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DUSUCK
2008-11-09, 11:03 AM
So, in an online campaign I am playing a level 3 scout level 1 monk. It is a very skill monkey focused campaign and I suspect there might be some pvp.

We each have 5,400 gold pieces and I have no idea what to buy. any ideas?:smallbiggrin:

kamikasei
2008-11-09, 11:12 AM
That's an odd combination. What are you trying to achieve with the character? What's your core concept or focus?

Proven_Paradox
2008-11-09, 11:19 AM
More information is needed. What books are available? What do your ability scores look like? What role are you trying to play with this character?

monty
2008-11-09, 02:07 PM
Monks suck. Play an unarmed Swordsage instead.

Starsinger
2008-11-09, 02:10 PM
You have 3 levels of not monk and only 1 level of monk... why are you asking for monk help in particular? Just take the +2 bonus to all saves and walk away IMO.

thornhill
2008-11-09, 02:12 PM
Monks suck. Play an unarmed Swordsage instead.

You know, you could try being helpful rather than acting like you're twelve.

Yukitsu
2008-11-09, 02:13 PM
Why? It's the most helpful advice he'll get in this thread.

monty
2008-11-09, 02:19 PM
You know, you could try being helpful rather than acting like you're twelve.

In case the tags weren't obvious enough, I was joking. Every time a monk help thread comes up, someone suggests that as if it's the only reasonable solution and anybody who doesn't do it is stupid.

You might want to get your sarcasm meter checked.

streakster
2008-11-09, 02:28 PM
I don't agree Monty - we also suggest K and Frank's rewrite!:smallbiggrin:

So, you've got money burning a whole in your pocket and nowhere to spend it, huh? You could always get some partially charged wands ...:smallbiggrin:

Seriously, though, we need to know your goals. Otherwise we won't know what items would help you.

BRC
2008-11-09, 02:42 PM
Actually, depending on the campaign, a one-level monk dip isn't that bad. it gives you a decent unarmed attack if the campaign is one where it will be good to be able to fight without weapons, it gives your saves a nice boost, you can take Stunning Fist or Improved grapple, either of which could be useful. And you don't really lose much by wearing armor, so it's all good.

monty
2008-11-09, 02:45 PM
I agree that it's a good dip (on the other hand, I've even seen arguments for CW Samurai being a useful dip in certain cases, so that's not saying much), but that's not really a monk any more than a Fighter 1/Wizard 19 is a fighter.

afroakuma
2008-11-09, 02:47 PM
Two levels of monk makes a great dip, but an XP drag. Although for most people, it doesn't factor in, so...

Triaxx
2008-11-09, 03:38 PM
I like the barbarian dip myself, but Monk is handy. You might see if the DM will let you have Raging Monk instead of the standard. Flurry of Blows is worth the loss. Wild Monk will make the DM tear his hair out around level 4, where it get's Wild Shape.

Are you fighting ranged or melee? If ranged, consider swapping out the monk for barbarian, or going another two levels of monk. Every bit of range is helpful, especially with Skirmish and later on when fighting casters.


Amulet's of Natural Armor are useful. They push your AC without increasing your armor weight. Consider bracers that let you cast greater magical weapons. Are you expecting to need to ambush enemies? Cloak/Boots of Elvenkind are helpful then.

Bayar
2008-11-09, 04:09 PM
I like the barbarian dip myself, but Monk is handy. You might see if the DM will let you have Raging Monk instead of the standard. Flurry of Blows is worth the loss. Wild Monk will make the DM tear his hair out around level 4, where it get's Wild Shape.

Are you fighting ranged or melee? If ranged, consider swapping out the monk for barbarian, or going another two levels of monk. Every bit of range is helpful, especially with Skirmish and later on when fighting casters.


Amulet's of Natural Armor are useful. They push your AC without increasing your armor weight. Consider bracers that let you cast greater magical weapons. Are you expecting to need to ambush enemies? Cloak/Boots of Elvenkind are helpful then.

Dragon magasine ?

Captain Six
2008-11-09, 05:42 PM
I'm pretty sure this thread was about magic items, not class choices. I don't think it's that bad myself. A third level scout gets a speed bonus, and a monk will start to get them. Spring attack and the scout skirmish bonuses will work well together in the future. And monks have a lot of anti-backstab traits for the possible pvp.

