FFXIII and FFXIII Versus

[Iskariot]

For me, the Final Fantasy experience has been a very very very varied one. There have been FFs that I loved, FFT, especially its PSP remake, FFs that I've liked FFX, FFVI, and FF's that I've hated with the heat of a thousand suns, trite as that comment may be, FFX-2 and FFXI.

The latest iteration of the Final Fantasy franchise appears to strike a jarring dichotomy for me, as best represented by this picture:

http://i172.photobucket.com/albums/w14/Kairi162/FinalFantasy13x2.jpg

On one hand, we have what I very much despise, a clownishly colored final fantasy rooted in absurd races that serve no other purpose than to make the world some kind of circus. Dropships fly about an illogically shaped city dispensing troopers I cannot help but laugh at, the protagonist wields some sort of balisong gun-sword.

On the other hand, we have a starkly verisimilitude-saturated world featuring, of all things, royalty. The last Emperor, if I'm to believe the last I read the wikipedia entry. This, in my book, is pretty big news, perhaps finally breaking out of the ever-present 'Kingdoms good, Empires bad' trope (which, by the way, is hilariously misguided, Empires being by necessity ethnically heterogeneous, are higher on the ladder of social development). The story is apparently dark, and it appears that your love interest is also your primary antagonist.

The recently released trailers (find them on gametrailers) serve to reinforce this notion in me.

It's my opinion, and disappointment, that Versus is clearly the better game, Enix apparently having dropped much of its pop-conventions to create it. XIII by contrast appears to play to the same flowery tune of FF's recent predecessors, offers nothing new in terms of story, from the look of it, and is in general simply uninteresting.

What do you think?

[Fan]

I'm sad to say that I too fear for the XIII for it does just look like a clone.
FF XIII Versus however looks awesome, and new. It will also be operating on a real time combat system (like God of War, or Prince of Persia.), so that is also a welcome change in this day, and age.
Now, dont get me wrogn I like turn based combat as much as the next guy, but I'll be damned if I wotn say that turn based is lazy, and allows for obvious combos that always succeed.
So in short:
FF XIII: Still gonna buy it, and give it a chance.
FF XIII Versus: HELL YES!

[KnightDisciple]

I have to admit, the XIII gunblade thing was "eh, that's mildly intriguing".
Versus XIII's floating blades of doom and such was much more of "dude, I actually want to play this!"
Which, considering I tend not to play a lot of RPG's, is saying something.
Is Vs XIII on anything besides PS3?

[Iskariot]

Unfortunately not. That's why I said I was disappointed that Versus was the better game, because I only have an Xbox.

[Oregano]

I only have a 360 too and I'm definately going to get FF XIII, I'm not too fussed about Versus because I don't like God of War style games.


I do think it would be great if Versus avoided the whole Final Fantasy=crap mentality people have.

[Eldariel]

Bleh, I guess I'll have to wait 'til it gets emulated. No way in hell am I getting a PS3 or Xbox. As a bonus though, I'll get to hear whether it's worth it before I play it.

[Drascin]

I too prefer Versus, but mostly because I personally prefer Kingdom Hearts's combat style to usual turnbased stuff. The "darkness" and "seriousness" that the OP so likes, though, is actually a minus point for me, because it brings me a lot of fear that it ends up a Darker and Edgier narmfest, as so many "serious" videogames end.

Still, I'll see. And I say see, because there's no way I'll get to play it any soon, since my chance of getting a PS3 are almost nil. I wanna play Disgaea 3... :smallfrown:

[Oregano]

Both game's characters have stupid names, although Versus' names are better.

I hope that if FFXIII does good on 360(which is what I'll buy it for) they'll port Versus over.

[Dairun Cates]

Sounds to me like Versus is basically there to keep Square-Enix in good faith with Sony as it ports its major releases over to the Xbox360.

I'd almost worry on principle about Versus being a less polished product because of this since it would've started later in development and would've been a lesser priority to the actual FFXIII game. Still, I'll just have to see how it does.

After all, I guess I'm just concerned it would be a lot like Last Remnant. It's still a solid game, but it lacks a lot of actual polish and has a lot of bugs.

Oh, and Disgaea 3 is awesome (my roommate has it), but as much of a Nippon Ichi whore as I am, it's not enough for me to buy a PS3 until it hits another price drop. Besides, good ole' N1 seems to be moving over to other consoles and focusing pretty heavily on the handheld market right now.

[Calamity]

Unfortunately not. That's why I said I was disappointed that Versus was the better game, because I only have an Xbox.

Uh, how can you know that Versus is going to be the better game? Sure, the details we do know about it may sound better than the ones we have about XIII, but that doesn't mean that when they're released, it'll be the same story.

