PDA

View Full Version : [nWoD] Running detectives



fireinthedust
2008-09-18, 09:49 PM
So here's the deal: I can run a mean dungeon, but I'm unused to running RP sessions with detectives.

I have a mixed group of vampires, werewolves and mages in the new WoD setting. Chicago (sort of). They're working for a detective agency, outside the normal order of things (only kinda sorta maybe legal). The job is to go to Chicago on behalf of the Prince of Philadelphia, find a snitch, and bring him home.

I want to introduce Chicago as the primary place for the campaign. I want to introduce a few vamps, a few weres, and a mage or two. I want it to be like a film noir story, but with supernatural elements for some of the encounters.

However, I don't know how to make a session exciting and *different* enough to get folks going with detectives. Heck, I've never played WoD games (except a brief stint on the old changeling).

So what do you do to make detective campaigns *work* for you? Like, aside from the whole vampire/mage angle. (or including it, I dunno)

Krrth
2008-09-19, 08:18 AM
well, one of the first things you are going to need to do is figure out a way to keep the players (mages in particular) from just using their powers to solve the mystery.

Other than that, plot twists are a good thing.

Tsotha-lanti
2008-09-19, 08:31 AM
Don't ever lead them around by the nose. Construct NPCs with motivations, determine what happens independent of the PCs, drop clues, let the PCs interfere...

This can be applied to most games and genres, but it's especially suitable for a detective style game.

The biggest issue is coming up with the mystery. Because it has to be a good one, but not an inscrutable or impenetrable one. The clues must inevitably lead toward the right conclusions, because you can rest assured the players will make the wrong ones where ever possible - yet you must not appear to be just dropping the next step on their lap. So, what you need to do it have a list of clues for each "step", and if the PCs don't get the first one, you let them find the next one, and so on. Eventually they'll see where the clues point, and the investigation does not grind to a halt.

Lapak
2008-09-19, 08:49 AM
Someone on this board just linked to an article about mysteries in RPGs that seemed very sensible to me. It boiled down to a few points:

- Players will fail to discover clues. If there is a single clue at any point that they MUST have to proceed, you will either end up stuck or you'll have to break the flow of RP by force-feeding it to them.

- Players are not Sherlock Holmes. They will find clues, and then misinterpret them.

- Mystery RPGs are not like mystery novels. Continuous real progress has to be made to retain interest, you cannot force players to ignore red herrings in the face of new evidence. They'll stick to theories like glue.

THEREFORE:
For every point at which you want to indicate some piece of information, leave at least three separate clues that point to that piece of information, or three separate ways to discover it. Include no red herrings. The players will do plenty of interfering, bad investigating, and running off after dead-end leads on their own.

EDIT: Aha! Here it is. (http://www.thealexandrian.net/creations/misc/three-clue-rule.html)

comicshorse
2008-09-19, 10:50 AM
well, one of the first things you are going to need to do is figure out a way to keep the players (mages in particular) from just using their powers to solve the mystery

ABSOLUTELY. A friend of mine is running a WoD game and she is finding it a major headache to stop the Tremere with Auspex 4 ( can read minds) just solving the plots by doing nothing but using that power.
When your preparing the plot take note of what horrible powers the P.Cs have and take them into ac****

comicshorse
2008-09-19, 10:51 AM
Oops, last word should have been ACCOUNT. I can guess what I accidentally typed that needed to be censored

fireinthedust
2008-09-19, 12:22 PM
great. :)

What, then, does one do for just finding people? This is going to be a fast-play session. I want the players to go to Chicago, find this guy's trail, and try to get to him in various locations.

what are some challenges? Like, I can have PCs fight monsters in DnD. I can have them open doors. I can have them solve riddles.

What comparable challenges are there for Detectives?

Krrth
2008-09-19, 12:28 PM
great. :)

What, then, does one do for just finding people? This is going to be a fast-play session. I want the players to go to Chicago, find this guy's trail, and try to get to him in various locations.

what are some challenges? Like, I can have PCs fight monsters in DnD. I can have them open doors. I can have them solve riddles.

What comparable challenges are there for Detectives?
Political intrigue is good. Anything that keeps them guessing. For real fun, have the person they are looking for be a changeling that still has a fetch.

Edit: I should probably mention the reason this is actually relevent to your situation. Fetches are exact duplicates of changelings. They smell the same, have the same (original) memories....and magic can't distinguish between fetch and original. They also usually hate the original.

Oracle_Hunter
2008-09-19, 01:25 PM
great. :)

What, then, does one do for just finding people? This is going to be a fast-play session. I want the players to go to Chicago, find this guy's trail, and try to get to him in various locations.

what are some challenges? Like, I can have PCs fight monsters in DnD. I can have them open doors. I can have them solve riddles.

What comparable challenges are there for Detectives?

