Please check out our comic Morning Squirtz

[slimredninja]

Hi everyone I'm the creator of one panel humor comic called Morning Squirtz we would love to have some of the great fans of OOTS check us out and let us know what you think. Much of the content is NSFW so mature viewers only please. I have included a couple of our tamer comics in this post.

Here is a link to our comic.

http://www.drunkduck.com/Morning_Squirtz/index.php?p=124542

http://i182.photobucket.com/albums/x121/slimredninja/301dalcopy.png

http://i182.photobucket.com/albums/x121/slimredninja/dorothycopy.png

[Gez]

Everyone knows about it already. The first few threads were closed for drama and flamebaiting, but the last couple was for spam because you keep doing more of these threads. We know about it already. Wait a couple of months before making another one...

[BRC]

Posting more threads won't make people like your comic.
We appreciate that you are no longer attempting to deceive us with sock-puppetry, and we appreciate that you are no longer attempting to use the names of popular web comics in association with your own. However, neither of those things was the problem. The problem was that people didn't really like your comic. Believe me, it is not because we don't know it exists, we know. So please, stop spamming this forum in the hopes that we will suddenly fall in love with Morning Squirt.

[Lord Seth]

You somehow seem to be under the impression that continually advertising your comic will somehow make it a good comic.

How about actually improving the comic and making it funny instead of posting yet another thread about it?

[PhantomFox]

Last topic got modded. Must have talked it out with St. Jude and gotten permission to repost the thread.

If not, this is getting locked quickly.

[slimredninja]

Actually we are back by popular demand! this is a forum thread for doing exactly what I am doing promoting web comics. This thread is moderator approved so please don't flame it. Whether you do or don't like the comic please tell us why. Constructive criticism is welcomed and since we put up new toons all the time you never know you may find something to like eventually. I would love to hear your opinions fox & seth since I know you have followed and been a part of our already storied past. We may already be the most banned web comic to ever hit these forums lol.

[Roland St. Jude]

Last topic got modded. Must have talked it out with St. Jude and gotten permission to repost the thread...

Sheriff of Moddingham: This one. Feel free to comment on the comic, but don't flame the poster. And please quit vigilante modding. Like the comic or don't, comment here or don't, but please report problem posts and don't try to regulate other posters yourself. I'm all too happy to do it for you...and I have weapons of mass destruction. :smallamused:

[PhantomFox]

Actually we are back by popular demand! this is a forum thread for doing exactly what I am doing promoting web comics. This thread is moderator approved so please don't flame it. Whether you do or don't like the comic please tell us why. Constructive criticism is welcomed and since we put up new toons all the time you never know you may find something to like eventually. I would love to hear your opinions fox & seth since I know you have followed and been a part of our already storied past. We may already be the most banned web comic to ever hit these forums lol.

I'll do what I can. Simply put, this is not the audience you're looking for. The jokes are banal and disgusting. I hate that kind of stuff. Not many people here DO like that brand of humor. This comic seems to be unvarnished offensiveness. I read backwards from the most recent comic to where the comic was the last time you promoted the comic, and you haven't changed a bit. A lot of the jokes seem to be either "Hey, isn't this disgusting?" or "Take a common phrase and make it literal" or in the case of your most recent one, both. The first just makes me want to be sick and turn me off, and the second is just bland and shallow.

Which is a pity, since your art is good. You're capable of good art as you demonstrated in the comic your SN is based on. (Better than me, I can't get my ideas past pencil sketches to make them web presentable) It's just that they're loaded with offensiveness that you turn off everyone here. If you want to appeal to the people here, you're going to have to stop pandering to the lowest common denominator.

This community is NOT your target audience. I'd suggest to either drastically overhaul it, or take it somewhere else.

[Lord Seth]

Actually we are back by popular demand! this is a forum thread for doing exactly what I am doing promoting web comics. This thread is moderator approved so please don't flame it. Whether you do or don't like the comic please tell us why. Constructive criticism is welcomed and since we put up new toons all the time you never know you may find something to like eventually. I would love to hear your opinions fox & seth since I know you have followed and been a part of our already storied past. We may already be the most banned web comic to ever hit these forums lol.I've already explained, but here goes:

The jokes aren't funny.

Okay, on occasion, they are. But for the most part, they aren't.

Let's take these two most recent ones. Take the "301 Dalmations". Oh, look, it's a portmanteau of "300" and "101 Dalmations".

That's it. That's the only joke. The picture is meaningless, because the only joke is that you combined two things. A portmanteau is not, by itself, a joke.

As for "Has anyone seen Toto?" First, I didn't even get the joke for a while, and when I did, it wasn't particularly funny. The joke is apparently "the lion ate Toto". That's not funny.

With proper buildup, it could work decently as a punchline. But the problem is that you're cutting directly to the punchline with no buildup. Therefore, any potential humor is lost.

Even worse, the strip is backwards. The way someone reads it is they look at the comic, then read the caption. But it needs to be the other way around. Granted, it wouldn't have been funny that way either I don't think, but it would've been better structured. As it stands, it's giving the punchline, then giving a poor buildup to the punchline we already saw.

The other problem is how much the strip tries for "gross-out". This CAN work, but as your strip isn't particularly funny in the first place, it just ends up making it look worse. Gross-out for the sake of gross-out is rarely if ever funny.

[slimredninja]

Thanks for the insightful critiques guys I'm really looking forward to converting you both into full fledged fans! I think our humor appeals to a lot of people Hustler humor just bought some of our comics for an upcoming issue and we do seem to have a lot of fans. Considering our overall feed back it's very positive just not always on forums where some people live to tear stuff down. Hopefully people will give us a fair chance and we will pick up a few new fans.

[Jayngfet]

This reminds me of those newspaper comics, you wouldn't look them up on you're own time, you just read them because it came with the paper. Except you get no news when you read this.

[PhantomFox]

Thanks for the insightful critiques guys I'm really looking forward to converting you both into full fledged fans! I think our humor appeals to a lot of people Hustler humor just bought some of our comics for an upcoming issue and we do seem to have a lot of fans. Considering our overall feed back it's very positive just not always on forums where some people live to tear stuff down. Hopefully people will give us a fair chance and we will pick up a few new fans.

Y'know, being picked up by a porn magazine doesn't help your case much.

And if you think we tear stuff down, defend yourself! How are we wrong? If your comic is as good as you think it is, you should be able to refute the critique laid against it.

Oh, and calling us "forums where some people live to tear stuff down." is not a way to "converting you both into full fledged fans". I mean, you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink. But beating the horse will NOT help any. Actually, this is kinda confusing. You thank us for critiquing you one second, and insult us for doing so the next!

In fact, it puzzles me why you continue to promote this here after it's clear that we don't like it. Are you just stubborn? Do you need our approval specifically for some reason? No seriously, I don't get it. Explain it to me please.

[Fawkes]

I'm with Seth and Phantom. The comic just isn't funny.

[BRC]

Advice time, the format you have chosen, namely one-panel, is very hard to pull off. When it IS pulled off correctly, it can be very funny, but it's very hard to do. If you really want to use it, I reccomend you look at the works of Gary Larson, creator of the print comic Far Side for inspiration.
Otherwise, I reccomend you switch to a three-panel format and build up your joke. Example, on that 301 dalmations one, perhaps do two panels mimicking the 300 trailer, with just a little bit off. Perhaps you see a paw holding the spear instead of a hand, just enough so the reader is thinking "wait, what?" until they get to the last panel, at which point it makes sense in a funny way.

[The Linker]

I actually thought '301 Dalmations' was kinda funny. The 'lion ate Toto' one was... well, I've seen it a million billion times before, and there was nothing to make it stand out, so... yeah. If you use a really, really common joke like that, you're going to have to twist it a bit, I think. God knows Garfield did it at least 20 times on his own.

Then I click the link, and it's like "OH MY GOD HE'S POOPING INTO A HAT HOW IS THAT FUNNY!? MY EYES!"

I find it sort of ironic that we call those 'adult themes,' when adults are the least likely to find it funny. I mean, unless you really like puns and have a high tolerance for... that. :smalleek:

[busterswd]

Like I said before in the last few topics;

Your comic isn't funny enough to warrant the drawings. The nudity, blood, feces and continual depictions of things fornicating with improbable objects are completely unnecessary for the jokes. You could easily do the jokes without them. In most cases, subtlety in humor makes for a better joke. Taking bad puns and making them as graphically unpleasant as possible does not.

If you think people are tearing your comic down, it's for a reason. You claim you welcome critique, but then blithely assume that we'll grow to like it since we don't have enough graphic images to complete our day. Just spamming your link here and dismissing anyone who has any criticism about your comic as unwarranted dislike isn't going to win you any fans, nor does it strike the critics here as anything more than spam.

[Neoriceisgood]

Okay I can't really comment on the comics, because seeing just a few of them grossed me out enough to make me refrain from coming anywhere near to that site for quite a time, it's not a very wholesome comic in general.

Although gore and creepy imagery can be used in likable ways [there's this one comic, I forgot it's name, but it's whole intention was to be the most sick, twisted and offensive thing out there; due to the whole purpose of the comic being what it was, it worked (especially because it was drawn in ms paint)] where I was one of the few people who actually saw the humour, mostly because I found it hilarious that people actually got offended over it, not realising that the guy was just doing it to offend to begin with.

Here, however, this does not apply.

From what I gather this is supposed to be a "one panel gag strip"-type of comic, the "gross" aspect isn't meant to flat out offend as many people as possible; it's there to be 'funny".

As other people commented on before, gross humour is just ... very low on the appreciation level, especially when you have a more intelligent crowd.

Now taken the fact that your latest comic "party pooper" is in this same section of gross humour I'll take it that it's something you like and will continue doing.

This would make me give you the same advice as other people who've commented in this thread, find a different place to gather readers, this really isn't the right crowd for you.


That being said I had one question to the person who made this thread;

Are you detached from reality in some way or another? Not to be a jerk, but looking at your posts there's lines such as;


I'm really looking forward to converting you both into full fledged fans!

When reacting to people who obviously dislike your comics quite a lot.


I think our humor appeals to a lot of people

Which is great and all, but hardly anyone on this forum has appeared to like it so far, why the need to stroke your own ego?


Considering our overall feed back it's very positive just not always on forums where some people live to tear stuff down.

This is offensive.

Have you looked at other webcomic threads on this forum? at all

Although you may just be bad at picking your words right, you appear to imply that any forum where your feedback isn't positive is a place where "people live to tear stuff down."; and judging from the feedback on Giantitp, you seem to imply that people here live to tear stuff down.

You appear to confuse intentional trolling with brutal honesty in feedback however, I've been posting a webcomic on here myself and have seen quite a few other people do so as well; a lot of them seem to draw in fans & kind/positive feedback.

Why would this happen on a board that's purely there to tear stuff down?

Oh, right! Because people give honest feedback and only give negative feedback in the case where they don't find a comic enjoyable!

Rather than accepting that your comic honestly doesn't fit the people and that their feedback is their honest opinion, you seem to find it necessary to somehow shrug it off as people who live on being negative.

Judging from your past on these boards, using sock accounts and spamming your thread quite a few times I can easily understand why people are especially negative when commenting on your threads.

You reap what you sow, and on these boards you've obviously left a very negative impression.

[Greep]

Okay I can't really comment on the comics, because seeing just a few of them grossed me out enough to make me refrain from coming anywhere near to that site for quite a time, it's not a very wholesome comic in general.

Although gore and creepy imagery can be used in likable ways [there's this one comic, I forgot it's name, but it's whole intention was to be the most sick, twisted and offensive thing out there; due to the whole purpose of the comic being what it was, it worked (especially because it was drawn in ms paint)] where I was one of the few people who actually saw the humour, mostly because I found it hilarious that people actually got offended over it, not realising that the guy was just doing it to offend to begin with.

Here, however, this does not apply.

From what I gather this is supposed to be a "one panel gag strip"-type of comic, the "gross" aspect isn't meant to flat out offend as many people as possible; it's there to be 'funny".

As other people commented on before, gross humour is just ... very low on the appreciation level, especially when you have a more intelligent crowd.

Now taken the fact that your latest comic "party pooper" is in this same section of gross humour I'll take it that it's something you like and will continue doing.

This would make me give you the same advice as other people who've commented in this thread, find a different place to gather readers, this really isn't the right crowd for you.


That being said I had one question to the person who made this thread;

Are you detached from reality in some way or another? Not to be a jerk, but looking at your posts there's lines such as;



When reacting to people who obviously dislike your comics quite a lot.



Which is great and all, but hardly anyone on this forum has appeared to like it so far, why the need to stroke your own ego?



This is offensive.

Have you looked at other webcomic threads on this forum? at all

Although you may just be bad at picking your words right, you appear to imply that any forum where your feedback isn't positive is a place where "people live to tear stuff down."; and judging from the feedback on Giantitp, you seem to imply that people here live to tear stuff down.

You appear to confuse intentional trolling with brutal honesty in feedback however, I've been posting a webcomic on here myself and have seen quite a few other people do so as well; a lot of them seem to draw in fans & kind/positive feedback.

Why would this happen on a board that's purely there to tear stuff down?

Oh, right! Because people give honest feedback and only give negative feedback in the case where they don't find a comic enjoyable!

Rather than accepting that your comic honestly doesn't fit the people and that their feedback is their honest opinion, you seem to find it necessary to somehow shrug it off as people who live on being negative.

Judging from your past on these boards, using sock accounts and spamming your thread quite a few times I can easily understand why people are especially negative when commenting on your threads.

You reap what you sow, and on these boards you've obviously left a very negative impression.

Like this guy said, sometimes gross Can be really funny. E.g. Satruday morning breakfast cereal is definately in my top 5 favorite comics, and it is INCREDIBLY gross. Then there's VG cats with its aborted fetus dances, exploding hemmerhoids, and potatomoto just generally being gross. But gross for the sake of grossness ends up being worse than not funny.

[Phase]

Like this guy said, sometimes gross Can be really funny. E.g. Satruday morning breakfast cereal is definately in my top 5 favorite comics, and it is INCREDIBLY gross. Then there's VG cats with its aborted fetus dances, exploding hemmerhoids, and potatomoto just generally being gross. But gross for the sake of grossness ends up being worse than not funny.

The vulgarity in SMBC is rather rare. the vulgarity in The Perry Bible Fellowship is used in the one of the only ways it can work. The comic has a normal, usually pleasant beginning, which is then trashed by th later vulgarity. This is funny. Cut to just the punchline and it usually ISN'T funny, as is seen in this "comic."

[Neoriceisgood]

E.g. Satruday morning breakfast cereal is definately in my top 5 favorite comics, and it is INCREDIBLY gross.

I may have missed some pages, but aside from the low-detail style [especially when it comes to gore] isn't most of the "gross" aspect of it purely by the power of suggestion?

I mean, for example: http://www.smbc-comics.com/comics/20081201.gif

That comic could have been made really gross if the angle of the shot was different, or if we actually saw what was shown on the screen.

The concept is gross to begin with, but it's shown in the least graphic way possible. [the big difference between this type of gross and the morning squirtz type of grossness may be the fact that the imagine makes sense in a terribly terribly bad way once you read the punchline, rather than it just saying exactly what's happening in the picture]

I can't remember ever seeing a SMBC comic that was graphically gross in a way that made me want to stop reading it.


Then there's VG cats with its aborted fetus dances, exploding hemmerhoids, and potatomoto just generally being gross.

It's very cartoony grossness, but above that, it's cute grossness.

The guy from VGcats uses a similar method to "Happy Tree Friends" [which I don't like that much, but okay]

Where it's not the fact that it's gross, but the fact that it takes the most absurdely cute and cartoony style and characters imaginable and then makes them go through or do the most gore and sick things imaginable, often with organs flying all over.

