Results 1 to 30 of 46
Thread: The perfect assassin
-
2009-06-25, 03:25 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2008
The perfect assassin
I'm trying to build a perfect assassin for a 3.5 game. He should specialize in stealth (of course) and I like the idea of kukris for weapons. He needs to be able to nock out spellcasters. TOB is being used. Other than than I'm open to suggestions.
Last edited by Fortinbras; 2009-06-25 at 03:32 PM.
-
2009-06-25, 03:34 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Feb 2006
- Location
- Seattle, WA
- Gender
Re: The perfect assassin
Wizard20
Or...maybe...Abjurer3/MasterSpecialist10/Iot7V7.
Yea...that'll be nice...
-
2009-06-25, 04:25 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2007
- Location
- Texas...for now
- Gender
Re: The perfect assassin
[/sarcasm]
FAQ is not RAW!Avatar by the incredible CrimsonAngel.
Saph:It's surprising how many problems can be solved by one druid spell combined with enough aggression.
I play primarily 3.5 D&D. Most of my advice will be based off of this. If my advice doesn't apply, specify a version in your post.
-
2009-06-25, 05:21 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Oct 2007
- Location
- Some kind of hell
- Gender
Re: The perfect assassin
How nice that people ignore what you're asking for an immediately and always suggest wizard.
On that note, if you're TOB allowed, I'd suggest a swordsage focused on Shadow Hand and Tiger Claw. You'll have more than enough maneuvers to make that happen. You'll be fairly Dex and Wisdom based at that point, so I'd recomend the Shadow Blade feat to increase melee damage. Tiger Claw is especially helpful if you plan on two-weapon fighting with kukris, but I think you'd be better served with shortswords or regular daggers to use Shadow Blade. Tiger Claw will work either way, Shadow Blade is more particular.
As far as being to knock out spellcasters, there is always the Suel Arcanamach, another solid class. Unfortunately, the best anti-spellcaster generally is another spellcaster, but if you want to do it from the better-skilled-than-spelled type, I'd use Swordsage and consider multiclassing into Suel Arcanamach, but remember that it doesn't get maneuvers, and that can hurt you. Straight swordsage never hurt anyone (except the NPCs).
-XLast edited by ErrantX; 2009-06-25 at 05:23 PM.
Chris Bennett
Author and Lead Developer of Path of War
Freelancer
My credits:
Path of War and Path of War Expanded: An OGL Tome of Battle for the Pathfinder game system, for Dreamscarred Press.
Psionics Augmented: Psychic Warrior and Psionics Augmented: Soulknife for Dreamscarred Press.
My extended homebrew signature!
-
2009-06-25, 05:24 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2007
- Location
- Texas...for now
- Gender
Re: The perfect assassin
[/sarcasm]
FAQ is not RAW!Avatar by the incredible CrimsonAngel.
Saph:It's surprising how many problems can be solved by one druid spell combined with enough aggression.
I play primarily 3.5 D&D. Most of my advice will be based off of this. If my advice doesn't apply, specify a version in your post.
-
2009-06-25, 05:28 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2006
- Location
- Poland
- Gender
Re: The perfect assassin
It is not supposed to contest of optimisation. He wants a guy that kills his enemies with stealth&steel
He should specialize in stealth (of course) and I like the idea of kukris for weaponsLast edited by Spiryt; 2009-06-25 at 05:31 PM.
Avatar by KwarkpuddingThe subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing;
Rush in and die, dogs—I was a man before I was a king.
Whoever makes shoddy beer, shall be thrown into manure - town law from Gdańsk, XIth century.
-
2009-06-25, 05:30 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2004
- Location
- I wish I knew...
- Gender
Re: The perfect assassin
Here's a build I made which was pretty handy for the job:
Rogue xx/Swordsage2 (split up)/Nightsong Enforcer1/Bloodclaw Master 2
In effect: TWF precision-based damage dealer. Deals hundreds of damage per round. Has wands of Gravebane and Golembane in Wand Sheaths in his paired Kukri (which are both Tiger Claw and Shadow Hand weapons), which have the Collision enhancement on them (flat +5 to damage), and Craven to further increase sneak attack damage.
Looses no sneak attack dice from multiclassing due to Assassin's Stance, although he also has Island of Blades to make flanking easier.SpoilerQuite possibly, the best rebuttal I have ever witnessed.
Joker Bard - the DM's solution to the Batman Wizard.
