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mr.fizzypop
2008-10-07, 08:43 PM
I want to get a book on psionics, so I've found the complete psionic and the expanded psionics handbook, which is better? I think Expanded psionics but I just want be sure.

ocato
2008-10-07, 08:44 PM
The complete psionics builds on the material from the Extended Psionic's Handbook. I'd definitely grab the XPH first.

Mr.Bookworm
2008-10-07, 08:45 PM
Complete Psionics is completely meh, and mostly not worth it. It's basically an expansion to EPH.

Get the Expanded Psionics Handbook. That's the basic handbook, and it's a damn good book.

Temp.
2008-10-07, 08:58 PM
The Expanded Psionics Handbook is my favorite D&D 3.5 handbook, but I wouldn't recommend buying it. All of its information is legally available here (http://www.d20srd.org/index.htm).

Complete Psionic is known as the worst splatbook in D&D v3.5. Its fluff is awful and contradictory, its content is mostly a bunch of rehashes of old spells and concepts (spells turned into powers, a bunch of pretty crummy prestige classes, a weak half-manifester-type, weak and repetitive feats).

It does have four things going for it, I suppose. I like the Lurk (a Psionic Rogue-type), most of the Ardent (a very nicely balanced full manifester, somewhat based on the Cleric; my complaints come from its Positive/Negative Energy Powers that contradict the basic concepts of Psionics) and the Anarchic Initiate (a slick Wilder-based Prestige class that either makes your Psion work a little more like a Wilder or exaggerates all of your Wilder's abilities; it also caps Psigishes off nicely). The Erudite variant is probably the most powerful incarnation of the Psion. I don't like playing them, but they're good.

Mr.Bookworm
2008-10-07, 09:10 PM
The Expanded Psionics Handbook is my favorite D&D 3.5 handbook, but I wouldn't recommend buying it. All of its information is legally available here.


Point. Though I would personally buy it anyway.


Complete Psionic is known as the worst splatbook in D&D v3.5

I dunno about that. I think through polling a little while back, we came to the conclusion that Weapon's of Legacy, Elder Evils, and Drows of the Underdark were the worst splatbooks.

Tthe Soulbow is another good thing out of the CP. Although you can get it online. (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20060403a&page=2)

Lert, A.
2008-10-08, 12:00 AM
Like everyone else has said, XPH good. ComPsi not so good.

If your group really end up liking the XPH then you probably won't mind spending a little extra time and effort in reworking ComPsi to work for you. It does have a few things that look good at first but fall flat in reality, so you would only want to use it if you aren't afraid to homebrew and houserule like mad.

The Glyphstone
2008-10-08, 12:14 AM
Speak not the name! SPEAK NOT THE NAME! If you invoke it, The Splatbook That Does Not Exist shall creep forth from its ashes to haunt us once again...


Ahem. Sorry.

On-topic, get the XPH. It's very good to have a physical copy, even though most of the material is in the SRD...Thri-Keen, for instance, are book-only, and very cool to boot.

If you like the contents, there's a 3rd party book out there that's incredibly highly recommended for psionics - I think it's called Hyperconscious.

http://www.malhavocpress.com/mpress_Hyper.html

Lert, A.
2008-10-08, 12:20 AM
Hyperconscious is a good book, but the feel is hard to pin down. If you like having variable flavor games, I recommend it. If you like to play the more traditional game, then you are pretty much stuck with the XPH.

Hyperconscious does have a lot of cool stuff, don't get me wrong. The cerebral rager is awesome, as is pretty much all the crunchy bits, but if you are looking for an adventure guide you might want to adapt something else.

JaxGaret
2008-10-08, 01:20 AM
Dreamscarred Press, a 3PP, also has some nice Psionics stuff.

You can get the bundle (http://dreamscarredpress.com/dragonfly/Store/product/pid=30.html) for a big bunch of well-designed Psionics material for a decent price.

Oh yeah, and CPsi sucks. A lot. Get XPH first, then other stuff, then CPsi last.

