[FR 4e] Who tricked Cyric into killing Mystra?

[Colmarr]

My DM is dropping hints about his campaign and tells me that this is "open info", meaning he expects me to know it.

I'm AFB, but even if I weren't I don't recall this being in the FRPG (I deliberately avoided buying the Campaign Guide.

So:

1. Is this "open" knowledge? Ie. Is it in the player's guide; and

2. Who dunnit?

[herrhauptmann]

It is a known fact that Cyric murdered Mystra, in much the same way that everyone knew (after it happened) that the Time of Troubles was the result of the Gods being sent to walk the world, even dying.

Now as far as Cyric needing to be tricked into it? I figured: "He's the god of murder, insanity, intrigue (and several others). No one needed to trick him into it, and hell, with the intrigue portfolio he took from Mask, it probably wouldn't have been possible to trick him." Plus, between the novels, and published game content, he's hated Mystra and Kelemvor with a passion since his apotheosis (I love that word). I think its also general knowledge that several other gods collaborated to lock him away afterwards (Lathander and 2 others I think)

That's my 2 cents, someone who's more up on 4e would be able to help you better.

edit: Wow, I wasn't ninja'd on that one! I took forever to type what I wanted

[Pronounceable]

Wait, Cyric needs reason to kill now? What is the FR coming to?

[EvilJames]

? I thought Mystra was killed by a wizard attempting to become a god by casting the only 12th level spell ever made (which subsequently caused all magic to temperarily fail, including his spell, killing both the goddess and the foolish mage) or is this some change that happened because of the new D20 system (did forgotten realms get an "Infinite Crisis"?)

[Eldariel]

That was the last time Mystra died (or that was Mystrul, I recall), Evil. Anyways, I recall Shar had something to do with the whole Cyric > Mystra-thingy.

[mostlyharmful]

That was the last time Mystra died (or that was Mystrul, I recall), Evil. Anyways, I recall Shar had something to do with the whole Cyric > Mystra-thingy.

No, the last time was during the time of troubles, the Karsus Spell thing was the time before. Why anyone would want to be the Goddess of Magic in FR escapes me.:smalltongue:

[The Rose Dragon]

Because you get to be smoking hot? Or is that just a coincidence?

[Sebastian]

Mystra died (that I know of) three times

once in the ancient Netheril; a wizard cast a spell to stole the weave from her, or something, it kinda worked, but before he could learn how to use it magic in the world stopped working and the flying city he was on crashed to the ground. Mystra died and recreated herselves to take control of the magic again. or something like that, all the story is on one old supplement about Netheril, which also happen to be a free download somewhere on the WotC site;

the second time was during the Times of Troubles, I don't rebemenber, know or really care about the details;

the third is this, where essentially what happened is that "A game designer did it"

[Eldariel]

That's what happened the second time around too.

The Rose Dragon: This is fantasy, every woman is smoking hot.

[RTGoodman]

Plus, between the novels, and published game content, he's hated Mystra and Kelemvor with a passion since his apotheosis (I love that word).

And before they all became gods and were just part of an adventuring party, they didn't seem too buddy-buddy to me anyway. (Of course, that could be because I think the Time of Troubles "Avatar" series or whatever it's called are about the worst-written books I've ever read.)

Basically, every time anything happens in the Realms, Mystra dies. I'm no Realms sage, but I know Mystrul died to become Mystra, then apparently died because of that epic-level spell (I didn't know about that), then got killed by Helm during the Time of Troubles for trying to sneak back into heaven, and then finally got killed by Cyric in the build-up to 4E (though I don't remember if there's any reason for it, besides that that's the kind of thing Cyric does), which caused the whole Spellplague thing.

EDIT: Ninja'd a COUPLE of times trying to remember the deaths of the Goddess of Magic. I agree with mostlyharmful, though - that's a pretty perilous job, apparently.

[Akisa]

Hmm I guess with Mystra's dead that would mean the weave is uncontrolled, I guess that explains that's why everyone has magic now.

