one a vampire's body is slowly changed over from the human GI into a far more efficent and carnivorous one. This new system includes a special 'second stomach' located slightly before the original that pocesses blood that is taken from the prey. This at it's largest pear sized organ looks like a slight bulge in the esphogus in disectted specimens and seems to filter blood as food is passed through. Their is also a large concentration of bacteria that cause vampirism found here as well making one wonder if the vampire simply is trying to stave off the disease. Thankfully the disease is still working upon the body and causing chemical havoc within the brain causing overaggresion and an intense hunger. Unforantly however after such long exposure the brain is beginning to adapt to this allowing the vampire some modicum of it's original mind to be used resulting in a fast aggresive often sdistic predator known as the beserker.

Stage Three- Considered for many years to be the final stage of the vampire's lifecycle stage threes finally come out of the killing haze that blankets their minds for approx. one-two years.At this point the vast majority of the vampires mutations have taken place and become stable aspects of it's anatomy. It can also be said that a Vampire at this point is at it's most deadly. A stage three is fully aware and sentient.Able to plan and use at least a human level intellect these creatures are also eager to search out others and form packs to claim territory for themselves. Stage threes act largely along a well planned routine that will not get them noticed and when in a fight make use of their prodigious speed and strength to full ability.

Vampire Stages:


Stage One: Newborn-
A newborn vampire is just coming out of it's coma. weaker than a the rest of it's kin a newborn primarily lives like a feral animal and will kill anything that it perceives as a food source, this includes other vampires...It also is learning the limitations of it's abilties and commonly appear almost clumsy as they adjust to their strength and dexterity. Newborns look very much like a regular human though extremely gaunt due to the nature of their transformation.

Stage Two: Beserker-
This stage occurs roughly within a week of awakening. The Beserker is the most common variety of vampire and also the most active. It has gained comprehension of it's new body and knows the surrounding area that it claims as it's own. Thankfully, a beserker is more intent on feeding than spreading it's disease and will normally outright kill it's prey. It has been shown however that certain specimens have an apparent malicious streak and will 'play' with their food by means such as stalking, torture and attacks against those that it thinks are connected to it's primary quarry. Beserkers thankfully are not very intelligent and act mostly off of animal instinct due to the brain still being flooded with high concentrations of hormones, This also is the source of their name. Many hunters have claimed that even for a vampire these creatures seem to feel no pain what so ever. further study however is difficult at best since the creatures are next to impossible to capture and in the rare instances they have been will try to starve themselves or attack anything that gets within a few feet of them.

Stage Three: Pack hunter-
The third and longest lasting stage, roughly between three and five years into a vampire's new life they begin to almost instinctively form a group with which to hunt prey. This disturbing behavior is only reinforced by a sharp and rather dramatic rise of intelligence as the vampires begin to develop a rudimentary form communicating and begin to coordinate with disturbing proficiency. There has also been some evidence that the vampires begin to attempt to mimic human behavior in crude attempts to fool their prey of choice. This includes waving hands and dressing in more than simple tattered clothes that they had from before changing. Some Hunters have also reported tool using amongst the vampires a disturbing trend that eventually culminates with a stage four.

Stage Four: Nightmaster
The rarest form of Vampire. The Nightmaster is an entity shrouded in mystery and wrapped in secret. It is believed that possibly not every vampire becomes a nightmaster and rather only certain individuals reach this point. A nightmaster is different from other vampires it goes out of it's way to spread the infection. It preys upon animals or upon the sick or dying. It is believed to be at least as intelligent as a regular human being and able to nearly seamlessly blend into everyday life. The few encounters with a nightmaster have shown that it seems to be able to at lest understand the local language and also seems to avoid combat. Beyond this however little is known though.

Gender: Male

Default Re: The Vampyre A look into Hunting the Hunter(inpsired partly by Max Brooks and thre
Vampire Stages:
Spoiler


Spoiler

A vampire goes through four distinct developmental stages as it ages. The first being the most easily dispatched and the final an elusive hunter intent on creating more of it's kind. There are few apparent physical changes to a vampire however and much of the changes that occur are within the creature's brain chemistry and thought processes.


