PDA

View Full Version : D&D's Least Hospitable Locales [3.5]



afroakuma
2008-09-11, 08:55 PM
Opinions, folks: of all currently available locations in the (official product-based) D&D multiverse, which are the most severe, the most soul-wrenching, the most inimical?

My own personal picks:

The Elemental Plane of Vacuum: Eternal, sucking nothingess, sparsely populated by creatures of eternal, sucking nothingness.

The Far Realm: The time-rent plane of unmitigated madness.

Sekolah's Realm, Stygia, Baator: Pitch-black, ice-cold waters of forgetfulness populated by GIANT MONSTROUS SHARKS. And there are still deeper waters below THAT.

Any others?

Thurbane
2008-09-11, 08:59 PM
Negative Energy plane.

Elemental plane of fire.

Sstoopidtallkid
2008-09-11, 09:02 PM
Tomb of Horrors.
Positive Energy Plane.
Sigil, only if you have a sign Sovereign-glued to you hands commanding people to worship the Lady.

afroakuma
2008-09-11, 09:05 PM
I didn't include the Plane of Fire in my own picks because there are so many ways to handle it.

And the Tomb of Horrors is too specific/obvious. I was looking more for really obnoxious/unpleasant/horrific places to force travel to, not really obnoxious/unpleasant/horrific dungeons specifically.

Collin152
2008-09-11, 09:06 PM
Inside the Tarrasque's belly.

or mouth.

Ganurath
2008-09-11, 09:08 PM
A theocracy devoted to Hextor, where the mandatory post-mortem option is reanimation as a skeleton to serve in the military.

Dode
2008-09-11, 09:12 PM
Temporal Energy Plane

You're constantly taking damage, getting messed up by insane constructs and being imprisoned in timelag.

Manoftyr
2008-09-11, 09:20 PM
The Far Realm, easily...where everything is conditioned specifically to 'be' unpleasant for beings of flesh and blood.

...curiously, I'd like the real life ability to be able to travel the far realm and back at will, seems like the kind of place one could really expand their mind in if one took it in small doses.

Jalor
2008-09-11, 09:22 PM
The Far Realm is probably the most horrible, but the Negative and Positive Energy planes will probably kill you faster.

Stupendous_Man
2008-09-11, 09:26 PM
The Far Realm, easily...where everything is conditioned specifically to 'be' unpleasant for beings of flesh and blood.

...curiously, I'd like the real life ability to be able to travel the far realm and back at will, seems like the kind of place one could really expand their mind in if one took it in small doses.

Are you prepared for NONLINEAR TIME AND UN-EUCLIDEAN GEOMETRIES BEYOND ALL COMPREHENSION!?!?!?

Manoftyr
2008-09-11, 09:29 PM
Are you prepared for NONLINEAR TIME AND UN-EUCLIDEAN GEOMETRIES BEYOND ALL COMPREHENSION!?!?!?

I'd welcome it, nothing like a little insanity or nonsense to splotch this predictable boring mindscape commonly known as reality :smallamused:

FoE
2008-09-11, 09:37 PM
The Abyss. And Dolurrh, Xoriat and Dal Quor, from Eberron.

Collin152
2008-09-11, 09:40 PM
Are you prepared for NONLINEAR TIME AND UN-EUCLIDEAN GEOMETRIES BEYOND ALL COMPREHENSION!?!?!?

The secret is to try to not understand it.
That's how I get by.

Sstoopidtallkid
2008-09-11, 09:55 PM
The personal, private sanctum of one of Tippy's epic-level wizards. Even if there isn't a Contingency to slowly shred your soul and crush your mind, the reek of cheese would be overwhelming.

TheCountAlucard
2008-09-11, 10:09 PM
Hades, I say. Nothing like having your soul slowly stripped away from sheer lack of will to live...

Mikeavelli
2008-09-11, 11:56 PM
The 4th layer of Pandemonium.. It's a lost, hidden place composed entirely of bubble-like caverns in what is otherwise a plane of solid rock. Plus, the crazy wind still blows.

It's where the gods go to seal away their nastiest little secrets that are never, ever supposed to be found.

The_Snark
2008-09-12, 12:55 AM
I'll nominate Carceri. It isn't as lethal as the Positive/Negative energy planes, but more than Hades, it's always defined misery for me. This is because Hades is a generic, grey misery, whereas Carceri is descriptive in its hostile squalidity.