Here's some general advice:
- Give the PCs an initial lead, but make that lead dead-end at a certain point. The goal of this initial lead is to help the PCs get started, and to introduce them to set-piece NPCs that may or may not be useful now, but should be stable features for your continuing campaign.

Example
The Prince of Philadelphia tells the PCs that the snitch had been an associate of Trevor the Vampire, who is currently a ganger affiliated with the 88's (a South Side gang). Butch, the leader of the 88's turns out to be a vampire too, but Alex vanished after Sydney (the Snitch) came to visit. Alex was a nobody, so Butch didn't really care that he went rogue, but if the PCs wanted to find him, he could check with:
- Cindy (Alex's Wicker Park hipster ex-girlfriend; also vampire)
- Donovan (a mortal crooked cop who used to have a beat on the South Side who was a friend of Alex's, but is currently riding a desk downtown)
- Ernesto (a mortal drug dealer who operates out of Pilsen and provided Alex with victims on occasion)

Now, any of these three may provide another lead somewhere, or just connect the PCs to another power structure (Mage Cabals, Werewolf Packs, other Vampires, or even mortal power players), or perhaps a coincidental encounter with someone that might be helpful (or dangerous).

- Make sure the PCs know of some "dangers" to their mission. Perhaps the Prince of Philadelphia doesn't want to alert the Prince of Chicago on this mission, so the PCs are told to avoid his minions (perhaps just a specific Enforcer). This will encourage the PCs to keep their heads down and provide them will a hint of what to expect in the new city.

- Figure out some spots the PCs might take for temporary housing, and plan around them. Either have the Prince of Philadelphia give them a local contact which will give them a safe house (and then put some other interesting NPCs in the same area!) or let the PCs fend for themselves.

Now, these may sound rail-roady but remember: if you are dropped into a brand new city, you're going to be totally lost unless you have some contacts; particularly if the PCs are checking out the underside of the city! So make sure you have an idea as to the power-structure of the city, and where Sydney the Snitch is connected to them.

Person_Man
2008-09-19, 02:34 PM
Create a long list of clues, put a few in plain site, hide the rest, and give the PCs a good motivation to solve the crime.

Make sure there are multiple suspects with varied reasons for killing the victim. At least one of the suspects (not the killer though) should have a violent tendency, so the PCs get to work in a fight scene or two with them or their minions.

Throw in several false leads, but make sure they don't require a leap of intuition or intelligence to find out that their red herrings.

If confronted with damning evidence, the killer should offer the players a large and plausibly acceptable bribe - come work for me and implicate X instead, and I'll give you the artifact of coolness and high paying jobs.

If confronted with damning evidence by legitimate real world authorities (the police), the killer should manipulate the system to get out of it. This leaves it up to the PCs to deal justice.

Above all else, don't be heavy handed. If the PCs go in a particular direction, let them. I've also played out more then one mystery campaign without knowing who the real killer is. I just let the PCs accumulate evidence and interview suspects, and then decide along the way who the killer was based on how the roleplaying played out.

Also, I haven't played or read anything about the WoD for about 5 years now - have they changed anything?

Krrth
2008-09-19, 02:37 PM
Create a long list of clues, put a few in plain site, hide the rest, and give the PCs a good motivation to solve the crime.

Make sure there are multiple suspects with varied reasons for killing the victim. At least one of the suspects (not the killer though) should have a violent tendency, so the PCs get to work in a fight scene or two with them or their minions.

Throw in several false leads, but make sure they don't require a leap of intuition or intelligence to find out that their red herrings.

If confronted with damning evidence, the killer should offer the players a large and plausibly acceptable bribe - come work for me and implicate X instead, and I'll give you the artifact of coolness and high paying jobs.

If confronted with damning evidence by legitimate real world authorities (the police), the killer should manipulate the system to get out of it. This leaves it up to the PCs to deal justice.

Above all else, don't be heavy handed. If the PCs go in a particular direction, let them. I've also played out more then one mystery campaign without knowing who the real killer is. I just let the PCs accumulate evidence and interview suspects, and then decide along the way who the killer was based on how the roleplaying played out.

Also, I haven't played or read anything about the WoD for about 5 years now - have they changed anything?
Complete and utter reboot. They kept some of the names, but changed just about everything else.

Oracle_Hunter
2008-09-19, 03:03 PM
Some noir-ish themes:
- Femme Fatale (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/FemmeFatale); obviously Vampires do this very well, but you might have a few hanging around, sexing up the joint. Good roles include: gangster's girlfriend, the con artist, and the hard-nosed woman. If you can hook a PC on one of these girls, you're can get some serious DRAMA rolling :smallwink:

- Corruption. Maybe a corrupt cop or the lawyer for the mob, but basically every authority figure should be tainted somehow. Then put in a few Clean Figures that the PCs like... but then put their resolve in constant jeopardy.