Stage One: Newborn
Spoiler

A newborn vampire is just coming out of it's coma. weaker than a the rest of it's kin a newborn primarily lives like a feral animal and will kill anything that it perceives as a food source, this includes other vampires...It also is learning the limitations of it's abilties and commonly appear almost clumsy as they adjust to their strength and dexterity. Newborns look very much like a regular human though extremely gaunt due to the nature of their transformation.


Stage Two: Beserker
Spoiler
This stage occurs roughly within a week of awakening. The Beserker is the most common variety of vampire and also the most active. It has gained comprehension of it's new body and knows the surrounding area that it claims as it's own. Thankfully, a beserker is more intent on feeding than spreading it's disease and will normally outright kill it's prey. It has been shown however that certain specimens have an apparent malicious streak and will 'play' with their food by means such as stalking, torture and attacks against those that it thinks are connected to it's primary quarry. Beserkers thankfully are not very intelligent and act mostly off of animal instinct due to the brain still being flooded with high concentrations of hormones, This also is the source of their name. Many hunters have claimed that even for a vampire these creatures seem to feel no pain what so ever. further study however is difficult at best since the creatures are next to impossible to capture and in the rare instances they have been will try to starve themselves or attack anything that gets within a few feet of them.


Stage Three: Pack hunter
Spoiler

The third and longest lasting stage, roughly between three and five years into a vampire's new life they begin to almost instinctively form a group with which to hunt prey. This disturbing behavior is only reinforced by a sharp and rather dramatic rise of intelligence as the vampires begin to develop a rudimentary form communicating and begin to coordinate with disturbing proficiency. There has also been some evidence that the vampires begin to attempt to mimic human behavior in crude attempts to fool their prey of choice. This includes waving hands and dressing in more than simple tattered clothes that they had from before changing. Some Hunters have also reported tool using amongst the vampires a disturbing trend that eventually culminates with a stage four.


Stage Four: Nightmaster
Spoiler

The rarest form of Vampire. The Nightmaster is an entity shrouded in mystery and wrapped in secret. It is believed that possibly not every vampire becomes a nightmaster and rather only certain individuals reach this point. A nightmaster is different from other vampires it goes out of it's way to spread the infection. It preys upon animals or upon the sick or dying. It is believed to be at least as intelligent as a regular human being and able to nearly seamlessly blend into everyday life. The few encounters with a nightmaster have shown that it seems to be able to at lest understand the local language and also seems to avoid combat. Beyond this however little is known though.



Social Structure Of the Vampire
Though it may seem that the vampire has little in the way of a mind this is sadly far from the truth. A vampire is a vicious cunning predator from the very first day. It may seem to be a mindless beast at first but, this is a subtle illusion. The chemicals that flood the brain of the vampire at 'birth' and during feeding frenzies cause it to enter a state of incredible rage and anger. Newborn vampires and the slightly older beserkers are nearly constantly in this state due to their severe malnutrition after the change. By stage three a vampires brain chemistry has balanced itself out to more a stable level when it is not threatened. Nightmasters seem however to be completely incapable of entering this state resulting in yet more questions about the strange life cycle of the vampire.
The question of a vampire being a social creature is not a question in all truth. They were human and like humans by nature are social animals. By stage three a vampire has developed a complex social hierarchy with it's fellow hunters and adheres to their rules. By stage four a vampire seems to take a dramatic turn and becomes something utterly unexpected. Nightmasters seem fueled by the urge to spread the disease and gifted with a frighteningly high capacity for learning. It is rumored that nightmasters actively seek out new victims by a variety of methods including possibly seduction considering the legends of succubi, inccubi and vampires that seduced mortals before consuming them. It has also been thought that nightmasters may have entire packs of vampires under their control. Weather this is through pure brute force or other methods remains a mystery. Some scientists however have suggested that it may be a form of pheromone or other subtler methods due to the distinct nature of the nighmaster and it's rarity.
The typical vampire pack ranges between three-twenty individuals who claim a swath of territory as their own hunting ground. Within this territory are typically three to five 'crypts' or areas that are protected from bright,direct daylight. This is duel purpose. The first being to prevent the bacteria that caused their transformation from breaking down flooding their bodies with painful metabolic toxins and to prevent their extremely sensitive eyes from being overloaded from the bright light. Within these lairs a vampire pack will enter into a coma like sleep waiting for the darkness.
As night falls upon a packs territory it awakens their bodies becoming supercharged and temperatures skyrocketing to around a hundred and three degrees core body temperature. A pack will begin by searching the surrounding area for any small game or going to a place they have previously hunted and found successful during past hunts. A pack leader will designate their next target or targets in the case of larger packs and begin to instruct it's fellows to set up a trap or ambush. Typically one vampire will scare the targeted prey and drive it towards it's kin. As the prey enters the kill zone the slaughter begins. Anyone unfortunate enough to stumble upon the remains of kill will find a mangled corpse ripped apart and drained of it's blood and missing organs with high iron and protein.