Takahashi no Onisan - The scariest Samurai alive
Incarnum and YOU: a reference guide
Soulmelds, by class and slot: Another Incarnum reference
Multiclassing for Newbies: A reference guide for the rest of us
My homebrew world in progress: Falcora
-
2009-06-25, 05:33 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Feb 2006
- Location
- Seattle, WA
- Gender
Re: The perfect assassin
+1
The best caster killer is another caster.
I'd also like to posit a MoMF build as an assassin. WS Ranger5/MoMF2/Warshaper4/NaturesWarrior1/MoMF+7...or something like that. Scout as a bird, get in as a squirell, kill em as a RAMPAGING GIANT!, and then get out. Also, spread rumers about angry teleporting giants and noone will ever have reasons to suspect you. Ever.
Regardless, if you want to build an assassin, I highly suggest you stay just about as far from the actual Assassin PrC as possible. Its bad. Really bad.
Oh, I just remembered another good Assassin build. Rogue or Spelltheif1/Wizard4/UnseenSeer10/ArcaneTrickster5. Swap out a couple levels of AT for Archmage if desired. Nearly full wizard casting, ok sneak attacks, more sneak attack damage summonable at will via Hunter's Eye, lots of spells for sneakin, mobility, assassinatin, and all that jazz. Able Learner feat (Races of Destiny) and a high Int keeps your vital skills up to augement your castable sneakiness (you can be invisible AND hiding since See Invisible and True Seeing can't pierce mundane hiding). Throw in a bit of Darkstalker from Lords of Madness and you'll be virtually undetectable, especially late in life when you get Superior Invisibility and Mind Blank.
-
2009-06-25, 05:34 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jul 2007
- Location
- London
- Gender
Re: The perfect assassin
Try to get hold of power attack, leap attack and frenzied beserker. Then get a ring of Invis and a custom item of silence. Then go do the sneaky thing followed by a Coup de over nine thousand! Much higher save than a death attack from the assassin class and a damn funny image to think of a guy that sneaks all the way into his targets bedroom and then leaps across the room screaming and smacks them with a greataxe.
Give them bread and circusses and the plebs wont rise against you. Give adventurers dungeons and trapped chests and they won't waste time looking to ransack your home and kill your wife.
-
2009-06-25, 05:43 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2007
Re: The perfect assassin
Feats: Blindfight, Magekiller, Pierce Magical Protection, Pierce Magical Concealment.
Craven +1 to damage on a sneak attack per Character level. This multiplies on a crit,
Dragonfire strike (convert SA into elemental damage, with right feats it becomes able to SA undead)
PrC:
Occult slayer: Permanent nondetection, bonus to saves vs spells, bonus damage and attack vs casters. At will detect magic (auras only)
Witchslayer: Find possessed beings, smite possessed beings, Momentary Disjunction
Items:
-Mageslayer weapon, extra +2 enhancement, and +2d6 damage vs casters/invocation users
-Starmetal weapon, like adamant, but +1d6 vs outsiders on the prime
-Bracers of Murder: higher death attack DC, +d6's on your SA.
-Generally avoid things like flaming or frost on your weapons. You need extra +1's to hit, not extra d6's of random energy types.
-A +3 weapon (at least one) with a greater truedeath crystal. Now you can crit and SA undead. Or demolition crystal (vs constructs)
Revelation crystals, allows your party to find the invisible wizard if you hit him. You can find his square with a good listen check, and pierce magical concealment ignores the misschance of him being invisible. (But if he's invisible in a smoky room, you still get a misschance due to the smoke. But blindfight helps you there)
Seriously Keld, Tallkid. He's asking for an assassin. So give him things for an assassin. Why not just say "Druid 20, wildshape+natural spell, grapple wizards FTW!"
-
2009-06-25, 05:48 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Feb 2006
- Location
- Seattle, WA
- Gender
Re: The perfect assassin
If the Red Wizards of Thay sent an assassin after you, do you think he would actually bother stabbing you with a knife? Probably not. He would probably sear the flesh from your body. Or Polymorph you into a mouse and feed you to his familar. Or drop a flaming mountain on your head. Or something.
Assassin is a PrC, and a bad one at that. Its also a concept, and in a fantasy world, that concept need not be limited to invoking a stabbity death upon your enemies. Dead is dead, and the contract if fulfilled.
EDIT:
And the OP wanted a "perfect" assassin. A character with actual levels in Assassin is hardly "perfect"
-
2009-06-25, 05:55 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2006
- Gender
Re: The perfect assassin
Herrhauptmann, your build still does nothing to locate or get close to the wizard, just keeps you alive long enough to flail about helplessly for a few rounds. As is often pointed out, the three parts of killing a wizard are finding the wizard, surviving the wizard's attacks, and killing the wizard. A melee build is ONLY really capable of the middle, and by far the easiest, one; it still can't find them nor can it kill them.