For magic items I always go for more AC first. It's usually more cost effective that increasing your attack bonus and I'm a very defensive player, even moreso if I thought the other players might turn on me.

So what I would get for pretty much any character:
Amulet of natural armor +1 (1000)
Bracers of armor +1 (1000)
Cloak of resistance +1 (1000)
Ring of protection +1 (2000)

So +3 ac +1 to all saves. Spend the rest on some skill-boosting gear. I might, depending on the campaign, get rid of something for Hand of the Mage, infinite mage hand can be very, very useful if well applied.

holywhippet
2008-11-09, 05:49 PM
Give him an item that can cast mage armour on demand. Low AC is the bane of all monks and mage armour is a very helpful spell. I'm a bit vague on the rules for magical item creation so I'm not sure what the cost will be, if you have enough left over get something that casts another protective spell on demand like shield of faith or protection from evil.

DUSUCK
2008-11-09, 08:14 PM
Well..... Mega tumbling to get around my enemy to get to the head guy grapple him stun him murder his face.
My stats are: 16, 14, 14, 12, 12, 10
Tumbling around someone counts as moving 10 ft if I am not mistaken so rolling a three or better means I get a + 1d6 dam and +1 to AC
The only allowed classed are: Bard, Rogue, Spelltheif, Ninja, Monk, Scout
Sources allowed: Core, Expanded Psi, Complete Adventurer (laaaaaame)
Note: I want to get my DM get to allow a astetic feat to get some scout monk synergy!

Flickerdart
2008-11-09, 08:38 PM
If XPH is in play, why are the classes so limited? Also, XPH is still Core, so that's redundant.

Siosilvar
2008-11-09, 08:50 PM
Also, XPH is still Core, so that's redundant.

No, it's not. Core is PHB, DMG & MM1. Most of it is, however, OGC, so it's allowed to be put in the SRD. At least, that's my understanding of it.

Starbuck_II
2008-11-09, 09:00 PM
No, it's not. Core is PHB, DMG & MM1. Most of it is, however, OGC, so it's allowed to be put in the SRD. At least, that's my understanding of it.

Complete Psionics refers to XPH as Core.
Most people think it is a misspeak (they didn't mean to say it, but they did). Never errataed.

Eldariel
2008-11-09, 09:11 PM
No game should ever be played with less than the whole SRD though :/ I mean, XPH and ELH add, to normal classes:
Greater Manyshot
Stand Still
Improved Multiweapon Fighting
Greater Multiweapon Fighting
Reckless Offense
Improved Flyby Attack
Improved Multiattack

I mean, all those feats should've been in PHB or MM. And that's just off the top (there's a huge number of handy, but less-than-optimal feats in XPH like Open Minded, Mind over Body, Rapid Metabolism, Cloak Dance, etc. that still address points PHB simply forgot to include feats for).

I mean, Greater Manyshot really just serves to make Manyshot do something (in other words, Rogues around the world enjoy and someone might actually pick that feat voluntarily). Stand Still actually enables non-Spiked Chain melee builds to control area. Reckless Offense isn't that impressive, but still, classes like Barbarian and Fighter have feats to burn and the effect fits perfectly into Barbarian's mindset and has its uses for Fighters too. And all the monster feats are pretty much autoincludes for the Monster section since they simply make some combat styles work for higher level games.

And a feat that gives skills and a feat that increases Healing Rate and Ability Restoration Rate are both so basic that it's simply shocking they forgot to include them in PHB.


So people, do yourselves and everyone you play with a service and at least allow non-Psionic parts of SRD in every single friggin' game you ever play (heck, epic feats and non-epic monster feats make high HD monsters with lots of feats actually scary).

Oh yeah, and if at all possible, allow Psionics too. 'cause Psionics change everything - for the better (XPH is a much better written book than PHB).

DUSUCK
2008-11-13, 11:43 AM
I think the SRD is allowed fortunatly....

Sinfire Titan
2008-11-13, 05:01 PM
I recomend Scout 3/Monk 1/Cloistered Cleric 1/Ranger 15 with Swift Hunter and swapping out your domains for Devotion feats (namely Travel and Knowledge devotion). Get the Animal Domain and use PrC Ranger to get Full BAB while you are at it, as everyone loves Divine Power.

Use TWFing with Sai's or another light Monk weapon to get the most out of your Skirmish damage+Travel Devotion feat.