[Iskariot]

Uh, how can you know that Versus is going to be the better game? Sure, the details we do know about it may sound better than the ones we have about XIII, but that doesn't mean that when they're released, it'll be the same story.

I don't know that it's the better game. From what I've seen, I believe it's the better game for me. Frankly, I don't think I can be wrong at this point since almost everything about the 13 aesthetic and world just strikes me as wank.


The "darkness" and "seriousness" that the OP so likes, though, is actually a minus point for me, because it brings me a lot of fear that it ends up a Darker and Edgier narmfest, as so many "serious" videogames end.


It's all what you play RPGs for. Frankly, I've never enjoyed an RPG that doesn't break out the so-called 'narm'. High drama an emotional turmoil are cornerstone of an epic experience, in my opinion. I don't play RPGs for their gameplay, I play other things for gameplay, like RTS or FPS. RPGs I play for the sole existence of a thought-out and well-made story.

[Oregano]

I don't know that it's the better game. From what I've seen, I believe it's the better game for me. Frankly, I don't think I can be wrong at this point since almost everything about the 13 aesthetic and world just strikes me as wank.


I think it could be good, but I'm a bit put-off with the fact that the director of X-2 and Revanent Wings is in charge, because I think they are two of the weaker FF games. Lightning and Snow are kind of rubbish names but they fit in with Cloud, Squall, Tidus, Yuna etc. theme, although they're still a bit offputting.

[Iskariot]

Perhaps more importantly, apparently it's been the stated aim of Versus to break out of the conventions of earlier Final Fantasies. This doesn't guarantee anything, but it's definitely a step in the right direction for a company that's been described as the 'Battleship Yamato'.

[Oregano]

Perhaps more importantly, apparently it's been the stated aim of Versus to break out of the conventions of earlier Final Fantasies. This doesn't guarantee anything, but it's definitely a step in the right direction for a company that's been described as the 'Battleship Yamato'.

No, that's not good.:smallfrown: The conventions are what makes Final Fantasy good, the common elements and themes. First they got rid of the combat system and now this?:smallfrown:

They should do a different series(they've already started quite a few in recent years) rather than ruin a good one.

[Drascin]

It's all what you play RPGs for. Frankly, I've never enjoyed an RPG that doesn't break out the so-called 'narm'. High drama an emotional turmoil are cornerstone of an epic experience, in my opinion. I don't play RPGs for their gameplay, I play other things for gameplay, like RTS or FPS. RPGs I play for the sole existence of a thought-out and well-made story.

No, no, I think you misunderstand the term. "Narm (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Narm)" means "tries to do 'high drama and emotional turmoil' (as you put it) and fails by a lot to actually evoke said feelings in the player". A sadly great amount of RPGs has fallen into that throughout history, but it seems more marked in games that try to be serious despite a basic silly mechanics - that's why I fear the whole "Darker than Thou" thing like the coming of the Reaper :smallsigh:.

[Fan]

Well, I bought a Ps3 for the SOLE reaso for staying up to date with Final fantasy.
Also I dont think the main charecterfor Versus is snow. I thought is was Noctis, or as his nickname is Noct which means Light in latin. >.>

[Oregano]

Well, I bought a Ps3 for the SOLE reaso for staying up to date with Final fantasy.
Also I dont think the main charecterfor Versus is snow. I thought is was Noctis, or as his nickname is Noct which means Light in latin. >.>

Yer Noctis is the main character in Versus, Snow is one of the main characters in FF XIII.

[Iskariot]

No, no, I think you misunderstand the term. "Narm (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Narm)" means "tries to do 'high drama and emotional turmoil' (as you put it) and fails by a lot to actually evoke said feelings in the player". A sadly great amount of RPGs has fallen into that throughout history, but it seems more marked in games that try to be serious despite a basic silly mechanics - that's why I fear the whole "Darker than Thou" thing like the coming of the Reaper :smallsigh:.

No. I know what narm is. That's why I said 'so-called' narm, since you went out of your way to imply that even trying is apparently the sign of the devil. Yes, yes it does miss. Video games don't get the star voicework and acting that movies get, commonly, yet. But trying to create drama and turmoil are the quintessential elements of good story and immersion, the ultimate goal of all RPGs and the ultimage goal of all gaming respectively.


No, that's not good.:smallfrown: The conventions are what makes Final Fantasy good, the common elements and themes. First they got rid of the combat system and now this?:smallfrown:

They should do a different series(they've already started quite a few in recent years) rather than ruin a good one.

I don't think so. I don't remember myself playing FFX and saying to myself 'hey, I really love how they put airships in this one.' I remember myself playing FFX and saying 'hey, this story's pretty interesting.'

