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View Full Version : [3.5] Searching for cheese ideas



The Mormegil
2008-11-20, 02:19 PM
This is for a campaign I'm in: we're at ECL 25 now, levelling each damn session, we are quite TOTALLY HOMEBREWED, and we keep using the standard 3.5 rules just for fun more than for actual reference. Now we're up against Lucifer (yeah, that one) and probably against one or more PCs too (PvP ending, probably). We're gathering as many artifacts as possible before going to match some really tough guys (totally homebrewed, the DM realized that he needn't apply rules as they are... so they're just as tough as we can manage, maybe a little more). Now, I warn you: magic is not allowed. Our party caster is a Duskblade (sort of...). I am a meleer, even though I can cast a little. I am mostly keyed off Intelligence (+20!), but Con and Str are at +14 and Dex is at +8.

Now, what I want is some ideas, be it other houserules or broken feats/abilities, to get mixed together in a brand new PrC to get during my Epic advancement. Keep in mind that anything too broken will be cut off, infinite loops are out of question and so on, but static bonuses to something, no matter how huge, are welcome.

Maily what I want falls into two categories: WotC material that is really strong by the above creteria (like +Int instead of +1 for dodge bonus), or intresting ideas for something homebrewed (like taking 10 on attack rolls).

Thanks in advance.

monty
2008-11-20, 02:26 PM
static bonuses to something, no matter how huge, are welcome

+10^50 untyped to all stats, with the bonus squared at every subsequent level of the class.

The Mormegil
2008-11-20, 02:29 PM
+10^50 untyped to all stats, with the bonus squared at every subsequent level of the class.

I was expecting something like this. Well, avoid.

weenie
2008-11-20, 02:44 PM
But really, asking for homebrewed cheese? That's like saying "Guys, I'd really like you to help me twist the rules of the game, to make my character completely unstoppable, and while at it, could you also invent all the rules in the first place?"

For what you are requesting the +10^50 to all stats is pretty plausible.

only1doug
2008-11-20, 03:22 PM
its not homebrewed, but do you already have +Int to damage rolls with finesseable weapons? (swashbuckler class feature: insightful strike) (Pg 194 complete warrior)

The Mormegil
2008-11-21, 01:55 AM
Ok, I'll try to make this clear. People around these boards homebrew. They homebrew many a thing, right? Most of them are methods to rebalance something by their point of view. I want THOSE things. I do not want homebrewed CHEESE. I want homebrewed somethings (melee-centered). The cheese will come as I (and my DM) adapt them to the campaign. As it is, I need new ideas. The best way to optimize in this scenario is to come up with something unique, versatile and completely unexpected. If I get +10^50 to all stats, expect all other players to gain that, and all monsters to have ACs, saves, hit points, attacks and damage to match what we are able to do.

For further explaining: our group's worst character is our invisible archer. He stays invisible, hits with arrows and deals a truckload of SA damage. Result: every monster can see invisibility in some way and is immune to crticals (while not totally screwing him up, because the DM makes sure he is still useful). And while he STILL deals an awesome lot of damage, he is easily defeated by any enemy. On the other hand, the most useful is the party's... well... mutant. He has a PrC that lets him choose every two levels a new "mutation" that grats him the X and Y powers. So far he can breath hellfire, has 4 tentacles to attack, can use bardic music, has supersight, superstrength, hits hard with a hammer, flies at 900m (perfect), can hit flatfooted, touch, teleport... and gods know what else...

So I need either something legal that boosts my values in the nigh stratosphere (again, nigh), or something homebrewed that is good to get. Only1doug has a point: that’s what I was asking for (well, part of). I got it already, but anyway…

Talic
2008-11-21, 02:42 AM
Well, I don't know about homebrewed, but a Ranger 5 (wild shape)/Momf 7/Deepwarden 2/Warshaper 5/Warblade 6 is pretty ok.

Polymorph into a Shambling mound. Use a weapon with a Crystal of energy assault (electricity) to auto hit a touch attack against yourself every round for 1 electrical damage.

It's prevented, you gain 1d4 con temporarily. Repeat as desired. Even assuming 1 touch a round, you could get 10d4 Con per minute. Go until you're bored, it goes away at a hideously slow rate (1 per hour)...

You get 600d4 con for every 1 you lose.

Deepwarden lets you apply it to AC.
Warblade gives you diamond mind, which has, notably 4 maneuvers of note.
One does double damage on a successful concentration check. With something like +2500 to your con modifier, that should be easy.

The next? quadruple damage on a successful concentration check.

Then? Replace your damage roll with a concentration check.

Finally? Diamond nightmare blade. Double your concentration check is your damage. Yes, we've just applied your constitution modifier to damage. Yes, you have something like 65,000 hp at level 25... From con alone. More if you increase your con past +2500.

Only down side is flat-footed will still allow you to be denied your con. Up side? Immune to crits and precision damage. Change into a form with decent DR. Have fun.

only1doug
2008-11-21, 02:40 PM
Only1doug has a point: that’s what I was asking for (well, part of). I got it already, but anyway…

I expected that you would have it, but if you didn't then it was worth suggesting.

I'd suggest going for class features that emulate useful spells on a uses/day basis. (much like monks get dimensional door)

pick useful spells and ask for abilities that emulate those.
(personal or touch attack only)
e.g.
Personal only
Fly,
Ray deflection (SC)(ranged touch attack spells miss you),
Dimension door,
stoneskin,
Ghost touch armour (SC) (your armour works normally against incorporeal),
Wraithstrike (SC) (your melee attacks strike as touch attacks),

touch attack:
Vulnerability (SC) (removes targets damage reduction),
scale weakening (SC) (subjects natural armour reduces),

AgentPaper
2008-11-21, 02:47 PM
Why not create the Pun-Pun prestige class? Or just become pun-pun normally. :smalltongue:

AmberVael
2008-11-21, 02:54 PM
..The best way to optimize in this scenario is to come up with something unique, versatile and completely unexpected...
Because he adapts to anything permanent? Interesting...
With that in mind, what you want is an ability or item or something that doesn't give you ANY set bonus, but allows you to shift what it does as often as possible.
Example: Something that allows you to change forms (gain strength, gain size, lose size, gain dexterity, gain HP, gain wings, etc. etc.)
Example 2: Something that emulates certain spells/powers which are allowed. Specifically, you want something that gives you a list that you can use any ability from. The limitation would be uses (per encounter, per day, permanently lost charges, whatever works).

ShneekeyTheLost
2008-11-21, 04:50 PM
Have you considered Polymorph? It sounds to fit the bill exaclty by what you are requesting. It's flexable, broken, core, and only a 4th level spell (which, as a 20+ duskblade, you can cast). Hell, blow a feat if you have to (extra spell, CompArc) to get this spell. It is one of the most flexable and broken spells in the game.

If you could find a way to cast 8th level spells, you could even do Polymorph Any Object for even more horrid brokenness. Many of the forms you can take can be permanent (like, say, War Troll).

Your archer sniper guy can still pull tricks out of his bag for insane damage output. What kind of things is the GM throwing at you to be immune to precision-based damage? Odds are it's either undead or constructs. Well, for the price of two wands (assuming he has Use Magic Device), he CAN sneak attack them both, via wands of Gravebane and Golembane (both 1st level spells. Gravebane from Complete Divine and Golembane from Complete mage or arcane, can't remember which).

You know, I homebrewed an Arcane Archer 'fix' a while back, had 1/2 casting progression and some other nifties he may like.