Human Paragon 3
2008-11-13, 05:08 PM
I recomend Scout 3/Monk 1/Cloistered Cleric 1/Ranger 15 with Swift Hunter and swapping out your domains for Devotion feats (namely Travel and Knowledge devotion). Get the Animal Domain and use PrC Ranger to get Full BAB while you are at it, as everyone loves Divine Power.

Use TWFing with Sai's or another light Monk weapon to get the most out of your Skirmish damage+Travel Devotion feat.

Ranger requires a BaB of +4. If you're not using fractional BAB, this character will have a BAB of +2 at level four. Even if you are using fractional BAB, this guy will have +3. So the build is not legal.

Sir Giacomo
2008-11-13, 05:52 PM
So, in an online campaign I am playing a level 3 scout level 1 monk. It is a very skill monkey focused campaign and I suspect there might be some pvp.

We each have 5,400 gold pieces and I have no idea what to buy. any ideas?:smallbiggrin:

Well, I did a build once...:smallwink: (seriously, follow the link below and check the level 1-4 monk entries, there are suggestions there for items to take).

Preview:
- masterwork items providing +2 circumstance bonus to skills- check with your DM what items he allows for what skills. Mostly they are only 50gp each.
- also check whether you can spend more than 25% on one item.
- with preparing spell casters in the group, a pearl of power level 1 greatly enhances the group's versatility and can net you a good 4-hour buff spell (mage armour).
- the beads of bless for 600gp are a bargain (provides +1 to hit morale bonus 1/day for the group via casting of bless)
- otherwise, the Magic Item Compendium has plenty of non-core items, and some are also very cheap for their effects.

- Giacomo

Stupendous_Man
2008-11-13, 06:27 PM
Don't forget to ask about being able to buy partially charged wands.

DUSUCK
2008-11-13, 06:34 PM
Well, I did a build once...:smallwink: (seriously, follow the link below and check the level 1-4 monk entries, there are suggestions there for items to take).

Preview:
- masterwork items providing +2 circumstance bonus to skills- check with your DM what items he allows for what skills. Mostly they are only 50gp each.
- also check whether you can spend more than 25% on one item.
- with preparing spell casters in the group, a pearl of power level 1 greatly enhances the group's versatility and can net you a good 4-hour buff spell (mage armour).
- the beads of bless for 600gp are a bargain (provides +1 to hit morale bonus 1/day for the group via casting of bless)
- otherwise, the Magic Item Compendium has plenty of non-core items, and some are also very cheap for their effects.

- Giacomo

Thank you sir amazingly useful!

Stupendous_Man
2008-11-13, 06:39 PM
Thank you sir amazingly useful!

Please let us know how it goes; it will be nice to have some data on this for once.

Wckd
2008-11-13, 06:40 PM
I'd say go for a doughnut as the first purchase! You will have a lot of gp left after purchasing it, and you have just picked up a portable hole! Oh, and always ask if they have any "...of doom" left. If they haven't then just buy one with chocolate coating and coconut pieces sprinkled on top instead.

Next thing you ought to get is a herring, because beating a minotaur to death with a fish is priceless! (It also qualifies for flurry of blows!)

The last thing I would advice you to get is a watch, in case you need to stop time!

Good luck on your adventures!

monty
2008-11-13, 06:49 PM
Don't forget your towel!

DUSUCK
2008-11-13, 06:55 PM
http://plothook.net/RPG/profiler/view.php?id=4829
That is the character sheet that I have so far.....Still working whenever I have an idea.

Here are somemore of the people in the campaign if it matters

http://plothook.net/RPG/profiler/view.php?id=3603
http://plothook.net/RPG/profiler/view.php?id=4826
http://plothook.net/RPG/profiler/view.php?id=4827

Stupendous_Man
2008-11-13, 07:02 PM
Monk:

AC: 17 - Acceptable if you don't plan on getting into combat much.

HP: 25 - Acceptable if you don't plan on getting into combat period.

AB: +4 - Unacceptable

Damage: 1d6+2 - Average damage of 5.5. Unacceptable if you plan on getting into combat.

With and AB of +4 and a damage of 5.5, even against someone with a low AC of, say 16, only 40% of your attacks will go through. This leaves you dealing an effective 5.5*0.40 = 2.2 damage per attack. This is bad.