(Actually, I've always had a soft spot for the Great Wheel planes that weren't supposed to exemplify alignments. Carceri, Pandemonium, Acheron, Gehenna, Ysgard, the Beastlands... all very atmospheric and full of story hooks. Limbo, Elysium, et al are less interesting to me.)

Put it this way: Everyone you meet is an absolute bastard who might have literally sold his own mother. You won't find brilliant, scheming politicians here; they're in Baator, or maybe Gehenna. You won't find screaming blood-crazed berserkers and nihilistic cultists; they're in the Abyss. Here you get the petty people, who are utterly without morals in a way that's not grandiose or impressive at all, just slightly nauseating. And the plane molds you to be even more that way, spiteful and malicious and hating everything, even (perhaps especially) yourself, for being such a slimy traitorous worm and not even doing it glamorously. Even the demons and devils stuck there hate it, and they're used to pretty terrible conditions already. The only known willing inhabitant is Nerull, who lives there to keep his hatred of everything that lives sharp. (You live in someplace like the Abyss, you run the risk of deciding you kinda like some of these layers, and maybe that minion can stay... next thing you know, you're actually teaming up with teams of heroes on a temporary basis and respecting foes.)

And if you have the means to get yourself out, great! You've now given all these spiteful, malicious bastards who are trapped here an actual motive to sell you out or shove you into an ocean of acid, as if they needed one. If you don't have the means... hi, and welcome to Carceri. Have a nice eternity.

Jade_Tarem
2008-09-12, 01:02 AM
I can't believe that people are fixated on places like Hell, the outer reaches of striated madness, and so forth. The most dangerous place in DnD, from the Far Planes down to the depths of Hades, is...

The tavern.

You know. The tavern where you start your adventure. No other place in any campaign has a default 100% chance of a potentially lethal encounter occuring than the average PC-occupied inn. All kinds of wacky **** rolls through, and if it doesn't, then the PCs will see to it that it becomes a death trap right before it bursts into flames, if not after. There's just something about your average two-story, one bar temporary traveller's shelter that corrupts the very fabric of reality, warping all probability and drawing all manner of dangers to that point. Hilarity and grand adventure stems from these events, but there can be no doubt that the traditional inn is by far the most inhospitable locale in DnD. When you walk in to that building, mark my words: Something. Will. Die.

"We'll leave the light on for you. As for the orcs, you're on your own."

Keld Denar
2008-09-12, 01:10 AM
Hmmm, the positive energy plane wouldn't be such a bad place to die. Sure, the swelling of temporary hp until you burst from awesomeness would ultimately be fatal, but the slow, yet pleasent, build up as your body is filled with a warm fuzzy feeling, culminating into an explosion of intense feelings of wholeness and goodness.

Kind of like having a heart attack and dying after really really REALLY good sex...

Winged One
2008-09-12, 01:17 AM
Put it this way: Everyone you meet is an absolute bastard who might have literally sold his own mother. You won't find brilliant, scheming politicians here; they're in Baator, or maybe Gehenna. You won't find screaming blood-crazed berserkers and nihilistic cultists; they're in the Abyss. Here you get the petty people, who are utterly without morals in a way that's not grandiose or impressive at all, just slightly nauseating. And the plane molds you to be even more that way, spiteful and malicious and hating everything, even (perhaps especially) yourself, for being such a slimy traitorous worm and not even doing it glamorously.
So...Carceri is Real Life?

Ecalsneerg
2008-09-12, 01:33 AM
The personal, private sanctum of one of Tippy's epic-level wizards. Even if there isn't a Contingency to slowly shred your soul and crush your mind, the reek of cheese would be overwhelming.
Definitely seconded. What he does is terrifying.

Zen Master
2008-09-12, 02:51 AM
Truth of the matter is: No place anyone has ever imagined - no creature anyone has ever invented - is any worse than the horrors of the prime material plane, and the evils committed by mortal man.

The Corinthian
2008-09-12, 03:13 AM
[threadjack]

Truth of the matter is: No place anyone has ever imagined - no creature anyone has ever invented - is any worse than the horrors of the prime material plane, and the evils committed by mortal man.