The FF series has changed, there is absolutely no denying that and no escaping it. I don't think Versus is meant to be a series that's going to redefine all of FF. It might, it if does well, and I hope it does because then I might get a port, but I think ordinary 13 does the job of playing to the tune of those freaky fans who buy the 'potion' energy drinks out of something other than novelty.

Versus is there as a counterpoint to 13 and all it represents, and story-wise and setting-wise, I'm very glad that it isn't falling back on conventions to make up for poor story and world-building.

[Fan]

Yer Noctis is the main character in Versus, Snow is one of the main characters in FF XIII.
Well, yeah. I thought you guys were talking about the main charecter in Versus being snow, and I was like... Did Gamespot LIE to me?:smalltongue:

[Oregano]

I don't think so. I don't remember myself playing FFX and saying to myself 'hey, I really love how they put airships in this one.' I remember myself playing FFX and saying 'hey, this story's pretty interesting.'

The FF series has changed, there is absolutely no denying that and no escaping it. I don't think Versus is meant to be a series that's going to redefine all of FF. It might, it if does well, and I hope it does because then I might get a port, but I think ordinary 13 does the job of playing to the tune of those freaky fans who buy the 'potion' energy drinks out of something other than novelty.

Versus is there as a counterpoint to 13 and all it represents, and story-wise and setting-wise, I'm very glad that it isn't falling back on conventions to make up for poor story and world-building.

Yes, but it was clearly Final Fantasy, if you take that all away and have no Chocobo's, Cactuars etc. It might still be a brilliant game, but it's not Final Fantasy. When I said Ruin, I meant change unnessarily(sp?). They're removing everything that makes it Final Fantasy.

[Iskariot]

I don't see why it has to be 'Final Fantasy' so narrowly defined. 'Final Fantasy' is just a name, just a tag, and calling one game 'Final Fantasy' doesn't ruin any of the franchise's prior games anymore than making a bad game, which they've done before.

Compare the feel of FFVII and FFT and you have something entirely different. Completely and utterly. In fact, even with the chocobos, I cannot come to you with a straight face and say that FFT is a child of the Final Fantasy franchise, and yet, I appreciate it's addition to it. It was a good game, and that's all that's needed.

[Oregano]

I don't see why it has to be 'Final Fantasy' so narrowly defined. 'Final Fantasy' is just a name, just a tag, and calling one game 'Final Fantasy' doesn't ruin any of the franchise's prior games anymore than making a bad game, which they've done before.

Compare the feel of FFVII and FFT and you have something entirely different. Completely and utterly. In fact, even with the chocobos, I cannot come to you with a straight face and say that FFT is a child of the Final Fantasy franchise, and yet, I appreciate it's addition to it. It was a good game, and that's all that's needed.

It has a lot of elements from Tactics Ogre, but it still had Chocobo's, Dark Knights. I don't want it just be a tag, I want to play each game and see certain familiar things.

[Iskariot]

Then I suppose we seek different things in games. I'm happy if it's a good game.

[Oregano]

Then I suppose we seek different things in games. I'm happy if it's a good game.

Oh if it's a good game, I'll play it, I'll enjoy it but it won't be Final Fantasy to me and I'd be a little annoyed if they abandoned all FF elements for new ones; I like Cactuars, Chocobo's and Dragoons.

[Vic_Sage]

I'm pretty much the oppisite, I absolutely love the design of everything I've seen from XIII so far and while Versus is no slouch XIII just looks so much better than it does.

[Eldariel]

I thought is was Noctis, or as his nickname is Noct which means Light in latin. >.>

Lumen is "light" in Latin. You may be thinking of "night".

[Fan]

Lumen is "light" in Latin. You may be thinking of "night".

Ah, yes thats right stupid non phonectic languages messing with my interpretations. Yeah, thats right, but his middle name Lucis may light... Not sure if that is the correct sense, but thats what Gamespot, and wiki tell me in addition to my translator.

[Eldariel]

That's incidentially where the myth of Santa Lucia got its name too. But yes, "lucis" is, as I understand, the plural of "lux", which also means light. I think it's something like "lumen" is more of the "daylight" while "lux" is more of "light". But yea, "lucis" would be the plural of "light" or "day" or some such (incidentially, while "lumen" is "daylight", "day" is a meaning of the word "lux"). And the problem is actually that English is a non-phonetic language, which causes some issues with phonetic languages for English-speakers :P Latin actually has a very close sound-symbol correspondence and indeed, it's enough to learn the alphabets to figure out the pronunciation of just about every Latin word (unlike in, say, English where e.g. the word "knight" is pronounced as anything but the sum of its letters). And now I'm babbling linguistics in an unassociated thread...sorry!