[Colmarr]

Hmm, guess it's not as "open info" as my DM seems to think.


Anyways, I recall Shar had something to do with the whole Cyric > Mystra-thingy

Now that you mention it, that does ring bells.

Having looked through the FRPG again once I got home, I can say with utmost certainly that it is not mentioned in that book how she died. There's no mention of Cyric killing her at all, let alone that he was tricked into doing so. So apparently it's not common character knowledge, and I can live with that.

Of course, it's possible (even probable) that my evil DMTM is messing with my mind. He does that on occasion :smallsmile:

Thanks all

[AslanCross]

I know Cyric and Shar conspired to kill Mystra. Shar wanted the portfolio of the Weave, while Cyric probably just wanted to do it for chuckles.

[bosssmiley]

That was the last time Mystra died (or that was Mystrul, I recall), Evil. Anyways, I recall Shar had something to do with the whole Cyric > Mystra-thingy.

Of course it was Shar. Shar's responsible for everything in 4E Forgotten Realms (the return of Netheril, the collapse of the Weave, the Spell Plague, the Tyr/Helm blue-on-blue derailment, etc.) :smallamused:
(this serves to explain why the setting is an evil, twisted shadow of its former self - 4E Faerun is the Shadow Realm version)

[Sebastian]

That's what happened the second time around too.


(assuming you are answering mine "a game designer did it")

Probably, but I doubt they were so blatantly obvious. Just for one example, The whole "Abeir-toril as two separate worlds" is really puilled out of ... well, let's just say thin air for decency. But everything in what happened is forced and contrived beyond belief.

[Tengu_temp]

(this serves to explain why the setting is an evil, twisted shadow of its former self - 4E Faerun is the Shadow Realm version)

So, the whole setting lost a duel of a children's card game and got sent to the shadow realm? At least, on the bright side, Elminster is no longer prancing around and Marty-Stuing his way out of/into everything important.

Not that I care much, anyway. I got the book for the Swordmage, with other crunchy bits as a bonus. I didn't even read the fluffy parts - FR wins my prize in the "most generic and bland fantasy world eva" category.

Greyhawk belongs to the "such a generic and bland fantasy world that it comes to the other side and becomes unique" category, by the way.

[Roderick_BR]

(...)
Now as far as Cyric needing to be tricked into it? I figured: "He's the god of murder, insanity, intrigue (and several others). No one needed to trick him into it, and hell, with the intrigue portfolio he took from Mask, it probably wouldn't have been possible to trick him." Plus, between the novels, and published game content, he's hated Mystra and Kelemvor with a passion since his apotheosis (I love that word). I think its also general knowledge that several other gods collaborated to lock him away afterwards (Lathander and 2 others I think)(...)
I agree. It's more like "Who Cyric convinced into helping him killing stuff".
I heard that killing deities of magic is all the rage in Forgotten Realms.

[Starbuck_II]

That's what happened the second time around too.

The Rose Dragon: This is fantasy, every woman is smoking hot.

Look at Mialee (ionic D&D Female Wizard) and tell me that with a straight face. Look, I'm not judging if you like "people" with 1/2 Cricket template, but she broke the ugle stick when she was born.

[Eldariel]

She's a really hot mutant frog.

[RTGoodman]

Having looked through the FRPG again once I got home, I can say with utmost certainly that it is not mentioned in that book how she died. There's no mention of Cyric killing her at all, let alone that he was tricked into doing so. So apparently it's not common character knowledge, and I can live with that.

I don't have the FRPG, but I do know that it's mentioned in the Grand History of the Realms book.* Since it didn't happen that long ago in game (less than 100 years, I guess), it should be pretty common knowledge for most characters, and if not then a History check (or heck, maybe even Arcana) would reveal all you need to know.

*Of course, it might just say something like, "Cyric and Shar conspire together to kill Mystra, which destroys the Weave and sets loose the Spellplague," but the GHotR is still probably the best place to look for sure.