All sorts of people say that, or something similar, and as cynical as I am, I always wonder why. It's just not true. Now, I think it's probably because all the atrocious horrors of the various Manuals of Planes and Monsters are ultimately not real, and as such just can't horrify us as much as all the disgusting things that have happened in the real world, which it is much easier for us to relate to. At risk of falling prey to Godwin's Law, take the example of the Nazis. They committed mass murder on an industrial scale because of a demented belief that their victims were subhuman, and have been a byword for human evil ever since. The Illithid? They commit mass murder on an industrial scale because they're *hungry*. Heck, they breed sentient species like animals for slaves and food. And you can't even resist, if you're one of those unfortunate souls. They make you *thank* them for it. They make you feel genuine *gratitude* that they'll allow you to nourish them. If they were real, do you think we'd be saying that no horror compares to human evil?

bosssmiley
2008-09-12, 05:29 AM
I'll nominate Carceri. It isn't as lethal as the Positive/Negative energy planes, but more than Hades, it's always defined misery for me. This is because Hades is a generic, grey misery, whereas Carceri is descriptive in its hostile squalidity.

(Actually, I've always had a soft spot for the Great Wheel planes that weren't supposed to exemplify alignments. Carceri, Pandemonium, Acheron, Gehenna, Ysgard, the Beastlands... all very atmospheric and full of story hooks. Limbo, Elysium, et al are less interesting to me.)

Put it this way: Everyone you meet is an absolute bastard who might have literally sold his own mother. You won't find brilliant, scheming politicians here; they're in Baator, or maybe Gehenna. You won't find screaming blood-crazed berserkers and nihilistic cultists; they're in the Abyss. Here you get the petty people, who are utterly without morals in a way that's not grandiose or impressive at all, just slightly nauseating. And the plane molds you to be even more that way, spiteful and malicious and hating everything, even (perhaps especially) yourself, for being such a slimy traitorous worm and not even doing it glamorously. Even the demons and devils stuck there hate it, and they're used to pretty terrible conditions already. The only known willing inhabitant is Nerull, who lives there to keep his hatred of everything that lives sharp. (You live in someplace like the Abyss, you run the risk of deciding you kinda like some of these layers, and maybe that minion can stay... next thing you know, you're actually teaming up with teams of heroes on a temporary basis and respecting foes.)

And if you have the means to get yourself out, great! You've now given all these spiteful, malicious bastards who are trapped here an actual motive to sell you out or shove you into an ocean of acid, as if they needed one. If you don't have the means... hi, and welcome to Carceri. Have a nice eternity.

Best. Plane. EVER.

I have crazy love for Carceri's insane layout (shades of C.S.Lewis' "The Great Divorce" meets "The Little Prince") and depressingly vile inmates. And the only way to escape? Dig yourself deeper into the mess. :smallbiggrin:

Then there's Gehenna, where there are no level surfaces on the actively volcanic landscape full of fiends (if you slip - or are pushed - you run the risk of falling off the planar layer into an endless void).

Oh, and Thuldadin and Ocanthus (Acheron 3 & 4). The one fossilises you, the other has weather that causes slashing damage/rnd.

Oh, and the Grey Wastes. Just being there sucks out your will to live. The whole place is an evil lotus eater machine of selfishness, ennui and cosmic depression (and not the whiney emo kind) filled with Night Hags, Yugoloths, Diakka, Hordlings and Larvae. :smalleek:

None of the above are quite as unremittingly hostile as the Energy Planes (you go there, you get slurped/ASPLODE!), but they're hardly prime resort locations.

@v: because the alternative is so much worse.

Tengu_temp
2008-09-12, 06:58 AM
So...Carceri is Real Life?

If you think real life is such a crapsack, why are you still alive?

Baxbart
2008-09-12, 07:12 AM
Wow, quite surprised this one hasn't been mentioned:

The Mournlands (Eberron)

Especially once you've read about 20 pages of the most evil, foul, disturbing ideas people have come up with here: http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=407341

DigoDragon
2008-09-12, 07:35 AM
The Prime Material Plane.
Sure there's some pretty nasty places out there like Baator and Carceri, but where do all those denzins like to hang out to have a good time? OUR plane. :smallannoyed: Every day thousands of adventurers are killed by vacationing balors and retired liches that come out of the woodwork in droves. They kill adventurers, topple kingdoms, and drive really slow in the ultrafast lane. And that's not counting all the evil twisted wizards and demigods trying to blow out plane up from the inside. Sphere of Annihilation in a statue's mouth? Yeah, that didn't just happen to conviniently roll there on it's own. :smallamused:

So that's my vote. :smallbiggrin:

Shazzbaa
2008-09-12, 09:58 AM
Now, I think it's probably because all the atrocious horrors of the various Manuals of Planes and Monsters are ultimately not real, and as such just can't horrify us as much as all the disgusting things that have happened in the real world, which it is much easier for us to relate to. [....] If they were real, do you think we'd be saying that no horror compares to human evil?