Flurrying gives you two attacks, but at an AB of +2. This means you have a 30% chance of hitting, dealing 2*5.5*0.30 = 3.3 damage. This is still pretty bad, considering a level 1 Fighter or Barbarian deals about 12 points of damage per attack.

Grapple: +8 - On par/lower than most comparable melee characters and monsters you will face. Your low HP will be a problem when making opposed checks for damage, or if the opponent has natural or light weapons out when grappled.

DUSUCK
2008-11-13, 07:04 PM
AC: 17 - Acceptable if you don't plan on getting into combat much.On par/equal with everyone else and +1 when I am tumbling which will happen a lot

HP: 25 - Acceptable if you don't plan on getting into combat period. <-- 4d8 what do you want

AB: +4 - Unacceptable <--- don't know what that is

Damage: 1d6+2 - Average damage of 5.5. Unacceptable if you plan on getting into combat. + 1d6 when tumbling

With and AB of +4 and a damage of 5.5, even against someone with a low AC of, say 16, only 40% of your attacks will go through. This leaves you dealing an effective 5.5*0.40 = 2.2 damage per attack. This is bad.

Flurrying gives you two attacks, but at an AB of +2. This means you have a 30% chance of hitting, dealing 2*5.5*0.30 = 3.3 damage. This is still pretty bad, considering a level 1 Fighter or Barbarian deals about 12 points of damage per attack.

Grapple: +8 - On par/lower than most comparable melee characters and monsters you will face. Your low HP will be a problem when making opposed checks for damage, or if the opponent has natural or light weapons out when grappled.<----- 3/4 BaB multiclass at low levels what can I say

Well I cant do anything about my stats but....(fear of sounding like a total noob) what is an AB

Stupendous_Man
2008-11-13, 07:06 PM
Attack bonus.

And watch your skills, you've been taking cross-class skills like they were class skills.

monty
2008-11-13, 07:06 PM
Well I cant do anything about my stats but....(fear of sounding like a total noob) what is an AB

Attack bonus. What you add to your attack rolls.

DUSUCK
2008-11-13, 07:10 PM
ahh ok and which are not class skills I am confused?

Oh and there is another monk in the group
http://plothook.net/RPG/profiler/view.php?id=4845

Stupendous_Man
2008-11-13, 07:13 PM
Ninja:

Dear Kord...


AB: +8 - Acceptable, but could be higher.

Damage: 1d4-1 averages to 1.5 damage. Sudden Strike adds an average of 7 damage. He deals 8.5 damage on average assuming all goes well.

A rogue will be doing 1d6+str. mod (between +1 and +2) +2d6 damage. That's 10.5/11.5/+12.5 damage. Ninja's behind the curve a tad.

At least he has his skills and poison.


Rogue:

Seems ok


Bard:

Rolled poorly.

Badly needs to pump Inspire Courage.


Second Monk:

Even less HP than the first


Conclusion: Do not ever get caught, and never fight a straight fight.

DUSUCK
2008-11-13, 07:17 PM
Ninja:

Dear Kord...


AB: +8 - Acceptable, but could be higher.

Damage: 1d4-1 averages to 1.5 damage. Sudden Strike adds an average of 7 damage. He deals 8.5 damage on average assuming all goes well.

A rogue will be doing 1d6+str. mod (between +1 and +2) +2d6 damage. That's 10.5/11.5/+12.5 damage. Ninja's behind the curve a tad.

At least he has his skills and poison.


Rogue:

Seems ok


Bard:

Rolled poorly.

Badly needs to pump Inspire Courage.


Second Monk:

Even less HP than the first


Conclusion: Do not ever get caught, and never fight a straight fight.

yeah I know not a high powered campaign and when monks are the only true melee class allowed what can you expect

personaly compared to the others I didnt think I was that bad off

Stupendous_Man
2008-11-13, 07:20 PM
yeah I know not a high powered campaign and when monks are the only true melee class allowed what can you expect

He didn't even allow Fighters?

DUSUCK
2008-11-13, 07:25 PM
He didn't even allow Fighters?

Nope only Bard, Rogue, Spelltheif, Ninja, Monk, Scout. (The only thing I considered other than monk/scout was spelltheif......)

Stupendous_Man
2008-11-13, 07:41 PM
I see he wants a sneaky campaign. It seems so limited; Everyone can be sneaky, but isn't good for much else, so you only explore one facet of DnD.

