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    Default [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    So I'm going over item slots, and I'm curious as to something: there is no "legs" slot.

    No, no, don't start with the "But there's a boots slot!" argument. Immaterial. There's an "arms" slot and a "hands" slot, isn't there? And Feet:Legs::Hands:Arms.

    And before you get into the "armor comes with legs coverings" shtick, consider thus: while "full plate" in real life entails a full suit of armor, wearing full plate in-game does not occupy your head, hands, feet, waist, face, or arms slots, so a suit of full plate doesn't apparently come with a helmet, gauntlets, boots, belt, faceplate or even forearm protection. You can also wear a robe over it or a shirt underneath it.

    To me, this looks like a squandered opportunity. Why can't one have miraculous pants? Why not have greaves of the sun sentinel? What about greaves of protection +2 or pants of the secret of monkey island (capable of storing even canoes!)?

    What're other people's thoughts on this?

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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    Miraculous pants seem excessive, but I don't object to greaves.

    I think the problem is that legwear just isn't very specialized...it's pants. There's little mythological precedent, and history has few pieces of equipment exclusive to the thigh, knee and calf.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    You ever play Morrowind? I had magic pants in that game... glorious, yet tight, magical noble pants. I always houserule their are leg/knee slots. No one messes with the guy who can shoot cloudkills out of his pajama pant's buttflap!

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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    Quote Originally Posted by afroakuma View Post
    I think the problem is that legwear just isn't very specialized...it's pants. There's little mythological precedent, and history has few pieces of equipment exclusive to the thigh, knee and calf.
    On that same argument, neither are the hands slot. You either have gloves made of a soft substance, or gloves made of a hard substance (gauntlets).

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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    Probably because armor like Full Plate includes leggings and a helmet. Bracers aren't exactly made for your entire arm. If you were wearing Full Plate and wanted to wear +2 Assless Chaps of Charm, you would probably take a hit to AC.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    Perhaps WotC just didn't want to have to think of wonderous items to fill the legs slot because all anyone could think of were magical pants and the idea just seemed silly?

    I, for one, would like some magic pants on my characters. I think with some of them it would be the only magic item they would have for a looooong time.
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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    I don't think it'd necessarily be a problem, but if you follow the Body Slot Affinities "guidelines" then there's not really anything special you could give to the "Pants Slot" unless you guys can come up with anything.

    Personally, I would be more likely to REDUCE the number of slots like 4E, which combined shoulder and throat, body and torso, arms and shield, and face and head, since those always seemed like silly distinctions for the most part anyway.
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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zergrusheddie View Post
    Probably because armor like Full Plate includes leggings and a helmet. Bracers aren't exactly made for your entire arm. If you were wearing Full Plate and wanted to wear +2 Assless Chaps of Charm, you would probably take a hit to AC.
    Except, no, armor doesn't take up those slots. Unless you're telling me that this:

    Quote Originally Posted by SRD
    Full Plate

    The suit includes gauntlets, heavy leather boots, a visored helmet, and a thick layer of padding that is worn underneath the armor.
    ...means wearing a suit of full plate takes up your hands, feet, armor, torso, and shirt slots.

    Woo! Another way to shaft the fighter!

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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    Quote Originally Posted by slexlollar89 View Post
    You ever play Morrowind? I had magic pants in that game...
    I used Parachute Pants - CE slowfall. Handy piece of kit there.
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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    The pants slot would be helpful, IMHO. It would at least give the Sorc somewhere to put his Cha-booster besides the Cloak spot(Assless chaps or tight pants of Cha would be epic and hilarious).
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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fax Celestis View Post
    On that same argument, neither are the hands slot. You either have gloves made of a soft substance, or gloves made of a hard substance (gauntlets).
    Yes, but not only is there a fantasy precedent for both gloves and gauntlets, but it is also more high-concept. A gauntlet of strength or throwing lightning bolts, or a glove of dexterity, is simply a powerfully evocative mental image. It's harder to picture someone crafting pands of thunderbolts, which smite the unlucky devil that you knee in the groin.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sstoopidtallkid View Post
    The pants slot would be helpful, IMHO. It would at least give the Sorc somewhere to put his Cha-booster besides the Cloak spot(Assless chaps or tight pants of Cha would be epic and hilarious).
    Now we know why Hennet's got the belt-fetish... he's making up for the lack of Leg slot!