The fact that the gross aspect of it seems to be placed in a "world" where it doesn't belong is absurd to the point where it becomes humorous.

I fully agree that both of them manage to use it better than Morning Squirtz [as far as I can tell, subjectively] but it's also important to point out why.

[slimredninja]

Actually my apologies the tearing down in forums shot was specifically for Phantom fox who has made it his lifes work to attack my forum posts and tell me to leave & that I have no right to post here. That being said compared to old threads He isn't behaving to badly. Actually I rather enjoyed Neoriceisgood's critique and comparisons and gleaned some good insight from them. I must say a major reason I believe we are funny is that our comics are often duplicated by other popular cartoonist. Cyanide & happiness copied one of our comics exactly and we have received an apology from a cartoonist for the New Yorker who also duplicated one of our toons and family guy also stole one of our gags our comic is well documented with post dates provided by drunk duck so we can prove we did them first. Plus we do have literally tens of thousands of fans. As for purposely gross of course we are the name should tell you that. I can't wait for everyone to see our upcoming D&D spoof we are both die hard gamers so this one means a lot to us. As for defending the comic I have found it better not to provoke people to much i causes flame wars that shut down your thread. I love the comic and someday someone else will post a good review on this thread I'm just bidding my time.

[Phase]

As for purposely gross of course we are the name should tell you that.

Point A) USE PUNCTUATION, DAMMIT!

Point B) See the above quote? That's the problem. People on this forum don't like that sort of thing. We prefer humor that doesn't make us wan't to boil our eyeballs.

[Greep]

Point A) USE PUNCTUATION, DAMMIT!

Point B) See the above quote? That's the problem. People on this forum don't like that sort of thing. We prefer humor that doesn't make us wan't to boil our eyeballs.

bah, get to work on your DD story strip, your claim time's up so if you don't hurry someone's gonna steal it :P

And yeah, someone will post a good review eventually, people are just jumping the bandwagon. I thought the 301 dalmations was pretty funny :) But like I said, gross for the sake of gross is not my piece of cake, and as others have said, you need build-up for your jokes.

E.g. This (http://www.vgcats.com/comics/?strip_id=274) is funny. If it was just the second to last panel? I don't think it really would be.

[RationalGoblin]

Actually my apologies the tearing down in forums shot was specifically for Phantom fox who has made it his lifes work to attack my forum posts and tell me to leave & that I have no right to post here. That being said compared to old threads He isn't behaving to badly. Actually I rather enjoyed Neoriceisgood's critique and comparisons and gleaned some good insight from them. I must say a major reason I believe we are funny is that our comics are often duplicated by other popular cartoonist. Cyanide & happiness copied one of our comics exactly and we have received an apology from a cartoonist for the New Yorker who also duplicated one of our toons and family guy also stole one of our gags our comic is well documented with post dates provided by drunk duck so we can prove we did them first. Plus we do have literally tens of thousands of fans. As for purposely gross of course we are the name should tell you that. I can't wait for everyone to see our upcoming D&D spoof we are both die hard gamers so this one means a lot to us. As for defending the comic I have found it better not to provoke people to much i causes flame wars that shut down your thread. I love the comic and someday someone else will post a good review on this thread I'm just bidding my time.

Hahahahaha, what? Seriously, what?

First of all, for sheer morbid curiosity, I read through most of your comic, and I've read through Cyanide and Happiness, so I should know that NONE of your comic's jokes have been duplicated by that comic in any way whatsoever.

Two, A cartoonist from the New Yorker AND Family Guy supposed copied your comic? More like you copied it, at a sad attempt to invoke the (slightly) better comedy of both of those. (as a side note, I dislike both of those immensely.)

Three, tens of thousands of readers? Then why haven't I seen them on the web? Why haven't I seen them in real life? Why haven't I heard about your webcomic before your attempts to introduce it to the Giantitp boards? Why haven't heard about "Morning Squirtz, that cool, gross webcomic?", when I've heard of people liking OOTS and 8-bit Theatre in real life? Answer me that. Furthermore, how can you have tens of thousands of readers when the most popular webcomics in the world are BARELY pushing ten thousand or so?

Also, tell me, when did you start your comic?

Finally, could you use paragraphs and indentation? It would help us take you a bit more seriously.

[slimredninja]

you need build-up for your jokes.

Unfortunately we do a one panel comic there is no extra space for build up everything has to come across immediately. There are many many times that I have had to boil a joke down to get it to fit in one or occasionally two panels. Actually we have a few fantasy rpg inspired comics already but this one will special.

[BRC]

Unfortunately we do a one panel comic there is no extra space for build up everything has to come across immediately. There are many many times that I have had to boil a joke down to get it to fit in one or occasionally two panels. Actually we have a few fantasy rpg inspired comics already but this one will special.
So my advice is to go to a three-panel format, because you currently use one-panel dosn't mean you always have to. Either that or work on jokes that don't need a build-up. Hence my reccomendation that you read The Far Side, which everybody should read,because it's very funny. But Gary Larson turned the one-panel and-a-caption format into an art form. Seriously, read his stuff. He's retired, but it's easy to find collections of his cartoons.

[The Linker]

Hmmm. I'm interested to see these gags that Cyanide and Happiness, and Family Guy, have done. Is there a place where you or someone has posted these comparisons?

I'd also be lying if I said I wasn't curious about where the 'tens of thousands of fans' figure came from. Please tell me that's not just the number of hits you've gotten since it's started. And, like RationalGoblin has said, I find it hard to believe I've never heard of it, ever, but at the same time there's that many fans.

Actually, I'd be interested to know about the fan figure for other webcomics. I really have no idea. :smalltongue: What are OotS and 8-bit Theatre's numbers like? Better yet, Penny-Arcade's? And how does one figure this out? :smallconfused:

[slimredninja]

As for rational goblin & Linker let me address your concerns:
Link to Cyanide in Happiness comic in question
http://www.explosm.net/comics/951/

Link to our comic which came out 3 month before theirs
http://www.drunkduck.com/Morning_Squirtz/index.php?p=189171

[averagejoe]

As for rational goblin & Linker let me address your concerns:
Link to Cyanide in Happiness comic in question
http://www.explosm.net/comics/951/

Link to our comic which came out 3 month before theirs
http://www.explosm.net/comics/951/

Both links go to the same comic.

Also, that's a pretty old joke. I've known it for years, long before either comic came out. It's like saying their comic copied yours because you both have a chicken crossed the road joke.

[slimredninja]

Whoops fixed it the link and BRC I worship Gary he is a god. We are Like farside but with nymphomaniac psycho cows and of course we aren't that funny yet.

[Lissou]

As for rational goblin & Linker let me address your concerns:
Link to Cyanide in Happiness comic in question
http://www.explosm.net/comics/951/

Link to our comic which came out 3 month before theirs
http://www.drunkduck.com/Morning_Squirtz/index.php?p=189171

Even if you did post it first, which I didn't check, I wouldn't have understood yours if I hadn't read the other one first.
The other one is funnier and done better.
But this being said, neither is very funny, really.

[averagejoe]

Even if you did post it first, which I didn't check, I wouldn't have understood yours if I hadn't read the other one first.
The other one is funnier and done better.
But this being said, neither is very funny, really.

Yeah, I thought they both spoiled the delivery a bit. Then again maybe I'm biased; it's one of my favorite jokes, so it may just be that I dislike any deviation in the version I know. It just seems like what makes the joke work is that you know he's a pedophile in the first place. The knife overdoes it, in my opinion.

[RationalGoblin]

Whoops fixed it the link and BRC I worship Gary he is a god. We are Like farside but with nymphomaniac psycho cows and of course we aren't that funny yet.

But you said earlier that the reason your comic is funny and popular is because people copy your jokes. Contradiction much?

[The Linker]

The thing I'm wondering about is how you keep saying you can't build up your jokes because you're limiting yourself to one panel. That right there is clearly a two-panel comic. :smallconfused:

[slimredninja]

We occasionally do split panel and while a couple of Morning Squirtz are based on old jokes 95% are very original never done before and even that joke hadn't been done as a comic. It's pretty obvious that you have at the most skimmed the surface of our comic there are tons of funny toons on our site.We have over a 150 comics plus a fan site where people submit their own Morning Squirtz. Again I will stand by our accomplishments we have been nominated and a finalist for several Drunk Duck awards ( although true we haven't won yet). We rank very high amongst the 10,000 comics available on Drunk Duck currently 9th amongst strips but we have been as high as second. We rank second on Frumphs list of adult comics. Oh and hustler humor a well respected humor magazine is paying us money for our comics and doing a color spotlight on us ( they only have two pages of color toons per issue). Now you can certainly try to convince me that I suck but I would argue the facts don't agree with your assertions. I'm sure like most people including myself you would like to win this argument and will say what you need to draw people to your cause. {Scrubbed} We do hope there will be a few we reach who are just to afraid of being ostracized to post but who will keep going back to our site to see more. Who knows maybe its even a few of you.

[Phase]

The problem isn't that your comic is horrible. The problem is that you're pandering to the wrong demographic. I would bet you that over 65% of the people o these boards have an IQ at least 125. We don't like "Gross-Out Humor" or many of the other things that your comic focuses on because we realize that vomiting is not inherently funny. I suggest that you spend your time doing one of the following:

1. Go proselytize on a different forum, this isn't your domain.

2. Actually PUNCTUATE YOUR SENTENCES! I CAN'T TAKE IT!!

[slimredninja]

Actually you are kind of our target audience Brandon Clark our artist has done 100's of pages of art for many well known gaming companies including cover art. We are both die hard gamers. I have ran dozens of gaming sessions over the last 20+ years. As for punctuation I really am trying it's just not my strong suit I usually do most of my punctuating after the fact.

http://i182.photobucket.com/albums/x121/slimredninja/trollscopy.png

[The Linker]

I don't think there are many people here that would be afraid of being ostracized here -- over at the Dominic Deegan thread, which is all about ragging on the comic and snarking at it, they get people fairly often who defend the comic and support it against the others.

I certainly don't think there are 'hundreds of fans' on this site that are just afraid to come out, as you once said. :smallannoyed:

[Neoriceisgood]

Since you already have the tide turned against us most sheeple will follow your lead.

Are these kind of comments really necessary? You really seem to insist that the people disliking your comic in this thread are either doing it purely because they live off of being negative and now you're saying it's because they want to conform to the norm.

Looking at the rather in-depth reasoning everyone's given so far as to why they dislike either.

a] the comic

and in almost all cases

b] your approach

I don't just find it rude, but flat out weak to throw in silly ad hominem-type of statements like calling those who dislike the comic "sheeple" rather than accepting the fact that your style of advertising is working quite adverse to your goal.

If you look closely at the comments in this thread quite a few people have conceded that they've liked at least one or two of your comics to some extend, and even complimented your art.

The biggest reason for the negative feedback is your own inabillity to produce proper and compelling PR, and going around calling people "sheeple" when they dislike your methods is a pretty good way to ensure more negative feedback in the future, because all it'll end up doing is making potential readers dislike you due to your behaviour alone.


lead. We do hope there will be a few we reach who are just to afraid of being ostracized to post but who will keep going back to our site to see more. Who knows maybe its even a few of you.

ostracized?

ostracized?

Really?

Do you honestly think that there's people who have commented on the comic in this thread who are purely giving rather negative feedback purely out of the fear of other people shunning them for liking the comic?

This'd make more sense to me if I wasn't strongly aware of the DD threads, where 90% of the people are self declared-snarkers [people who read the comic purely because they find it horrible enough to enjoy]

These people don't go around ostracizing people who post there who actually like the comic, I honestly doubt this forum houses the kind of crowd who'd absolutely loathe a person for liking a comic.


Brandon Clark our artist has done 100's of pages of art for many well known gaming companies including cover art. We are both die hard gamers. I have ran dozens of gaming sessions over the last 20+ years. As for punctuation I really am trying it's just not my strong suit I usually do most of my punctuating after the fact.


Yeah and I have run zero gaming sessions over the last 20 years, people are judging you by your comic and behaviour, not by the fact that you happen to share a hobby with them.

[PhantomFox]

Actually my apologies the tearing down in forums shot was specifically for Phantom fox who has made it his lifes work to attack my forum posts and tell me to leave & that I have no right to post here. That being said compared to old threads He isn't behaving to badly.

I believe you misunderstood me. I did not say you shouldn't post here. Nor did I say you have no right to be here. I was honestly curious on why you, as it looks like to me, keep banging your head against the wall. No, seriously, I was. I'm sorry if it came across as sarcasm.

As for attacking your posts, I'm very fond of a debate. I'm willing to listen to reason, but it appears that you're more interested in attacking the person instead of their arguments.

[slimredninja]

Neoriceisgood you are probably right I do get a little passionate when I'm defending my comic and I rarely think out every thing I do or say. I still stand by my comic and was secretly hoping that the term sheeple might some inspire someone who agreed with me to take a stand with me. As for you Phantom I think this is your
In fact, it puzzles me why you continue to promote this here after it's clear that we don't like it. Are you just stubborn? Do you need our approval specifically for some reason? No seriously, I don't get it. Explain it to me please. and you have posted much worst in previous threads.

[PhantomFox]

Well, I was honestly confused beforehand. Though I think I've figured it out. You want a thread here for your comic, and you'll have one no matter what people think about it. You want a presence here. That's fine. I can go with that.

Though I've always tried to keep my criticism constructive. I apologize if I've been unnecessarily mean. But the fact is that I disagree with your core concept and to a lesser extent, the execution thereof.

[Phase]

Slim Red, I'm no longer going to respond to any of your actual arguments until you use some godamn punctuation! By the gods!

[slimredninja]

Phase I will try my best. Perhaps I could send my posts to you for editing before I post them. That is the nicest thing you have ever said to me fox and I apologize if I sometimes come across as a bit of a cretin. As to the quality of the comic we can certainly agree to disagree. Plus we post new comics several times a week. How do you know we might not one day tickle your funny bone?

[busterswd]

How do you know we might not one day tickle your funny bone?

Because when people tell you why your comic isn't funny you ignore insult them and keep on doing the same stuff over and over?

[slimredninja]

Because I don't believe that the few posters speak for everyone I KNOW FOR A FACT that some people do like our comic and find it funny. If you don't no biggie but I will never cease to believe that others will. As for insults I think I suffer many more slings & arrows then I let fly.

[PhantomFox]

Well, I would but for one thing. The level of grossness keeps me away. Personally when I see something that gross, like scat jokes or eating urinal cakes, it literally turns my stomach. That's what grossness is all about. It is, by definition, offensive and repulsive. And the more gross and offensive you make something, you get bigger reactions. And if you are offensive, you ARE going to turn people away. It's like, a law or something. I don't want to check up on something that might make me be sick.

Tell you what, remove or dial down the grossness a lot, and I'll keep tabs on it.

[RationalGoblin]

Because I don't believe that the few posters speak for everyone I KNOW FOR A FACT that some people do like our comic and find it funny. If you don't no biggie but I will never cease to believe that others will. As for insults I think I suffer many more slings & arrows then I let fly.

Oh, stop it. Stop pretending to nurse a martyr complex. It isn't working.

And I agree with Phase. Please use punctuation and proper grammar. There's a reason these boards aren't like MSN, AIM, or whatever. You have to take time to formulate your responses.

And a third thing, a suggestion; perhaps you should listen to our criticism? And stop calling us sheeple?

[Mc. Lovin']

I wonder, if you have "Tens of Thousands" of fans as you claim, why is it you are scrabbling around in GitP, trying for a few readers from our forums? Why can't one of them convince us to go read a comic which they must feel is spectacular?

I'd like to see at least one fan post on this forum, and not one of your multiple accounts which you used in the original thread, but someone who's actually another person.