I think it's just easy to say we're the evilest because, in a metagame sense, our world is the originator of all this. Example: the tsochar, my favourite aberration, the horrifying parasite who bores into your flesh, hijacks your brain, and forces you to do what it likes? We didn't make that up. There are parasites in the real world that get inside ants, hijack their brains, and force them to crawl to the tips of blades of grass so that grazing animals will eat them, because the parasite's final destination is the guts of a cow. Freakin' creepy. We just took what already exists in this world and applied it in ways that disturbs us... but we're always limited by the power of our own imaginations, limited to horrors that we can fathom because we see them in our world.

In truth, the far realm, to continue with my aberration example, is something we're incapable of comprehending. There can't ever be accurate illustrations of it, because it cannot be depicted. Sure, that's kind of corny to say now, but you still can't well imagine something that's beyond your ability to even understand. It's easy to say our evil is the worst when all you have is our own imaginings of what an evil place must probably be like.

Back on topic.

The planes that always creeped me out the most were actually not the most horrific and least hospitable ones. The creepiest ones to me were the two that made you eventually not care, and never want to leave. One made you depressed -- which might've been Limbo -- and the other made you kind of happy -- I don't remember that one's name -- and you just stop caring about your quest and your friends and your family and any reason that you had to leave. For reasons I can't quite identify, this is severely freaky to me, so I'd avoid those planes more than any others.

Tokiko Mima
2008-09-12, 11:03 AM
For evil being's with less than 1500 HP it's anywhere within 10' of my good-aligned Hellfire Warlock's Eldritch Glaive. :smallbiggrin:


The planes that always creeped me out the most were actually not the most horrific and least hospitable ones. The creepiest ones to me were the two that made you eventually not care, and never want to leave. One made you depressed -- which might've been Limbo -- and the other made you kind of happy -- I don't remember that one's name -- and you just stop caring about your quest and your friends and your family and any reason that you had to leave. For reasons I can't quite identify, this is severely freaky to me, so I'd avoid those planes more than any others.

Ravenloft aka the Demiplane of Dread? You go there and there's no real way to escape except DM fiat, and people will be convinced you're nuts when you say you came from somewhere outside, because to the inhabitants there is no outside to the Demiplane of Dread.

arguskos
2008-09-12, 11:06 AM
One made you depressed -- which might've been Limbo -- and the other made you kind of happy -- I don't remember that one's name -- and you just stop caring about your quest and your friends and your family and any reason that you had to leave.
Random note:

Depressed: The Grey Wastes of Hades

Happy: The Blessed Fields of Elysium.

Also, I agree completely, those planes bug the crap out of me ("But guys, why go kill the dragon? I'm happy here.")

-argus

Eldritch_Ent
2008-09-12, 11:11 AM
There's also a sub-plane for everything. I once had a Conjuror who disposed of particularly hated villains and rivals by dumping them into a random unpleasent plane. Such as the Plane of Urine, or the Plane of Bad Haircuts, or the plane of High Interest Rates.

Blackfang108
2008-09-12, 11:20 AM
Oh, and the Grey Wastes. Just being there sucks out your will to live. The whole place is an evil lotus eater machine of selfishness, ennui and cosmic depression (and not the whiney emo kind) filled with Night Hags, Yugoloths, Diakka, Hordlings and Larvae. :smalleek:


I actually LIKE going to the Grey Wastes.

except for the Deep Bats.

JackMage666
2008-09-12, 11:45 AM
The Plane of Mirrors.

Nothing is worse than having the DM throw all your cheesy tricks back at you.

Sstoopidtallkid
2008-09-12, 12:41 PM
The Plane of Suck (http://www.lfgcomic.com/page/148). :smallamused:

Triaxx
2008-09-12, 12:53 PM
The Temple of Elemental Evil's basement is a good place not to be.

Three-quarters of a mile distance from Elminster. Everything seems to pile on him and anyone within range.

Anywhere Volo is.

Zen Master
2008-09-12, 03:47 PM
[threadjack]At risk of falling prey to Godwin's Law, take the example of the Nazis. They committed mass murder on an industrial scale because of a demented belief that their victims were subhuman, and have been a byword for human evil ever since. The Illithid? They commit mass murder on an industrial scale because they're *hungry*. Heck, they breed sentient species like animals for slaves and food. And you can't even resist, if you're one of those unfortunate souls. They make you *thank* them for it. They make you feel genuine *gratitude* that they'll allow you to nourish them. If they were real, do you think we'd be saying that no horror compares to human evil?

There are so many possible responses for this. Here are a few:

You really think being hungry is evil? Mind flayers can't help it - they feed on the brains of sentient people.