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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    cargo shorts of holding
    Pants with a bag of holding type 1 on each leg.
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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    There are already a ton of magic item slots. I would guess that they left out leg for the sake of brevity and because of the possibility of magic pants.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fax Celestis View Post
    ...means wearing a suit of full plate takes up your hands, feet, armor, torso, and shirt slots.

    Woo! Another way to shaft the fighter!
    I think the people who made the game were almost thinking that, yes. You can wear different gloves, different boots, and wear bracers under metal armor. The leather padding was so that a Mace hit didn't instantly transfer it's force to your chest.

    WotC probably decided that allowing a Fighter to grab new helmets/headbands, boots, and gloves and that it shouldn't change the overall AC of the Fighter but removing leg-guards would.

    Of course, there is no earring slot and only 2 rings despite having many other digits. Sometimes things are made to be balanced and sometimes they are just forgotten.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    Quote Originally Posted by afroakuma View Post
    Yes, but not only is there a fantasy precedent for both gloves and gauntlets, but it is also more high-concept. A gauntlet of strength or throwing lightning bolts, or a glove of dexterity, is simply a powerfully evocative mental image. It's harder to picture someone crafting pands of thunderbolts, which smite the unlucky devil that you knee in the groin.
    Well, you'd have to have some sense with what they can do. Associated abilities could be extradimensional pockets, perhaps, or increased movement speed. Maybe plusses to Reflex saves. Increased carrying capacity. Stability (or upgrades to stability). Bonuses to Perform skills (like Perform: Dance).

    Then you can also make subtle jokes (as D&D items do) and make parachute pants, which feather fall you.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    Wiz-Aubury: "Hey, we should have a legs slot for magic leg armours!"

    Wiz-Boris: "Yeah! I could design Magic Leather, Pants of Power, Pants of Divine Purity and Pants of Deception Flameburt. It'll be great!"

    Wiz-Charlie: "But what about sales in England where the word pants by itself automatically implies underpants and is consequently hilarious?"

    Wiz-Aubury: "Oh good point."

    Wiz-Boris: "Hmmm... Spatbook?"

    WotC proudly presents the latest expansion to the basic game: Britches of Battle!

    Magic items galore, from the anti-werewolf armour Long Johns of Silver to the fabled Kord Pants. And Battle mages, place your spell components in your magic khaki cargo combats of component concealment.

    Discover new monsters such as the Lurking Levi and the Trouser Titan!

    New classes! Discover the Marching Master Prestige Class and the new base Class Can-Can kick dancer! Full BAB!

    Extra feats! A trained rogue can steal a belt straight off someone. Then after a flanker de-pants your opponent you can grapple by stepping on the floored britches!

    All classes can benefit from warrior to skillmonkey!

    *Cover of the book featuring Gimble the Bard wearing Clown pants.*
    If only I'd got in the Waist to Feet / Waste 2 Feat pun.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sstoopidtallkid View Post
    The pants slot would be helpful, IMHO. It would at least give the Sorc somewhere to put his Cha-booster besides the Cloak spot(Assless chaps or tight pants of Cha would be epic and hilarious).
    Great minds think alike - chaps of sexiness were one of the first items to come to mind, along with the Kilt of the Moon - say, a Moon Bolt 3/day, and you can guess how you activate it.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    I find your lack of pants disturbing.
    You came in those pants? You're braver than I thought!
    These aren't the pants you're looking for.
    I'm not in this for your revolution, and I'm not in it for you, Princess. I expect to be well paid! I'm in it for the pants!
    ... sorry, just seemed timely.
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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fax Celestis View Post
    while "full plate" in real life entails a full suit of armor, wearing full plate in-game does not occupy your head, hands, feet, waist, face, or arms slots, so a suit of full plate doesn't apparently come with a helmet, gauntlets, boots, belt, faceplate or even forearm protection.
    Not precisely.

    Armor is always created so that even if the type of armor comes with boots or gauntlets, these pieces can be switched for other magic boots or gauntlets. (src)
    The fact that helmets don't affect AC is its own issue. I would assume any belt could be worn over your armor, and that forearm protection could be swapped out just as hand/feet slots can.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fax Celestis View Post
    You can also wear a robe over it or a shirt underneath it.
    Pretty sure this is false.

    One robe or suit of armor on the body (over a vest, vestment, or shirt) (src)
    You can wear a robe or armor, and a "shirt". You can't wear armor and a robe.