And although I do get pretty annoyed every time I see a squirts thread pop up again, I admire the fact that you still have not given up trying to get us to like your comic, about five threads later. I look forward to many more to come :smallsmile:

[NerfTW]

Here is my critic of your web page design:


Why, exactly, does the comic need to be larger than my screen, if it's only one panel? One panel comics should not require me to scroll on a 1440x900 pixel screen.

It's difficult to find the navigation buttons. They should be immediently under the comic, not underneath a collection of digg/blog/twit/whaever links, an ad (that has the bottom cropped off, I might add), and six links, two of them rating sites. Not to mention your links to navigate around the site are miniscule compared to the ads next to them. Your site comes off as a desperate attempt to earn ad money instead of a creative endeavor. I should be able to click through your archive without searching for the buttons among a sea of ads.

Also, you need to tell people clearly what your update schedule is. I can't find it. If I wanted to watch your comic, I'd have no way of knowing when to check back for a new one.

Your page needs some serious cleaning up before I'd even bother working on fixing the comic.

[JeffreyToTheMax]

Slimredninja, first off let me say that I admire your persistence. You have clearly put a lot of effort into promoting your work on this forum, and I don't think anyone here would deny you that right. For the most part, we like a good discussion, and are happy to offer constructive criticism. We wouldn't be doing it if we didn't get something out of it.

That said, it seems clear to me that your efforts are misguided. OotS and Erfworld have an entirely different audience in mind than your comic, and the population on the forums reflects that. We, as a general rule, simply do not enjoy your kind of humor. I certainly don't speak for everyone and I might be wrong, but as far as I can tell, it seems clear that you will not find a significant possible readership on this site. What's not so clear to me is why you persist even while this fact is becoming all the more obvious. You seem to be claiming that there are a number of members here who would have something positive to say about Morning Squirtz, but they are simply afraid of being mocked for standing against the crowd. It may work that way on other forums, but here we tend to encourage differing opinions to an extent, and we have strict rules in place to prevent the kinds of personal attacks you seem to suggest would occur.

By no means am I saying you don't have a place on this forum. I for one would be happy to help with what I consider to be the weak points of your comic, and I have no doubt there are others who would say the same. But your tactics thus far - multiple threads, using puppet accounts, ad hominem attacks, and greatly exaggerating numbers of readers - are surefire ways to further alienate yourself from the possible fans you seem desperate to collect. If you are truly set on establishing a presence here, these are things you need to be sure to avoid.

However, my personal recommendation is that you redirect your efforts elsewhere. Don't take that to mean I don't want you here, because that is not true. I just think that your time would be better spent in a location more in line with the content of your comic. I have no doubt that there are many people who would enjoy it. You just aren't going to find a lot of them here.

[Greep]

Oh, stop it. Stop pretending to nurse a martyr complex. It isn't working.

And I agree with Phase. Please use punctuation and proper grammar. There's a reason these boards aren't like MSN, AIM, or whatever. You have to take time to formulate your responses.

And a third thing, a suggestion; perhaps you should listen to our criticism? And stop calling us sheeple?

well we could argue this is a bad idea. But interestingly it is getting his thread bumped to be almost consistently higher than even strip slays.

[slimredninja]

Nerftw that is the kind of input we really need thanks a lot. Eventually we will have our own site and we will fix all those problems. As for why we do it and why do I think people here would check us out, here is one of the reasons. 77: giantitp.com my reading from project wonderful. 77 people visited from this site to mine just today! That does not even count how many of those people then checked out multiple pages. Giving us 100s if not thousands of page views.
If nearly a 100 people a day are checking us out why are only a few of them saying they don't like us? Also Phantom not all of our toons are gross outs here is just a small sample of non gross or sexual Morning Squirtz. I just realized nearly half of our toons aren't gross, sexual or about drugs.

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z237/danielmehlhorn/7f5b4cfcb2092bfd79f763d1b8d9fd2c.png

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z237/danielmehlhorn/gangsigns.png

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z237/danielmehlhorn/paperbag.png

[Jayngfet]

Those ones aren't as bad as the others, if you work at it a bit more you may get better. Just don't insult critics or assume too much.

[slimredninja]

Thanks Jayngfet that is actually the closet thing to a compliment we have received yet. I feel like I'm making head way.

[Tom_Violence]

I just realized nearly half of our toons aren't gross, sexual or about drugs.

I do hope you realise that all that means is that not even half of your comics stand any chance whatsoever of really appealing to me.

Its a funny thing about the webcomics, and the internet in general I guess. Even though this stuff is free, and I've got nothing better to do (otherwise I wouldn't even contemplate looking at it in the first place), there's still very little chance that I'll trawl through an archive of stuff that at best bores me and at worst makes me feel ill, just in case there's a little nugget of comedy excellence in there somewhere.

My point really is that, even though you may have the occasional strip that might appeal to the people that are repulsed by the gross stuff, its probably a wasted effort trying to convince them to go hunt for it. This is all the more true if your overall quality of comedy is fairly low, as it appears to be here.

The one good thing I will say to you is kudos for at least trying to work on the punctuation. Your earlier posts were very difficult to read; the latter ones less so.
And @Phase, I think its incredibly rude to say to someone something along the lines of "I'm not reading your posts until they meet my standards". Encourage people to try and improve, by all means, but not from a high horse.

[slimredninja]

Actually phase helped me realize I needed to proof read my posts a few times do to my atrocious grammar skills. As for the comic not appealing to this person or that person, we find being extremely diverse works for us. Some people really love the gross out stuff. The main thing for us is we do the comics as we imagine them with out any self censorship. We enjoy the raw aspect of our comic. We love going over the top. I have always felt arts most important aspect is to invoke strong feelings be they positive or negative and we certainly do that.

[Sholos]

Out of the three above comics, I actually somewhat enjoyed the first two. Didn't get the third one. Do more along those lines and you'll probably be much beter received.

[Arioch]

Actually phase helped me realize I needed to proof read my posts a few times do to my atrocious grammar skills.

I think paragraphing would make an incredible difference. Basically all your posts so far have been tangled messes of words. If you put paragraphing in it makes your posts easier on the eye and more readable, and helps separate your points.

It really does make a difference.

Also, please could you spoiler your comics when you post them? Currently they make the threat irritatingly wide. :smallsmile:

I liked the first two of those non-gross comics you posted. You should probably try doing more like that.

[JeffreyToTheMax]

77 people visited from this site to mine just today! That does not even count how many of those people then checked out multiple pages. Giving us 100s if not thousands of page views.
If nearly a 100 people a day are checking us out why are only a few of them saying they don't like us? Also Phantom not all of our toons are gross outs here is just a small sample of non gross or sexual Morning Squirtz. I just realized nearly half of our toons aren't gross, sexual or about drugs.

You are certainly going to get a lot of views from here; even if we don't like the comic, many of us are going to take a look at what you have, even if only to be able to offer better advice.

That said, I find myself a little more impressed with the ones you just posted. Those are the kinds of comics I personally would enjoy reading. As far as I can tell, you have made a genuine effort to openly communicate with us and follow advice, so I can't honestly complain except to say that your webcomic, on the whole, is not something I would sit down and read through. I'm sure you have a lot of good ones, but I would not find it worth the effort to go through all the ones that I find repulsive.

If you believe it is worth the effort to appeal to this vastly different audience, I certainly won't argue with you. Maybe you'll even be able to make some genuine improvements in the process.

[The Linker]

Gross-out comics, I think, are much more dangerous and riskier then regular comics. With a regular comic, if someone doesn't like it, they say "meh" and move on to the next. With a disgusting gross-out comic, if someone doesn't like it, they're going to go "EW! NO NO NO!" and quit and probably write about how they couldn't keep reading after it. You know, like us Giantitp people. :smalltongue:

But you say that there are people who like those comics, so... what if you were able to divide the comic into two different sections? One section would be filled with the comics like the above three, 301 Dalmatians, etc, while there would be an entirely different section, easily avoidable for those who so desire, that contains the comics of people chewing on urinal cakes and monkeys having relations with computers. Essentially, readers would be able to choose to read just the non-gross ones, or just the gross ones, or all of them together.

It might make a good compromise. Of course, I don't know how easy it would be to manage on Drunkduck, but... you could give it some thought. :smallsmile:

[slimredninja]

That is a tremendous idea Linker but hard to pull off in our current format maybe when we have our own web site.
As for the love we have received in the last few posts its making me teary eyed thanks guys & gals.
As I said earlier we actually do have a large number of the milder Squirtz. Here are a couple of more examples.
Is this kind of what you were referring to Arioch?

{Scrubbed - Oversized Images}

[Mc. Lovin']

I'm sure the punchline can be delivered better than that. I mean, just writing "Bubba Fett" underneath the picture you drew really doesn't reach the full potential. I know that I'm not an expert, but I also know you arent doing it right.

Also, 1 panel =/= one punchline. Take this SMBC comic;

http://www.smbc-comics.com/comics/20081211.gif

He had the Laughing punchline, and the line bit underneath. Two punchlines really did make the comic better here, and I think it'd work well on yours too.

[slimredninja]

I like a lot of SMBC but I dont think that one works that well. In a way the simple punchline is better on this one because there are a lot of funny redneck details conveyed by the picture. I wanted the picture to be the main theme of the joke not the text.

[Mauve Shirt]

It took me a second to get the "This is your brain on drugs" one. That might benefit from having the text in speech balloons and a caption. Bubba Fett I think is fine as it is.

[Greep]

It took me a second to get the "This is your brain on drugs" one. That might benefit from having the text in speech balloons and a caption. Bubba Fett I think is fine as it is.

actually I think it was more like his mind was in the gutter ;)

[slimredninja]

Bingo Greep! Give the man a Cigar! See guys we aren't always obvious.

[PhantomFox]

It took me a second to get the "This is your brain on drugs" one. That might benefit from having the text in speech balloons and a caption. Bubba Fett I think is fine as it is.

I think he was going for a "Mind in the gutter" pun.

[Mc. Lovin']

I like a lot of SMBC but I dont think that one works that well. In a way the simple punchline is better on this one because there are a lot of funny redneck details conveyed by the picture. I wanted the picture to be the main theme of the joke not the text.

Lemme tell you that what the reader sees and what you are trying to convey are two different things. It's obviously not been done right if you need to explain what is funny in your comic and what isn't.

[slimredninja]

Not true 99% of people get the jokes its very rarely that they don't. If anything people accuse us of over explaining them. I don't think many people had a problem getting that one here is what people said about on Drunk duck. It was also well received on other forums.

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Of course bubba fett would strap a nascar sticker on themself
-Posted on Jun 13, 2007

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Ouch you guys dont like red necks!!
-Posted on Jun 11, 2007

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-Posted on Jun 04, 2007

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Redneckdom cliams yet another decent soul.
-Posted on Jun 03, 2007

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Too funny!
-Posted on May 31, 2007

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I'm suddenly reminded of the late comedian Bill Hicks, and his jokes about "Buddha Bubba". I love this strip!
-Posted on May 31, 2007

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LOL!!
-Posted on May 31, 2007

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CHEESE PANDAS ARE NOT GOOD FOR THE ATMOSPHERE ALERT YOUR LOCAL GROCER SO HE MAY SELL THEM TO YOU IN BIODEGRADABLE CUPS
-Posted on May 30, 2007

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nice
-Posted on May 30, 2007

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I'm positive I've seen that guy at a number of comic cons. Or maybe they were clones....
-Posted on May 30, 2007

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lollylops
-Posted on May 30, 2007

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heheheee
-Posted on May 29, 2007

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nice
-Posted on May 29, 2007

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ha!
-Posted on May 29, 2007

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That is hilarious! Sup bubba?
-Posted on May 29, 2007

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That is sooo funny, both Ethan and I laughed out loud at this one guys, neigh a LOL isn't enough to emphisize, an entire spelling of laughed out loud is required, because it did indeed 'cause us to laugh out loud.
-Posted on May 29, 2007

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I am originally from West Virginia.... and this looks like my uncle Penata.

yes... thats his name.
-Posted on May 29, 2007

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Ha ha were doya come up with this awesome stuff?
-Posted on May 29, 2007

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-Posted on May 29, 2007

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OMG!
-Posted on May 29, 2007

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Yeah, Bubba!
-Posted on May 29, 2007

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In response to dantheman, I'd simply like to see them kill a puppy.
-Posted on May 29, 2007

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LOL!
-Posted on May 29, 2007

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personally I'd kind of like to see you kill a puppy...just to see if you'd do it.
-Posted on May 28, 2007

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XD I wonder if he's the one that bought the General Lee?
-Posted on May 28, 2007

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oh geesh. as if i didn't see enough rednecks daily....
-Posted on May 28, 2007

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Would Big Bubba Fett be a homosexual prison inmate?
-Posted on May 28, 2007

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Save a puppy . . . vote! Bubba Fett. I laughed, I cried, and I wondered why this isn't being turned into a tee-shirt.
-Posted on May 28, 2007

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LOL, nice!
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Oh man, that's what we need - Redneck Star Wars!
LOL!
-Posted on May 28, 2007

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nice.
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Sweet LORD, That's Funny!!
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-Posted on May 28, 2007

[Mc. Lovin']

Okay, you have already told us other people like it. Unfortunately, there are other factors than peer pressure effecting weather I enjoy a comic. I generally think that (ironically) your jokes are too ... obvious, I guess. And vulgar. And the other complaints addressed in the thread.

[BRC]

The point is, your trying to sell to the wrong crowd.

Most of the people on this forum were brought here because they look Oots and/or Erfworld. Both of which are very wordy, plot-driven comics. Let's call them the webcomic equivilent of a novel. Morning Squirtz is a series of one-panel independant gags. To continue the metaphore, Morning Squirtz is more like a Joke Book. Though it's possible to enjoy both the novel and the Joke book, they appeal on very different levels, so don't be surprised when the majority of people here don't like your comic, it simply applies to a different demographic.

[slimredninja]

Actually I'm hearing more and more people on this forum saying they like our comics. I believe we are winning many converts.
OOTS is hilarious and doesn't just appeal to people who feel they are some how smarter then the masses. We have a college professor who regularly posts comments on our comics and he loves us.{Scrubbed}

[RationalGoblin]

Actually I'm hearing more and more people on this forum saying they like our comics. I believe we are winning many converts.
OOTS is hilarious and doesn't just appeal to people who feel they are some how smarter then the masses. We have a college professor who regularly posts comments on our comics and he loves us. {Scrubbed}

No, no, no. What people are saying is that they like some of your comics, and if you cut down the grossness and cleaned up the format of your comics, they'd like it a lot. That is not the same as liking it as is. As a side note, I thought these new ones you posted here are reasonably funny. I really liked the "Gang Signs" Good work. I think that if you cut down on the grossness, and increase the bizarreness, then I might start reading your comic more.

But anyways, that college professor you mentioned is probably a fluke. You may have gained one or two followers from your thread here, but like others have said, for the most part, Morning Squirtz would most likely not do as well here. Perhaps you could advertise on the Ctrl-Alt-Delete Forums instead? They seem like they'd like that style of humor better then we would.

As a side note, how do you know the "college professor" isn't lying?

[slimredninja]

Reading his posts he is not lying about liking us. As to whether he is a real professor or not I cant quantify that.
As to liking some of our comics, that is liking us. We never expected people to love every Morning Squirtz.
Even you and Apelord seem to be softening on us and today a 100 people from this site will visit ours and more then you might think will be LOLing it up.

[The Linker]

Now, someone in an older thread mentioned that those comics being hotlinked means that every time we load them up in this thread, it counts as a hit. Can someone with more experience in the interwebz confirm this for me?

Cause that could be a LOT of faux-hits. :smalleek:

(Also, is there a way to check how many times a thread on Giantitp has been read? I can't find a way...)

