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Emperor Tippy
2008-10-31, 03:20 PM
What are all of the Rogue Alternate Class Features?

Preferable with their source and it would be really nice if you gave a short description of what it does.

RMS Oceanic
2008-10-31, 03:31 PM
I know one off the top of my head: In Complete Champion, you can give up your trap sense to deal half you sneak attack damage to undead.

ravenkith
2008-10-31, 03:34 PM
I think the PHB II allows you to sack trap sense for 'spell sense' instead of a bonus to ac against traps, you get a bonus to saves against spells....

(AFB)

Shishnarfne
2008-10-31, 03:35 PM
I know one off the top of my head: In Complete Champion, you can give up your trap sense to deal half you sneak attack damage to undead.

That's Penetrating Strike: only applies to SA while flanking. I believe it previously (not sure on exact time frame) appeared in Dungeonscape and Expedition to Castle Ravenloft (where the rogue probably really wants it).

Eldaran
2008-10-31, 03:36 PM
Rogue
Wilderness Rogue (UA, p 56): Modified skill list. Add camouflage, woodland stride, and hide in plain site to the list of abilities rogues can pick.

Martial Rogue (UA, p 58): Lose sneak attack and gain bonus feats as a fighter.

Goliath Rogue (RS, p 152): d8 hitdice, add survival to class skills
2nd level: Mettle of Mountains (+4 bonus to For, Mettle), no evasion
3rd level: Wild Sense (bonus to knowledge: nature checks), lose trap sense
8th level: Fortification (25% chance to prevent crits and such), lose uncanny dodge

Kobold Rogue (RDr, p 109): d4 hitdice, add knowledge: dungeoneering to class list
1st level: Rapid Retreat (+5' while withdrawing), Shrewd Trapfinding (+2 bonus to find/disable traps),
3rd level: Improved Trap Sense (bonus to saves vs. traps), Shrewd Trapfinding
8th level: Evasive Skitter (can move out of area of effects), Shrewd Trapfinding

Halfling Rogue Substitution Levels (RW, p 160)
1st level: Ranged Sneak Attack
3rd level: Thief's Luck (can reroll reflex saves), lose trapsense
10th level: Sniping Mastery (can take ranged attacks while hiding), lose special ability

Spell Reflection (CM, p 35): Lose evasion, gain the ability to reflect spells targeted at you that miss.

Spell Sense (CM, p 35): Lose trapsense. Gain AC bonus vs spells.

Antiquarian (CC, p 51): Lose trapfinding. Gain wisdom bonus on appraise checks with divine items. Can attempt to identify divine items, as per the spell.

Death's Ruin (CC, p 51): Lose trapsense. Can use sneak-attack on undead, at one half normal.

Friend's Evasion (CC, p 51): Lose improved evasion as a special ability option. Every ally adjacent to you gains evasion.

Holy Stalker (CC, p 51): Lose crippling strike as a special ability option. Add two points of damage per normal sneak attack dice when sneak attacking undead.

Disruptive Attack (PHB 2, p 57): Don't gain uncanny dodge. Whenever you attack a flanked or flat-footed target, you can sacrifice your sneak attack to give them a -5 to AC.

Breathstealer (DrM, p 11): Pick as one of your special abilities. Use sneak attack to prevent a dragon from using its breath weapon.

Uncanny Bravery (DrM, p 14): Gain immunity to draconic presence and resistance to fear instead of uncanny dodge.

Quick Fingers (DS, p 13): Lose one level of trap sense to reduce the time needed to disarm traps.

Penetrating Strike (DS, p 13): Lose trap sense. Whenever you sneak attack something normally immune to sneak attack damage, do half your normal dice of sneak attack damage.

Planar Rogue (PlH, p 34): gain knowledge: the planes as a class skill
6th level: Breach Sense (detect activation of portals and spells that cross planes)
10th level: Slip the Bonds (turn ethereal once per day), replaces normal special ability
16th level: Blink once per day, replaces normal special ability

Rilkan Rogue Substitution Levels (MoI, p 47): add speak languages to class skills
1st level: Improved Flanking (+4 bonus while flanking), lose one die of sneak attack
3rd level: Bardic Knowledge, Bonus feat, lose trap sense
10th level: Fortunate Reflexes (reroll reflex saves), replaces normal special ability

Lightbringer Penetrating Strike (ECR, p 208): When flanking a creature normally immune to sneak attack damage you still deal half your sneak attack dice in damage. Does not effect creatures immune to flanking, and can only be used against flanked creatures.