    I think part of the problem is that a lot of what a leg slot could cover is already taken care of by boots and/or armor. Protection? Armor. Jumping, running, etc? Boots.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    Quote Originally Posted by kamikasei View Post
    The fact that helmets don't affect AC is its own issue. I would assume any belt could be worn over your armor, and that forearm protection could be swapped out just as hand/feet slots can.
    So, then, could shin guards, I would assume.

    You can wear a robe or armor, and a "shirt". You can't wear armor and a robe.
    Okay, you got me there. Still, though. You can wear a shirt and armor, why not pants?

    I think part of the problem is that a lot of what a leg slot could cover is already taken care of by boots and/or armor. Protection? Armor. Jumping, running, etc? Boots.
    Carrying capacity? Stability? Charisma? Bonuses on long distance travel? Reflex saves?

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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fax Celestis View Post
    Carrying capacity?
    ... why? The thematic connection seems tenuous. Sure, your legs support your weight when you're carrying stuff, but so does your back, and your feet, and ... etc.

    Stability?
    Can be done just fine by the Feet slot.

    Charisma?
    I don't think WotC wanted this level of innuendo in their core rules.

    Bonuses on long distance travel?
    Can be done by the Feet slot. But I guess it sort of makes sense too.

    Reflex saves?
    Can be done just fine by the Feet slot.

    In fact, I think I've actually seen some officially-published magic Greaves somewhere that used the Feet slot. And Anklets in the MIC sure do. So it appears to be on purpose that legs and feet really share one body slot.

    If you want to make magic pants, I suggest they compete with belts for the Waist slot. Just my 2 cents.
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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    Think that Fax played a bit too much Morrowind
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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    The legs do seem to be the common casualty of the magic item bonanza. While it is more difficult to think of great enchantments for them, I do think they should at least be an option.

    I mean, the legs are a good chunk of most bodies, why can't you enchant the fabric/armor that protects them? Of course, it's also funny to think of everyone in the D&D world running around pantless because there is no leg slot.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    "Other slots already do it" seems like a really weak argument to me, especially if you want to argue that it was the intent of the designers that each slot do something unique- the official affinities list already has duplications for 'protection' (cloaks and amulets) and 'physical improvement' (shirts and belts.) Not to mention the multiple vaguely differentiated affinities, like 'ranged attacks', 'combat', and 'destructive power'.

    I would argue that there are just too many magic item slots as is, and there's no particular game need for more regardless of much sense it would make for a legs slot to exist. Especially if the MIC rules on combining enchantments are used, which alleviates one of the biggest pressures on limited spaces by no longer forcing you to pay extra just to get both Natural Armor and Con/Wis.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    The Kilt sounds like an interesting choice for a magic item.
    Last edited by hamishspence; 2009-02-04 at 02:30 PM.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    Quote Originally Posted by bayar View Post
    Think that Fax played a bit too much Morrowind
    I was seriously wondering; I have never played a CRPG or PCRPG with a leg slot for equipment.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    You're all wrong.

    All worn magic items except armor can be sundered.

    So if there were magic pants they could be sundered.

    And there's no underwear in D&D.

    Thus, the existence of magic pants would mean that players may find themselves with the wrong part exposed during battle.


    And let's not talk about something like cursed magic pants that you couldn't take off.
    That would be really crippling.

    In a more serious note, probably because there's already plenty of body slots. Just like there aren't magic earrings or shoulderpads.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    Quote Originally Posted by Oslecamo View Post

    And let's not talk about something like cursed magic pants that you couldn't take off.
    That would be really crippling.
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    Default Re: [3.5] Why Is There No "Legs" Item Slot?

    Trouser Effects:
    Speed (Running shorts +xfeet of movement)
    Swim (swimming trunks - Gain x swim speed)
    Stability (+x against bullrush and trip attempts)
    Reflex saves (dodgeball shorts, +x to reflex saves)
    Feather fall (the aforementioned parchute pants)
    storage/carry capacity (Bag of holding/ ignore x pounds of carried weight {but not worn equipment weight})
    endurance related things (+x against fatigue/exaustion)
    Surprising your opponents (+x init)
    kicking attack bonuses (Kick pants +x to unarmed attacks)
    hide/move silently bonuses (Stealth pants)
    freedom of movement (pants unbound?)

    Actually, on Nuisha(OWoD Werecoyotes) character sheets, the space where auspice would be for the other changing breeds the coyotes have a spot for pants (in the example characters the the pants spot is used for something witty, and with being gaia's laughter and all, how they respond to an easy joke set up does demonstrate things about your character's personality, and the nuisha have no auspice{they are all ragabash})
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