SoD
2008-10-08, 02:10 AM
I'd go EPH, but not for any reasons stated yet. I found it generally more interesting and useful than CPsi. EPH gives five new base classes, and seven (I think?) new races. CPsi gives three base classes (plus one variant) and no new races. Not to mention the prestige classes and feats.

Eldariel
2008-10-08, 03:59 AM
I dunno about that. I think through polling a little while back, we came to the conclusion that Weapon's of Legacy, Elder Evils, and Drows of the Underdark were the worst splatbooks.

This didn't happen. Elder Evils, C. Psi, Weapons of Legacy? Sure. DoTU was actually found quite decent (and I'm inclined to agree - DoTU has a ton of interesting material, although I feel it should be available to PCs as there's so much of it and so many interesting options such as poison).

Chronos
2008-10-08, 12:12 PM
Even if Complete Psionic were the best book ever, you still need to already have Expanded Psionic Handbook to be able to use it.

JaxGaret
2008-10-08, 12:15 PM
Even if Complete Psionic were the best book ever, you still need to already have Expanded Psionic Handbook to be able to use it.

Not with d20srd.org (http://www.d20srd.org/) at our beck and call. :smallsmile:

sonofzeal
2008-10-08, 12:19 PM
This didn't happen. Elder Evils, C. Psi, Weapons of Legacy? Sure. DoTU was actually found quite decent (and I'm inclined to agree - DoTU has a ton of interesting material, although I feel it should be available to PCs as there's so much of it and so many interesting options such as poison).
Agreed, definitelly. Elder Evils is only there as a source of plothooks for unimaginative DMs; Weapons of Legacy are universally seriously suboptimal; Complete NerfsPsionics took a system with a lot of potential and tried to run it into the ground. There's also Savage CheesesSpecies, and Complete CheeseChampion which deserve mention here.

Drow of the Underdark is pretty sweet though, there's a lot of good material.

Waspinator
2008-10-08, 12:58 PM
Not with d20srd.org (http://www.d20srd.org/) at our beck and call. :smallsmile:

Still, the point is that Complete Psionic is not a self-contained system.


And yeah, Elder Evils is kind of lame. How many of those ideas would any DM ever actually use?

mr.fizzypop
2008-10-08, 02:17 PM
The complete psionics builds on the material from the Extended Psionic's Handbook. I'd definitely grab the XPH first.

hmm...so the Complete Psionic expands on the Expanded Psionics Handbook...I find that confusing:smallconfused:

...anyway, well thanks guys! I'll get the XPH now

AstralFire
2008-10-08, 02:18 PM
hmm...so the Complete Psionic expands on the Expanded Psionics Handbook...I find that confusing:smallconfused:

...well thanks guys! I'll get the XPH now

Expanded Psionics Handbook expands on the original Psionics Handbook.

By which they meant "completely invalidated it by overpowering amounts of awesome, balance, and cool."

Mr.Bookworm
2008-10-08, 03:03 PM
Whups, my mistake.

There's the thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4715329&postcount=185).

Dunno why I was thinking of Drows of the Underdark.

AstralFire
2008-10-08, 03:08 PM
Because Drow are bad and should feel bad.

I think C. Psi gets a bit of an unfair rap - it has some useful stuff in it, part of the issue is that it was a mediocre supplement to (at that point) the most well-designed system in the game and it was the first one in the Complete series that didn't revolutionize its subject.

Chronos
2008-10-08, 03:28 PM
Expanded Psionics Handbook expands on the original Psionics Handbook.Right, the Psionics Handbook was 3.0, and had the best psionics system D&D had seen up to that point, but that's not saying much. It still had a fair number of glaring problems, just not as many as, say, the horrible 2nd edition system. When 3.5 came along, they re-did the psionic system in the Expanded book, keeping the same basic idea as in 3.0, but fixing most of the bugs. But since it was a complete re-work, it didn't need the original, and in fact you'd probably get confused if you tried to use both.

Waspinator
2008-10-08, 07:44 PM
Chronos is right. The "Expanded" Psionics Handbook is merely the 3.5 version of the 3.0 Psionics Handbook. The name is a little odd, but it's a good book.