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Fan
2008-11-17, 08:28 PM
Anyway I have most of this template abomination fleshed out so far, and am wondering ways to improve it all cricism/ rules fixing is appreciated no matter how harsh!

Name: random guy X
race: Vampire Were Bear Half orc/Half Ogre
Stats: Strength (after enhancements):65 Dex: a sad 12 Con: 28 Wis: 14 Cha: 12 Int: 6 GRAH ME NO KNOW HOW SPELL!
Class: Lion totem barbarian 10/Frenzied berserker 5/ Were bear 7/Vampire 8.
Feats: Power attack, Improved bullrush, Leap attack, Shocktrooper, Endurance, and Cleave.
Flaws: Murky eyed, and Vulenerable.
Traits: Agressive.
Skills: ???
Rage 3/day. frenzy 3/day. ragin frenzy 3/day!
Comments, help, whatever?

SurlySeraph
2008-11-17, 08:36 PM
Why not a full Orc? He'll get more strength that way.
Otherwise, not much to say. Looks like a decent Ubercharger build.

Fan
2008-11-17, 08:37 PM
Why not a full Orc? He'll get more strength that way.
Otherwise, not much to say. Looks like a decent Ubercharger build.
I can be a Orc/Half Ogre?!?!?!:smallconfused:
the Half ogre gets me a additonal +10 str because of size increase thats my explainatiopn.
Could go catfolk/Half ogre but thats just plain weird.

Flickerdart
2008-11-17, 08:41 PM
You forgot to list INT and have mixed up Wereboars and Werebears.

Sstoopidtallkid
2008-11-17, 08:43 PM
I can be a Orc/Half Ogre?!?!?!:smallconfused:
the Half ogre gets me a additonal +10 str because of size increase thats my explainatiopn.
Could go catfolk/Half ogre but thats just plain weird.Yes. Half-Orc means your dad was an Orc and your mom was a human. Introducing Ogre to that gets...odd. Half-Ogre Orc, OtOH, is fine.

Rei_Jin
2008-11-17, 08:46 PM
Also, as a Vampire you have no Con Score.

Lycanthropy is a disease. Unless I missed something, when you're an undead, you aren't subject to disease. So, you should lose the lycanthropy.

Aneantir
2008-11-17, 08:47 PM
I can be a Orc/Half Ogre?!?!?!:smallconfused:
the Half ogre gets me a additonal +10 str because of size increase thats my explainatiopn.
Could go catfolk/Half ogre but thats just plain weird.

Actually, unless you're getting Half-Ogre from somewheres other than Races of Destiny or Savage Species, then it doesn't work anyway. Those Half-Ogres are base races, not templates, they come from the breeding of Ogres and Humans.

As for help: Take the Knockback feat, and a level of Warblade at level 5 or above for the Emerald Razor maneuver.

Full power attacking on a touch attack where you get a free bullrush and a bonus on the strength check equal to the extra damage you recieved from power attack on top of everything else is just hilarious.

Also, if you go that route, talk to your DM, and see if you can get him to use a house rule that states that if a creature would be bullrushed into an object, if the initial bullrush attempt minus the opponents opposed check, minus the distance moved is greater than the hardness of the object, they destroy the object and continue on the bullrush path. Because sending an enemy through doors/windows/walls/debris is just plain cool.

Fan
2008-11-17, 08:49 PM
Also, as a Vampire you have no Con Score.

Lycanthropy is a disease. Unless I missed something, when you're an undead, you aren't subject to disease. So, you should lose the lycanthropy.

Actually by 3.5 its a curse.
Yep, I was confused to, but apprently all those Underworld fantasies tht have been deredging in our deepest receesses are possible.

JeminiZero
2008-11-17, 09:00 PM
If you want a melee undead build, consider stacking the evolved undead template. +2 Str and Cha, +1 AC, and a SU per level.

Rei_Jin
2008-11-17, 09:00 PM
Hmmm...

Well, the templates do stack, although I'm sure that they shouldn't.

The difficult part is that under the Vampire Template, it states that your type and subtypes change. You would lose the shapechanger part of your subtype, thus meaning that you don't get the hybrid form or the animal form anymore. Of course, the DM can change how that is interpreted.

Just be careful, template stacking is a fine art and should only be attempted as a player if you're 110% up on how it works. As a DM, go nuts.

Heliomance
2008-11-17, 09:01 PM
Evolved's been banned for this game, unfortunately. Otherwise I'd have it in my ghost build a few times.

Fan
2008-11-17, 09:02 PM
Almost ninja'd.. good thing I have my tusty trohpy to gaurd my ninjatude.

Anyway.. maybe I could take the Tauric template, and perform some insanity with War beast?

Sstoopidtallkid
2008-11-17, 09:02 PM
The difficult part is that under the Vampire Template, it states that your type and subtypes change. You would lose the shapechanger part of your subtype, thus meaning that you don't get the hybrid form or the animal form anymore. Of course, the DM can change how that is interpreted.Why would you lose the ability? After all, you retain all Special Qualities.

Rei_Jin
2008-11-17, 09:05 PM
No shapechanger subtype, no natural ability to use shapechange.

Fan
2008-11-17, 09:06 PM
No shapechanger subtype, no natural ability to use shapechange.

Actually the hybird form is only usable through the alternate form ability that hey gain from being a lycanthrope.
Which BTW is a (Su) quaility that is seperate from the animal form ability.