habits and characteristics of each phase.

Stage One- The newborn stage is noted for it's ravenous appetite and almost animalistic mindset. Newborns have a one track mind focused upon feeding till they can satisfy their incredible hunger caused by their transformation. Newborns are rarely seen with other vampires and tend to have very simple minds in a fight. They focus solely on killing and eating the enemy.

Stage Two- The beserker is little different form the previous stage save for the fact that it's no longer obsessed with simply eating. A Stage two vampire is a cunning predator that hunts at leisurely pace or attacks with a ravenous hunger and fury. Stage twos also have gained a better comprehension of their capabilities and will employ surprising strategy when confronted with a strong opponent. Beserkers also have been known to use weapons such as clubs or pieces of re-bar to beat an armored foe to death.

Stage Three- For many decades considered the 'adult' form of the vampire stage threes are highly intelligent and assuredly pack animals. Threes employ concepts such as ambush hunting, tool using, disguising themselves as regular humans, baiting and switching, and weapon and tool using.

Stage Four- The most mysterious of the vampires the nightmaster seems to be fully able to blend into human society surprisingly well. There have been reports of nightmasters across the globe all of which seem to avoid combat as much as possible as they slowly spread the disease amongst the populace. They oddly however do not perform this act in a conventional bite normally. Rather it's primary method is an act known as the Death Kiss. A Nightmaster will 'kiss' normally with a small cut in it's mouth and spread the bacteria orally. This may explain the high concentrations within a vampires lungs save the fact it seems to be present even in specimens that have been bitten. Nightmasters are rarely seen with stage fours and rather seem to keep a pack of stage threes which will follow there commands unerringly.

The physiology of The Vampire
physical characteristics-
A vampire looks much the way it did before it changed into a monster. hair, and skin color stay the same as does height. However do to it's incredible energy demands a vampire appears nearly always gaunt. The exception being after it has fed in which case it's face and cheeks in particular appear ruddy and filled with blood. This probably is a method to single to other vamps of a food source. The bodily composition of a vampire is different from the human as well. The fatty layer beneath the skin is almost non-existent and is replaced along the long bones, sections of the chest, spine, feet and hands by chitin like scales that are hidden beneath the skin. If the vampire is of considerable age this chitinous layer is visible beneath the skin of the ankles and feet leading to the legends possibly of harpies and other bird-men creatures. The nails of a vampire have also changed. The keratin in the nails has been blended with a similar chitin-like material that is found beneath the skin allowing for incredible durability, this has allowed many vampires to easily stalk prey from trees and rooftops and kill a man easily with it's bare hands.

Senses- During the transition into becoming a vampire a human being develops Surprisingly specialized senses. The eyes become far more photo-sensitive(nearly five times that of a human being) allowing for accurate and rather impressive night vision. The ears of a vampire become similar to a canines even developing a distinctive point. The sense of smell of a vampire is also enhanced. Hunters who have had the tables turned have recounted how vampire's blinded and deafened have still tracked down their prey using their sense of smell alone. The sense of touch however seems to be slightly deadened allowing for an incredible pain threshold. Their sense of taste has become attuned to a new more carnivorous diet and plants including onions and garlic are repulsive to the creatures taste. It can also be said that certain specimens become blood addicts due to unique euphoria that is induced while feeding in both the victim and the vampire.These senses can be used against it however and will be discussed later.

