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Thread: Pounce

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    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    RangerGuy

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    Default Pounce

    I've been thinking on it, and I'm afraid that I don't like Pouncing. Yes, I can see from a game balance perspective how it equalizes damage potential somewhat, but from a simulationist perspective, it's quite silly.

    Yes, on a cat or something similar that attacks with many limbs, I can see how the extra force from a charge adds a little soemthing to each attack, but what about a level 20 Barbarian using all of his attacks, is his momentum really applying to that last swing? Isn't there a better way to solve the melee-attacker damage issue? Perhaps one that doesn't break credulity quite so much?

    I, for one, allow movement to be completely interspersed between attacks during a full attack action, so long as they do not supercede their movement limit, as soon as they do, their round ends, whether or not they finished up all their attacks.

    Does this really solve the problem?

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    Ogre in the Playground
     
    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Pounce

    I think you are confusing Pouncing and Power Attacking.

    Pouncing simply lets you get all of your attacks after a charge.

    In this way, charging doesnt really add much to the last swing.

    I am completely sorry if I misinterpreted your writing.

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    Ogre in the Playground
     
    AssassinGuy

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    Default Re: Pounce

    Why force them to end their turn with their movement?

    Also, didn't you just effectively give everyone pounce by allowing them to move 25 feet (hey! I still have 5 feet of movement!) and then full attacking? The big thing about pounce is movement and then full-attacking, not the +2hit. Pounce just happens to be the easiest way to move and still full attack, and also happens to get crazy synergy with PA with the right builds. But it's still the movement->full attack that's the most important.
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    Titan in the Playground
     
    Lizardfolk

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    Default Re: Pounce

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin B. View Post
    I, for one, allow movement to be completely interspersed between attacks during a full attack action, so long as they do not supercede their movement limit, as soon as they do, their round ends, whether or not they finished up all their attacks.
    Doesn't that defeat the purpose of Spring Attack and Shot on the Run?
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    Default Re: Pounce

    Quote Originally Posted by Cheesegear View Post
    Doesn't that defeat the purpose of Spring Attack and Shot on the Run?
    Well, yes, but those things shouldn't exist anyway because move+full attack should be a standard for all melee characters.

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    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Sstoopidtallkid's Avatar

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    Default Re: Pounce

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin B. View Post
    I've been thinking on it, and I'm afraid that I don't like Pouncing. Yes, I can see from a game balance perspective how it equalizes damage potential somewhat, but from a simulationist perspective, it's quite silly.

    Yes, on a cat or something similar that attacks with many limbs, I can see how the extra force from a charge adds a little soemthing to each attack, but what about a level 20 Barbarian using all of his attacks, is his momentum really applying to that last swing? Isn't there a better way to solve the melee-attacker damage issue? Perhaps one that doesn't break credulity quite so much?
    Okay, it seems here your objection is not to pounce(Full attack on a charge), but to the fact that Power Attack still applies. Which seems odd. PA is just swinging harder but slower, so it's easier to avoid but hurts more. All attacks should benefit from it. You could be objecting to the charge bonus still applying, I guess, which is a boost in attack bonus, noot damage. If that's the case, think of it as your daring run directly at the enemy, frothing at the mouth and swinging a giant overcompensator, left everyone a bit off-balance and unprepared, and you take advantage of that to keep them off-balance and unprepared for as long as posssible(+2 AB for one round). However, in so doing, you leave yourself open as well(-2 AC for the same duration).

    Actually, reading that again, it seems your objection is to something else, maybe Leap Attack, still applying. If so, repost and CLARIFY. We know only what you tell us, so please try to avoid confusion.
    I, for one, allow movement to be completely interspersed between attacks during a full attack action, so long as they do not supercede their movement limit, as soon as they do, their round ends, whether or not they finished up all their attacks.
    What movement limit? A move action? A run? A Charge? A Double-move(not always the same as a charge)? The reason Pounce is loved so much is that it allows what you have houseruled in. I wouldn't recommend quite your decision, just on the basis of the fluff for a full-attack action, but houseruling the ability to take a move action without interfering with the ability to full-attack is not unheard of on here.

    Just be careful no one plays a Scout.
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    Default Re: Pounce

    Quote Originally Posted by Sstoopidtallkid View Post
    Just be careful no one plays a Scout.
    Yeah, they might do almost as much damage as lazy Rogue.

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    Titan in the Playground
     
    AssassinGuy

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    Default Re: Pounce

    Quote Originally Posted by Dark_Scary View Post
    Well, yes, but those things shouldn't exist anyway because move+full attack should be a standard for all melee characters.
    You're talking about a completely different game, then. D&D 4th ed. went the other way, removing the "full attack".

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    Default Re: Pounce

    Quote Originally Posted by Dark_Scary View Post
    Well, yes, but those things shouldn't exist anyway because move+full attack should be a standard for all melee characters.
    That's why many, many melee builds you'll see are:

    1) Shadowpouncers
    2) 1-level barbarian dippers
    3)Feral-template buyoffers

    We here tend to think Pounce is very nice :D

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    Ettin in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Pounce

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