[T-O-E]

Now, someone in an older thread mentioned that those comics being hotlinked means that every time we load them up in this thread, it counts as a hit. Can someone with more experience in the interwebz confirm this for me?

Cause that could be a LOT of faux-hits. :smalleek:

(Also, is there a way to check how many times a thread on Giantitp has been read? I can't find a way...)



This thread has been viewed 1332 times.

[slimredninja]

No linker the hits from here are from people who actually take the time to check out our comic from the first page link. The pictures are actually linked from photobucket and have no connection to our site at all.

[The Linker]

This thread has been viewed 1332 times.

Holy crap dat's a lot.

Edit: I just found where to find the 'times read.' It's gone up to 1383 since 7:48 pm, apparently.

I didn't think the Giantitp forums had so many members! :smalltongue:

[slimredninja]

We are on pace to have 150-200 people from this site visit ours just today. Maybe we could do a OOTS and Morning Squirtz crossover. Even better it could be like secret wars and cross through a bunch of web comics.

[Lissou]

Holy crap dat's a lot.

Edit: I just found where to find the 'times read.' It's gone up to 1383 since 7:48 pm, apparently.

I didn't think the Giantitp forums had so many members! :smalltongue:

I'm pretty sure that if you read the thread twice, it counts as two reads. A third of these alone are probably checking back on his thread or something.

Also, I understand the jokes. M problem is, I keep thinking I didn't understand them because I'm thinking "there IS more to it, right?" because what I understand isn't funny. But when I ask around or read the comments yes, it seems what I understood right away was the whole joke. To me it's either the build up demanding a punchline, or the punchline without a build-up.

Good for you if you have lots of readers. You got lots of readers from here, too! Obviously, you don't need to keep posting new threads then.

[The Linker]

We are on pace to have 150-200 people from this site visit ours just today. Maybe we could do a OOTS and Morning Squirtz crossover. Even better it could be like secret wars and cross through a bunch of web comics.

Don't get too full of yourself, now. I mean, no offense, but OotS is pretty huge. If you think you get a lot of comments, check out the discussion threads that come up every time Rich posts a new comic... :smalltongue:

[slimredninja]

Please I know I'm not in his league I own five of his books I'm sure he owns zero of mine.

[The Linker]

Huh. I only own 2, the ones with just new content. Someday I'll get the others... I likes me some commentary.

[slimredninja]

Its cool to read them all on here for free but its great to loan them out and get new people hooked!

[Fawkes]

No linker the hits from here are from people who actually take the time to check out our comic from the first page link. The pictures are actually linked from photobucket and have no connection to our site at all.

And how many of those people looked more than three comics before closing the window in disgust?

Dude, your comic is just a string of visualizations of old puns. It's not exceedingly clever or entertaining. I can see how some people would enjoy it, but most of us don't.

[Roland St. Jude]

Sheriff of Moddingham: If you don't like what a poster says - or a comic he's promoting - feel free to express your opinion on that. But please do not insult, attack, or belittle another poster personally. That includes a wide range of insults, including passive-aggressive insults. Please report offending posts rather than returning fire.

[Fawkes]

Should I edit my post? I guess if it was overly offensive, you would've scrubbed it.

[slimredninja]

Here is an interesting stat for you Mecha my average viewer reads 3 toons and leaves the average visitor from this site reads 14.7 toons with out question OOTS fans are reading more morning Squirtz then any of our other viewers. This number is derived using our unique viewer stats and over all page views and figuring in the surges to both from this site.

[Fawkes]

All right, that's interesting. Perhaps they want to give you a better chance. Or perhaps, like me, they wanted to see just how deep this rabbit hole goes.

It was pretty deep.

In this metaphor, deep is bad.

[The Linker]

Heh. That's pretty much what I was thinking, though less pessimistic. :smalltongue: The average reader is just somebody who randomly happened upon it, and if it doesn't hold their interest, they leave. Meanwhile, here at Giantitp, we're specifically being asked to form an opinion, so we have to read quite a few.

[slimredninja]

Actually thats not true the average viewers are the ones who tune in a few times a week to see the 2 or 3 new ones because they have already seen the old ones.

[The Linker]

Ah... well, I guess that's true too. I think both are true, really. *shrug*

[Fawkes]

Actually thats not true the average viewers are the ones who tune in a few times a week to see the 2 or 3 new ones because they have already seen the old ones.

Can you back up that claim?

[slimredninja]

Of course but its not an exact figure just an educated guesstimate based off our numbers from project wonderful and our stats from drunk duck and our normal numbers.

[Tom_Violence]

Here is an interesting stat for you Mecha my average viewer reads 3 toons and leaves the average visitor from this site reads 14.7 toons with out question OOTS fans are reading more morning Squirtz then any of our other viewers. This number is derived using our unique viewer stats and over all page views and figuring in the surges to both from this site.

Sounds like the only thing that you can conclude from that is that OOTS fans aren't your regular readers. Which isn't at all surprising if they're following the links from here rather than from their own bookmarks.

I myself probably flicked through a dozen or so comics without even so much as a smile before giving up. That you've kicked up as much of a fuss as you have means you're gonna get a certain amount of hits regardless of quality. But if you're judging a comic's success solely by the amount of traffic that it generates then I guess its all good. :smallamused:

[slimredninja]

I have a great time working with the many extremely talented artists who draw the comic. I love making my friends & girlfriend laugh with these comics. Most of all I love making new friends. My favorite is when they tell me how much they love us & more importantly how we made them laugh.
I know you wont believe this but I think we have many future fans right here. I'm looking forward to gaining new viewers from here because I think I can make them laugh. True not every person will be a fan and thats ok. I will be happy with one and honestly that will be more important then 10,000 page views ( I put the value at around 11,436 or so ).

[Mc. Lovin']

Reading his posts he is not lying about liking us. As to whether he is a real professor or not I cant quantify that.
As to liking some of our comics, that is liking us. We never expected people to love every Morning Squirtz.
Even you and Apelord seem to be softening on us and today a 100 people from this site will visit ours and more then you might think will be LOLing it up.

I don't think that people clicking the link in your original post men you like it. Rickroll on youtube has over a million veiwers, but it doesn't mean that it's their favourite song.

[Greep]

heh, this thread has degenerated into "U suck" "No U!"

I wonder who's gonna get tired first :smallsmile:

[The Linker]

I dunno... I mean, I love making new friends and getting new readers, but if one has tens of thousands of readers already, wouldn't it be hard to notice 2 or 3 more? Or even, like, 20 more? :smalltongue:

Now, someone like ME getting 2 or 3 more readers, well, that would double my readership. That'd be nice. :smalltongue:

[pickleninja]

I feel kinda bad for this guy. Most web comickers want nothing more than people to take notice in their work and I know it can be hard to resist spamming.

I remember a long while back i posted a couple of my comics on here, and it took over a week before anyone responded.

I don't know if he got any feedback on the first post he made, but it's kind of unnerving to post up work and have no one comment. It makes you wonder if they think it's good, or bad...and leaves you wanting to know what you can do to actually get some type of response.

As for the comic...

My initial thought to the comic was that the artwork in many of them seems rushed. It's like the artist thought of something, and started drawing...then got in a hurry to tell the joke so they cut corners and threw it out.

If the artist is still reading at this point in the thread, I'd suggest taking more time with your comics, and have someone review them before you post. Ask them what they think would make the comic funnier...or to point out any mistakes they see (mistakes draw way more attention away from your point then you think).

I have a couple friends and my wife review mine before I even begin editing on the computer (just make sure they're willing to tell you the truth and not blow smoke up your skirt).

Good luck to you.


-Pickle

[slimredninja]

Actually the way we got tens of thousands of readers is holding my own in forums and allowing new readers to discover the comic. Instead of giving up on a forum after a couple of people tell me I'm wasting my time.
Yesterday I received a 180 unique viewers from this site so thats a lot more then 10 or 20. As for the art occasionally that is true but for the most part the art is amazing. We have top artists from all of the world working on our comic. Including very famous RPG industry and comic artists.
Our creative staff has been read by 10's of millions if not 100's of millions of readers just not on this project. This may sound like our greatest boast but I will prove it if you want. Just ask nicely.

[Fawkes]

We have top artists from all of the world working on our comic. Including very famous RPG industry and comic artists.

Name some.


Our creative staff has been read by 10's of millions if not 100's of millions of readers just not on this project. This may sound like our greatest boast but I will prove it if you want. Just ask nicely.

{Scrubbed}

[pickleninja]

Actually the way we got tens of thousands of readers is holding my own in forums and allowing new readers to discover the comic. Instead of giving up on a forum after a couple of people tell me I'm wasting my time.
Yesterday I received a 180 unique viewers from this site so thats a lot more then 10 or 20. As for the art occasionally that is true but for the most part the art is amazing. We have top artists from all of the world working on our comic. Including very famous RPG industry and comic artists.
Our creative staff has been read by 10's of millions if not 100's of millions of readers just not on this project. This may sound like our greatest boast but I will prove it if you want. Just ask nicely.

What project, and if your the freak'n wal*mart of webcomics then why are you hosting on drunkduck.com? wouldn't it be better to host your comics on your own site?

Just curious.

[Fawkes]

What project, and if your the freak'n wal*mart of webcomics then why are you hosting on drunkduck.com? wouldn't it be better to host your comics on your own site?

Just curious.

Because he's lying. Or severely misinformed.

[pickleninja]

I like your avatar Mechafox...because he has a monocle :smallsmile:

[slimredninja]

Ok here is how it breaks down for you Brandon Clark has done interior art & cover art for over 30 different Palladium books. Paladium produces lots of popular RPGs including Rifts and he has done stuff for most of them. He has also done art for Hero systems and did the art for the dragon storm card game. I know this just scratches the surface of his resume but it's good for now.
William Messner Loebs another of our artist is so famous Vertigo is going to do a comic about his life. Long runs on dozens of Marvel & Dc books and the creator of the Maxx one of Images first million selling comics not to mention numerous independent comics (wikipedia him if you want them all).
Kelley Ferguson another frequent contributor is published everyday in a newspaper in Minnesota. If you want to see his stuff and find the papers name do a search for basketcase his comic he has the details on his site.
Corey Dye has been published in lots of small papers in his home town of Tokyo I'm not sure of his details but he does do the multi award winning comic Rawfish.
Other great artists contribute as well who have their own web comics
Dawn Griffen ( Zorphbert & fred)
Catherine Alvheim ( Cute N Spicey & Jack)
We have Randy Zimmerman long time Greenarrow & green lantern artist and artist for Deadworld and founder of Arrow comics is coming up soon.
As for why we are on drunk duck its because artists and writers seldom become rich you do it because you love it. When this project generates enough funds we will give Morning Squirtz a proper site but even then we will keep drunk duck as a mirror site. A lot of popular web comics maintain a presence there as well as their own site.

Mecha Fox please don't insult me here is your proof.

[Surfing HalfOrc]

Okay, I looked at the comic, and the best I can give is a "Meh." :smallsigh:

Not that funny, sometime decent art. I'd say that if everyone who doesn't care for this strip were to stop posting how much they don't like it, it will fall off the front page in about two weeks, and join hundreds of mediocre comics that have come and gone.

My (only) 2cp worth...

[slimredninja]

Cool stuff half orc I hope we can change your Meh to a Heh in the near future. Plus I don't think its that they don't like us they just don't like us yet. Were kind of like the Howard Stern of Web comics people hate us at first but then they start to realize that we have desensitized them to other forms of humor. Then they become fans because we are the only source of humor that gives them the rush they crave ( Keep in mind this is a theory & hasn't been proven yet ). Also your comments are worth 2 ep at least (electrum for you non-old schoolers).

[ninja_penguin]

Were kind of like the Howard Stern of Web comics

Which is why a lot of people here aren't going to be permanent readers. Sure, gang signs would be funny and get a chuckle from me if my first exposure to your comic hadn't been spiderman shooting webs from his butt. By the time anybody exposes themselves to something that's generally funny and not crudely funny, the humor part of their brain has already been turned off by a bunch of comics that make them shrug instead.

And seriously, people will visit it if they want to, continually insisting that more and more people are reading isn't going to inspire some sort of pack mentality. Likewise, dropping gamer terms doesn't endear you to anybody. Gamers are not some sort of mass collective that all like the same thing.

[Whoracle]

Oh people, c'mon, let it die. This thread will drop from the front page soon enough on it's own. If he gets readers that seriously like his comic from here, fine, good for him.
But if you all continue to show how much you dislike his comic, he'll get lots and lots of hits from people who want to look for themselves to see what has all your knickers in a twist, and he will just think his comic is popular.

That said, my 2 cents on the comic:
1. The Artwork is OK.
2. I don't find it all that gross, but this is coming from someone who watches splatter/gore movies while eating lunch, so that probably don't count.
3. I find the jokes to range from mindboggingly bad to something approaching "meh" from below.

And one last word of advice to the OP:
I don't care (and I believe neither do a lot of people here or elsewhere) if you artists were the offspring of Leonardo DaVinci... If something is crap (which is not to say that your comic is, it just doesn't fit my taste, mind you!), then it doesn't matter who crapped the load. So my counsel would be to drop the "But we have XXX artist and yyy theme aboard. You HAVE to like it!".

[slimredninja]

I love that spiderman comic and so do lots of others. I'm sure we will get a few fans from here or believe me I wouldn't waste my time. Plus lots of people love crude humor I'm sure I don't need to list the amazingly popular animated series and comics that rely on crude humor.
As for your disparaging remark about my gaming reference I don't know what you have against electrum.
As for me naming our great artists and their resumes I was asked to, nay challenged to.

[Whoracle]

As for me naming our great artists and their resumes I was asked to, nay challenged to.

Not exactly. You were throwing around boasts of you having all those great people aboard in defense of your comic.
You were, however, challenged to name those people and thus prove your boasts.

[slimredninja]

Darn whoracle I really hoped you would like us Germany is one of our top 3 countries for visitors and we have lots of fans from there. Plus you love heavy metal as do we! You didn't even like our slayer toon? Keep checking back maybe you will like our upcoming zombie christmas Morning Squirtz since you like gore films.
Also I do believe the initial boasts were in response to an attack of some kind. I really do lose track sometimes I think I'm getting a little punch drunk from all the shots I've taken.

[Jibar]

Darn whoracle I really hoped you would like us Germany is one of our top 3 countries for visitors and we have lots of fans from there.

People don't really sort into those general categories ya know. Sure, different countries, different senses of humours, but it's not as simple as that. Just because an American is American doesn't mean he should automatically appreciate Chris Rock, just as every Britishman doesn't like Al Murray.


Plus lots of people love crude humor I'm sure I don't need to list the amazingly popular animated series

Which are broadcasted and generally more well known than the tiny niche that is the webcomic in the wide world of media...

And also, I must know to satisfy my curiosity, but why are you doing this, here? Why search so hard for a few fans on one forum? Is this your job, do these few fans have some real impact upon your life? If it's a hobby then these few people shouldn't matter, only as long as you're happy with your work and having fun.
I've seen so many webcomics that are nothing more than people enjoying themselves, making the most of their creative freedoms, and they come across so much better than those started purely to be a success, to fill a niche and be marketable.
I genuinely find your continuation in the face of heavy negativity bizarre and intriguing. Like watching a cow slowly topple over as to the end it is sure it will roll back over simply as can be.

And then a katamari hits it.

[slimredninja]

Jibar have you looked at a substantial number of the comics? Because background wise we seem very similar except Donnie Darko would be my number 5 favorite and Nightmare before christmas would be my 1. Also I give Gaiman the nudge over Moore but its close. We seem to have similar outlooks and likes.
I thought Ode to Banksy was amazing and most of your writing was top notch and had a random rebellious feel to it. I'm not sure I have ever heard of Al Murray.
As to why I do it, I guess because its fun. I don't mind a little ribbing from those who don't like it or if others don't always get the jokes. I'm convinced we will find a few fans here. Until then I'm enjoying popping through and responding to the comments.

