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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Halfling in the Playground
     
    Garian's Avatar

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    Default Warlock as party fighter build? Help/advice

    I came up with build in a dream actually...
    An Orc barbarian 1/warlock, all other levels.
    This build relies on the ability to channel eldrich blast though melee attacks.

    The problems with it are, the low health, the low BAB and the low Cha bonus.
    Also few Skills that party fighters want.

    The Good things are the 1d6 extra damage per two levels -1 rounded down on every hitting melee attack. Way to high strength this character has from 1st level. Being similar to any other fighter but with the evocations from the warlock class. Damage reduction, fast healing and energy resistance also help.
    With the +4 str from being an orc and the +4 every rage it makes up for a few levels of lacking the high BAB.

    Important Feats would be: Extra Rage, Extended Rage, The feat that let you use armor at heaver levels then light (its name escapes me) and finely Mortalbane. Maybe weapon focus.

    Idea's for improvement? Weakness'? Why this does not work or why a different party fighter is better?
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  2. - Top - End - #2
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    Neithan's Avatar

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    Default Re: Warlock as party fighter build? Help/advice

    I'd simply take more levels of barbarian. Makes the eldritch blast weaker, but you get to actually use it that way. Doesn't help you if you have a very strong ability you can not use.
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  3. - Top - End - #3
    Orc in the Playground
     
    Baalthazaq's Avatar

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    Default Re: Warlock as party fighter build? Help/advice

    Usually with lock like that you just want 4 levels of Lock for the Lesser invocation.

    That way you get either permanent flight, the teleport + illusion, or stony grasp to try to grab at your enemies before you attack them.

    As for your least invocations:
    Hideous Blow, Sickening Blast, Earthen Grasp, Spiderwalk.

    Again earthen grasp for when you need to pin someone before you attack yourself.
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  4. - Top - End - #4

    Default Re: Warlock as party fighter build? Help/advice

    The problem with that build is that Eldritch Glaive is a special full-round action; it doesn't work with Pounce. Hideous Blow can't be used in a charge either, provokes AOOs, and requires a free hand. I've seen some very nice melee Warlock builds, but they're not "similar to any other fighter". My advice is to play to your strengths: you have a class that can fly at will, so take Flyby Attack at level 6 and dip in a class with lots of standard actions. How about Warlock 14/Warblade 6? If you time it right, there's a stance that gives you reach, so you can avoid AOOs more easily.

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Orc in the Playground
     
    Baalthazaq's Avatar

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    Default Re: Warlock as party fighter build? Help/advice

    Quote Originally Posted by Faleldir View Post
    The problem with that build is that Eldritch Glaive is a special full-round action; it doesn't work with Pounce. Hideous Blow can't be used in a charge either, provokes AOOs, and requires a free hand. I've seen some very nice melee Warlock builds, but they're not "similar to any other fighter". My advice is to play to your strengths: you have a class that can fly at will, so take Flyby Attack at level 6 and dip in a class with lots of standard actions. How about Warlock 14/Warblade 6? If you time it right, there's a stance that gives you reach, so you can avoid AOOs more easily.
    That's why I was thinking of things like the pin from earthen grasp. At the very least you actually USE your opponent's AoO. So you can now freely move into his square for next round. Assuming it survives 2 rounds.
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    Gnome Illusionist. Preferably with Cityscape allowed.

    Kender Spellthief.

    LG Hellbred Cleric of Levistus. Fiendish Codex needed.
    Low levels good but hope to reach epic.

    Wizard developing his own school of magic.
    Low levels good but hope to reach >18.
    1 custom feat request but it isn't vital.

    Warforge Artificer (Backstory not Eberron specific)
    Minimum level 6. Needs dryad cohort.

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: Warlock as party fighter build? Help/advice

    Really, one level of Barbarian doesn't really give you much. Plus, there's no support for this kind of mix (besides one homebrewed PrC on the boards, but I only remember that if exists, and that it's a Barbarian/Warlock mix, so if you can find it and use it, good for you). Nevermind, here is is: Eldritch Rager

    If you really want a melee Warlock without the homebrew, Warlock/Cleric/Eldritch Disciple(Complete Mage) with Eldritch Glaive is the way to go, but that's a very different feel.
    Last edited by MeklorIlavator; 2009-04-12 at 04:02 PM.

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Darrin's Avatar

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    Default Re: Warlock as party fighter build? Help/advice

    Quote Originally Posted by Garian View Post
    The problems with it are, the low health, the low BAB and the low Cha bonus.
    Also few Skills that party fighters want.
    Use the magic-blooded template (Dragon #306, +2 Cha -2 Wis, see Crystalkeep's 3.0 templates for details) to eliminate the Cha penalty.

    Quote Originally Posted by Faleldir View Post
    The problem with that build is that Eldritch Glaive is a special full-round action; it doesn't work with Pounce. Hideous Blow can't be used in a charge either, provokes AOOs, and requires a free hand.
    Travel Devotion fixes the "can't pounce" thing, although without turn attempts to burn you're limited to 10 rounds per day. Cleric 3/Warlock 4/Eldritch Disciple 10 is a much stronger melee build because you've got Divine Powah! to give you full BAB.

