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ideasmith
2008-11-04, 06:29 PM
Training Rules
These rules assume that the basic difference between a NPC class and a PC class is training.

Apprenticeship:

Apprenticeship allows you to replace levels in commoner with levels in other NPC classes. This requires a year of occasional training. The trainer must have at least one level in each of the student's new classes. After the year of training is completed, a DC 30 check is made with the following modifiers:

Trainer:

Add the trainer's Con, Wis, and Cha modifiers.
+1 per trainer's class level (if multiple classes are being taught, use the lowest relevant class level.)
+5 if trainer had the Endurance feat.
+5 if trainer has the Iron Will feat.


Student:

+1 per rank in new class's class skills student had before training.


After a successful training check, the student loses all of her levels in commoner, using the rules for level loss. She then regains the lost experience points, one level at a time. The new levels must be in the class(es) being taught which must be NPC class(es).

Intensive Training:
Intensive training allows you to replace levels in NPC classes with levels in PC classes. This requires a full week of training, no time off, with such needs as food and sleep incorporated into the training. The trainer must have at least one level in each of the student's new classes. After the week of training is completed, a DC 40 check is made with the following modifiers:

Trainer:

Add the trainer's Con, Wis, and Cha modifiers.
+1 per trainer's class level (if multiple classes are being taught, use the lowest relevant class level.)
+5 if trainer had the Endurance feat.
+5 if trainer has the Iron Will feat.


Student:

# +1 per rank in new class's class skills student had before training.
# +5 per feat new class automatically gets at some level which student had before training.
# +2 per feat new class has available as a bonus feat which student had before training.
# +5 if new class has Summon Familiar as a class ability and student was 2nd level adept before training.
# +10 if all old class levels are in commoner.


After a successful training check, the student loses all of her levels in the old class(es)(exception: her initial level in aristocrat may be kept), using the rules for level loss. She then regains the lost experience points, one level at a time. The new levels must be in the classes being taught. Additionally, the student's class restrictions are as follows. (A student learning a prestige class must meet the prerequisites normally.):

Adept: Any class able to cast spells at first level, due to either class abilities or prerequisites. (Bard, Cleric, Druid, Sorcerer, Wizard, Arcane Archer, Arcane Trickster, Archmage, Assassin, Blackguard, Dragon Disciple, Eldritch Knight, Hierophant, Loremaster, Mystic Theurge, Thaumaturgist)

Aristocrat: Any class whose class skills include Bluff, Diplomacy, Gather Information, and Sense Motive; or which is a prestige class, or both. (Bard, Rogue, Arcane Archer, Arcane Trickster, Archmage, Assassin, Blackguard, Dragon Disciple, Duellist, Dwarven Defender, Eldritch Knight, Hierophant, Horizon Walker, Loremaster, Mystic Theurge, Shadowdancer, Thaumaturgist)

Commoner: Any class. (Barbarian, Bard, Cleric, Druid, Fighter, Monk, Paladin, Ranger, Rogue, Sorcerer, Wizard, Arcane Archer, Arcane Trickster, Archmage, Assassin, Blackguard, Dragon Disciple, Duellist, Dwarven Defender, Eldritch Knight, Hierophant, Horizon Walker, Loremaster, Mystic Theurge, Shadowdancer, Thaumaturgist)

Expert: Any class with at least 6 skill points per level (not counting intelligence modifier) (Bard, Ranger, Rogue, Eldritch Knight, Shadowdancer)

Warrior: Any class with Good BAB. (Barbarian, Fighter, Paladin, Ranger, Arcane Archer, Arcane Trickster, Blackguard, Duellist, Dwarven Defender, Eldritch Knight, Horizon Walker)

Feats:

Fast Learner (General)
Benefit: You can make Intensive Training checks once per day rather than once per week, and Apprenticeship training once per 50 days rather than once per year.

Latent Powers (General)
Benefit: You do not need a trainer to make Intensive Training checks, although you do still need a week of self-training as described for Intensive Training.

Metamorphosis (General)
Prerequisites: Fast Learner, Latent Powers.
Benefit: You can make an Intensive Training check as a free action.

zeruslord
2008-11-04, 07:48 PM
Why do we need rules for this?
It can just go on behind the scenes for NPCs, and PCs shouldn't be having to do this ever. Unless you believe that absolutely everything needs to have rules or else the DM is abusing his power, just make all of this up. Also, these feats permanently reduce character power for what is presumably just background.
If you actually follow these rules, I'm pretty sure it is possible to lose spellcasting power with the right selection of prestige classes (Sorcerer 6/Dragon Disciple 10/Arcane Archer 4) Commoner also becomes the most powerful NPC class, since it can train into a real class more easily than any other.

ideasmith
2008-11-06, 03:07 PM
Why do we need rules for this?

Yeah, I should explain why players would want to use this option. Possibly something like :

‘Sometimes, a group of adventurers included a character who seems to have no business being on an adventure. Such characters from fiction include Bilbo Baggins (The Hobbit) and Garian (Pawn of Prophecy). Such characters often develop abilities they didn’t know they had.

On a more rule-oriented note, sometimes one may have trouble deciding what class to play. These rules provide a way of delaying the decision without delaying the game.’

Does that sound like it does the job?


It can just go on behind the scenes for NPCs, and PCs shouldn't be having to do this ever. Unless you believe that absolutely everything needs to have rules or else the DM is abusing his power, just make all of this up.

Since Bilbo and Garian were each a member of an adventuring party, keeping such characters away from the PC’s would hardly be true to my sources.


Also, these feats permanently reduce character power for what is presumably just background.

Those feats are not permanent. Per the rules for level loss on page 296 of the DMG, the things lost to level loss include all feats gained with that level. Training causes you to lose levels “using the rules for level loss”.


If you actually follow these rules, I'm pretty sure it is possible to lose spellcasting power with the right selection of prestige classes (Sorcerer 6/Dragon Disciple 10/Arcane Archer 4)

You can have the same combination of classes without these rules, and have precisely as little spellcasting power.


Commoner also becomes the most powerful NPC class, since it can train into a real class more easily than any other.

If you have already decided that you want to play a spellcaster, then commoner has no obvious advantage over adept. Similarly with other classes.

Luean
2008-11-07, 05:11 AM
I like that concept, really interesting idea.

BUT I see a problem on the RP side:
With 1 year and 1 week training a character can become, let's say, wizard.
This makes every magic academy and the years of studying, normally needed to gain that knowledge, obsolet.
Same goes for other classes, in my opinion.

ideasmith
2008-11-10, 04:16 PM
I like that concept, really interesting idea.

BUT I see a problem on the RP side:
With 1 year and 1 week training a character can become, let's say, wizard.
This makes every magic academy and the years of studying, normally needed to gain that knowledge, obsolet.
Same goes for other classes, in my opinion.

Only 1 year and 1 week? What bonuses are you assuming for the training checks? My own calculations suggest more like 7 years.

If your want training to take longer, just increase the check DC's until it takes long enough to suit you.