[Phase]

Background wise we seem very similar except Donnie Darko would be my number 5 favorite and Nightmare before christmas would be my 1. Also I give Gaiman the nudge over Moore but its close. We seem to have similar outlooks and likes.
I thought Ode to Banksy was amazing and most of your writing was top notch and had a random rebellious feel to it. I'm not sure I have ever heard of Al Murray.

This? Non-sequitor. I suppose I should leave this thread, though...

[Killersquid]

Why do you treat your webcomic like a business, throwing figures around about % of viewers in countries blah blah blah. You shouldn't be throwing them around if you want this comic to be good, you should be making it good because you like working on webcomic.

[slimredninja]

whoops sorry I was commenting on some things I found in Jibars link on his signature. Actually I need to learn to put a link in my signature. Good to have you stop back through here phase.
I love this comic and I already believe its good squid.

[Fawkes]

Cool stuff half orc I hope we can change your Meh to a Heh in the near future. Plus I don't think its that they don't like us they just don't like us yet. Were kind of like the Howard Stern of Web comics people hate us at first but then they start to realize that we have desensitized them to other forms of humor. Then they become fans because we are the only source of humor that gives them the rush they crave ( Keep in mind this is a theory & hasn't been proven yet ). Also your comments are worth 2 ep at least (electrum for you non-old schoolers).

What, you're trying to brainwash us into liking your comic? We're not going to change our minds. Your comic isn't good. If anything, it's exceptionally mediocre.

And you've thrown about a bunch of names. What exactly have they contributed to the comic?

[busterswd]

To the people saying "if you don't post, it will fall off the front page."

We've tried that. It doesn't work, because if no one responds to his thread, he bumps it himself. If his thread gets closed, he makes a new one, or he posts in other threads to try to get people to visit it. Or he does painfully obvious things like make a "top 5" comics list and puts his comic first. One of the biggest turn offs of this comic to me isn't the content of the comic, but that the OP is pretty much forcing this down our throats.
{scrubbed}

[Greep]

well, I doubt he'd bump it over and over by himself if we don't post. That's probably against forum rules right?

[slimredninja]

That is not true IF I was a spammer I would wait until the thread dropped then I would repost I answer immediately and I don't just leave some quick bump post. I legitimately answer or try to answer each question. I can't help that you don't seem to like me busterswd but I'm enjoying being active on this thread and I can't help that others wont stop posting here and to be honest I hope they don't I enjoy talking to so many people. That being said if any admin wants me to stop replying I will.

[busterswd]

That is not true IF I was a spammer I would wait until the thread dropped then I would repost I answer immediately and I don't just leave some quick bump post. I legitimately answer or try to answer each question. I can't help that you don't seem to like me busterswd but I'm enjoying being active on this thread and I can't help that others wont stop posting here and to be honest I hope they don't I enjoy talking to so many people. That being said if any admin wants me to stop replying I will.

But you've done exactly that before, in your top 5 webcomic thread and in your earlier 3 train wrecks. Anyone who visits the Webcomics forums on a somewhat regular basis knows your behavior.

In addition, there's something just wrong about your response to people. When people say they dislike your comic after reading through several strips, you just churn out more of the same, bump your thread again, and say "you'll like it eventually." It's a disrespectful attitude to have towards people if you're genuinely interested in getting a growing readership. Most of the PG comics you've posted are the few more tasteful ones from earlier on, NOT in response to people saying "your comic is gross and I dislike it." At risk of giving you yet another hit, I clicked your comic again and went a few days back. You had someone taking a crap at a party and a monkey having sex with a monitor. Exact same stuff as earlier.

In other words, I've been getting the impression you have no interest in input here, let alone any desire to respond to it in your actual comic. Your primary concern isn't discussion, it's to get more clicks.

I'll give you that you're at least making an effort to be more presentable in this thread. You're actually typing coherently at some people's request and it makes you seem like less of a spammer.

[The Linker]

I'm starting to see some sort of pattern. He mentioned he was doing it for the challenge. It's just like any other challenge. Some people climb big mountains, and he comes on forums that are far, far outside his niche audience and tries to pick up fans. And instead of spiked boots and climbing gear, he uses statistics and user comments to make it work. Why do something with no tangible reward? Because it's THERE! It seems pointless and kind of dangerous to others, but it's something to do. He doesn't care that there are smaller and easier to climb mountains with more fans on them--

I think I forgot where I was going with this.

Anyway, your spiked boots and climbing gear -- I mean, statistics and user comments are really not relevant once we've read the comic for ourselves, so you're definitely not going to convince us that way. If someone says they do not like Spider-Man shooting webs out of his butt, or that they think it stinks, saying that you and other people like it has never made anyone go "Oh, I see now. Yeah, it IS funny!" They may acknowledge that others do like it, but they're not going to change their minds and suddenly like the comic. We are not sheeple, you see. We judge the quality on our own. :smallsmile:

[Fawkes]

I legitimately answer or try to answer each question.

Then allow to repeat myself. You've thrown about a bunch of names. What exactly have they contributed to the comic?

[colonelslime]

Just to throw my two cents into this.

A lot of your comics rely on trite, inane, overly-gross visual puns. I must admit that a few made me laugh. "Wasted Time" got a chuckle out of me. I genuinely laughed at "Dali Llama". So is was entertained by a few of your comics.

What did not entertain mewas the continuous scatalogical references, unfunny sexual referrences, and poorly traced cartoon characters. The Monkey giving the computer AIDS? It was in such poor taste that I could not bear to read further.

Even ones that don't really require it are grossed up. "Magic Mushrooms" (http://www.drunkduck.com/Morning_Squirtz/index.php?p=490805) didn't require the blood. Tone down the low-brow humour, and maybe you would win more fans.

[slimredninja]

I assure you the guys who do the art for squirtz don't need to trace and I do love the challenge. What I really don't understand Mecha is why you feel you must spend so much time railing against the comic. You have said in multiple posts that you dislike the comic. So why keep posting on this thread? Is it just to harass me? I think it is awesome that colonelslime liked a few that is all I ask is that people try them. There are so many different comics on such a wide variety of things you never know what someone will or wont like. We don't mind critiques and lively debate but don't just belabor your old points please come up with some fresh critiques or topics. colonel & linker thanks for your comments.

[Fawkes]

That doesn't answer my question. I would like to know what the extent of William Messner Loebs, Kelley Ferguson, Catherine Alvheim, Randy Zimmerman's contributions to your comics were. How are they connected? As far as I can tell, Morning Squirtz appears to be made by just two people, an author, Mehlhorn (presumably you), and an artist, Brandon Clark. I've found comics made by two of the others you mentioned, but I can't find any mention of the others. If all they've done is the occasional guest comic, I think it's a bit misleading to call them part of your "creative staff."

[Jamethiel]

I really respect loebs as an artist and so was disappointed that the 'perpetrators' of this comic were claiming any association with him. So - google.

A google of 'morning squirtz' and 'william messner loebs' seems to bring up only, surprise, more forums where slimredninja is talking about their association.

This name dropping business doesn't work so well when there is no real relationship, does it?:smallcool:

[slimredninja]

Jamethiel if you look through our archives you will see 2 of Bills comic they are called our little miracle and war of words. Actually I am very friendly with Mr' Loebs he is a great mentor and we had a table together at xcape con here in Michigan where we were both guests but our relationship has spanned the last three years. We both belong to Dark Elf designs a local comic company. He actually wanted to do the Tinkerbell one to but I had already promised it to Corey Dye. I'm sure he would do more Morning Squirtz if I asked him.
Brandon Clark is the artist on about 80% of all Morning Squirtz. Randy Zimmerman is waiting for me to send him a list of toons to choose from.
As far as name dropping, Bills name didn't come up until late in the thread when I had to prove I wasn't lying about the quality of our artists and the number of people who have seen their art.
I must say I love the tactic of asking me specifics and then when I answer them accusing me of name dropping.I think I have been very forthright with all of you and will continue to answer any questions you might have.

[The Linker]

I must say I love the tactic of asking me specifics and then when I answer them accusing me of name dropping.I think I have been very forthright with all of you and will continue to answer any questions you might have.

Well, really, Mechafox has asked his question three times without a complete answer -- you've only answered Jamethiel's concern which happens to cover a similar topic. It's hard not to see it as some sort of name-dropping tactic when you say "Famous person #1 and Famous Person #2 work on the comic," and then someone asks "Oh, really? What do they do?" THREE TIMES while you go off and sort of whistle innocently. "Can't hear you, can't hear you..." Even if that's not what you're meaning to do, it sure gives that impression.

Personally, the individual artists don't make a difference for me, at least. I mean, I don't care much about who drew the guy pooping into a hat, it's the fact that there's a guy pooping into a hat. :smalleek: The subject matter of the art along with the writing is what turns me off.

[pickleninja]

here's an idea slim.

1. Make yourself a banner or a link, and if people are interested in your comic, they'll click the link.
--Once link/banner is created add value to the site by creating topics people actually want to read about (not advertisements about your comic), and reply to other topics that are not directly about you.

2. Advertise to a target audience...this place isn't it. Nothing about OotS or Erfworld says "I want to see a guy pooping in a hat" or "a monkey giving a computer aids". Hence the fact that both comics hosted on giantitp.com are not in tune with your comics sense of humor, it's irrational to think anyone reading your comic is going to all of a sudden fall in love with it.
--My guess would be for you to go to 4chan or ytmnd.com those places have people more in tune with your style of humor.


-Pickle

[The Linker]

...and reply to other topics that are not directly about you.

This is a good idea; just note that you do not MAKE the topic about you. :smalltongue:

[slimredninja]

Lol I think maybe you haven't read the posts I have answered all questions I told him which comics Loebs has done. I really prefer not to do a full bibliography of who did which exact toon. All that info can be found by checking out the comics and reading the info on those pages.
As for checking other threads here and commenting on them I work 2 full time jobs ( Fortunately one allows me to check the computer all day) I barely have time to keep up the fast paced discussions on this thread.
As for other sites being better I have received more traffic from this site then most any other site we have ever linked to there is a ton of interest even if it is of the macabre type. Nearly 200 people yesterday took the time to go to the front page and follow the link to our site. I don't see 200 negative responses by the law of averages some people enjoyed the comic.
Not to mention this thread is not even a week old and if it keeps to its current pace it will eclipse EVERY other thread under the web comic heading in both views and replys I would say there is more then a bit of interest.

[pickleninja]

Lol I think maybe you haven't read the posts I have answered all questions I told him which comics Loebs has done. I really prefer not to do a full bibliography of who did which exact toon. All that info can be found by checking out the comics and reading the info on those pages.
As for checking other threads here and commenting on them I work 2 full time jobs ( Fortunately one allows me to check the computer all day) I barely have time to keep up the fast paced discussions on this thread.
As for other sites being better I have received more traffic from this site then most any other site we have ever linked to there is a ton of interest even if it is of the macabre type. Nearly 200 people yesterday took the time to go to the front page and follow the link to our site. I don't see 200 negative responses by the law of averages some people enjoyed the comic.
Not to mention this thread is not even a week old and if it keeps to its current pace it will eclipse EVERY other thread under the web comic heading in both views and replys I would say there is more then a bit of interest.

Ok... obviously everything that anyone says about your comic just doesn't seem to sink in.

What you basically told me is you have enough time to run your own comic, and respond to every single comment made about it in this thread with walls-o-text magnitude, yet you don't have enough time to read what other people have to say about their comics.

That's basically what I got out of that.

I can honestly tell you that if you don't have the "time" to post anything other than stuff about yourself than I don't have the "time" for morning squirtz.

Don't bother responding to this message as i'm not responding to any more of yours...infact I'm not even going to read this again. So anything you say falls on deaf ears.

I suggest others to do the same...as he doesn't have time to listen to anything you have to say.

-Pickle

[Fawkes]

Guest artist =/= creative staff. Unless you pay Messner-Loebs a salary, or he receives a share of your ad revenue, he is not part of your creative staff.

[Occasional Sage]

That you've kicked up as much of a fuss as you have means you're gonna get a certain amount of hits regardless of quality. But if you're judging a comic's success solely by the amount of traffic that it generates then I guess its all good. :smallamused:


Ad revenue based on views, perhaps?

[The Linker]

Ad revenue based on views, perhaps?


Oh, hell. If that's true... :smallannoyed:

[Nerd-o-rama]

Not to mention this thread is not even a week old and if it keeps to its current pace it will eclipse EVERY other thread under the web comic heading in both views and replys I would say there is more then a bit of interest.HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=98206).

Bear in mind, that's the seventh or eighth thread about that one comic. And unlike this one, every other reply is not from the author trying to whore for attention.


Oh, hell. If that's true... :smallannoyed:Yeah, that's generally how internet advertising works. Much like network TV advertising, really, only it's based on all views instead of a poll of particular households.

[Occasional Sage]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=98206).

Bear in mind, that's the seventh or eighth thread about that one comic. And unlike this one, every other reply is not from the author trying to whore for attention.


Also note that Winterwind's list of regular contributors includes three people who defend DD, and get equal attention from him. GitP doesn't... what was the suggestion, ostracize? people with minority opinions.

[Mc. Lovin']

I really respect loebs as an artist and so was disappointed that the 'perpetrators' of this comic were claiming any association with him. So - google.

A google of 'morning squirtz' and 'william messner loebs' seems to bring up only, surprise, more forums where slimredninja is talking about their association.

This name dropping business doesn't work so well when there is no real relationship, does it?:smallcool:

Oh thank you for googleing it idea.

This thread was one of the top things that came up, which I find hard to beleive, if it is indeed such a popular comic.

Also, he's tried to pull one on the XKCD forums. Same sock puppet (or whatever you lot called it) account thing:

{Warning: They permit images there we don't allow here. ~Sheriff}:
http://forums.xkcd.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=29581 {Warning: They permit images there we don't allow here. ~Sheriff}

[The Linker]

Huh, they managed to not post on his thread at all. Man, too bad we don't have that kind of self-control. Lucky bastards. :smalltongue:

[slimredninja]

Originally Posted by Mechafox Guest artist =/= creative staff. Unless you pay Messner-Loebs a salary, or he receives a share of your ad revenue, he is not part of your creative staff.

If that was the case myself and Brandon would'nt be part of the creative staff either since we haven't recieved a payment yet for Morning Squirtz. That will change soon and of the four toons Hustler Humor is buying one is by an artist other then Brandon and that artist will recive an equal share for that toon. If someone wanted to buy one of Loebs comics we would pay him as well.
Actually thats not true I took the time to read all of Jibars stuff and it was great. I also check signatures so if you link to something I probablly have seen it. I also watch the OOTS thread and have just started reading through Erfworld and have really liked it so far. The art is amazing and reminds me of Mobius. As to whoring the comic I wouldn't call responding to thread posts whoring the comic.
As for ad revenue we have made $5.00 on Project Wonderful in 2 months which we have rolled back into ads on other web comics. I want people to view the comic because no matter what the naysayers say I believe anyone who reads them all will find some they like. I still contend that if you say you hated them all you didn't read them all.

If you want see a good forum check out Noxopia where we have recieved only positive comments. Go to user art and check our thread.
http://www.nexopia.com/

[Nerd-o-rama]

I, for one, didn't read them all because the ones I did read disgusted me. That's your problem. Even in a plotless gag comic, if most of your comics suck, you're not going to convince people to become return readers, even if there are a few decent jokes buried in there somewhere.