Sinfire Titan
2008-11-13, 07:48 PM
Ranger requires a BaB of +4. If you're not using fractional BAB, this character will have a BAB of +2 at level four. Even if you are using fractional BAB, this guy will have +3. So the build is not legal.

In that case go Scout 4/Monk 1/Cleric 2/PrC Ranger 13. Not as effective, but it does work. Or just use regular Ranger.

Telonius
2008-11-13, 11:19 PM
Pity Arms and Equipment Guide isn't allowed. Sparring Dummy of the Master makes that single level of Monk worthwhile. It's awfully cheesy, but very effective.

DUSUCK
2008-11-14, 10:02 AM
Pity Arms and Equipment Guide isn't allowed. Sparring Dummy of the Master makes that single level of Monk worthwhile. It's awfully cheesy, but very effective.

Not familiar with that, what does it do?

Telonius
2008-11-14, 10:27 AM
It allows you to take a 10 foot adjustment whenever you could make a 5 foot adjustment. Only people with at least one level in Monk are allowed to use the item. You can still make a full attack when you only make a 5-foot (now 10-foot) adjustment. So a Scout could techically get off a full attack with skirmish added to each attack.

Like I said, horrendously cheesy. It's also technically 3.0 material, so many DMs don't allow it for that reason. It's also very expensive (30,000gp) so you wouldn't be getting it until higher levels anyway.

DUSUCK
2008-11-14, 02:50 PM
It allows you to take a 10 foot adjustment whenever you could make a 5 foot adjustment. Only people with at least one level in Monk are allowed to use the item. You can still make a full attack when you only make a 5-foot (now 10-foot) adjustment. So a Scout could techically get off a full attack with skirmish added to each attack.

Mega epic awesome

Darrin
2008-11-14, 03:48 PM
It allows you to take a 10 foot adjustment whenever you could make a 5 foot adjustment. Only people with at least one level in Monk are allowed to use the item. You can still make a full attack when you only make a 5-foot (now 10-foot) adjustment. So a Scout could techically get off a full attack with skirmish added to each attack.


Anyone who can make a DC 40 Tumble check can do the same thing without the dummy. Oriental Adventures p. 58 (still a 3.0 source, so not always allowed).

There's also those wacky magic roller blades on the WotC site.

Travel Devotion is still the easiest. 1/day, move up to your speed as a swift action for 1 minute.

Telonius
2008-11-14, 03:54 PM
I couldn't seem to find a link for the Eberron Rollerskates. What was the item's real name? Cannith somehting-or-other, right?

DUSUCK
2008-11-15, 09:30 PM
I couldn't seem to find a link for the Eberron Rollerskates. What was the item's real name? Cannith somehting-or-other, right?

Roller skates.... Really??

The Glyphstone
2008-11-15, 09:39 PM
Cyran Gliding Boots (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/cw/20061120a).

LOL.

DUSUCK
2008-11-15, 09:59 PM
Cyran Gliding Boots (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/cw/20061120a).

LOL.

I want them

only1doug
2008-11-16, 08:09 AM
Cyran gliding boots have 4 effects, the effect granting a 10' step is only 3/day.


1. As a result, gliding boots allow the wearer to make a 10 ft. adjustment in combat as a free action rather than a 5 ft. adjustment; this adjustment follows all the rules for the normal 5 ft. adjustment, and can be used 3 times/day.

2. The boots add a 10 ft. enhancement bonus to the base land speed of the wearer when the wearer is moving down a slope or across a flat surface such as a road or trail.

3. Gliding boots add a +2 circumstance bonus to all Tumble and Jump checks made on solid ground.

4. Spellcasters can use gliding boots in combination with a gust of wind spell to travel at double their normal speed for a single round (the duration of the spell). (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/cw/20061120a)




I prefer the boots of sidestepping (MIC pg78) which have a slightly superior version:



when you activate the boots you can take a 5' step. (3/day) Unlike a normal 5' step this can be used in conjunction with normal movement (or even taking a normal 5' step).

DUSUCK
2008-11-16, 08:51 AM
Cyran gliding boots have 4 effects, the effect granting a 10' step is only 3/day.




I prefer the boots of sidestepping (MIC pg78) which have a slightly superior version:

Those are cool to....