Changeling Rogue (RE, p 121): Add one knowledge skill to class list, 10 skills per level
1st level: Social Intuition (grants bonuses to a number of social skill checks), lose trapfinding
3rd level: Minor Lore (+1 to knowledge checks, +1 every 3 levels), lose trap sense
8th level: Mutable Anatomy (50% chance to negate extra damage from a critical or sneak attack), lose uncanny dodge

Emperor Tippy
2008-10-31, 03:40 PM
Any that a human can take that trade trapfinding for something else? I'm getting it from Factotum so it's not a problem yo give it up.

Draz74
2008-10-31, 03:46 PM
Antiquarian, according to what he posted, qualifies.

The Glyphstone
2008-10-31, 05:59 PM
Any that a human can take that trade trapfinding for something else? I'm getting it from Factotum so it's not a problem yo give it up.

Does that work by RAW? I've never seen any Factotum ACF's, and it'd be odd if ACF's were just interchangable like that...it's a logical houserule, but i've never seen it in print.

The_Snark
2008-10-31, 06:00 PM
I think he means that he has levels in Factotum, will be multiclassing into rogue, and would like to get something other than a class feature he already has.

Emperor Tippy
2008-10-31, 06:41 PM
I think he means that he has levels in Factotum, will be multiclassing into rogue, and would like to get something other than a class feature he already has.

Exactly.

@Draz74

I noticed Antiquarian and I suppose if nothing else exists I'll take it but it really doesn't do anything for my build at all, I mean a free feat would actually be a ton more helpful.

The Glyphstone
2008-10-31, 06:55 PM
I think he means that he has levels in Factotum, will be multiclassing into rogue, and would like to get something other than a class feature he already has.

Ah, I see now.

Draz74
2008-10-31, 06:56 PM
Fair enough. At least it's something, though. And I sure haven't heard of any rogue variants that get a free feat instead of Trapfinding. (A lot of characters would be interested in that ...)

Eldaran
2008-10-31, 06:57 PM
I noticed I forgot one, and probably the one you'll want to take, given your situation. It's from Exemplars of Evil, but there's nothing particularly evil about it. Of course, the duration is based on rogue level, but even a few levels of rogue should make it last long enough.

MIMIC
Class: Rogue.
Level: 1st, 3rd, 6th, 9th, 12th, 15th, and 18th.
Special Requirement: You must have a Charisma of 12
or higher to select this alternative class feature.
Replaces: If you select this feature, you do not gain the
trapfinding ability.
Benefi t: Once per day, you can use disguise self as a caster
whose level equals your class level. At 3rd level and every
three levels thereafter, you can reduce your bonus on trap
sense by 1 to gain an additional use of mimic.
At your discretion, when using disguise self, you can spend
two uses of the spell-like ability to produce the effect as a
swift action rather than a standard action.

SoD
2008-10-31, 10:38 PM
Oh, from Exemplars of Evil, there's one where you loose evasion (I think), and instead can 'die'. It takes a scaling heal check to tell that you're still alive. That's what I remember off my head, can someone with the book verify?

Eldaran
2008-10-31, 11:33 PM
Oh, from Exemplars of Evil, there's one where you loose evasion (I think), and instead can 'die'. It takes a scaling heal check to tell that you're still alive. That's what I remember off my head, can someone with the book verify?

Er, yes. But it sucks, I was referring to the one which I put below my comment. Since he was specifically asking for trapfinding replacements.

Emperor Tippy
2008-10-31, 11:35 PM
There any others? That would be a nice ability but my charisma is only 9 and I don't really want to move around the points to up my charisma.

Salvonus
2008-10-31, 11:56 PM
Well, it's probably not RAW-legal, but you could maybe convince your DM to allow the ACF for Drow Rogues in Drow of the Underdark. Essentially, you trade Trapfinding for Poison Use. Probably a little more useful than Antiquarian, but, again, it does require a DM ruling.

RTGoodman
2008-11-01, 01:48 AM
How about seeing if your DM would allow you to Reverse-ACF it. I know there's a Ranger ACF (in Dungeonscape) that gives up Track (and I think Survival class skill) for Trapfinding and the requisite skills, so maybe you could trade out Trapfinding for Track.

I know Fax did a whole chart of ACFs a long time ago, I'll go see if I can find it and see other things you might try to trade in or out.


EDIT: Huh, that was a MUCH faster search than I expected. Fax's Class Feature Equivalencies (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=58667) might be at least worth checking out. There's only a couple of mentions of Trapfinding, but you might find something else.