If 10% of a comic is good and 90% of it is disgusting and unfunny, why would people continue reading it when there are 100% (okay, 95%, everyone has off days) funny comics out there? Even if you attract new attention through this kind of advertising, it doesn't mean jack if people don't like it enough to become regular readers.

Hell, this isn't even creatively bad like Dominic Deegan, whose author keeps finding new and entertaining ways to fail.

[slimredninja]

Ah yes thats your farvoite lament a few were gross so I couldn't read them all. Like I said read them all soldier through and then say you didn't like them I think you may even like 25% or more. Take the challenge and respond truthfully.

[The Linker]

I think we all DID find some we like, as when you posted the Gang Signs one. You seem to have missed the part where that was NOT THE POINT. Good, congrats, you've made some comic strips that made us laugh. Am I going to start reading through the archives or checking every day for some other rare comic that makes me laugh, when half of them honestly make me navigate away from the site in disgust?

No. I'm going to go read through the Goblins! archive, or play WoW, or something else that gives me more than a 25% chance of enjoyment (and a less than 50% chance of making my day worse). It's simple math. And let me tell you, even when one does make me laugh... well, a Morning Squirtz laugh isn't exactly on par with an OotS laugh. So it's still not really worth it.

[Trazoi]

Nearly 200 people yesterday took the time to go to the front page and follow the link to our site. I don't see 200 negative responses by the law of averages some people enjoyed the comic.
You're going to need a better metric to determine how many fans you're getting from your advertising. You can't assume that people who are disinterested or repelled from your comic are going to bother replying in threads like this. A far better measure would be how many people sign up for a RSS feed, as those are people who enjoyed your comic enough to want to regularly view it. I'd say most people who viewed your comic from here shut down the tab in their browser and just never came back (that's common for everything on the internet, not just your webcomic! Click-throughs are rare.)

As for your comic, my honest opinion is that I find it too disgusting to read. The best examples I've seen are merely dull, but since at least every second comic seems to go far overboard on the gross out humour I don't have any desire to trawl far in your archives. Personally I like webcomics with clever word play, which your comic doesn't have, and I find the more extreme comics you do to be more repulsive than amusing.

You'll have to accept that you've got a niche comic and it will not appeal to the majority. This is especially true here at the OotS forums, as your comic is the polar opposite. OotS is has a cartoony abstract style, page long and heavy in dialog and word play, with a PG at worst rating. Yours has a highly graphic style, single panel, depends on gross out humour and probably would be refused classification in my country :smallwink:. So don't be surprised if you don't get many signed up fans from a site like this.

[Fawkes]

Ah yes thats your farvoite lament a few were gross so I couldn't read them all. Like I said read them all soldier through and then say you didn't like them I think you may even like 25% or more. Take the challenge and respond truthfully.

I think I can speak for everyone here:

No.

Your comic isn't good. We don't like it. We're never going to like it. Please stop telling us that we're going to like it. I've read about half of your comics, and not one elicited as much as a smile from me. Reading more of it isn't going to suddenly change my mind.

If someone has to "soldier through" to read your comics, it's not worth it. Why should I "take the challenge" to read your bad comic when I can be entertained by good comics elsewhere?

[Nerd-o-rama]

Ah yes thats your farvoite lament a few were gross so I couldn't read them all. Like I said read them all soldier through and then say you didn't like them I think you may even like 25% or more. Take the challenge and respond truthfully.That's not a high enough proportion to make me care, sorry. Not when there are comics where 80% or more of the updates are laugh out loud funny, and the ones that aren't are merely "meh" rather than "what the **** is this ****?"

[Trazoi]

I didn't see this reply when I was making my post, otherwise I would have commented on it.


Ah yes thats your farvoite lament a few were gross so I couldn't read them all. Like I said read them all soldier through and then say you didn't like them I think you may even like 25% or more. Take the challenge and respond truthfully.

No, you can't assume that people have to read your entire archive in order to make an honest opinion on your work. That's not how marketing webcomics to prospective fans work. Yahtzee from Zero Punctuation and the Escapist Magazine has a policy when checking out a new webcomic that he'll only check the latest comic and the first comic, and if neither of those looks promising he'll never come back. I'm a bit more flexible: I'll check the last three or so comics and if it looks vaguely interesting I'll go back to the beginning and read a few there. But very few people will read an entire archive before making a decision for themselves about whether they like a webcomic!

The biggest problem your webcomic has is that many, many people are going to be repulsed by your style. More than half of your webcomics go for over the top gross out humour, and that's an instant fail for my webcomic standards. When reviewing your webcomic from one of your earlier threads in this forum, I kept going until I saw three of them so I could make a valid opinion, but that didn't take very long. I don't like viewing those kinds of comics, so I'm not going to keep clicking on "next comic" if there's a good chance I'll see something I don't want to see. There's plenty of other things to do on the 'net.

[The Linker]

If someone has to "soldier through" to read your comics, it's not worth it. Why should I "take the challenge" to read your bad comic when I can be entertained by good comics elsewhere?

Exactly. I simply cannot understand how you can think that if we 'soldier through' a comic we will find it good. By DEFINITION, 'soldiering through' means 'doing something you wish you weren't, doing something without enjoyment.' I don't want to 'soldier through' it, for crying out loud! I want to do things which are 100% enjoyable, and there are SO MANY out there, and there's no reason that yours comes above ANY others.

[Occasional Sage]

Exactly. I simply cannot understand how you can think that if we 'soldier through' a comic we will find it good. By DEFINITION, 'soldiering through' means 'doing something you wish you weren't, doing something without enjoyment.' I don't want to 'soldier through' it, for crying out loud! I want to do things which are 100% enjoyable, and there are SO MANY out there, and there's no reason that yours comes above ANY others.

Heck as far as return-on-time-investment goes, there are LOTS of things in real life I'd rather do; what time I spend on the internet is going to be time well spent.

Slim, I'm impressed by your dedication, and would be nothing but happy for you if MS takes off the way you expect. It's going to do that without me, and without most of the folks here.

Since you like statistics, here's a way to look at them that is a cross-industry standard among perception-savvy corporations: think of this thread as a customer service telephone poll. Most people, when asked "Do you have ten minutes to give us feedback?" will say no, UNLESS they have a very positive or very negative opinion to share. The positive respondents to this hypothetical poll are the ones that would bookmark your site and become regular readers, and the non-respondents *might* follow a link to your site if they see one because they remember being mildly entertained. That people here are only posting negative responses should make your take-away obvious.

This doesn't make your comic bad; it just makes GitP a bad demographic fit for your product.

[JeffreyToTheMax]

If the only thing you care about is getting site views, then this tactic seems to be serving you well.

If, however, you want to acquire fans and people who will genuinely enjoy your comic, the fact that by far the most positive feedback you have received here is that a small minority of your comics were acceptable should tip you off that this is not the right place to be looking.

You have come here and done everything in your power to attract as much attention as possible, and have used dishonest tactics in the process, for a gain that I'm not sure how you figure is worth the effort. You keep citing numbers of increased traffic as proof that someone here likes your work, even though this clearly means next to nothing in terms of stable readership growth.

I believe that the worst part of it all is how you are acting towards those who say they dislike the comic. I for one would have no problem pointing out what could be improved and doing all I can to help you, if not for the fact that the only thing you seem to want to hear is unadulterated praise.

You tried, but are not achieving the desired result. The only reason I can think of for you to persist is that you only care about raw numbers of views, or that you genuinely believe that we will all start singing your praises if only argued with enough. In either event, there is really not much left to say.

[Roland St. Jude]

...Nothing about OotS or Erfworld says "I want to see a guy pooping in a hat" or "a monkey giving a computer aids"...

That is the most sig-worthy board comment I've seen in months.

[Occasional Sage]

That is the most sig-worthy board comment I've seen in months.

I'll eagerly await seeing it on your posts!

[slimredninja]

Actually the phenomena that is happening here is one we have seen a couple of times. A few people hate on the comic we defend it and the community feels they have to pile on a bit. When the first few comments are positive the thread tends to be positive (see Nexopia link for proof of this phenomena). Nothing wrong with that I envy your spirit of community.
I know we have lots of fans I know we are funny. Maybe a nice chunk of you will read the comments left here check out one or two with a negative veiwpoint alreeady in your mind and then rush back to join in the dogpile. I still believe there are some who will check it out and become instant fans. As for Aussies liking us not only do we get lots of traffic from there but some of our truely die hard fans are from there. They are all beautiful women I truely envy you for living in a land of beauties like that. Someday you will all tell your kids I tried to get that guy to give up and now your wearing their T-shirts.

[RationalGoblin]

Actually the phenomena that is happening here is one we have seen a couple of times. A few people hate on the comic we defend it and the community feels they have to pile on a bit. When the first few comments are positive the thread tends to be positive (see Nexopia link for proof of this phenomena). Nothing wrong with that I envy your spirit of community.
I know we have lots of fans I know we are funny. Maybe a nice chunk of you will read the comments left here check out one or two with a negative veiwpoint alreeady in your mind and then rush back to join in the dogpile. I still believe there are some who will check it out and become instant fans. As for Aussies liking us not only do we get lots of traffic from there but some of our truely die hard fans are from there. They are all beautiful women I truely envy you for living in a land of beauties like that. Someday you will all tell your kids I tried to get that guy to give up and now your wearing their T-shirts.

Hahaha, wait what? For one, are you even listening to our complaints? And two, you think all Aussies are beautiful? Hahaha, wow. I don't even know where to begin.

[Occasional Sage]

Actually the phenomena that is happening here is one we have seen a couple of times. A few people hate on the comic, we defend it, and the community feels they have to pile on a bit. When the first few comments are positive the thread tends to be positive (see Nexopia link for proof of this phenomena). Nothing wrong with that; I envy your spirit of community.


As several people mentioned above, our community here is diverse. The Dominic Deegan thread is an open snarkfest; a few people post there to defend the comic are are well received by the majority. Several fans have stuck around for quite a while. We're not, by any stretch of the imagination, a hive-mind or anything resembling homogeneous. We don't blacklist members or hate people for their opinions.



I know we have lots of fans. I know we are funny. Maybe a nice chunk of you will read the comments left here, check out one or two with a negative viewpoint already in your mind, and then rush back to join in the dogpile. I still believe there are some who will check it out and become instant fans.


I have no response to this.



As for Aussies liking us: not only do we get lots of traffic from there but some of our truly die-hard fans are from there. They are all beautiful women. I truly envy you for living in a land of beauties like that. Someday you will all tell your kids, "I tried to get that guy to give up and now you're wearing his T-shirts."

Huh? Are you responding to something from a different thread? This is a total non sequitur as far as I can see.

[slimredninja]

Surely not all but the hotties who are fans from My Space lead me to think that they surely have an aubundance. Are you trying to imply Aussie women are mostly ugley Goblin?
As for listening to your complaints of course I am and they are quite entertaining although I must say I don't even think you guys believe most the stuff your saying. Your just caught up in the moment and having a good time. I have np with that like I said I'm enjoying the interaction quite thoroughly.
I have made lots of little thumbnail sketches in my mind about each of you. Some I have come to respect and I believe are being honest. Some I believe are jealous that maybe their thread hasn't dont well about their comic. Others just see this as a debate that they want win. A few are just being mean for means sake. I read every post the ones that don't catch my attention or just repeat the same thing over & over I don't comment on. Plus if a commented to them all I would be called a spammer or worse.
Sage please read Trazois comment on the previous page to see the connection.

[Raroy]

Would you mind pointing out these hateful people and how their comments are hateful? I promise we won't bark too loudly.

[Occasional Sage]

Would you mind pointing out these hateful people and how their comments are hateful? I promise we won't bark too loudly.

I think he means Roland. :smallwink:

*removes tongue from cheek*

[Fawkes]

Actually the phenomena that is happening here is one we have seen a couple of times. A few people hate on the comic we defend it and the community feels they have to pile on a bit. When the first few comments are positive the thread tends to be positive (see Nexopia link for proof of this phenomena). Nothing wrong with that I envy your spirit of community.
I know we have lots of fans I know we are funny. Maybe a nice chunk of you will read the comments left here check out one or two with a negative veiwpoint alreeady in your mind and then rush back to join in the dogpile.

As for listening to your complaints of course I am and they are quite entertaining although I must say I don't even think you guys believe most the stuff your saying. Your just caught up in the moment and having a good time. I have np with that like I said I'm enjoying the interaction quite thoroughly.

Please stop belittling our opinions. Plenty of people have told you what they think of your comic. Just because it isn't what you want to hear doesn't mean you can handwave it.

Listen to me. Read this closely.

I don't like your comic. I think it is bad. The jokes are stale, the art is mediocre, and the style is disgusting.

I am not saying this because someone else did first. I am saying it because I am an intelligent human being, capable of forming my own opinions.

[RationalGoblin]

Surely not all but the hotties who are fans from My Space lead me to think that they surely have an aubundance. Are you trying to imply Aussie women are mostly ugley Goblin?
As for listening to your complaints of course I am and they are quite entertaining although I must say I don't even think you guys believe most the stuff your saying. Your just caught up in the moment and having a good time. I have np with that like I said I'm enjoying the interaction quite thoroughly.
I have made lots of little thumbnail sketches in my mind about each of you. Some I have come to respect and I believe are being honest. Some I believe are jealous that maybe their thread hasn't dont well about their comic. Others just see this as a debate that they want win. A few are just being mean for means sake. I read every post the ones that don't catch my attention or just repeat the same thing over & over I don't comment on. Plus if a commented to them all I would be called a spammer or worse.

Okay, I'll dissect this post, and what I meant before.

1. I do not think Aussie women are ugly, I just find it hard to believe, that if you have thousands of fans, and a good portion of them are diehard fans, that all of them are attractive women. Webcomics simply do not normally attract that type of person.

2. You don't think we believe the things we say? No, we do believe, we've made that abundantly clear, in at least one post per poster in this thread excluding you. Now, unless we've been caught up in the moment for about a week, I don't think we're doing this just for fun. We're doing this to tell you that a vast majority of us dislike your comic, and that you won't have much luck in getting fans here.

3. Thumbnail sketches in your head of a lot of us? Okay... that's a little bit creepy.

And as a side note, I don't care if one of your jobs is on the computer, and that you can surf the internet on it. It still seems highly improbable that you'd be on the Internet enough to respond to us if you really had two jobs.

I'll comment on more later.

[slimredninja]

No thanks if I did that I would accussed of a personal attack I'm happy with being a nice guy. To be quite honest I have a tremendous amount of respect for St. Jude for even letting me reopen a thread and I plan to bend over backwards to follow any of his suggestions which include no singling out of haters. I'm sure if you read all the comments you could figure out who I'm refering to on your own without me singling them out.
Lol I love how many times I'm called a liar on this thread. Actually your right goblin that is not exact. Technically I have three cash jobs. Best of all I can prove it to you if I wanted to waste my time showing you yet again that I'm not a liar. I think I have defended myself plenty.
If you count doing web comics I have many other jobs since I do more comics then just Morning Squirtz. Actually I have a contract with Platinum studios for our project Slim red ninja. They sell wall paper based off our comic for cell phones and own are cell phone game rights. Also once Hustler Humor prints our comics and pays us we could technically consider that a job to.

[Fawkes]

(It's me.)

Clearly, since I do not appreciate the genius of Morning Squirtz, I must have some sort of vendetta against its author. It's the only explanation.

[Twin2]

From what I've seen there's just not enough depth to keep me interested. Single panel comics can be amazing (ala farside), but the "here is your joke it is funny ha ha" just doesn't do it for me.

[slimredninja]

Twin2 how many of our comics did you read before you decided you hated them all? Just out of curiousity please answer truthfully I would really like to know.

[Raroy]

I read your webcomic. I read about twenty of them. I don't find them funny. A few are admittedly okay, but that's it.

