This DM still needs help

[Kayoden Usoden]

Only reply if you have any HELPFUL and/or CONSTRUCTIVE ideas.

the setting is this: a group PCs (6-8) are part of a larger group of 20 people sent to a place called battle city to fight other teams to the death.

the plot is simple: massive war, lots of death, a deal was made, small gorups sent to fight in a nuetral nation, last team standing wins war for there nation

the PCs will level 40 (3.5 ed) with 20 extra feats with three stats at 50 and three stats at 30. To make this sane, no spellcasters, other than cleires, and epic spell casting will be banned.

I want there to be 10 other teams for the PCs to fight.

I am working on one of them right now, as for the others, i aint got a clue what to use.

if you read this and have any ideas, please post, and dont post anything dumb or stuiped. thank you

[BRC]

I assume you don’t want us to talk about the sheer insanity of this concept.


Alright, First of all, Templates, Monsters with Class levels, all that stuff will be your friend. I suggest at least one team be made up of giants with class levels, Another team of Illithids ect.
In a campaign like this, just smashing stuff will get really old really quickly, so mix it up on them. Have at least one team not be frontline combat specialists, but instead focus on traps and clever tactics. Make this a team the PC’s must Outthink rather than Outfight. You know, the type that will lure the PC’s into a clearing so they can all be stunned, sneak attacked, and flamestriked. Or have them lead the PC’s to another team, and after they beat that team up, BAM, sneaky team bursts from the shadows and starts sneak-attacking.
Also, With this much HP being flung around, fights to the death will take hours and will get very boring. SO instead, make fights environmental. Rather than simply smacking each other until one side runs out of hitpoints, try to maneuver your opponents so that you can knock them into a sphere of annihilation that’s been left lying around.
With characters of this magnitude and this many feats, you will need a lot of paper for the character sheets., I suggest going digital.
Finally, What is the purpose of this city. A fight like this is going to considerably rearange the landscape. Is this a normal city, or was it built for the purpose of this fight, or what. If the second, you can have alot more fun with it. Presumably, whoever is running this is even more powerful than the PC's, so this city was built magically. Soaring spires for the combatants to duel on, monster-infested tunnels underneath, meandering streets and wide open parks. And, of course, Traps everywhere. It's not an epic battle for survival if the landscape itself isn't trying to kill you.

There, that is all the wisdom I can dispense right now, so let me just say, the game isn’t designed to be played at this magnitude.

[Gorbash]

To make this sane, no spellcasters, other than cleires, and epic spell casting will be banned.

By allowing clerics, you made it insane.

And yes, I agree, this is a totally ________ (insert inappropriate adverb here) idea.

[kjones]

I'm a little unclear on what, exactly, you're asking for here. So there's some PCs, with a larger group (of NPCs?) so there's 20 of them total? And you want to come up with 10 "teams" to oppose a group of 20 epic level PCs and NPCs?

[BRC]

Oh yeah, more advice. Drop the NPC's in the PC's group. With a party like this you don't need DMPC's. NPC'S on the party's side tend to be unwieldy, and should only be used to fill a crucial gap in the party (For example, if nobody wants to play a healer). At best, they should be flies on the wall, just hanging around and letting the players make decisions. They should never outnumber the PC's. When you get alot of allied NPC's, you get alot of the DM playing against themselves while the Players just watch.

[Eorran]

Second the advice about dropping the NPCs. In fact, depending on how you play your games, it might be good to have a short session where individual PCs face a one-on-one against a counterpart foe. I tried this once for a group of 4 level 15 PCs, and they enjoyed their moment in the spotlight immensely.
Also, trying to run this as a single all-out deathmatch will probably overload you as a DM. Consider tournament-style work: some challenges might not be all about reducing the other guy to a fine paste. Look at the 12 labours of Hercules for examples, but with several people trying to be the first to accomplish an impossible task.
Also, make Battle City its own demiplane, built specifically for this competition. You can tailor everything to your needs. And yes, the environment SHOULD be out to get the combatants.
Other than that, I can't see how this would be more fun at super-high levels than it would at lower levels. Your enemies are going to be exclusively homebrewed NPCs and monsters with class levels at 40 - I imagine that managing all their resources will be very taxing.
Maybe get one or more of the players to assist you in managing the monsters.

[Telonius]

Plot idea: Lawful Evil team bribes a Neutral Evil team to throw a fight. LE promises to spare the nation when they've won, and not kill the NE when the fight is over.

[evisiron]

First piece of advice: Tone down the levels. It will be crazy enough even if people are level 10!

And if you do go ahead with original plan, find a few people who owe you a favour and have them help you if at all possible. Each taking a few teams will make this run much smoother.

[valadil]

D&D is not designed to work at those levels. Be prepared for the game to not function correctly.

I'd suggest taking the NPC team that you're working on already and doing some practice one on one fights between those guys. That'll let you see how the game system holds up when the numbers are way out of the intended boundaries.

What defines a spellcaster? Wiz/sorc/cleric/druid? Are bards allowed? How about paladins and rangers?

Have you considered giving a tarrasque class levels?

[BRC]

First piece of advice: Tone down the levels. It will be crazy enough even if people are level 10!
He posted this before and that is pretty much what everybody said. Apparently, he's dead set on playing at those levels, hence why he said "Only post helpful ideas". the OP has deemed "Tone this campaign down to sane levels" unhelpful advice.

[afroakuma]

Well, if he is dead set on the ludicrous levels and stats, then my only suggestion would be "lose the dice."

With 50 Str, you're already looking at a +20 attack bonus and 20 damage per hit. Assumign epic levels, you have highly magical weapons that add damage dice anyway. Average it all off instead of having "1d4+20" be a rapier's listed damage. It will also make the large combats more efficient. Barely.