[4e] Beastmaster Ranger help

[Asbestos]

So, rolling up a beastmaster ranger and have a few questions.

1. Is the Bear companion a trap? I can see it if I were using a small sized race and needed that d12 for damage, but is it worthwhile with the lack of AC and crummy to hit?

2. What IS the 'best' companion? I can see Snakes, Spiders, and Raptors being useful in terms of utility (they can swim, climb, and fly, respectively) but it seems like Lizards, Cats, and Wolves are the 'best'. Boars are... bleh to me, unless I'm a dwarf.

3. Should I focus on Beast powers and take a two-handed weapon, or use TWF or Ranged powers and use my beast as a flanker/blocker?

4. Any suggestions for refluffing some of the companions into other animals while keeping them sensible? Like... Bears into Giant Apes, Spiders into Giant Centipedes, Raptors into Giant Dragonflies, Boars into Rams, etc. Basically things that could, mechanically, act the same.

[SadisticFishing]

I believe that a Fullblade (or you know, any sort of big weapon, but +3 and 1d12 makes sense to me as a base) is the way to go if you really want to play a Beastmaster Ranger. If you want TWF powers, go TWF. The ability is extremely strong, and TWF without it will be rather underpowered.

I believe Boar and Wolf are the best companions, just because of the powers that work with them. Wolf is my favorite, as its power scales very well, but it starts a bit weaker.

Bear is very weak, in my opinion - -2 to hit is a HUGE deal. There's no reason to have him attack instead of your Fullblade (at level 1, the Bear has +3 to hit, if you have 16 strength [and there's no reason you shouldn't have 18], you have +6).

Raptors are also very weak, though they were my favorite at first, I then realized that virtually every Beastmaster Power keys off the animal's Strength score.

[Kurald Galain]

1. Is the Bear companion a trap?

Depends. Most of the time, it'll be you who attacks, not your companion. That said, in 4E, to-hit bonuses are very important.

2. What IS the 'best' companion?

Wolf. Although it depends what you want it for (e.g. for an archer, the hawk is nice).

3. Should I focus on Beast powers and take a two-handed weapon, or use TWF or Ranged powers and use my beast as a flanker/blocker?

The latter. You're a ranger, use your TWF for best effort. It's really okay if the beast does nothing but flank for you.

[Random NPC]

4. Any suggestions for refluffing some of the companions into other animals while keeping them sensible? Like... Bears into Giant Apes, Spiders into Giant Centipedes, Raptors into Giant Dragonflies, Boars into Rams, etc. Basically things that could, mechanically, act the same.

Dwarf Mountain Ranger with a Goat(boar) called Betty

beat that

[Hzurr]

Don't forget that if you're a beastmaster, you don't get all the two-handed fighting bonuses that normal TWF rangers get (i.e., you'll have to make sure you have a weapon with the "off-hand" property)

[Kurald Galain]

Don't forget that if you're a beastmaster, you don't get all the two-handed fighting bonuses that normal TWF rangers get (i.e., you'll have to make sure you have a weapon with the "off-hand" property)

True enough, but that only means a -1 to damage or so, plus you get to use rogue MC for sneak attack.

[Myatar_Panwar]

Also, I don't have the book on me, but isn't there a MC feat for tempest fighters which gives you that class feature (the any 1handed weapon for TWF one)?

[Theodoric]

Also, I don't have the book on me, but isn't there a MC feat for tempest fighters which gives you that class feature (the any 1handed weapon for TWF one)?

I don't know if you can multiclass into your own class.

[Draz74]

Tempest Fighter != TWF Ranger. Fighter != Ranger. He is not MCing into his own class.

[Grynning]

Also, I don't have the book on me, but isn't there a MC feat for tempest fighters which gives you that class feature (the any 1handed weapon for TWF one)?

You're thinking of the new Ranger multiclass feat. You can't multiclass into ranger if you're already a Ranger.

I personally think using a reach weapon may be a good idea with a Beastmaster build, depending on how you want to play it. Stay out of reach, with the pet in the enemy's face. Unfortunately the pets are kind of crappy as off-tanks, with only two healing surges (plus yours).

I too am a bit disappointed in the bear. I think most DM's would probably allow upping their hit bonus to match the other animals, their low speed and AC is already enough to make up for that bigger damage die.

Of course, my beast master ranger will have to be an Orc with a boar...like my first WoW character.

[Myatar_Panwar]

To clarify I was trying to ask if there was a fighter MC feat (not FOR fighters, for other classes which want to MC with fighter. That better?) which gave that class feature.

You're thinking of the new Ranger multiclass feat. You can't multiclass into ranger if you're already a Ranger.

Ah, wasn't sure if it was ranger or fighter. Thanks.