{Scrubbed}

[Fawkes]

Raroy, we might have to get married.

[Raroy]

Sorry, I'm not interested.:smalltongue:

[Twin2]

I don't hate them, it's just that your genre isn't exactly my "cup of tea" if you will. All I can say is keep on trucking, and perhaps try for a bit more subtlety with your jokes.

[Fangly]

This thread has made me laugh harder than any webcomic I've read in a long time.



But onto the real reason I've emerged from my lurkage:




1. I do not think Aussie women are ugly, I just find it hard to believe, that if you have thousands of fans, and a good portion of them are diehard fans, that all of them are attractive women. Webcomics simply do not normally attract that type of person.

*raises eyebrow*


I take offense to that, as I'm sure the many other female members of this subforum do. Like doompuppy, Mauve Shirt, Vael, and um. Um. Raroy has a female avi. And... yeah. There are others. Probably. Somewhere.



Damn it. This place is a sausage fest.


I'm going to some fantasy comic forum. With pretty elves and forbidden love and three dimensions and stuff. Yeah.





No thanks if I did that I would accussed of a personal attack I'm happy with being a nice guy. To be quite honest I have a tremendous amount of respect for St. Jude for even letting me reopen a thread and I plan to bend over backwards to follow any of his suggestions which include no singling out of haters. I'm sure if you read all the comments you could figure out who I'm refering to on your own without me singling them out.


I try to leave, but then you post a masterpiece like this and I just can't. It's like that "My Immortal" fanfic. I'm a sucker for a trainwreck.


I wish I knew how to quit you.

[Nerd-o-rama]

Twin2 how many of our comics did you read before you decided you hated them all? Just out of curiousity please answer truthfully I would really like to know.A note on this sort of interpretation; even though you're not responding to me specifically, I have a feeling I know where Twin2 is coming from:

When we say "we don't like your comic", we don't mean "we dislike every single individual panel". We, or at least I, I can't speak for everybody, mean "we don't like your comic as a whole. There is enough bad and not enough good that we don't wish to follow it regularly." See what I'm getting at?

EDIT: It seems Twin2, personally, simply doesn't like the style. I repeat, I'm not speaking for Twin2 here.

You have a couple of decent strips. However, most of them are bad. I can't speak for everyone else, but I feel your comic overall is juvenile and not funny. Not that every part is bad, just most of it.

Now, to the more general subject: not everyone will like your comic. Deal with it. Don't tell us we're all "haters" that just "dogpile" your comic for the sake of being part of the crowd; that is immensely disrespectful for those of us who did take the time and effort to check out your comic on the strength of your questionable advertising. Start respecting our opinions by not trivializing them, and maybe we'll have a little more respect for you.

[slimredninja]

Thanks Raroy for noticing my humble dignity I really appreciate that. Unfortunately are intro comic hasn't been poop related for a long time now so you must not have read the comic perhaps you read a similar comic and just thought it was us since I don't want to call you the L word I will assume you are simply mistaken.. Hey thats ok you got to make a funny poop joke which is great. I'm glad you did like a few.
Twin2 I appreciate that you liked some but I'm still curious as to how many you actually read.
I have tremenous respect for you Nerd I just don't agree with you maybe the real problem is you try so hard to make me believe it isn't good and judging by ever improving numbers from this site I think more and more people are liking us.

[Fangly]

Now, to the more general subject: not everyone will like your comic. Deal with it. Don't tell us we're all "haters" that just "dogpile" your comic for the sake of being part of the crowd; that is immensely disrespectful for those of us who did take the time and effort to check out your comic on the strength of your questionable advertising. Start respecting our opinions by not trivializing them, and maybe we'll have a little more respect for you.


I'm totally here to get in with the cool kids. That's why I'm on the internet in the first place. Because internet webcomic forum = HYPERCOOL.

[Twin2]

Not too many. I mean no offense, but I generally won't trawl through something if it isn't something I'll like. Unless of course I have to (damn you great gatsby, and damn you too high school english).

[slimredninja]

If it helps our cause Fangly Morning Squirtz has had a few female artists. Who shockingly enough ( to goblin at least)actually have their own popular web comics.

[Ragabash]

Going by the comics that have been posted in this thread and others... the comic has no appeal to me.

The jokes either rely on obvious sight gags or crudeness for the sake of being crude.

If you want to draw people in, you need a hook, you need to either do something new, do something old in a new way, or do something old in an absolutely incredible way.

Your comic does none of those things that I can see. They remind me of the types of comics drawn by a grade six student to impress his friends.
You would do well to take the advice of some of the other posters here and really study some of the one panel comics. The truly good one panel comics work best by implying that there is more to the story, or at least making the reader think about the joke. Of the comics you have posted here, the paper bag one comes within shooting distance, but that's one example out of how many?

Also remember the classic advice for aspiring talent in the world of comics: good writing can make up for bad art, but good art can't make up for bad writing. You might want to address that shortcoming before you start dropping the names of artists you have worked for as a hook.



I know you're going to tell me that I should read all your comics before I pass judgment, but that's not going to happen. If what you've posted here is a sampling of your best work... then there's no draw for me, and I'm sure that a lot of other people feel the same. If you want us to give you a real chance, then you need to give us something that makes you stick out in the ocean of webcomics out there. So far you've offered nothing unique and special for us to see.

[Raroy]

Thanks Raroy for noticing my humble dignity I really appreciate that. Unfortunately are intro comic hasn't been poop related for a long time now so you must not have read the comic perhaps you read a similar comic and just thought it was us since I don't want to call you the L word I will assume you are simply mistaken.. Hey thats ok you got to make a funny poop joke which is great. I'm glad you did like a few.
Twin2 I appreciate that you liked some but I'm still curious as to how many you actually read.

I was talking about the first strip you ever made and put up. I just thought a few were decent enough, stop jumping to love and hate extremes. I'm done arguing with you. I was just here to bait you and deal with you in the most proper way I could. I knew you were going to doge my request, so I just hit you with my own hammer of criticism.

The "poop" joke was about build up, repetition, and irony. Maybe you yourself should learn the structure of a joke. Never jump to the punch line. Also, I will not dignify that "L word" comment with a response.

[Fawkes]

*sigh* I give up. {Scrubbed} Hopefully he'll get bored and leave our forum alone.

[slimredninja]

Thats weird still since our first comic has to do with dogs and cats and has nothing to do with poop. I actually counted we only have 5 out of 155 comics that are about poop and one about farting so the constant poop referneces bear no truth.
Bored of you Fox? I perish the thought you will be my greatest success someday. Already you post more here then anyone but me. I know it must kill you that your constant calls for people to ignore the thread or for me to go away have fallen on deaf ears. I really apoligize for any inconvience this must be causing you.

[Killersquid]

I have tremenous respect for you Nerd I just don't agree with you maybe the real problem is you try so hard to make me believe it isn't good and judging by ever improving numbers from this site I think more and more people are liking us.

There is something called Bile Fascination (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/BileFascination). Those higher numbers may not mean more fans, but more people to snark about it. I mean, Dominic Deegan is a terrible comic, with a high amount of traffic, but how much traffic is used to make fun of it? Also, just because there are female artists shouldn't sway Fangly's opinion, and it is disgusting you thought so.

[Raroy]

Remeber the power up comic trolls? At least those guys had style. The best way is to forget about it and move on. Or, at least derail the thread.

So, at what art level should I begin making a webcomic? It's what all the cool kids are doing. I already know how to shade yet I can't properly draw a person past stick figures. Could you imagine stick figures with shading? I can't.

[slimredninja]

Raroy if you would like to do a Morning Squirtz I will gladly post it on our seperate fan site (yes we have a fan site click my icon on morning Squirtz to see it). I would also be glad to give you some pointers.

[Fangly]

If it helps our cause Fangly Morning Squirtz has had a few female artists. Who shockingly enough ( to goblin at least)actually have their own popular web comics.


What? WOMEENZ ARE INVOLVED? Well that changes everything!! Before I thought your comic was bland and unfunny, but now that I know a pair of ovaries are on board I love it!!






Did I overdo it on the sarcasm? Probably.






*sigh* I give up. Slim is either trolling us, or so incredibly deluded that's there's no chance of ever getting through to him. Hopefully he'll get bored and leave our forum alone.

It does make me sad that you're not enjoying this. But then, I suppose I can't talk you into finding this thread funny. T'would be a long and futile attempt if I tried to somehow convince you that this thread is absolutely hysterical and you just can't see it.


I now have an urge to start up a thread called "Please check out our thread on the comic Morning Squirtz" and start this cycle all over again. Would that be spam?


Probably.

[Fawkes]

Remeber the power up comic trolls? At least those guys had style. The best way is to forget about it and move on. Or, at least derail the thread.

So, at what art level should I begin making a webcomic? It's what all the cool kids are doing. I already know how to shade yet I can't properly draw a person past stick figures. Could you imagine stick figures with shading? I can't.

Mad Mask and Nameless actually do shading with their OotS-style comics in Avatar Battle Royale. Give me a minute and I'll fish out some examples for you. It works better than you'd think.

Mask's avatar: http://www.kinogo.com/victor/maskatar8.gif
And a comic example:
http://www.kinogo.com/victor/fff21a.gif
(Don't ask me to explain it, it's far too complicated to keep up with)

[slimredninja]

{Scrubbed}

[Trazoi]

So, at what art level should I begin making a webcomic? It's what all the cool kids are doing. I already know how to shade yet I can't properly draw a person past stick figures. Could you imagine stick figures with shading? I can't.
Shading stick figures can work!

http://members.gamedev.net/trapperzoid/images/projects/engine/20060813_lou.png

Don't ask why I made this or to explain it. There was a reason, but despite being fuelled by a lot of crazy it was actually pretty dull. :smallbiggrin:

[Raroy]

It has it's own lovely style. Too bad the characters are far too stats. I could try a practice webcomic(baby steps) while training my art. Now I just need to memorize that oots art style guide.

[slimredninja]

You should try the Morning Squirtz style Raroy it's simple and easy almost juvenille anyone could do it.

[Fawkes]

Here's an example of how Nameless shades:
{Scrubbed - Please post only images within the Image size rules.}

I look forward to reading your comic, Raroy.

[slimredninja]

I don't think you are allowed to post pics here mecha. St. Jude scrubbed most of mine. Unless there is a legal way to do it that I'm not sure about. oh I see you have it in a spoiler now sweet I need to find out how that and the signature thing work.

[Raroy]

Winter break seems like a good time to get it rolling. I got about seven diffrent ideas. On diffrent levels of mundane and humor focus. I think I should come up with something completely different though.

[Fawkes]

Winter break seems like a good time to get it rolling. I got about seven diffrent ideas. On diffrent levels of mundane and humor focus. I think I should come up with something completely different though.

Would it be in the OotS style? Fantasy-based?

[slimredninja]

I have found comics about poop are very popular maybe you should try that. On a more serious note cut your chops on Drunk Duck its a great way to get started and to get lots of immediate response. Best of all its free.

[Raroy]

Of course Order of the Stick style. I like throwing in genres together. Heck, I think I might start of with romance that leads into grimdark.

[Fawkes]

Of course Order of the Stick style. I like throwing in genres together. Heck, I think I might start of with romance that leads into grimdark.

Sounds interesting. Are you planning on hosting it here on GitP?

[slimredninja]

Maybe I could get Rich to do a guest Morning Squirtz? That would be awesome. I could ask to him draw the upcoming D&D comic we are doing. How many of you think he would say yes?

[Raroy]

Yes. Anyway, I really have to go to sleep right now. Goodnight.

[Lissou]

I take offense to that, as I'm sure the many other female members of this subforum do. Like doompuppy, Mauve Shirt, Vael, and um. Um. Raroy has a female avi. And... yeah. There are others. Probably. Somewhere.

I don't take offense with that. A webcomic that would atract only beautiful women (note, not ALL beautiful women, but ONLY beautiful women, as in, anyone who isn't beautiful hates it, and some beautiful people might hate it too) would positively suck. It would be incredibly shallow, and talk only about how people who aren't gorgeous suck and it's their fault or whatever.

So yeah, webcomics don't work like that. They don't attract only beautiful women. If they did, it would be proof they're terrible.

This in no way says that women who read webcomics are ugly, so I had no reason to feel insulted.

[Nerd-o-rama]

I have tremenous respect for you Nerd I just don't agree with you maybe the real problem is you try so hard to make me believe it isn't good and judging by ever improving numbers from this site I think more and more people are liking us.As other people are pointing out, site traffic is relatively meaningless in terms of how many people liked your comic. It just tells you how many people read it.

And, okay, let me be very specific here. I'm not telling you it's bad. I'm telling you I think it's bad. You keep trying to say my opinion is invalid because it's not the same as yours, when they are in fact both opinions and not fact. It's the same with everyone else in this thread. We give you our honest opinion and maybe some suggestions for improvement, and you tell us our opinions don't matter because we're just out to get you or something.

Wow, there was a whole other page of posts. Also, SLR, posting images with permission of the artist is perfectly fine. Your images were scrubbed because they violated board rules regarding obscenity (probably, I'm not the one who scrubbed them).

[slimredninja]

Nonsense I believe you are not a fan I also belive others could be. I think your opinion is fine but it isn't my opinion nor do I believe it will be the opinion of everyone who visits.
As for you Lissou I love to imagine that all the women who read our comic are amazingly hot and only read it while scantily clad. We also accept that a few are merely large breasted men scantily clad with skid marks.
Good night everyone and thanks for all the great commentary some of it really had me cracking up. The thread is a week old today!

[Jayngfet]

I read your webcomic. I read about twenty of them. I don't find them funny. A few are admittedly okay, but that's it.

{Scrubbed}


This, you're comics may be funnier to other people, but not so much here.


Trust me, this isn't worth it, at best you'll find one or two regular readers who'll quit after a month or two. I'd reccomend heading on over to another site for readers with less high standards, you'll do well there.


And for actual critisisim:


You could work on textures a bit, the smurf one seems a bit off to me.

[Castel]

Maybe I could get Rich to do a guest Morning Squirtz? That would be awesome. I could ask to him draw the upcoming D&D comic we are doing. How many of you think he would say yes?

This one actually made me LoL. :smallamused:

Thats good old fashioned baiting.

*joins fangly in the lurking seats*

[PhantomFox]

*wakes up and sleepily posts*

Is there really anything left to say? It seems we're at an impasse. Doesn't look like either side is going to change their stance.

[Greep]

honestly, I think both the guys for and against the comic should stop arguing about how the comic is either good or bad and just focus on what can be improved. Also if you state if you like it or not, there's really no need to argue about whether people should like it or not, just state your opinion and be done with it. People just aren't going to change their minds if you tell them "But no you SHOULDN'T like this comic!" or vice verse.

I'm just tired of seeing this at the top of the forum only to start reading and seeing the same exact flame being spouted on both sides, no facts or opinions differing, just different people saying them.

EDIT: bah fox ninja :(

[Fawkes]

There's no point in focusing on what needs improvement. The author doesn't want to hear it. He's off in his own little world, far, far away from our comments.

[Killersquid]

There's no point in focusing on what needs improvement. The author doesn't want to hear it. He's off in his own little world, far, far away from our comments.

Yea, whenever improvement comes up, he goes into business speak of "why its like this" or "your people like it though".

[Fawkes]

Yea, whenever improvement comes up, he goes into business speak of "why its like this" or "your people like it though".

Which is how the whole argument got started. Best thing to do is to just leave him alone.

[Tom_Violence]

I think I can speak for everyone here

I don't. After this I almost feel like standing up for the guy (if only that were possible). As much as I dislike this comic, I absolutely cannot stand this 'I am the voice box of the entire community' attitude. Your arguments should be able to stand on their own - you don't need the mirage of everyone else on this board holding you up, do you?

