Spell slots, what to do with them?

[Chineselegolas]

I'm playing a Sorcerer/Shujenga/Mystic Theurge and I have plenty of spells and tend to finish the adventuring day with most of them unused as we have a psion in the party who blows through power points rather fast and is the limiter on how far we go.

So I'm looking for other things I can spend my spell slots of stuff to mean I get to do some more during the day.
Currently have the Spell Shield alternate class feature from Dungeonscape to reduce damage, Krauvaul's combined sigil to boost saves 2/day, Versatile Spellcaster to get more of the high level spells.

[Zaq]

There's always Explosive Runes.

If you're allowed to take spells off of obscure lists (maybe with research?), you could take the 2nd level Wu Jen spell Fire Shuriken and make a stockpile of 'em. Better than nothing.

If you're allowed to retroactively take ACFs, you can spend a LOT of spell slots on the Divine Companion from Complete Champion.

What's your caster level? If it's at least 8 or 9 (with buffs, of course), you can spend a bunch of spells slots on Quick Potion (Or, if your caster level is lower, Extended Quick Potion) at the end of every day. What you do is you cast a bunch of Quick Potions, then you fill them with your leftover spell slots. First thing in the morning, you drink 'em all (or pass them around, both are good) and you've got your morning buffs all set and ready. The reason that you want to have a caster level of at least 8 or 9 is to ensure that they last overnight, so they use the evening's spell slots and not the morning's. Just make sure to leave a handful of slots in reserve, just in case you get ambushed overnight.

Does any of that help?

[HamsterOfTheGod]

I'm playing a Sorcerer/Shujenga/Mystic Theurge and I have plenty of spells and tend to finish the adventuring day with most of them unused as we have a psion in the party who blows through power points rather fast and is the limiter on how far we go.

So I'm looking for other things I can spend my spell slots of stuff to mean I get to do some more during the day.
Currently have the Spell Shield alternate class feature from Dungeonscape to reduce damage, Krauvaul's combined sigil to boost saves 2/day, Versatile Spellcaster to get more of the high level spells.

Quicken. Use the feat and/or rod(s) of same.

Also the feat Versatile Spellcaster from Races of the Dragon. This allows your sorcerer to convert 2 spells of a specific level into a single spell, one level higher.

Also read this http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=860220 and similar stuff.

Alternately, find a way for the psion to get more PPs. Here's one way, if you don't mind him "shining" just a little more, http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/sp...ansference.htm (had to go look it up, psionics is not my strong suit)

Dweomer Of Transference
Evocation
Level: Cleric 4, sorcerer/wizard 4
Components: V, S
Casting Time: 1 minute
Range: Close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels)
Target: One willing psionic creature
Duration: 1 round/level
Saving Throw: Will negates (harmless)
Spell Resistance: Yes (harmless)

With this spell, you form a radiating corona around the head of a psionic ally, then convert some of your spells into psionic power points. When you finish casting dweomer of transference, a red-orange glow surrounds the psionic creature’s head. For the duration of the spell, any spells cast at the subject don’t have their usual effect, instead converting themselves harmlessly into psionic energy that the subject can use as energy for psionic powers. You can cast any spell you like at the subject, even area spells, effect spells, and spells for whom the subject would ordinarily not be a legitimate target. The spells don’t do anything other than provide the subject with power points, but you must still cast them normally, obeying the component and range requirements listed in the description of each spell.

For each spell you cast into the dweomer of transference, the psionic creature gets temporary power points, according to the following table. The transference isn’t perfectly efficient. The temporary power points acquired through a dweomer of transference dissipate after 1 hour if they haven’t already been spent.

Spell  Power Points
Level  Acquired 
0      0 
1st    1 
2nd    2 
3rd    4 
4th    6 
5th    8 
6th    10 
7th    12 
8th    14 
9th    16

[ericgrau]

Long lasting buffs. Cast 'em in the morning, stack 'em, make the party love you. Other than that you could get some high level utility spells that may or may not get wasted if you can't find any other options.

[Chineselegolas]

There's always Explosive Runes.

If you're allowed to take spells off of obscure lists (maybe with research?), you could take the 2nd level Wu Jen spell Fire Shuriken and make a stockpile of 'em. Better than nothing.

Will pick up explosive runes when I get 3rd level arcane spells, then at the end of the adventuring day will start filling my haversack with paper covered in them.
Will ask the DM about that spell, not sure how he will react

If you're allowed to retroactively take ACFs, you can spend a LOT of spell slots on the Divine Companion from Complete Champion.

Not allowed CC, one of the other players took a few things from there and was a tad too powerful for the game the DM wanted, and upon my pointing out some of the other poorly thought out things in it...
And I gave up my familiar for Spell Shield (Dungeonscape)

What's your caster level? If it's at least 8 or 9 (with buffs, of course), you can spend a bunch of spells slots on Quick Potion (Or, if your caster level is lower, Extended Quick Potion) at the end of every day. What you do is you cast a bunch of Quick Potions, then you fill them with your leftover spell slots. First thing in the morning, you drink 'em all (or pass them around, both are good) and you've got your morning buffs all set and ready. The reason that you want to have a caster level of at least 8 or 9 is to ensure that they last overnight, so they use the evening's spell slots and not the morning's. Just make sure to leave a handful of slots in reserve, just in case you get ambushed overnight.

Currently caster level only 6, (With spells known and per day of 4 Sorcerer, 5 Shujenga), and where is Quick Potion from?
There is also the thing I don't have any long duration buff spells. Only buff spells I have are bless, magic weapon and resistance. And the others I could swap around for have durations of minute/level, which at the start of the day not enough duration

Does any of that help?

I don't play casters very often, everything helps.

Quicken. Use the feat and/or rod(s) of same.

Quicken... Will try and get a rod when I have the money for that. I'm a spontaneous caster so the feat doesn't work.

Also the feat Versatile Spellcaster from Races of the Dragon. This allows your sorcerer to convert 2 spells of a specific level into a single spell, one level higher.

Also read this http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=860220 and similar stuff.

And I've got versatile caster already. And have read through the handbooks, all seem to just offer suggestions of spells or classes. Not what to do with the sheer number of spare spell slots at the end of the day

Alternately, find a way for the psion to get more PPs. Here's one way, if you don't mind him "shining" just a little more, http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/sp...ansference.htm (had to go look it up, psionics is not my strong suit)

Dweomer Of Transference

That is a really cool spell. Might pick it up when I can

Long lasting buffs. Cast 'em in the morning, stack 'em, make the party love you. Other than that you could get some high level utility spells that may or may not get wasted if you can't find any other options.

Thinking I might just have to pick up some all day buff spells.

[HamsterOfTheGod]

Quicken... Will try and get a rod when I have the money for that. I'm a spontaneous caster so the feat doesn't work.

Ah OK...Quicken will not work with Shugenja because it's a spontaneous class...Oriental Adventures is not my strong suit either...

And I gave up my familiar for Spell Shield (Dungeonscape)

But you are a Sorcerer/Shujenga/Mystic Theurge. Without Improved Familiar your familiar is gonna suck. If you can retcon into the Metamagic Variant Sorcerer from PHB2 (which can use Metamagic without the full round penalty) then your Sorcerer side can use Quicken.

Thinking I might just have to pick up some all day buff spells.

At higher levels you can get Persistent Spell (requires Extend Spell) to extend your personal range or touch spell to a 24 duration. Not sure how useful this is with the Sugenja spell list. According to this, http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1187297, "Earth Shugenja might consider this one essential. Fire and Water Shugenja find it harder to utilize as effectively."

But the persistent uses a spell slot 6 levels higher so you'll have to be at least level 17 (?) unless you get something to reduce the metamagic cost like Arcane Thesis. Since you also probably want/need Practiced Spellcaster (twice) you are probably already running out of feat slots.

[Chineselegolas]

Ah OK...Quicken will not work with Shugenja because it's a spontaneous class...Oriental Adventures is not my strong suit either...

Shugenja is from Complete Divine actually. But it is an eastern themed class

At higher levels you can get Persistent Spell (requires Extend Spell) to extend your divine personal range or touch spell to a 24 duration. Not sure how useful this is with the Sugenja spell list. According to this http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1187297 "Earth Shugenja might consider this one essential. Fire and Water Shugenja find it harder to utilize as effectively."

But the persistent uses a spell slot 6 levels higher so you'll have to be at least level 17 (?) unless you get something to reduce the metamagic cost like Arcane Thesis. Since you also probably want/need Practiced Spellcaster (twice) you are probably already running out of feat slots.

I am an Earth Shugenja, but as it is 6 levels higher, will need to be 16th level. Don't need practised spell caster, Illumian sigils raising caster level and dual progression classes. But will keep it in mind for at a later stage.

[HamsterOfTheGod]

Don't need practised spell caster, Illumian sigils raising caster level and dual progression classes.

Well one last thought is Arcane Strike. I imagine your not wading into melee but (as a free action), you can sacrifice an arcane spell slot to gain +2 to attack and +1d4 to damage per spell level to your next melee or ranged attack. The attack bonus is capped at your BAB and doesn't add up if you stack spell but IIRC damage bonus does add up if you stack spells. Might work well under certain circumstances depending on your buffs...

[Sstoopidtallkid]

Don't need practised spell caster, Illumian sigils raising caster level and dual progression classes. But will keep it in mind for at a later stage.

You apply benefits and penalties in the most beneficial order. So Practiced Spellcaster still applies.

[Numinous]

One way would be to pick more spells with a casting time of "1 swift action" or "1 immediate reaction". Burn through those slots more quickly.

There are plenty of them in Spell Compendium, and from memory a fair number in PHB2.

Can't give any advice on what spells to take though.

Chris

[Chineselegolas]

Well one last thought is Arcane Strike. I imagine your not wading into melee but (as a free action), you can sacrifice an arcane spell slot to gain +2 to attack and +1d4 to damage per spell level to your next melee or ranged attack. The attack bonus is capped at your BAB and doesn't add up if you stack spell but IIRC damage bonus does add up if you stack spells. Might work well under certain circumstances depending on your buffs...

I'm lacking in buffs. And my BAB at level 6 is only two at the moment, so a few levels of that +4 required. But combine with wraith strike and can toss out fair bit of damage...

You apply benefits and penalties in the most beneficial order. So Practiced Spellcaster still applies.

Both have cap of HD and at the moment both my CL are equal to my HD

One way would be to pick more spells with a casting time of "1 swift action" or "1 immediate reaction". Burn through those slots more quickly.

There are plenty of them in Spell Compendium, and from memory a fair number in PHB2.

Can't give any advice on what spells to take though.

Chris

I'll keep an eye out for more of them. The downside is just the limit to the number of spells I can know.

[HamsterOfTheGod]

Can't give any advice on what spells to take though.

Many gish build uses Wraithstrike, a 2nd level swift spell, which lets your melee attack that round be touch attacks.
Ninja'ed by OP

[Sstoopidtallkid]

Both have cap of HD and at the moment both my CL are equal to my HD.

Assuming you are currently level 6, 3/3 in levels, and have +3 to each from the Sigils, it still helps. You have CL 3 from class levels. You add 3 from Practiced Spellcaster, bringing you up to CL 6. Then you add 3 from the Sigils, bringing you up to 9. That's the reason you change the order you apply benefits in.

[Chineselegolas]

Assuming you are currently level 6, 3/3 in levels, and have +3 to each from the Sigils, it still helps. You have CL 3 from class levels. You add 3 from Practiced Spellcaster, bringing you up to CL 6. Then you add 3 from the Sigils, bringing you up to 9. That's the reason you change the order you apply benefits in.

Krau Sigil gives +2 to CL, upto character level. And Practised Spellcaster gives +4, upto character level. Order change makes no difference as neither can push over my level
And I'm actually at Sorcerer 1/Shugenja 2/Mystic Theurge 3. Improved Sigil trick for early entry. DM approved it.

[Sstoopidtallkid]

Krau Sigil gives +2 to CL, upto character level. And Practised Spellcaster gives +4, upto character level. Order change makes no difference as neither can push over my level
And I'm actually at Sorcerer 1/Shugenja 2/Mystic Theurge 3. Improved Sigil trick for early entry. DM approved it.

Ah, didn't realize the Sigils were limited by HD. Annoying.

[Gnaeus]

Wings of Cover (Races of the Dragon) Level 2 (sorcerer only spell)
Is an immediate action to give yourself complete cover from one attack. That sounds like a good start on your second level spells if your goal is blowing through your spells rapidly. Being immune to 4 attacks/day can't hurt.

Side question: your psion knows that he is limited to 6 (or whatever his manifester level is) pp per round, right?

[HamsterOfTheGod]

Wings of Cover (Races of the Dragon) Level 2 (sorcerer only spell)

Damn it. How could I forget that one? Have to remember to search here http://www.imarvintpa.com/DnDLive/FindSpell.php

[Chineselegolas]

Wings of Cover (Races of the Dragon) Level 2 (sorcerer only spell)
Is an immediate action to give yourself complete cover from one attack. That sounds like a good start on your second level spells if your goal is blowing through your spells rapidly. Being immune to 4 attacks/day can't hurt.

Side question: your psion knows that he is limited to 6 (or whatever his manifester level is) pp per round, right?

My Shugenja side has Air spells forbidden and trying to avoid air themed spells on Sorcerer side to be thematic (Yeah... Roleplaying *shudder*)

And yes, she does know limited to manifester level pp a round, just ends up using them so quickly... Max PP on her blasting power most the time eats through them fast. And she was the parties face before my current character showed up so was using lots of point for charm. Unfortunately don't think +6 on social checks will be enough and will still rely on her for charming to cover up the druids miss timed comments and the LG cleric/fighter annoying of our evil allies.

Damn it. How could I forget that one? Have to remember to search here http://www.imarvintpa.com/DnDLive/FindSpell.php

Wow, that site looks cool.

[Dagren]

At higher levels you can get Persistent Spell (requires Extend Spell) to extend your divine personal range or touch spell to a 24 duration. Not sure how useful this is with the Sugenja spell list. According to this, http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1187297, "Earth Shugenja might consider this one essential. Fire and Water Shugenja find it harder to utilize as effectively."

Don't know if I'm misinterpreting this, but it sounds like you're saying that Persistent Spell only works on divine magic?

[HamsterOfTheGod]

Don't know if I'm misinterpreting this, but it sounds like you're saying that Persistent Spell only works on divine magic?

Didn't mean to say that. Thanks. Fixed that above.

[Dagren]

Didn't mean to say that. Thanks. Fixed that above.

Happy to help. It also works on "fixed range" spells too, whatever that means. (Maybe the 60' and 120' arcs that detect spells and true seeing have respectively? I would have though those would have come under personal myself though. It isn't really clear)

[Cyclocone]

Ah OK...Quicken will not work with Shugenja because it's a spontaneous class...Oriental Adventures is not my strong suit either...

You might want to take a look at Rapid Metamagic from CMag.

There's also Arcane Fusion and Greater Arcane Fusion from the same book, and arcane spell surge of course.

Never play a theurge if you can't quicken

[HamsterOfTheGod]

You might want to take a look at Rapid Metamagic from CMag.

There's also Arcane Fusion and Greater Arcane Fusion from the same book, and arcane spell surge of course.

Goot catches all.

Never play a theurge if you can't quicken

QFT

[Chineselegolas]

Cool. Thanks for your advice guys.