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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    AssassinGuy

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    Default The makings of a BBEG

    A lot of monsters like outsiders have the mental abilities and the abilities like teleportation to be the logical linchpin for any kind of nefarious plot.

    But what about class levels? What classes do you like to use for a final showdown? Granted, minions can provide most of the abilities for a BBEG that you would want, but when it comes to the final showdown what's your favorite class for a real knock-down battle royale?

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    Titan in the Playground
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    Default Re: The makings of a BBEG

    I like critters with good mental scores and physical abilities, but no casting. Then I give them casting, and make them mostly defensive-based. Basically, set it up so that the party's magic is mostly nullified, and then their fighting a gorram combat BEAST.

    Dragons are notoriously good at this, as are most high-level demons/devils/unique fiends (like archdevils and demon princes).

    All that I say applies only to myself. You author your own actions and choices. I cannot and will not be responsible for you, nor are you for me, regardless of situation or circumstance.

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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Kaihaku's Avatar

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    Thumbs up Re: The makings of a BBEG

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrawn183 View Post
    A lot of monsters like outsiders have the mental abilities and the abilities like teleportation to be the logical linchpin for any kind of nefarious plot.

    But what about class levels? What classes do you like to use for a final showdown? Granted, minions can provide most of the abilities for a BBEG that you would want, but when it comes to the final showdown what's your favorite class for a real knock-down battle royale?
    I prefer the Divine Classes. Clerics make for nice BBEGs that can engage most other classes on even footing. It's harder for a DM to handle a Wizard BBEG because if you do him justice he smokes the party. Clerics are a bit less squishy and with the right domains can challenge a party without utterly destroying them. Paladins, or Blackguards, also make for nice martial oriented BBEGs.
    Umuntu ngumuntu ngabantu.

    Your living is determined not so much by what life brings to you as by the attitude you bring to life; not so much by what happens to you as by the way your mind looks at what happens.
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    Orc in the Playground
     
    Temp.'s Avatar

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    Default Re: The makings of a BBEG

    I like mid-level Experts. And Formians. I have a tendency to use each at least once in any given group.

    Using weak NPC classed characters seems to always bring an interesting scene: the Players find the Evil Fortress of Terrifying Intent, kill a few hordes of Mooks, have an epic confrontation with the Dragon and smash the door in to the BBEG's chambers, expecting to have a battle that trivializes everything they've experienced thus far. But instead they find a defenseless old man. Intra-party conflict ensues. Invariably a vocal member will want the old man dead, but other members will sympathize and still others will have qualms with killing a defenseless old fart. Instead of a tactical fight that might be interchangable with any high-level character battle, the PCs get a memorable question of ethics within the group. Divisions tend to develop within the party to emerge later. And whatever they choose, whatever happens, I'll be sure to make it haunt them.

    And I like monsters that make the PCs squirm to agree with -- a society of ghouls or a symbiote/disease that turns its hosts into monsters (maybe they won't kill anything too often, but if the disease spreads society will crumble in months). But I like the PCs to sympathize with the creatures that they're inclined to slash up and kill on sight.

    Then I'll throw a change up with a high-level heat/dehydration-themed Sorcerer who's decided to destroy/dehydrate the Earth to raise the value of water in the interplanar commodities market. Keeps the players on their toes.

    I like Sorcerer and other classes with restricted but themed power lists as BBEGs more than other classes. It tends to keep the villains a bit more memorable than generic omnipotent Archivist/Wizards that tend to blur into each other after a while.

    ...And, of course, the big scary Formians. Because generic hive-mind insect villains are double plus nifty.
    Last edited by Temp.; 2009-02-04 at 08:15 PM.

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    Ogre in the Playground
     
    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: The makings of a BBEG

    Dragons. More Dragons. Even More Dragons.

    Then I add class levels to do what ever I want the dragon to do. I have two current BBEG dragons, both of which are wyrmlings. You heard me. The players are scared silly of them. One is a black dragon assasin/rouge/[multiple other classes], CR 6, and the other is a blue dragon wizard/warlock, CR 4. The assasin killed my brother's CR 12 character . I laughed for weeks about him being killed by something half his level no bigger than a housecat...