[Ninetail]

So, rolling up a beastmaster ranger and have a few questions.

1. Is the Bear companion a trap? I can see it if I were using a small sized race and needed that d12 for damage, but is it worthwhile with the lack of AC and crummy to hit?

I wouldn't call it a trap; it does what it's supposed to. It's a big, strong, slow bruiser. If you want that, bear'll do it.

2. What IS the 'best' companion? I can see Snakes, Spiders, and Raptors being useful in terms of utility (they can swim, climb, and fly, respectively) but it seems like Lizards, Cats, and Wolves are the 'best'. Boars are... bleh to me, unless I'm a dwarf.

Cats and wolves are good all-around choices for melee types -- cats have the edge in stealth, but wolves get a nice bonus when flanking. Raptors are very nice for archers.

3. Should I focus on Beast powers and take a two-handed weapon, or use TWF or Ranged powers and use my beast as a flanker/blocker?

Depends on the powers you take. Though I wouldn't recommend a two-hander, other than maybe a polearm. Reach might be interesting with those "melee weapon (beast 1)" powers.

4. Any suggestions for refluffing some of the companions into other animals while keeping them sensible? Like... Bears into Giant Apes, Spiders into Giant Centipedes, Raptors into Giant Dragonflies, Boars into Rams, etc. Basically things that could, mechanically, act the same.

[/quote]

You seem to have a pretty good grasp on it already. You can also make minor changes -- perhaps change that ape to d10 damage but level + 3 base attack, for instance.

[Asbestos]

I find the lack of lizard love strange, is the higher AC and bonus to hit on opportunity attacks not worth it? Is the wolf's bonus to damage when flanking really worth it? (especially since I plan on being the one attacking when flanking) Or does it apply to me and the wolf? The cat is also nice because of it being trained in stealth, which is potentially more useful than say, endurance.

Also, I think its interesting that I ask 'what's the best path I should take here' and I get a bunch of different answers. Anyone thing that ranged ranger powers would be worth it? I think I'd have to definitely use a lizard in that case, in order to get the better OAs so it'd be a better blocker (the higher AC would help there too)

[KKL]

The Bear starts off as crap. +3 to hit at level 1 is...horribly unimpressive. However, a +18 to hit at level 16 when a Ranger with 20 Str and a +3 weapon has +19 to hit.

All in all, the bear starts out crappy, and ends up horribly tanky. It hits hard, the to hit bonus isn't a total travesty, and it's a massive tank.

I however, prefer a wolf.

Abestos: The wolf, with CA, deals the most damage out of any beast, and since you're controlling two characters, flanking shouldn't be hard to acheive.

[Asbestos]

The Bear starts off as crap. +3 to hit at level 1 is...horribly unimpressive. However, a +18 to hit at level 16 when a Ranger with 20 Str and a +3 weapon has +19 to hit.

All in all, the bear starts out crappy, and ends up horribly tanky. It hits hard, the to hit bonus isn't a total travesty, and it's a massive tank.

I however, prefer a wolf.

Abestos: The wolf, with CA, deals the most damage out of any beast, and since you're controlling two characters, flanking shouldn't be hard to acheive.

That's true about the bear... but won't a level 16 ranger have some sort of magic weapon adding an enhancement bonus? Or did you include that?

About the wolf: If it has combat advantage, I will still almost always be doing more damage when I attack than it will, unless I'm a halfling or similarly sized race.

[KKL]

That's true about the bear... but won't a level 16 ranger have some sort of magic weapon adding an enhancement bonus? Or did you include that?

I included that.

About the wolf: If it has combat advantage, I will still almost always be doing more damage when I attack than it will, unless I'm a halfling or similarly sized race.

Take a gander at Paired Predators (Level 3). Or any power that allows you and your companion to attack. Ideally, since you're controlling two entities, you'd want to flank. Flanking gives CA. Wolves deal their wisdom modifier in extra damage with CA.

[7th lvl scrub]

That's true about the bear... but won't a level 16 ranger have some sort of magic weapon adding an enhancement bonus? Or did you include that?

About the wolf: If it has combat advantage, I will still almost always be doing more damage when I attack than it will, unless I'm a halfling or similarly sized race.

Yes, but there's also all the powers that also allow your pet to attack with you, essentially multiplying your damage when you have CA.

Also as another note, for a Beast Mastery ranger who plans on dual wielding, simply spend a feat to get proficient with a double weapon from Adventurer's Vault and use that.

And for fluff you can have a Dragonborn (cause it makes sense) with a lizard for a pet, that's a drake, and name the drake Trogdor.

[Asbestos]

And for fluff you can have a Dragonborn (cause it makes sense) with a lizard for a pet, that's a drake, and name the drake Trogdor.

