[3.5] Scorpion Themed Warrior

[Thurbane]

Looking for a themed character build – a melee type with a scorpion motif. I believe there is a clan of scorpion themed Drow in Eberron, but I’m trying to avoid anything campaign specific (no Eberron or FR). Also, no ToB or psionics.

Maybe a fighter or barbarian type with scorpion themed feats, items and/or PrC? Looking at 8th level, standard WBL. Sandstorm has some scorpion themed feats and a PrC from memory.

[Sstoopidtallkid]

Grab a Whip-Dagger or a Spiked Chain. Then take Rogue and Assassin, get a homebrew poison system allowed, and kill people. A lot.

[AdamSmasher]

Don't listen to that guy.



Go TAURIC.

[Sstoopidtallkid]

Don't listen to that guy.



Go TAURIC.Drider refluffed? Were-Drider(if you can get it allowed)?

[Iku Rex]

The PrC from Sandstorm is the Scorpion Heritor. It's a +5d6 sneak attack class (over 10 levels) with some scorpion themed abilities. Not too bad.

Beyond that it depends on what kind of fighting style you want. Grappling is scorpion-ish, and possibly doable, but not all that effective. Monk levels and maxing stunning fist could work. Maybe Rog3/Mnk2/SH 3. Or you could go with Rgr2/Rog3/SH3 and dual wield a claw-like weapon. Plain Rog5/SH3+ makes for a fairly standard rogue with some scorpion abilities.

Make sure you get an Amber Amulet of Vermin (scorpion) from MIC (note errata).

Gharyn’s Monastic Array (MIC) is somewhat scorpion themed, and might be worth it for a monk.

Chitin armor (RacDrag) isn't very powerful, but fits the flavor. Just say it's made from a scorpion carcass.

It's Eberron, but Secrets of Xen'Drik has a couple of scorpion themed weapons and the nifty Bracers of the Hunter (8500 gp). It also has a "Scorpion Wraith" PrC.

[Keld Denar]

Take Bear Totem Barbarian. It gives you Improved Grab. Just call it Scorpion Totem Barb. Then work on optimizing your grapple check and your unarmed damage. Deepwarden and/or Fist of the Forest, Frostrager, and other such jazz. Just be all like, SCORPION DEATH GRASP BEECHES!

[BobVosh]

Drider refluffed? Were-Drider(if you can get it allowed)?

Tauric is a template from Savage Specis.

Completely awesome if done right.

So when you say scorpion themed do you mean humanoid and <3s scorpions, scorpion blood, halfscorpion, wants to imitate scorpions, or his parents were killed by scorpions and he has vowed venegence.

PHB2 variant druid, scorpion as the land critter >.>

[RTGoodman]

Take Bear Totem Barbarian. It gives you Improved Grab. Just call it Scorpion Totem Barb. Then work on optimizing your grapple check and your unarmed damage. Deepwarden and/or Fist of the Forest, Frostrager, and other such jazz. Just be all like, SCORPION DEATH GRASP BEECHES!

Heck, there's even a feat called Scorpion's Grasp or something like that in Sandstorm that basically gives you Improved Grab (IIRC), so that's something to look into, also.


EDIT: It is indeed called Scorpion's Grasp, and there's also Scorpion's Instincts (which makes you sneakier and harder to detect via scent, etc., in the desert), Scorpion's Resolve (which gives you a bonus on saves vs. Mind-Affecting spells and abilities), and Scorpion's Sense (which basically gives you Tremorsense).

EDIT 2: Also, there's a Scorpionfolk race in... Monster Manual 2, I think, in the back (the "OGC" section). I think it has a lot of RHD and a high LA, though, so it's probably not your best bet.

[Sstoopidtallkid]

Tauric is a template from Savage Specis.

Completely awesome if done right.Also broken beyond imagining. I was just suggesting other racial options.

[Enlong]

Scorpion Heritor, from Sandstorm. You get a Sneak Attack, the ability to polymorph into a small scorpion, the ability to spit venom onto your weapon, immunity to Scorpion Venom, and a whiplike scorpion tail.

There's also weapons in Sandstorm like the Scorpion Claws that give you a bonus to grapple and deal slashing damage with successful grapples, as well as the Scorpion Tail Whip that can store venom in the tip.

Scorpiony enough for ya?

[Talic]

Yeah, if you hit an unarmed strike/light weapon attack, you get a free grapple attempt.

Can be good if you up your size.