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    Titan in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: The makings of a BBEG

    Soul Eater goes great with evil critters, but on a dragon or especially a Pit Fiend, it's lethal.

    If you can lower the magic bar for the battle, then a creature stuffed with fighter levels can give the party a nasty run for its money.

    Clerics have some nice tricks, and rogue sneak attack bonuses are just lovely for those hard-to-find baddies.

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    Titan in the Playground
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    Default Re: The makings of a BBEG

    Give it levels in Fiend of Possession from the Fiend Folio. It should be possessing some high-HP adventurer-turned-noble and using him as a puppet to further its nefarious schemes. The final showdown will involve the PCs fighting the possessed noble rather than the fiend directly. When the noble is extremely low on HP, have the noble saying something about one of the PCs (spellcaster preferably) bringing statues to life. The fiend then exits the noble and possesses a statue (ethereally so the guards don't see it), thus freeing the noble to his rightful mind. The possessed statue then pulverizes the already-nearly-dead noble, likely crying out for mercy with his last breaths, and the PCs get blamed for his murder. The fiend would of course make his escape and probably watch in malicious glee as the PCs are persecuted for the apparent crime.

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    Titan in the Playground
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    Default Re: The makings of a BBEG

    Quote Originally Posted by afroakuma View Post
    Soul Eater goes great with evil critters, but on a dragon or especially a Pit Fiend, it's lethal.

    If you can lower the magic bar for the battle, then a creature stuffed with fighter levels can give the party a nasty run for its money.

    Clerics have some nice tricks, and rogue sneak attack bonuses are just lovely for those hard-to-find baddies.
    Fiendish Advanced Elite Multi-Headed Pesudonatural Kraken Soul Eater 10. That beast was a creation of a friend of mine. It obliterated more than a small handful of level 20 characters. >_< Soul Eater... scary stuff.

    Here's a fun bad guy monster w/ levels: a dogai, or assassin devil (from Fiendish Codex 2) with assassin, ninja, and/or rogue levels. They're already scary bastards anyways, but the levels just make them even better at it.

    All that I say applies only to myself. You author your own actions and choices. I cannot and will not be responsible for you, nor are you for me, regardless of situation or circumstance.

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    Titan in the Playground
     
    afroakuma's Avatar

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    Default Re: The makings of a BBEG

    Better yet, use my homebrew ninja class. The villain I made with it was quite something.

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    Titan in the Playground
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    Default Re: The makings of a BBEG

    Quote Originally Posted by afroakuma View Post
    Better yet, use my homebrew ninja class. The villain I made with it was quite something.
    I recall. God love Ninjas and Dogai.

    All that I say applies only to myself. You author your own actions and choices. I cannot and will not be responsible for you, nor are you for me, regardless of situation or circumstance.

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    AslanCross's Avatar

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    Default Re: The makings of a BBEG

    I tend to multiclass my BBEGs a lot, usually between martial adept classes and a caster-ish class. My last BBEG was a half-fiend ogre mage warlock/crusader. Unfortunately, the campaign died just a few sessions from finishing. :(


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  12. - Top - End - #12
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    AssassinGuy

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    Default Re: The makings of a BBEG

    Quote Originally Posted by AslanCross View Post
    I tend to multiclass my BBEGs a lot, usually between martial adept classes and a caster-ish class. My last BBEG was a half-fiend ogre mage warlock/crusader. Unfortunately, the campaign died just a few sessions from finishing. :(
    That's just... weird. How do you even describe something like that in game?

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    Titan in the Playground
     
    afroakuma's Avatar

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    Default Re: The makings of a BBEG

    "A tall, powerful thingy that wants to kill you."

    That describes Dandag, as well.

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    Spamalot in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: The makings of a BBEG

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaihaku View Post
    It's harder for a DM to handle a Wizard BBEG because if you do him justice he smokes the party.
    That all depends on the party's makeup. I had a group who could tear up every Wizard build I pulled from the online boards. Yet they nearly fell to the Dervish I put together...

    ...but I agree with you that cleric a is good choice for BBEG class.
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