[Daze]

I don't see why it has to be 'Final Fantasy' so narrowly defined. 'Final Fantasy' is just a name, just a tag, and calling one game 'Final Fantasy' doesn't ruin any of the franchise's prior games anymore than making a bad game, which they've done before.

Well... If I said: "Here... eat this McDonalds Double Cheeseburger and enjoy."

And then gave you a Taco Bell grilled chicken Stuffed Burrito. How would you feel?

While it's true that both can be equally good (or gross, depending on preference), it's a bit of a bait and switch isnt it?

I buy, play and generally obsess over Final Fantasy because I know what it is and I know what I like. If I buy the latest iteration (not necessarily talking about XIII or FF Versus mind you), I'd be pretty ticked if it turns out to be an action game or a twitcher and i had no advance warning.

McDonalds has sold half a trillion hamburgers and no one in their corporate headquarters is talking about a new recipe. If it aint broke, dont fix it.

For the record, I think McDonalds is way gross since I've become all growed up... just using it as an example.

[Setra]

Well... If I said: "Here... eat this McDonalds Double Cheeseburger and enjoy."

And then gave you a Taco Bell grilled chicken Stuffed Burrito. How would you feel?
Pretty good seeing as I prefer the latter. This has nothing to do with the current argument mind you.

I personally dislike the looks of XIII because it seems to be to be an RPG Action (as opposed to an Action RPG), in other words an RPG with action elements in it.

In a similar vein XII was more actiony (not much mind you) than a standard RPG as well, and I also disliked it. I love turn based battles, and the old atb, but XII changed it in a way I didn't like, and it seems XIII is going to change it further.

Versus seems to be closer to an action game from what I have heard, making it more in the vein of Action RPG rather than an RPG with action elements added. I'll probably enjoy it more.

Unlike most of you I played the final fantasy games almost as much because I like the battle systems as because I love the stories.

Edit: Unfortunately I am Squaresoft's bitch and will be getting both.

[Oregano]

Unlike most of you I played the final fantasy games almost as much because I like the battle systems as because I love the stories.

Edit: Unfortunately I am Squaresoft's bitch and will be getting both.

Well apparently the ATB is going to come back for XIII, but it's going to be different in how it work. It might have a battle system similar to Eternal Sonata, you can only more when it's your go but then you can run around alot.

What does everyone think of Random encounters, I didn't mind them, except when they were hideous monsters. Although I think I prefer Dragonquest Monsters: Joker system.

I doubt I'll get a PS3 just for Versus but I am considering a PSP at some point for all the spiffy FF games on there.

[Setra]

Well apparently the ATB is going to come back for XIII, but it's going to be different in how it work. It might have a battle system similar to Eternal Sonata, you can only more when it's your go but then you can run around alot.

What does everyone think of Random encounters, I didn't mind them, except when they were hideous monsters. Although I think I prefer Dragonquest Monsters: Joker system.

I doubt I'll get a PS3 just for Versus but I am considering a PSP at some point for all the spiffy FF games on there.
I have never played Eternal Sonata (though I wish to), though what you say sounds similar to Grandia.

I think I prefer random encounters to actually encountering enemies... I have the tendency of being VERY good at avoiding seen enemies and can't not try to, so I tend to be very underleveled.

Ps. I recently got a PSP (My brother got it as a Birthday/Christmas gift for me) and I'm playing it much more than my DS, I recommend it to you.

[Oregano]

I have never played Eternal Sonata (though I wish to), though what you say sounds similar to Grandia.

I think I prefer random encounters to actually encountering enemies... I have the tendency of being VERY good at avoiding seen enemies and can't not try to, so I tend to be very underleveled.

Ps. I recently got a PSP (My brother got it as a Birthday/Christmas gift for me) and I'm playing it much more than my DS, I recommend it to you.

It may very well be similar, it's turn based and when your round starts you have a timer but it's real time.

I don't if I get a PSP it will replace my trusty DS but it'd be nice to have a different set of games to play(even though I've cleared on two of my nearly twenty DS games as is).

[JabberwockySupafly]

Both XIII & Vs XIII aren't really all that exciting to me. I'm anticipating the release of White Knight Story, personally.

Also, in regards to the PSP. Get one if you can. I can safely say (as I imported it with the help of a friend & I am playing it right now!) Dissidia: Final Fantasy is reason enough to own a PSP.It is pretty much an RPG with a fighting game tacked on... and that's really not doing any justice to this amazingly rich and involved game (you have equipment, levels, spells, summons, ect). Now, if only I could read Japanese...