    If you want to try an arcane glaivelock... hmm. How about Duskblade 2/Warlock 4/Abjurant Champion 5 to start with. Not sure where you'd go from there.

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Titan in the Playground
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    Default Re: Warlock as party fighter build? Help/advice

    Just to make it clear: It looks like the OP is using Hideous Blow, which lets you add your eldritch blast damage to a melee weapon attack. The much better option, however, is to take the Eldritch Glaive shape from Dragon Magic. Using that, you don't add it to your weapon, but shape the blast itself into a weapon. It's much better for several reasons:
    1: It has reach (without the doughnut hole in the middle that most reach weapons have).
    2: You can make a full attack with it.
    3: It makes touch attacks.
    4: If you score a critical hit with it, you multiply all of your blast damage, whereas with Hideous Blow, you just multiply the damage from the weapon itself (which is probably much lower).
    5: You don't need to have a weapon to attach it to, so you can save that money for other items, and you're not helpless if your DM puts you in one of those "naked in prison" situations.

    The only drawback is that you don't get the weapon damage or other effects, but as mentioned above, those are probably negligible compared to Eldritch Blast to begin with.
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  9. - Top - End - #9
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    HalflingRangerGuy

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    Default Re: Warlock as party fighter build? Help/advice

    Quote Originally Posted by Chronos View Post
    1: It has reach (without the doughnut hole in the middle that most reach weapons have).
    As I read it, it still has: "as if wielding a reach weapon" implies that it is just like any other reach weapon. It looks intriguing, though.

  10. - Top - End - #10
    Troll in the Playground
     
    PirateGuy

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    Default Re: Warlock as party fighter build? Help/advice

    Quote Originally Posted by RebelRogue View Post
    As I read it, it still has: "as if wielding a reach weapon" implies that it is just like any other reach weapon. It looks intriguing, though.
    You could try and get around that by taking Shorten Grip or Short Haft. Both permit you to attack adjacent with a reach weapon, and can be found in crystal keep's feat listing.

    Of the 2, Shorten Grip is clearer by RAW, as Short Haft requires you to take a swift action in the middle of a full action, which your DM may or may not allow.
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  11. - Top - End - #11
    Titan in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Warlock as party fighter build? Help/advice

    I'm gonna go against the public grain and suggest Warlock 4/Cleric 3/Eldritch Theurge 3/Hellfire Warlock 3/Legacy Champion 4/Eldritch Theurge +3.

    End result: You get a legacy weapon. Eh. Screw it and don't use it. However! You get EB of 5d6, a Hellfire EB of +12d6, and the ability to use Divine Power/Might/What-have-you. Throw down 24-hour invocations and wear heavy plate to walk around with an 18d6 weapon with reach and the "tanking" ability of your average fighter. Take the Spell Domain and you have the wonderful, wonderful Allspell. Sure, you lose out on Pounce but the magical boost is more than enough to make up for it.

    End Result is only a BAB of 11, but that's not important since you end up with Cleric casting 9 and that renders BAB utterly meaningless. Coupled with Allspell which can replicate Wizard spells up to 4th(?) level.

    EDIT: I forgot to mention, but don't forget to take the Strongheart Vest and Open Least Chakra. This gives you DR equal to your Essentia Invested against Ability Damage, which allows you to use your Hellfire ability whenever you feel like it.
    Last edited by ZeroNumerous; 2009-04-12 at 09:24 PM.

  12. - Top - End - #12
    Titan in the Playground
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    Default Re: Warlock as party fighter build? Help/advice

    Note that both using Legacy Champion to advance a prestige class beyond its maximum level, and using Strongheart Vest to negate Hellfire Con damage, are on very shaky grounds, and many DMs won't allow either of them.
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  13. - Top - End - #13
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    streakster's Avatar

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    Default Re: Warlock as party fighter build? Help/advice

    Binding Naberius can replace the vest, though.
    Quote Originally Posted by true_shinken View Post
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    The perfect fighter fix.
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  14. - Top - End - #14
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: Warlock as party fighter build? Help/advice

    Ah, but that requires a couple more levels.

    Also, one thing about the current built is that it mandates and Evil Alignment, which is somewhat problematic for Clerics as it means you can't spontaneously convert, and also that what is likely the best ability(healing blast) is out of reach.

  15. - Top - End - #15
    Titan in the Playground
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    Default Re: Warlock as party fighter build? Help/advice

    Also, one thing about the current built is that it mandates and Evil Alignment
    I don't see anything in the thread thus far that requires evil. Even Hellfire Warlock is open to any alignment (the hope is that using hellfire will tempt a good character towards evil).
    Time travels in divers paces with divers persons.
    As You Like It, III:ii:328

    Chronos's Unalliterative Skillmonkey Guide
    Current Homebrew: 5th edition psionics

  16. - Top - End - #16
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: Warlock as party fighter build? Help/advice

    Ah, very true. I could have sworn it requires it, but it appears not to.

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