Proudly without a signature for 5 years. Wait... crap.
-
2009-06-25, 06:06 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Oct 2007
- Location
- Some kind of hell
- Gender
Re: The perfect assassin
That's why I recommended Suel Arcanamach, it has a good mix of spells to be able to get in and kill a wizard. That's what they're designed to do. Mix that up with some swordsage and enjoy.
-XChris Bennett
Author and Lead Developer of Path of War
Freelancer
My credits:
Path of War and Path of War Expanded: An OGL Tome of Battle for the Pathfinder game system, for Dreamscarred Press.
Psionics Augmented: Psychic Warrior and Psionics Augmented: Soulknife for Dreamscarred Press.
My extended homebrew signature!
-
2009-06-25, 06:11 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2008
Re: The perfect assassin
Whisper Gnome with Silencing Strike. Casting Silence on people when you hit them with no save is not only good for keeping the guard quiet while you finish murdering him, but also messing with most casters.
-
2009-06-25, 06:26 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2007
Re: The perfect assassin
At what point did I actually recommend he take Assassin, Avenger, BlackFlameZealot, or a half dozen other death attack PrC's?
And yes, I would actually expect Thay to send a melee assassin against me, because it's a freakin assassin, whether it's got levels in the PrC or not! Because that's how the adventures are written.
Finally, he hasn't specified what world this is in. Or any houserules. It could easily be Ravenloft or Eberron, neither of which as a Red Wizard of Thay.
He asked for stuff for an assassin character, and I gave him something for it. I'd have recommended stuff for ToB, but I haven't played a ToB character, so I left that alone.
three parts of killing a wizard are finding the wizard, surviving the wizard's attacks, and killing the wizard.
Again, he's asked for things for an assassin class, so I've suggested it, if I had a link to the rogue handbooks I'd post those too.
If he asks for a meatshield, or an archer, I'll post what I've got on that. If he asks for a monk, I'll write something about a monk, other than just "monks suck, play wizard," same thing if he asks for a blaster sorcerer.
-
2009-06-25, 06:40 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2008
Re: The perfect assassin
Actually this guy is supposed to work alone. Some spellcasting is fine but I also want use of stealth skills and kukris.
-
2009-06-25, 06:56 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Feb 2006
- Location
- Seattle, WA
- Gender
Re: The perfect assassin
Probably best would be something like this:
Spellthief1/Wizard4/UnseenSeer10/ArcaneTrickster5
1 Two Weapon Fighting
H Able Learner
2 Improved Init (swap from Scribe Scroll with Martial Wizard ACF)
3 Extend Spell
6 Master Spellthief
9 Greater TWF
12 Persist Spell
15 Improved TWF
18 Arcane Strike
You'll have spells as a 19th level wizard, with a CL of 20 for non-Divinations, and 23 for Divinations. Then, you Persist Hunter's Eye (Ranger2 leared from Unseen Seer) and attack from Improved or Superior Invisibility for lots of Sneak Attack damage, including stealing spells which you can use to power your own arcane spells. You also pick up Divine Insight (Clr2) from Unseen Seer, allowing you to really nail that one skill check you need to bluff your way into the Kings bedroom or whatnot.
Get a pair of +1 Keen Spellstoring Bloodstone Kukiri's and load them up with a pair of Vampiric Touches each. Your initial strike will do like, 90d6 damage between your 5ish attacks and your 4ish spells that are all being discharged.
-
2009-06-25, 07:08 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2008
Re: The perfect assassin
That's what I'm talking about. What book is unseen seer in?
-
2009-06-25, 07:11 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Feb 2006
- Location
- Seattle, WA
- Gender
Re: The perfect assassin
-
2009-06-25, 07:15 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2008
Re: The perfect assassin
Is there any way to work a similar build using something else then?
-
2009-06-25, 07:25 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2009
- Location
- South American jungle.
- Gender
Re: The perfect assassin
Ghost template?
Kaldon Fulgrant, planar dwarf, ex-Guvner, Free Leaguer, Automata-born, Sigil-resident, surly, erudite, recently short-tempered Archivist. Previously a miner.
"No dictator, no invader, can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever. There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom. Against that power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand."
-
2009-06-25, 07:25 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Oct 2007
- Location
- Some kind of hell
- Gender
Re: The perfect assassin
Either more Arcane Trickster and/or some Daggerspell Mage, but that restricts your alignment some. Without Complete Mage this is a little harder. Spellwarp Sniper from Complete Scoundrel... That's what I've got off the top of my head without Unseen Seer. Good build, Keld.
-XLast edited by ErrantX; 2009-06-25 at 07:26 PM.
Chris Bennett
Author and Lead Developer of Path of War
Freelancer
My credits:
Path of War and Path of War Expanded: An OGL Tome of Battle for the Pathfinder game system, for Dreamscarred Press.
Psionics Augmented: Psychic Warrior and Psionics Augmented: Soulknife for Dreamscarred Press.
My extended homebrew signature!
-
2009-06-25, 07:43 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2008
Re: The perfect assassin
what about ghostfaced killer?
-
2009-06-25, 07:47 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2006
- Location
- Sunnydale
Re: The perfect assassin
I dislike the Wizard vs. Wizard approach. For instance, See Invisibility is just too common, so attacking while invisible isn't reliable. Conversely, mundane stealth can only be countered by high Spot scores, which a Wizard is unlikely to have. So one of the good Hide in Plain Sight versions is ideal. Assassin and Shadowdancer get the good Supernatural HiPS. But by far the best HiPS is that of the Eye of Lolth (Drow of the Underdark), because it functions identially to the Supernatural one but is Extraordinary. Add Antimagic Field and partay!
Last edited by Curmudgeon; 2009-06-25 at 07:47 PM.
-
2009-06-25, 08:10 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Feb 2006
- Location
- Seattle, WA
- Gender
Re: The perfect assassin
-
2009-06-25, 10:57 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2009
Re: The perfect assassin
Rogue/Wizard/Daggerspell Mage
Spells: Daggerspell Stance, Cloud of Knives, Whirling Blade.
-
2009-06-25, 11:26 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2006
- Location
- Akron
- Gender
Re: The perfect assassin
Spoiler
Avatar
XBL: EtaTyrant (L4D2, BF3, RE5)
Battle.net: Pwned101
Damned Good Shop of the Damned
Dread Spells
Complete Lich
Dark God-themed PrCs
Explorer - Politician - Shadowcaster 2 - Devotee Paladin
-
2009-06-26, 07:45 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Feb 2009
- Location
- Jolly Old England
- Gender
Re: The perfect assassin
There are plenty of builds for assassinating people, yet surprisingly few melee ones.
Even if it's not optimal, the Black Flame Zealot is the only class which can truly "Assassinate" well, due to it's capstone ability. Not much point in killing someone if they're just going to be brought back to life faster than you can say "reduced impact of NPC mortality". It's also probably not too hard to build up Death Attack to a DC that your opponent will not pass.
If you're not going for any targets that would be resurrected, try being a poison using class with sneak attack. Use Disembowling Strike and high Con damage poisons with high saves, use the 2 poison feats from Complete Scoundrel as well. You could also go for a dip in Suel Arcanamach for effectiveness against casters and the ability to dispel defensive buffs. Either that or just go for an activated Antimagic Field item just before you attack, so ALL of their magical defences are null and void. While you? You still have your massive Con damage.
(For some numeric values; giving up a 4d6 sneak attack and using Black Lotus extract that you made, that means 3d6+1d4+3 Con damage for an average of 16)Last edited by Melamoto; 2009-06-26 at 07:59 AM.
-
2009-06-26, 08:13 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jul 2008
- Location
- Italy
- Gender
Re: The perfect assassin
I'd second the suggestions about some gish rougueish-mageish*.
Mostly for what Curmdgeon said. I wonder if is possible a wisper gnome, as said above, I like the idea of silence. Remember the evergreen antimagic torc (acrivate it only when you are sure, or it means being "orbed" by the wizard).
Maybe, a combination of anti-casting ambush feats or stuns, and some utility spell added to high climb, move silently, hide..
Can be useful the Garrote from song and silence (as well dragon compenidium)? You can strangulate enemies whit it, maybe after you activated the torc.
Just few ideas..
EDIT: if you like the poison ideas, there are 3 ambush feats in DotU and one in DM lowering the saves or raising the poison DC.
EDIT2: DMagaz, too, Lacerate, another ambush feat that disables enemies limb, Powerful, but a gish is unlikely to take it because is a lot fighter/rogue due his laundry list prereqs..
*I know, too many -ish.
-
2009-06-26, 08:18 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2007
Re: The perfect assassin
If you can use LA buyoff, Lords of Madness has the Shadow template (LA +2) which grants almost-permanent total concealment (Tome of Magic has the Dark template for LA +1, really good as well). I'd go with Changeling because it makes infiltrating places a lot easier. And Swordsage for the class - with a healthy dose of Shadow Hand maneuvers.
"Even gods must learn to control their tempers, lest they set a bad example."
The Malazan Book of the Fallen, Steven Erikson