I was also thinking of having a halfling with a drake and going all Eberron on it. I've found it harder to justify an elf with a lizard though, any suggestions on this? Feel free to refluff it (I've found that the lizard is the hardest thing to refluff, well, that and the cat)

[KKL]

II've found that the lizard is the hardest thing to refluff, well, that and the cat)

Komodo Dragons are awesome, by the way. Also, Alligators, Crocodiles, there are a lot of large lizards. Cats are simple as well, seeing as you can just go for cheetahs or panthers, etc.

[Shadow_Elf]

Okay, this is what you have to do:

First, Spider is my favourite, for Spider Climb. So this is based off of that:
1. Train your Spider/Giant Centipede/Scorpion in Acrobatics.
2. Go with Rapier (takes a feat, but worthwhile) and then either Dagger (or Parrying Dagger, if you can afford the feat) or Short sword, depending on how much damage output you're looking for, or if you want a smidge of range.
3. Take TWF and Beast powers (depending on which is best at your level. The level 3 Encounter attack that is compatible with Spiders is very nice, btw)

In combat:
1. Put your Giant Insect on the ceiling, and walk into the room (it helps if you take the feat that give syour beast +2 to all your trained skills, and you're trained in Stealth + Acrobatics, but it isn't necessary and you've used a lot of feats)
2. Have it fall on top of an enemy (make a Tumble check). I believe that the enemy takes falling damage also, and if you succeed on your Tumble, you are now standing on top of a prone enemy during a surprise round.
3. Shift with the Giant Insect and attack the prone enemy.
4. Rush into flanking with your Rapier and Dagger or Shortsword, and Twin Strike with Combat Advantage (remember Hunter's Quarry too), and deal d18 + 1d6 + 1d6(1d8 with Lethal Hunter).

At later levels, MC into Rogue for Paragon MC and First in, to take advantage of your surprise rounds and high initiative even more. Then make your light blades kill stuff with high-damage rogue and ranger powers.

[SadisticFishing]

Most of the BM powers have you and your Beast attack. If you're twf'ing, your damage will be very low. If you have a Fullblade/etc, your damage will be very high. With a Wolf, their damage will be high too if you're flanking.

[Kurald Galain]

2. Have it fall on top of an enemy (make a Tumble check). I believe that the enemy takes falling damage also, and if you succeed on your Tumble, you are now standing on top of a prone enemy during a surprise round.

Wait, is there any rule that indicates you can do that?

[Starsinger]

Wait, is there any rule that indicates you can do that?

DMG pg. 42 I believe.

[Asbestos]

Okay, this is what you have to do:

First, Spider is my favourite, for Spider Climb. So this is based off of that:
1. Train your Spider/Giant Centipede/Scorpion in Acrobatics.
2. Go with Rapier (takes a feat, but worthwhile) and then either Dagger (or Parrying Dagger, if you can afford the feat) or Short sword, depending on how much damage output you're looking for, or if you want a smidge of range.
3. Take TWF and Beast powers (depending on which is best at your level. The level 3 Encounter attack that is compatible with Spiders is very nice, btw)

Why wouldn't I just spend a single feat to get a double sword... beyond them looking silly that is.

[Shadow_Elf]

@^: Oh, I forgot about Double Swords. Yup! Just go with that, for a single feat. You can just refluff them so they don't look as silly. Call them Swordchucks .

Also, if you go back-to-back with your beast companion and use Total Defence actions, you both get +3 to all defences. Add the Companion Slot Item that improves all their defences when adjacent to you, and shield bonus from Double Weapon and Two-Weapon Defence, and you can also hold a choke for a very very long time.

[Shadowstriker]

Um actually it is possible to make an effective to make a TWF and beastmaster ranger, it is just difficult.

if you plan on doing this i suggest you buy the magical weapon "paired weapon" and specialize your items and feats around this

as for best animal... i use a cat, enough said

[cupkeyk]

My favorite is Raptor+the ritual Beast Growth+ Halfling with archery powers. You're practically untargetable at Heroic Tier. Halflings have a nice feat that makes shortbows brutal 1, too.

In Eberron, Halfling Raptor Riders ride on Pteradactyls.

[Mando Knight]

2. Go with Rapier (takes a feat, but worthwhile) and then either Dagger (or Parrying Dagger, if you can afford the feat) or Short sword, depending on how much damage output you're looking for, or if you want a smidge of range.

Actually, poke your DM until he makes use of the Essentials updates: Rapiers are now Military weapons rather than Superior. Boom, shiny new weapon for free.

[The Glyphstone]

Great Modthulhu: That is not dead which can eternal lie, and with strange eons even threads may die. Unless they're necro'ed.