[Fan]

*bump*
I think its defintely better, but I still like Anne rice better.:smalltongue:

[black dragoon]

I won't argue I've sadly had to call Hiatus on this for the time being. I've got a D20 commission going that chews up my time and spits it out.

[Fan]

I won't argue I've sadly had to call Hiatus on this for the time being. I've got a D20 commission going that chews up my time and spits it out.
We all has our hobbies, and preferences BD, and if life or other projects sponge your time no one can hold it against you.:smallsmile:

[black dragoon]

Yeah I posted The rewrite on Deviant art so it can glare at me when I'm looking for material for the D20 at least.:smalltongue:

[Fan]

Well then, since I'm a vamp.

*kitteh glares*
.... that loses alot of its effectiveness with the kitteh part added doesn't it?

[black dragoon]

yeah sorry. Here's some catnip...But IT IS HOLY CATNIP BUWHAHA!:smallbiggrin:

[Fan]

Your mean *nibbles, and gets burnt*
I cant resist!:smalleek:

[black dragoon]

Hehehe. Can't help it. And no holy symbols don't work on my vamps.

[Fan]

Hehehe. Can't help it. And no holy symbols don't work on my vamps.

they don't work in Anne Rice either. Lestat walks into churches of his faith ALL the time.

[black dragoon]

Figures. It was a concept invented in a time when religion was strong so why not make it repellent to the undead?

[Fan]

Figures. It was a concept invented in a time when religion was strong so why not make a repellent to the undead? Nowadays science seems to hold over better. I have faith but I'm a scientist. I don't care what anyone says either. I'm darwininst and catholic. If they don't like they can suck an egg.:smallamused:
So you believe that God pushed along evolution. (take this to Pm as I think its inaprropriate for the boards.)

[black dragoon]

Yeah I'm gonan drop the topic right now I don't want to incur the wrath of the mods again...:smalleek:

[Fan]

As I said if you wanted to talk about it I'd be willing to move to Pm.
On another topic... how bout them cowboys?

[black dragoon]

Not really just throwing it out there.
yeah cowboys...not doing so good I've heard. As for the vampires well they are getting yet another movie...Blech.

[Fan]

I know its twlight I think, a decent romance to read, but not so good in movie form.

[black dragoon]

Yeah GF is not thrilled with who they cast as Edward. Honestly I could care less. I don't like cuddly Vampires and Biologically they are a nightmare for me. You can't have skin as hard as a rock be Ice cold and not be dense enough to have to have incredible levels of muscle and a Hyper active metabolic rate to function Not to mention I don't like psionics any time they are mixed with the undead.

[Fan]

Yeah GF is not thrilled with who they cast as Edward. Honestly I could care less. I don't like cuddly Vampires and Biologically they are a nightmare for me. You can't have skin as hard as a rock be Ice cold and not be dense enough to have to have incredible levels of muscle and a Hyper active metabolic rate to function Not to mention I don't like psionics any time they are mixed with the undead.
As I said decnt read.... crappy movie. :P

[black dragoon]

To each their own then. gah! so Hungry!!! But I'm poor and don't want to waste my free meal...:smallfrown:

[Fan]

To each their own then. gah! so Hungry!!! But I'm poor and don't want to waste my free meal...:smallfrown:
I understand your pain, money isn't something i have in abundance either.

[black dragoon]

Yeah...I used to have a steady job then I went to college....:smallfrown:

[Fan]

Yeah...I used to have a steady job then I went to college....:smallfrown:
Yeah its not exactly cheap, but its well worth the extra pay that you grab by having a degree.

[black dragoon]

I know that's why I keep telling myself that if I starve a little It's for the greater good...Argh.... I can't help but to think of Tau now....

[Fan]

I know that's why I keep telling myself that if I starve a little It's for the greater good...Argh.... I can't help but to think of Tau now....
Don't ofcus on the hunger freind lose yourself in the work, or homeowr that you are given. It serves as a good motivator, and focus tool as well.

[black dragoon]

That's what I do. Hard when I all get is lecture though. Oh well. I can't wait to see how Microbio lab goes to tomorrow I'm attempting a culture off of M&Ms.:smallbiggrin: