A Sniper's Rundown

[Signmaker]

Having made a sniper for a PvP contest within my circle of friends, I'd like to find out when hide/move silently checks should be made. As such, I'll set up a few scenarios:

Scenario 1:

Player A moves and hides on their turn. Player B spends a portion of his turn seeking the hidden target.

Scenario 2:

Player A is hidden. From Player A's position, they snipe, and then hide.

Scenario 3:

Due to Woodland Archer, Player A may move after the sniping process, and then hide again.

Scenario 4:

As scenario three, but Hide in Plain Sight is an option.


Additional questions:

1. Is a player flatfooted against a snipe?

2. While hiding under plain sight, is the hiding character visible between movements (such as moving from spot A to spot B)?

[Keld Denar]

1) Yes

2) Yes. The Snipee could potentially ready an action to shoot back or cast a spell to hit you that would have no trouble finding you once your reveil youself.

I'd highly recommend UMD + Wand of Greater Invis or actual spellcasting levels + Greater Invis, and the Darkstalker feat from Lords of Madness to defeat extra sensory perception like Blindsense or Scent.

[Signmaker]

1) Yes

2) Yes. The Snipee could potentially ready an action to shoot back or cast a spell to hit you that would have no trouble finding you once your reveil youself.

I'd highly recommend UMD + Wand of Greater Invis or actual spellcasting levels + Greater Invis, and the Darkstalker feat from Lords of Madness to defeat extra sensory perception like Blindsense or Scent.

I've got Darkstalker covered, but I'd prefer not to use Greater Invisibility if at all possible. Personal preference.

[Keld Denar]

Then I'd highly suggest Superior Invis instead! :P

[pingcode20]

I'd say that if you pulled off the hide and moved away to re-snipe (or otherwise prevented yourself from being discovered), the whole ready action idea wouldn't help at all. I prefer to think of Sniping as basically 'shooting without breaking your cover' - if you snipe and succeed, your opponent can only tell what general direction the arrow or bolt got them from, not where you were precisely when you shot. Fireball area, maybe.

(Also: Crossbows + Crossbow Sniper for 60' ranged attack and an effective +6 to your hide check)

And yes, they'd be flatfooted versus the shot, since you're striking from 'surprise'.

---

But why would a hiding character be visible while moving? The spotter would be able to detect based on spot and listen checks, but the hider wouldn't become automatically visible and thus shootable, even if the spotter had a readied action.

[holywhippet]

Instead of invisibility you could use an illusion spell to make it look like you are out in the open. When your opponent shoots they will reveal their position while the real you is still hidden.

[Signmaker]

But why would a hiding character be visible while moving? The spotter would be able to detect based on spot and listen checks, but the hider wouldn't become automatically visible and thus shootable, even if the spotter had a readied action.

Consider: There are no facing rules in general DnD. Generally, one needs cover or concealment to hide (except in HiPS situations). So, minus HiPS, one would think that someone in, well, plain sight would be visible moving between cover.

[Curmudgeon]

So, minus HiPS, one would think that someone in, well, plain sight would be visible moving between cover.

Not necessarily. If you do it while the opponent's not looking your way you may still be undetected. Lacking facing rules, D&D does this through the Move between Cover use of Hide, detailed in Complete Adventurer. Basically you can move up to your Hide ranks in feet, with no cover or concealment, and still have a chance to stay hidden.

[Signmaker]

Another question:

Someone readies an action against your attempt to snipe. Is this doable, and what results?

[Curmudgeon]

Someone readies an action against your attempt to snipe. Is this doable, and what results?

No, it's not really doable. The problem is that a readied action isn't magic; it's just a plan. So someone using the Sniping rules is hiding, and you can't see them until after they attack. You can ready an action to happen immediately after they attack (i.e., the plan kicks in as soon as you see them), and before they use their move action to Hide again -- but you can't do anything to prevent the attack in the first place.