Human evil is aggravated by the things that make us evil. Spite, greed, ambition, ancient feuds the causes of which no one remembers - lets not forget new classics like oil, spheres of influence, heck, even to supply our arms manufacturers with a viable testbed for their new inventions.

When compared to the sheer vista of creativity devoted by man to destroy his own - nothing, and I really, honestly do mean NOTHING a few measly game designers can come up with has anything to offer. It pales to nothing.

Also - what do you think is the ultimate inspiration for everything you ever read in a book?

No - you want hell, you turn on the news.

Mind you - while the stuff we get up to will turn the stomach of a strong man ... every tale of heroism, selfless sacrifice, righteousnes, justice, love and devotion also comes from real life. We're not all bad - but our worst (and best naturally) cannot be beat.

D Knight
2008-09-12, 03:55 PM
if you are lawful dumb than The Bandit Kingdoms region is a bad place to be because of all our undead guard walking the streets. Also a clreic of any good god is aslo in trouble like my clerice of Palor (i hated one seccion i was in but i got good rp points).

thegurullamen
2008-09-12, 04:03 PM
There are so many possible responses for this. Here are a few:

You really think being hungry is evil? Mind flayers can't help it - they feed on the brains of sentient people.

Human evil is aggravated by the things that make us evil. Spite, greed, ambition, ancient feuds the causes of which no one remembers - lets not forget new classics like oil, spheres of influence, heck, even to supply our arms manufacturers with a viable testbed for their new inventions.

When compared to the sheer vista of creativity devoted by man to destroy his own - nothing, and I really, honestly do mean NOTHING a few measly game designers can come up with has anything to offer. It pales to nothing.

Also - what do you think is the ultimate inspiration for everything you ever read in a book?

No - you want hell, you turn on the news.

Mind you - while the stuff we get up to will turn the stomach of a strong man ... every tale of heroism, selfless sacrifice, righteousness, justice, love and devotion also comes from real life. We're not all bad - but our worst (and best naturally) cannot be beat.

I gotta say I disagree. I'm in the boat that says human evil is not the end-all-be-all of evil. In nearly every case of horrible human evil, there is some aspect of goodness or potential redemption, no matter how small, warped or perverse. Simple plain evil-for-evil's sake coming from an abomination that is quite literally unknowable by humans on any and every level is more evil than humanity could ever imagine (once again, literally.)

But then again, we'll all see this first hand when the lords part the veil and step maddening foot into our insignificant lives. Teleki-ei!!

FoE
2008-09-12, 04:15 PM
It may not be inhospitable, but certainly the most frightening place in D&D would be waking up in Mialee's bed, with the naked elf beside you. I know a guy who hanged himself after that. :smalltongue:

black dragoon
2008-09-12, 04:57 PM
Not gonna ask how he managed that one...
I'd have to say for the foolish mortal it's going to be Sigil. Why because when hell and heaven are walking down the street talking about how the day went at the barrister you tend to lose it.
For the mage the Outlands. Near the spire especially because then all your blasting is useless.
For everyone else I'm gonna say far realm or mialee's bed.:smallbiggrin:

nagora
2008-09-12, 05:51 PM
Speaking from experience, Fraz Urb'Lu's house.

No tea, nothing to eat, and he knackered all our magical gear. That's what I inhospitable. We never invited him back to our house after that.

Also: Mind Flayers actually subsist on orange juice; they eat brains for fun.

Behold_the_Void
2008-09-12, 06:39 PM
Neth might be a candidate. The living plane that has a tendency to encapsulate visitors. Not necessarily out of evil or malice, but just the danger of going into a living plane with an insatiable curiosity and the ability to absorb people and acquire all their knowledge.

Flickerdart
2008-09-12, 06:54 PM
The Plane of Suck (http://www.lfgcomic.com/page/148). :smallamused:
That didn't turn out that bad.

And I'm going to have to say "in proximity to the PCs". Bad things happen to these people. Plus, there's always the hypothetical that the game world doesn't exist if the players aren't there to see it.

chiasaur11
2008-09-12, 07:23 PM
That didn't turn out that bad.

And I'm going to have to say "in proximity to the PCs". Bad things happen to these people. Plus, there's always the hypothetical that the game world doesn't exist if the players aren't there to see it.

Ah, but the second scenario would make "around the PCs" the only place you could be.

Flickerdart
2008-09-12, 07:28 PM
Therefore making it the worst place anywhere, yes. See how that works? "In the CE guy's line of sight" especially.