Minor ring of spell storing if you can convince your mage to know enlarge person, high strength character, and go straight Barbarian from there. Ideally, go Lion totem for the pounce.

Then go Unarmed strike to grapple on humanoid targets. I'd suggest a reach weapon and stand still for larger things.

[Keld Denar]

AD&D 2nd Ed had a monster called a Manscorpion, basically a centaur with the body of a scorpion instead of a horse. The image was pretty freakin badass, but unfortunately, my google-image-fu is weak, and I can not find it. Anyone have one of these lying around they could scan?

Totally badass.

[RTGoodman]

EDIT 2: Also, there's a Scorpionfolk race in... Monster Manual 2, I think, in the back (the "OGC" section). I think it has a lot of RHD and a high LA, though, so it's probably not your best bet.

(Yeah, I quoted myself, what of it? :smallamused:)


I just realized that, since the Scorpionfolk race is OGC, it's also in the d20 SRD. You can find info on it HERE (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/scorpionfolk.htm), though like I said, it's a ECL 16 creature (12 RHD, and +4 LA). It is pretty freakin' sweet, though:


http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/mm2_gallery/88268_620_111.jpg

[Sstoopidtallkid]

I was able to find fanart of that thing here (http://www.elfwood.com/art/k/i/kingarthur/manscorpion.jpg.html).

[BobVosh]

Those racials suck. Also the first race I have seen with SR that doesn't scale, but starts out at something decent. How bizarre.

[Sstoopidtallkid]

Those racials suck. Also the first race I have seen with SR that doesn't scale, but starts out at something decent. How bizarre.No it doesn't. SR 18, lowest available ECL is 16. Enemy casters beat it on a 2.

[JeminiZero]

Since no one has mentioned this, I'll throw it out. Go for a Cleric-Geomancer. Either get your DM to wiave the pointless Arcane spell requirements, or else, qualify for it by splashing Wizard and taking Alternate Source Spell. You retain (near-full) cleric casting to go zilla if needed.

Geomancer PrC lets you add animal/insect/plant parts to your anatomy. Some of these can be refluffed to be Scorpian parts. E.g. Go without Water for 5 days (desert scorpian), +1 Natural AC (Scorpian Carapace), 2 claw attacks + Constrict + Improved Grab (pincers), Acid Stinger + Poison Bite* (Tail stinger).

*The Poison Bite is supposed to only enhance your bite attacks, but I see no reason why you can't convince a DM to apply it to your acid stinger instead.

[BobVosh]

No it doesn't. SR 18, lowest available ECL is 16. Enemy casters beat it on a 2.

er. Sorry. I meant a decently high number. Not a decent SR for when the character starts with it.

[Talic]

*The Poison Bite is supposed to only enhance your bite attacks, but I see no reason why you can't convince a DM to apply it to your acid stinger instead.

Tail attacks typically receive a higher benefit from strength (Str or 1.5 Str) than Bite (1/2 Str usually).

Damage die is usually similar.

Mouthpick weapons allow for weapons from bite attacks, Prehensile tail allows for weapons from Tail attacks. Similar there.

I'd not have a problem personally with houseruling altering it to a piercing Tail attack that dealt listed damage +1/2 Strength, and had the poison effect.

Just my opinion on a balanced effect.

[Starbuck_II]

Poison Use is granted by the Vestige Malphas (2nd level Vestige):
You also get Sudden Strike/Invisibility.

You can take 3 levels of Binder or 1 level and Improved Binding to qualify.

Or create a Savage Species progression for the Sciorpian Folk might do.

[Ryuuk]

Tauric is a template from Savage Specis.

Completely awesome if done right.

Actually, how would you apply that template? It doesn't seem to have a listed LA.

[JeminiZero]

Tail attacks typically receive a higher benefit from strength (Str or 1.5 Str) than Bite (1/2 Str usually).


Checking the Geomancer text, the bite belongs to that of a crocodile (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Crocodile), which can apply 1.5x strength to damage.

However, checking the tail sting, that belongs to the Giant Ant (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Giant_Ant_Soldier), and so only applies when you establish grapple.

To better simulate a true Scorpian, you want your tail sting regardless of grapple check. So take the bite instead, fluff that its actually a tail attack, and apply poison to it.

[Talic]

Actually, how would you apply that template? It doesn't seem to have a listed LA.

Look at the MM2 3.5 update (downloadable from the wizards website for free).

Tauric's LA is equal to the humanoid creature +3. The Racial HD are equal to the quadruped.

[Talic]

Checking the Geomancer text, the bite belongs to that of a crocodile (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Crocodile), which can apply 1.5x strength to damage.

However, checking the tail sting, that belongs to the Giant Ant (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Giant_Ant_Soldier), and so only applies when you establish grapple.

To better simulate a true Scorpian, you want your tail sting regardless of grapple check. So take the bite instead, fluff that its actually a tail attack, and apply poison to it.

Then you've gotten rid of the grapple restriction of the poison, and added it to an ability that's balanced in it's own right.

Fluff is only fluff when it doesn't affect mechanics.

In order to add poison, you must take something away. Drop the strength bonus to 1, or 1/2 when you use it as a natural secondary attack.

[RebelRogue]

Don't listen to that guy.



Go TAURIC.
That would basically give you a Scorrow, but that is Eberron-specific.

[JeminiZero]

Fluff is only fluff when it doesn't affect mechanics.


It doesn't. You buy a bite attack. You buy poison bite, so that your bite attack also deals poison. You call your poisonous bite attack a "tail sting", that can be used outside of grapple and adds 1.5x Str bonus to damage just like a real tail.



Then you've gotten rid of the grapple restriction of the poison, and added it to an ability that's balanced in it's own right.




In order to add poison, you must take something away. Drop the strength bonus to 1, or 1/2 when you use it as a natural secondary attack.


You are free to rule that as a DM, but by RAW thats not the case. Also, looking through the Geomancer list, it would seem that the grappling tail sting is underpowered compared to the other drift options at stage 4, which has stuff like Improved Grab and Ferocity.

[Talic]

It doesn't. You buy a bite attack. You buy poison bite, so that your bite attack also deals poison. You call your poisonous bite attack a "tail sting", that can be used outside of grapple and adds 1.5x Str bonus to damage just like a real tail.

You are free to rule that as a DM, but by RAW thats not the case. Also, looking through the Geomancer list, it would seem that the grappling tail sting is underpowered compared to the other drift options at stage 4, which has stuff like Improved Grab and Ferocity.

By RAW, it's a bite. Not a tail. If you are talking about 'refluffing' and changing things, you are no longer using RAW, and can't fall back on it later.

And the Bite is not underpowered. Adding the poison, and removing the grapple restriction, improves the power of an ability that isn't underpowered.

Further, with crocodile bite, mouthpick weapons can be used, with just the weapon. With a tail, you must take prehensile tail first, and you use normal weapons. There are mechanical effects on changing something from a bite attack to a tail attack. Those mechanical effects mean that it's not fluff.

Fluff is changing the deity a PrC follows, or somesuch.

But even a change as small as changing an alignment requirement from lawful to chaotic has mechanical impact. There are classes, both base and prestige, that have alignment requirements. Thus, it can't be called "Fluff", because it has mechanical impact on what can be chosen, or done.

Sorry, but one of my pet peeves is when people refer to changes which actually effect mechanical change, and call it fluff. Because when people call it "fluff", it implies that everything stays equally balanced, because no real mechanics are being changed, just the story around them...

And then they make a change that actually does make a change in mechanics, and now they're selling a misconception.

[Thrawn183]

All we really need to do is figure out how to do this with a kobold...

[bosssmiley]

Message from the Bayushi: "Yer ALL doing it wrong!"


http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/l5r/images/6/6c/Way_of_the_Scorpion.jpg

[Enlong]

Well, I still stand by my prestige class that can't go two class features without saying "scorpion", and the scorpion-based feats and weapons from that same book.

[ChaosDefender24]

There's some variation on lycanthrope that works with vermin instead. I have no idea where you can find it, however.

[RTGoodman]

There's some variation on lycanthrope that works with vermin instead. I have no idea where you can find it, however.

Ah, yes - entomanthropes. You can find that on the WotC website HERE (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/re/20040621a).

[Thurbane]

Well, I still stand by my prestige class that can't go two class features without saying "scorpion", and the scorpion-based feats and weapons from that same book.
Indeed, good suggestions.

I probably should have stated in the original request - I really want something that is one of the more "standard" races, and also a non-caster. Enlongs suggestions fit with that very well.

[Occasional Sage]

Message from the Bayushi: "Yer ALL doing it wrong!"


http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/l5r/images/6/6c/Way_of_the_Scorpion.jpg

Mmmmm, Scorpion feats. That's a tasty option.

L5Rd10 would be even better, but....