[Occasional Sage]

So, at what art level should I begin making a webcomic? It's what all the cool kids are doing. I already know how to shade yet I can't properly draw a person past stick figures. Could you imagine stick figures with shading? I can't.

At whatever level makes you comfortable posting for the world to see. When you do, please let us know so that we can PEACH.

Any idea what title you'll be using? I'll keep an eye open for threads....

EDIT:
For an interesting look at the possibilities of stick figures, check out Jason Thompson's adaptation (http://www.sonic.net/~jason/dream/dream-image18.html) of Lovecraft's The Dream-Quest of Unknown Kadath (http://www.amazon.com/Dream-Quest-Kadath-H-P-Lovecraft/dp/0345337794/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1229612908&sr=8-2), from Mock Man Press. The art is detailed and lush, but the hero is a stick figure. The dichotomy is very interestingly done, and the story is well-translated from novel to graphic formats.

[slimredninja]

Sheew lag on here is crazy today is it always like this when the new strip goes up? I'm glad to see so many new comments since last night.
Let me answer everyone.

Webox yes you could consider me a master one.

Phantom Fox I am hoping you will eventually come around.

Mecha fox your comments are always close to my heart not far away and as for leaving me alone I don't think you can quit me.

Killer squid sorry I'm not really sure what your talking about.

Tom violence I think you maybe the closet thing to a friend I have here or at least the closet thing to not an enemy.

Occasional sage I think Raroy would have to respond to you. ( and people say I go off topic)

[Raroy]

I'll just make up one. I'm creative when it comes to titles. I doubt I'd be able to check that series of books out, I never seem to have money.

Let's change the topic. I feel that webcomics as a whole reflect human ambition as a general whole. Interpret that as you will.

[Roland St. Jude]

Sheriff of Moddingham: Am I wrong to expect better of posters here? Please do not flame the OP. Please do not call him any names including, spammer, troll, etc. If you feel his posts violate the Forum Rules, please feel free to report them. Otherwise, please confine your comments to his work and posts and not to his person.

[busterswd]

Well, I'm going to suggest what someone said earlier then:

If the webcomic turns you off, stop responding to this thread. If there is a legitimate fan and the OP gets bumps from them, fine. Otherwise, don't bump this thread, don't try to reason with the OP, don't give him a chance to respond. Let the mods do their job if he does anything inappropriate, otherwise you're just giving a comic you dislike more attention.

[slimredninja]

If you haven't seen it yet we have a great new Christmas Morning Squirtz thats at best mildly offensive check it out and let us know what you think.
You guys will love this me and my partner are having a contest. We want people to suggest improvements for our toons but each one individually. Literally a change in the art including such things as unfinished scenes things that could go in the background etc.or an improvement to the text. All changes will be considered.
We are giving original signed Morning Squirtz art as a prize. Now I know most of you would scoff at that prize but we also give you some notoriety if you write it or draw it better then us your name goes on that toon for all time. We do get a few thousand readers a day and I know its hard for you to believe but we do have quite a few fans. Plus we have over 10,000 myspace friends that we post them out to once a day. At the very least its a way to see your critiques help us to improve our comics instantly. Please be specific so we know which toon you are referring to.
You can post it here if you want or on our site or through myspace or a private message if you don't want people to know you are helping us. If you hate us why not help us improve ourselves. We are serious about this and we will try to get a front page news announcement from Drunk Duck. I would love for some of you to tell us or show us how you can do some of our toons better. I will send you a private message if we use your change.

[pickleninja]

Lol I'm flattered you used my quote as a signature St. Jude :smalleek:


-Pickle

[Occasional Sage]

Lol I'm flattered you used my quote as a signature St. Jude :smalleek:


-Pickle

Pickle my man, you've made it to the big leagues!

And Slim, yes the site does generally lag like this when a new strip goes up. It's pretty impressive!

[slimredninja]

We have a new Christmas/cookie related Morning Squirtz up on our homesite it isn't gross but maybe inappropriate for children and not completely Safe for work. There is a link on the first page of this thread back to our home page where you will have to go to the most current comic. Please check it out and offer us your opinion of it. We would love to hear what you think. Happy Holidays to all of you.

[jmsl]

I just read all of the comics you have posted so far. I didn't laugh once. I almost smiled two times. I wasn't offended by your gross stuff, though I've never liked the subject matter. I was bored with it. Does that mean you should stop or change what you're doing? No. There are people to whom that sort of stuff appeals. I found that for the most part the jokes were the simplest forms of humor, and I was tired of those before I got to middle school. Maybe I'm being snobbish, but it's not appealing to me personally.

I think you'd have a wider audience with a different style of jokes, but you'd probably lose the one you have now. I think some of the art looked nice, but most didn't. I won't bother to check this thread because I've barely got enough interest in the subject to post. I gave your comic more than enough of a chance to impress me, and it didn't. About the only use I saw was as another source of Rule 34, which isn't something I'm interested in. Good luck, and I'm done.

[Raz_Fox]

First, a disclaimer: I have not looked at any of the comics on your website. However, what I have seen on this thread and the comments of others have led me to the decision that I probably never will.

Allow me to give you some advice. This is not a very good forum to be advertising on. Some popular webcomics here are Order of the Stick and Girl Genius, both webcomics containing cerebral humor and a compelling storyline.

From the comments given here, I suspect that your comic contains neither. Not many people here are looking for a webcomic with crude humor and off-color jokes, especially ones lacking subtlety. The webcomics mentioned above have detailed and very good art, but they aren't compensating for anything. They have reasons for the readers to return to it every day and eagerly read the next one.

I am not going to comment on the quality or lack of it in your webcomic, but as one intelligent reader I will not touch that with a ten-foot pole. Sorry, fifty-foot pole. If you want more readers, go advertise on another forum, another website. Here, you'll be rebutted and mocked by those who enjoy webcomics lacking unnecessary crudity, webcomics with cleverness and wit written into every strip and posts containing proper grammar and spelling. :smallamused:

[slimredninja]

Check out an amazingly cool brand new Morning Squirtz featuring Michael Jackson with great art by Tokyo's own Corey Dye. Its safe or general consumption and maybe my new all time favorite Morning Squirtz. Check it out and let us know what you think. The link is back on the 1st page.

[Sholos]

Hardly safe for general consumption, given the subject matter. And you'll have to excuse me if I think raping children isn't something to be made fun of.

[Surfing HalfOrc]

Seriously, is ther ANY way of getting this thread locked, and this strip removed?

I know I asked once since slimredninja was clearly spamming the thread, but never got a reply. And what can I say, I don't find child molestation particularily funny.

I mean, Shredded Moose got locked when it was posted on the main board within a week (even though it's on the Webcomic Page) for being NSFW, but if Gingerbread Crackhouse and Michael Jackson molesting kids is OK, I just don't understand what the mods consider "acceptable" and "not acceptable."

Maybe it's me... I never understood the clever beauty and wit & wisdom of Howard Stern either... :smallfrown:

[Johnny Blade]

Okay, so that made me go back and look, just to see if maybe this comic has gotten any better.

I found the Michael Jackson one pretty borderline, but not really too much. It's made clear in the first post that this is for mature readers only, after all.

Which is a bad thing for this comic, since while I could totally see my 12 year old self chuckling at maybe 1 in 200 Morning Squirtz strips because this kind of humor is a lot funnier when you're just hitting puberty, it just falls completely flat now.

I mean, nothing against shock value humor in general, but there has to be something more to it than just "SEX! DRUGS! EXCREMENTS! VIOLENCE! AIDS! HOORAY!!!" to make it actually funny, like some clever insight behind it. Once in a while? Maybe? Probably not.

Also, non sequiturs aren't funny if they're just complete non sequiturs, and all the pun-based strips aren't either and apparently always just used as an opportunity for more low-brow hackwork.

Oh, and I hope slimredninja got some infraction points for his constant spamming.

[Nerd-o-rama]

You know, it's not really spamming if other people keep bumping the thread too. SRN hasn't even doubleposted.

My strategy has been, since I don't like the comic (and it's not any fun to make fun of, even), just shutting up about it. The thread will eventually die, barring actual spamming from the topic creator.

[T-O-E]

I mean, Shredded Moose got locked when it was posted on the main board within a week (even though it's on the Webcomic Page) for being NSFW, but if Gingerbread Crackhouse and Michael Jackson molesting kids is OK, I just don't understand what the mods consider "acceptable" and "not acceptable."


The Shredded Moose guy plugged his comic here?

[Roland St. Jude]

Sheriff of Moddingham: Okay, all the backseat modding has to stop now. At the start of, and throughout this thread, I have told slimredninja what the boundaries are, and he has stayed within them. He can have this one thread, post two board appropriate images, link to something board appropriate on his site in the OP, not post any other links or images, and, later I added, post only to announce updates. He has done as I asked without complaint.

If someone wants to go to the trouble, after reading the OP, to not only go to the site but to go through the comics, that's their choice. It's clear what is involved. Regarding the content, much of it can't be posted here, but as it is original artistic content, reference to it, as long as it's clear what is involved, is okay. Yes, this is pretty much the right on the line case in terms of appropriateness and the vague standard about what can be posted here versus what can be linked. It's definitely not the former and is barely the latter. It's an ongoing issue that we're monitoring.

Since the start of this thread, slimredninja's kept to every restriction that I've given him. As for his prior threads/posts, while we don't discuss posters' warnings/infractions publicly, trust me, I've been all over it from square one. The fact that this thread is so tightly monitored should put your minds at ease on the moderation front. If you have questions, please PM me.

On the issue of the comic, feel free to read or not, like it or not, and comment or not. But please do so without personal attacks on the OP, backseat modding, or any other rules violations.

[Tom_Violence]

My strategy has been... just shutting up about it.

Isn't this a fantastic contradiction?

On the comic itself, I've finally worked out what it keeps reminding me of. I remember when I turned 18 (not so long ago that the memory has faded entirely) and from just about every single relative I've ever had sent me a card with either a picture of a guy throwing up (because 18 is the hallowed drinking age over here), or a girl with her top off (same reason). Not a single one of them would raise so much as a smirk, but rather I found the whole thing tremendously embarrassing - not just personally because they were horrible to look at, but vicariously as well because I had to imagine someone like my dad going into a shop and actually picking one of these things up and deciding to send it to me.

I'm sure the recent festive period has probably exposed many people to a very similar phenomenon - that of sitting next to the incredibly-loud aunt who does nothing but talk about sex for the entirety of the Christmas meal.

[Nerd-o-rama]

Isn't this a fantastic contradiction?If you dislike something, not giving it free publicity seems perfectly valid to me. What are you accomplishing by trashing a comic that's obviously trashy (this is a summary of a critical review, not a personal insult)?

[Thayus]

Indeed, he says with a full awareness of the irony.

Y'know, the previous posts do a decent job of letting everyone know what they might be getting into. It might be best if all the detractors pledged to avoid posting in this thread from here on.

If you want to take the pledge, do so by not responding to this post.

-Thayus

[The Linker]

If you dislike something, not giving it free publicity seems perfectly valid to me. What are you accomplishing by trashing a comic that's obviously trashy (this is a summary of a critical review, not a personal insult)?

I think he meant that the contradiction was in posting that you weren't posting. But I might be misinterpreting it as well.

[Nerd-o-rama]

It was on top of the forum anyway. Which it isn't quite now, but I don't feel like cluttering up all our PM boxes to explain myself.

[Ravens_cry]

I don't really like it.
Average, if messy art, plus tired, or just plain gross, material, does not a funny thing make. And oh ho, illustrrated old jokes.
I only speak for myself, but I read a couple dozen, then hit the snooze button.
The art might be be acceptable if there was some kind of story, but it's a gag strip. I am sorry to say this, but I don't like it.

[Thayus]

I don't really like it.
Average, if messy art, plus tired, or just plain gross, material, does not a funny thing make. And oh ho, illustrrated old jokes.
I only speak for myself, but I read a couple dozen, then hit the snooze button.
The art might be be acceptable if there was some kind of story, but it's a gag strip. I am sorry to say this, but I don't like it.

Yes, yes.

Look, there's no hidden propaganda, no unfortunate subtext, no secret corrupting influence. The comic is what it is. This thread has enough posts to give people fair warning, we don't need to chime in with how we feel about it.

-Thayus

[Ravens_cry]

Yes, yes.

Look, there's no hidden propaganda, no unfortunate subtext, no secret corrupting influence. The comic is what it is. This thread has enough posts to give people fair warning, we don't need to chime in with how we feel about it.

-Thayus
Actually, yes we do. This thread is basically, especially if started by the creators, advertising. And we are telling them how we feel about it. I am not being vindictive, I am merely being honest to my own self.

[Glome]

I didn't read through this thread so excuse me if this has been mentioned already.
I think a comic strip you should look at is "The Parking Lot is Full"
http://plif.courageunfettered.com/archive/archive.htm

It seems to be the closet thing I can think of along the style of comic that you are trying to do that is funny.

[The Linker]

Yes, yes.

Look, there's no hidden propaganda, no unfortunate subtext, no secret corrupting influence. The comic is what it is. This thread has enough posts to give people fair warning, we don't need to chime in with how we feel about it.

-Thayus

:smallconfused:

This is a new person giving her (or, uh, his) opinion on the strip. Why is this person not allowed to? I would rather encourage more person to give their opinion, at least once. This thread was created partly for the purpose of getting people to 'chime in with how they feel about it.'

[slimredninja]

Hey guys we have a couple of great new Morning Squirtz up for you to check out. One is a total redo of an older Morning Squirtz after reading all of your critiques we are going back and improving the art on some of the more hastily done toons and correcting dialogue problems as well. The other new one features the peanuts gang and their crazy high jinks both are fairly safe for general viewing. Linker thanks for fighting for our right to post here. Glome The Parking lot is full is one of my favorites and has been a definite influence on what we are trying to do. We are picking up where they left off. Special thanks to all the playgrounders who keep stopping through. Your critiques have been very important and we appreciate the ones that actually give advice. We are still holding out hope for some positive feed back but we will take what ever feedback we can get.

[slimredninja]

Hey guys we have a great new Morning Squirtz up maybe the funniest one yet. No sex or violence just a family friendly drug reference. I hope you stop by to check it out. Unfortunately you have to go back to the link in the first post and select the current comic to see it since we don't have permission to post a fresh link at this time. Let us know what you think!

[slimredninja]

We have updated again! The newest toon features Bi sexual acts and is for adult anthropomorphic fans. Please be advised it is NSFW. If you haven't stopped by in a while we have lots of new comics up. We are in a constant state of improving comics and value your critiques and suggestions. We have already updated and improved some of our comics based on suggestions from all of you. Thanks again to those of you who follow the front page link back to our site. We'll be sure to let you know when we have updated again!

[slimredninja]

Hi everyone just letting you know we have a new update up this one is safe for all ages. So stop by and let us know what you think.

[slimredninja]

Hey guys we have put up a couple of new toons since my last post here. This Gary Gygax comic will go up on our mainsite and out to our My Space friends tomorrow on Gary's passings 1 year anniversary we were hopping for some early feedback from you guys. Any little touches that might enhance the toon. We can't do a major overhaul but we can still add small stuff. Let us know what you think! For anyone who would like to see more of our comics just visit the first page of our thread there is a link there.

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z237/danielmehlhorn/gygax.png

[Roland St. Jude]

Sheriff of Moddingham: And on that note, I'm going to lock this thread. We generally prohibit double posting and resurrecting old threads that the original posters are no longer interested in. This represents some of both. Only the OP seems to post here.

This comic, which has always been borderline in terms of content for here, is apparently not of interest to people here - or at least discussing it is not. If I'm wrong, please let me know by PM.