JeminiZero
2008-11-17, 09:12 PM
Evolved's been banned for this game, unfortunately. Otherwise I'd have it in my ghost build a few times.


Presumably the 2 of you are in teh same game?

Hmm... ok then. Another good source of strength might be the half dragon template, which comes with a nice AC bonus, elemental immunity, and flight if you are large or larger.

You might also like the Phrenic Template somewhere in there for the PLAs and the Power/Spell Resistance.

Fan
2008-11-17, 09:16 PM
Presumably the 2 of you are in teh same game?

Hmm... ok then. Another good source of strength might be the half dragon template, which comes with a nice AC bonus, elemental immunity, and flight if you are large or larger.

You might also like the Phrenic Template somewhere in there for the PLAs and the Power/Spell Resistance.

Theres NO magic/psionics in our game.
Also GHalf Dragon would defintely be good. That wiould takc ion another +4 though on the LA spectrum.
Maybe replace the Were bear with it?

Aneantir
2008-11-17, 09:16 PM
Presumably the 2 of you are in teh same game?

Hmm... ok then. Another good source of strength might be the half dragon template, which comes with a nice AC bonus, elemental immunity, and flight if you are large or larger.

You might also like the Phrenic Template somewhere in there for the PLAs and the Power/Spell Resistance.

If you're going to take a Half-Dragon template, make it pyroclastic. It would give you two things:

#1, a more difficult to resist breath weapon, since it would be of sonic AND fire.
#2, really bad-ass looking molten-rock scales.


Also, I'm wondering, where exactly did you get your Half-Ogre template? I can't seem to find it anywhere.

Fan
2008-11-17, 09:18 PM
Races of Destiny.
Also I would like to check out this Pyroclastic thing.
Maybe take some metabreath feats with it?

JeminiZero
2008-11-17, 09:18 PM
That wiould takc ion another +4 though on the LA spectrum.


1/2 dragon is only +3 LA I believe.

Aneantir
2008-11-17, 09:20 PM
Races of Destiny.
Also I would like to check out this Pyroclastic thing.
Maybe take some metabreath feats with it?

Pyroclastic is from the draconomicon, all the difference is is color and breath weapon, and that you get either fire immunity or sonic immunity from it.

Also, Half-Ogre is NOT a template. It is a base race. You can't have a Half-Ogre/Orc, or a Half-Ogre/Half-Orc.

Rei_Jin
2008-11-17, 09:33 PM
If you want awesome strength, you should look at taking levels in Warhulk. It doesn't advance BAB, but it gives you +2 Str every level.

If you've got that on one side of the Gestalt, and a full BAB on the other side, you're set.

Combine that with a Feral Half-Dragon Half Ogre and you're set.

I'd have it something like this

Barbarian 5/Frenzied Berserker 5/Warblade 10//Feral 1/Half Ogre 2/Half Dragon 3/Warblade 4/Warhulk 10



Total bonus to Strength? +40, before you add in level boosts and items. Also, your base strength gets added, etc.

Aneantir
2008-11-17, 09:39 PM
And, as I said above, sneak in a level of warblade at level 5+ for Emerald Razor, and then take the Knockback feat from Races of Stone, so you end up with a touch attack that bullrushes, with full power attack damage and a check like this:

+40(2-handed power attack)+4(Improved Bullrush)+4(size)+20(strength, could be higher) for a total of +68, as well as normal melee attack damage, and you don't have to follow them on the attempt.

JeminiZero
2008-11-17, 09:55 PM
If you want awesome strength, you should look at taking levels in Warhulk. It doesn't advance BAB, but it gives you +2 Str every level.

If you've got that on one side of the Gestalt, and a full BAB on the other side, you're set.


Or if you are feeling like feasting on cheddar, you can stack multiple halfdragon templates on top of each other. There is nothing in RAW that prevents you from doing so. 3 more levels of halfdragon get you +8 Str and +4 Nat AC, along with another elemental immunity. Stack 5 of these for +15 LA giving +40 Str, +20 Nat AC and immunity to the 5 energy types (putting it on par with the evolved template). But this works best only if you have full BAB and HD progression on the other side of the gestalt.

Edit: Doing this also nets you +10 Int, Con and Cha bonus. The Con bonus is lost if you go undead, but the Int and Cha bonus might work well with Warblades and Crusaders.

Fan
2008-11-17, 09:57 PM
Warhulk thats what I was looking for.
So, if I sneak in 6 levels of that over lycanthropy I get +12 str, and then with Feral Ha;f Dragon/Half ogre I get +20 Again. Sweetness.

Jack_Simth
2008-11-17, 09:59 PM
Or if you are feeling like feasting on cheddar, you can stack multiple halfdragon templates on top of each other. There is nothing in RAW that prevents you from doing so. 3 more levels of halfdragon get you +8 Str and +4 Nat AC, along with another elemental immunity. Stack 5 of these for +15 LA giving +40 Str, +20 Nat AC and immunity to the 5 energy types (putting it on par with the evolved template). But this works best only if you have full BAB and HD progression on the other side of the gestalt.
Don't forget to put a little troll in there - a Half-Red Dragon Half-black Dragon Troll, with Frenzied Berserker on the other side, and something to keep nonlethal damage from getting you down (and something to avoid Death effects, Disintegration effects, and a few other insta-death things), is nearly-invincible death on two legs.

Fan
2008-11-17, 10:09 PM
I like Cheddar.:smallamused: