Support the GITP forums on Patreon
Help support GITP's forums (and ongoing server maintenance) via Patreon
Results 1 to 25 of 25
  1. - Top - End - #1
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2008

    Default Could use some advice on a thrower

    Howdy y'all. It's me again to pester the forums because, as previously stated, my Intelligence <

    I have always wanted to use a build that specializes in throwing things. The Hulking Hurler is the Big Daddy of these builds, but the idea of using a Campaign Smasher is a little dubious when you actually want to see the campaign through. Having looked through Tome of Battle, I saw the wonderful Bloodstorm Blade and thought that would be a great addition to the Master Thrower I was going to start with. I have him built to level 10 but considering this is really new territory for me I wanted to know how badly I was screwing up.

    5 Warblade/4 Bloodstorm Blade/1 Master Thrower
    Moment of Perfect Mind, Leading the Attack, Steely Strike, Emerald Razor, Disarming Strike, Iron Heart Surge as Maneuvers.
    Stances: Punishing Stance and Bolstering Voice
    Feats:

    H: Power Attack
    1: Point Blank Shot
    3: Precise Shot
    W5 Bonus Feat: Iron Will
    6: Weapon Focus
    Bonus Feat: Throw Anything
    B3 Bonus Feat: Weapon Specialization
    9: Ranged Weapon Mastery
    Throw Trick: Trip Shot

    The only thing I am really concerned about is that my damage with a throwing weapon isn't going to be all that amazing, though I would not expect a build that throws normal things to do so much damage. So, how far off am I to something coherent?

    Best of luck
    -Eddie
    Last edited by Zergrusheddie; 2009-07-03 at 06:25 AM.

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    AslanCross's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Metro Manila, Philippines
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Could use some advice on a thrower

    Since a Bloodstorm Blade can throw melee weapons fine, get the biggest melee weapon you can find. A greatsword is a good start. That way you can Power Attack at range and also use your Iron Heart maneuvers.

    The Master Thrower level is rather superfluous, IMO, but if you want to get Trip Shot, I suggest getting a morphing weapon. Turn that greatsword into a spiked chain or heavy flail and trip the sucker.
    Last edited by AslanCross; 2009-07-03 at 05:15 AM.


    Eberron Red Hand of Doom Campaign Journal. NOW COMPLETE!
    Sakuya Izayoi avatar by Mr. Saturn. Caella sig by Neoseph.

    "I dunno, you just gave me the image of a nerd flying slow motion over a coffee table towards another nerd, dual wielding massive books. It was awesome." -- Marriclay

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Titan in the Playground
    Join Date
    Dec 2004

    Default Re: Could use some advice on a thrower

    Bloodstorm Blade allows you to Power Attack with a thrown weapon, and even throw it two-handed. That alone can contribute quite a bit of damage.

    I wouldn't bother with Master Thrower. Maybe go Warblade 6/ Bloodstorm Blade 4, then more Warblade levels. Remember that Warblade will qualify you for Weapon Specialization, and you can even get Melee/Ranged Weapon Mastery (PH2) at level 9.

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2008

    Default Re: Could use some advice on a thrower

    I would just throw a Greatsword but it's range increment is only 10 feet, though maybe that will double with far shot. BSB and Warblade level stack to determine Fighter levels for taking Weapon Specialization and such. Even than, I do not feel as if those feats are so great. I was thinking Master Thrower because that would let me get a free roll to Trip on someone every time I hit them and with Blade Storm at higher levels I get hit an entire army and potentially cause them to drop.

    But obviously, as I stated, I have never done a thrower build before so I am basically talking out of my butt. What advice can y'all suggest?

  5. - Top - End - #5

    Default Re: Could use some advice on a thrower

    Don't change your build just for them; Palm Throw does double PA damage. However, I don't think you can take Weapon Focus as a Warblade bonus feat.

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Titan in the Playground
    Join Date
    Dec 2004

    Default Re: Could use some advice on a thrower

    You need Weapon Specialization to take Melee/Ranged Weapon Mastery from the PH2, which are definitely worth spending the feats on. Once you get Throw Anything, your Weapon Specialization with a melee weapon will count as the same for a ranged weapon, thus qualifying you for Ranged Weapon Mastery. That feat increases your range increment by 20 feet. Your Greatsword or whatever you throw will have a range increment of 30 feet instead of 10 feet, Far Shot will increase it to 60 feet.

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2008

    Default Re: Could use some advice on a thrower

    Perhaps Weapon Specialization is worth getting than
    I didn't see the part about adding an extra 20 range increment

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Imp

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Manchester NH
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Could use some advice on a thrower

    wasn't there a trick with stormgaurd somehting(the tactical feat) palm throw and shurkens that did some stupid amount of dmg, every other round or so.
    When the end comes i shall remember you.

    I sorry i fail Englimish...(appologise for Spelling/Grammer Errors) Please don't correct my spelling or grammer eaither.

  9. - Top - End - #9
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2008

    Default Re: Could use some advice on a thrower

    Quote Originally Posted by RagnaroksChosen View Post
    wasn't there a trick with stormgaurd somehting(the tactical feat) palm throw and shurkens that did some stupid amount of dmg, every other round or so.
    Stormguard Warrior is what I think you are talking about. Honestly, I never really understood Stormguard Warrior. I would end up using Palm Throw but they have to be small ranged weapons like darts. The DM is a pretty easy going guy, but I don't think that even he would allow my Greatsword to be a small weapon for the purpose of Palm Throw.

  10. - Top - End - #10
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Imp

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Manchester NH
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Could use some advice on a thrower

    Quote Originally Posted by Zergrusheddie View Post
    Stormguard Warrior is what I think you are talking about. Honestly, I never really understood Stormguard Warrior. I would end up using Palm Throw but they have to be small ranged weapons like darts. The DM is a pretty easy going guy, but I don't think that even he would allow my Greatsword to be a small weapon for the purpose of Palm Throw.
    agreed but the way stormgaurd works... The ability we are looking at is combat rytheme.

    so you get with palm throw from master thrower the ability to throw 2 small weapons for 1 attack..
    so assuming 3 attacks with bab you can then throw 6 shurkiens as touch attacks... they could be stones or what ever... the next round you add +30 dmg to each attack against that opponite. that can be any style weapon. heh just opened my books
    Last edited by RagnaroksChosen; 2009-07-03 at 08:24 AM.
    When the end comes i shall remember you.

    I sorry i fail Englimish...(appologise for Spelling/Grammer Errors) Please don't correct my spelling or grammer eaither.

  11. - Top - End - #11
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2008

    Default Re: Could use some advice on a thrower

    I just checked Combat Rhythm is melee attacks only. So, unfortunately, Stormguard is a no-go.

  12. - Top - End - #12
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Frosty's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2006

    Default Re: Could use some advice on a thrower

    But remember, Bloodstorm Blades get to TREAT THEIR THROWING ATTACKS AS MELEE ATTACKS if they use a swift action!

  13. - Top - End - #13
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2008

    Default Re: Could use some advice on a thrower

    Quote Originally Posted by Frosty View Post
    But remember, Bloodstorm Blades get to TREAT THEIR THROWING ATTACKS AS MELEE ATTACKS if they use a swift action!
    Ok than. How am I going to fit that into my build? Come hell or high water, it's going to be there!

    Hmm, just thought of something:
    Grab Palm Throw.
    A butt ton of Darts.
    Quick Draw (which is free)
    At BAB 11, that's 3 attacks. Use a dart in each hand gives 4 attacks. Haste makes 5. So, with Palm Throw that is 10 darts that suffer big penalties because of no TWF but they are touch attacks so they will probably hit. So if 9 hit, that's +45 damage per hit next time. Then just Quick Draw your weapon, use a Swift to 'melee', and get off 4 attacks that deal +45 damage.

    That is remarkably effective.
    Last edited by Zergrusheddie; 2009-07-03 at 12:36 PM.

  14. - Top - End - #14
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Darrin's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Cleveland, OH
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Could use some advice on a thrower

    Quote Originally Posted by Biffoniacus_Furiou View Post
    You need Weapon Specialization to take Melee/Ranged Weapon Mastery from the PH2, which are definitely worth spending the feats on. Once you get Throw Anything, your Weapon Specialization with a melee weapon will count as the same for a ranged weapon, thus qualifying you for Ranged Weapon Mastery. That feat increases your range increment by 20 feet. Your Greatsword or whatever you throw will have a range increment of 30 feet instead of 10 feet, Far Shot will increase it to 60 feet.
    You can do some of that with magic items instead of spending precious feats. Gloves of Extended Range (MIC p. 103, 2000 GP) will double your range with thrown weapons. You can also get a Helm of the Hunter (MIC p. 194, 9000 GP) to give you Far Shot.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zergrusheddie View Post
    Ok than. How am I going to fit that into my build? Come hell or high water, it's going to be there!
    It's already in your build. Bloodstorm Blades get Thunderous Throw at 2nd level. And it works just dandy with Stormguard Warrior.

    Here's another idea... the most humiliating weapon you can throw at your enemies? Your enemies themselves:

    http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=5897646

  15. - Top - End - #15
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Frosty's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2006

    Default Re: Could use some advice on a thrower

    That's right! but don't forget you also need to use a swift action to make your 10 touch attacks into melee attacks as wellso they can activate combat rhythm for next turn.

    It's *extremely* effective and cool.

    And if you're willing to get all 5 lrevels of Master Thrower for some reason, then you can grab Weak Spot and make all your thrown attacks into Touch Attacks so you can Power Attack to your heart's content.

  16. - Top - End - #16
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2008

    Default Re: Could use some advice on a thrower

    Can't Power Attack with Palm Throw though as they have to be Darts, which are light. With +45 damage though, it doesn't really matter much.

  17. - Top - End - #17
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Imp

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Manchester NH
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Could use some advice on a thrower

    Quote Originally Posted by Zergrusheddie View Post
    Ok than. How am I going to fit that into my build? Come hell or high water, it's going to be there!

    Hmm, just thought of something:
    Grab Palm Throw.
    A butt ton of Darts.
    Quick Draw (which is free)
    At BAB 11, that's 3 attacks. Use a dart in each hand gives 4 attacks. Haste makes 5. So, with Palm Throw that is 10 darts that suffer big penalties because of no TWF but they are touch attacks so they will probably hit. So if 9 hit, that's +45 damage per hit next time. Then just Quick Draw your weapon, use a Swift to 'melee', and get off 4 attacks that deal +45 damage.

    That is remarkably effective.

    ya its a butiful thing
    When the end comes i shall remember you.

    I sorry i fail Englimish...(appologise for Spelling/Grammer Errors) Please don't correct my spelling or grammer eaither.

  18. - Top - End - #18
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Darrin's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Cleveland, OH
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Could use some advice on a thrower

    Quote Originally Posted by Zergrusheddie View Post
    Can't Power Attack with Palm Throw though as they have to be Darts, which are light. With +45 damage though, it doesn't really matter much.
    Hmm. Try using large-sized darts/daggers. They still count for palm throw, and you take a -2 penalty for the increased size, but the handedness also increases from light to a one-handed weapon. That should work with PA, if the DM is cooperative.

  19. - Top - End - #19
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Keld Denar's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Could use some advice on a thrower

    I know you've already done a Bardblade build before (I know, I built it!), but this is another circumstance where it would be rather fun! I built this a while back. On a modified halfling chasis, this baby can purr and she can roar. Effective at all levels, although peters out a bit at super high levels or in specific settings where fire resistance is common.
    Quote Originally Posted by Fax Celestis View Post
    AILHAY THULUCAY! AILHAY THULUCAY! AILHAY THULUCAY!
    _________________________________
    A beholder’s favorite foods include small live mammals, exotic mushrooms and other fungi, gnomes, beef, pork, colorful leafy vegetables, leaves, flower petals, insects, and birds.

  20. - Top - End - #20
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Frosty's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2006

    Default Re: Could use some advice on a thrower

    Quote Originally Posted by Zergrusheddie View Post
    Can't Power Attack with Palm Throw though as they have to be Darts, which are light. With +45 damage though, it doesn't really matter much.
    No, on your second turn I mean. After you made your initial touch attacks, on your next turn when you pull out your REAL weapons, you can power attack if you wish!

  21. - Top - End - #21
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2008

    Default Re: Could use some advice on a thrower

    Quote Originally Posted by Frosty View Post
    No, on your second turn I mean. After you made your initial touch attacks, on your next turn when you pull out your REAL weapons, you can power attack if you wish!
    This is the Samurai cutting off your head after cutting your torso in half...

    Redundant extra damage; what a beautiful thing.

  22. - Top - End - #22

    Default Re: Could use some advice on a thrower

    Quote Originally Posted by RagnaroksChosen
    so you get with palm throw from master thrower the ability to throw 2 small weapons for 1 attack..
    so assuming 3 attacks with bab you can then throw 6 shurkiens as touch attacks... they could be stones or what ever... the next round you add +30 dmg to each attack against that opponite. that can be any style weapon. heh just opened my books
    No no no no no no NOOOOOOOOOOO!
    This is the second time I've had to correct someone making the exact same mistake with the exact same combination! Palm Throw uses one attack roll for both weapons, therefore it only counts as one attack for the purpose of activating Combat Rhythm. The only thing that gets doubled with Palm Throw is the damage. Am I the only one on this whole forum who knows this?

    EDIT: And before anyone calls me a hypocrite, Thunderous Throw just says you can use Power Attack with a thrown weapon, no exceptions, and I assumed specific would beat general in this case. There is also a feat called Power Throw that allows you to Power Attack with thrown weapons, including light weapons.
    Last edited by Faleldir; 2009-07-03 at 04:32 PM.

  23. - Top - End - #23
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Darrin's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Cleveland, OH
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Could use some advice on a thrower

    Quote Originally Posted by Faleldir View Post
    No no no no no no NOOOOOOOOOOO!
    This is the second time I've had to correct someone making the exact same mistake with the exact same combination! Palm Throw uses one attack roll for both weapons, therefore it only counts as one attack for the purpose of activating Combat Rhythm. The only thing that gets doubled with Palm Throw is the damage. Am I the only one on this whole forum who knows this?
    Palm Throw is confusing a badly worded... and the errata that they issued for it did nothing to clear up the confusion. Volley attacks are confusing to begin with, since they are never clearly defined anywhere, and don't come up that often. So yes, you may be the only one on this forum that understands them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Faleldir View Post
    EDIT: And before anyone calls me a hypocrite, Thunderous Throw just says you can use Power Attack with a thrown weapon, no exceptions, and I assumed specific would beat general in this case. There is also a feat called Power Throw that allows you to Power Attack with thrown weapons, including light weapons.
    Thunderous Throw says you may treat your ranged thrown weapon attacks as if they were melee attacks. It clarifies how your strength bonus is applied, and uses Power Attack as an example. I'm not sure where you get the "no exceptions" from, as the ability is pretty broadly worded. Any melee feat could conceivably be used with a thrown weapon, which can lead to some rather mind-bending results... like the feat where you bull rush an opponent and suddenly appear next to him... I forget what it was called.

  24. - Top - End - #24

    Default Re: Could use some advice on a thrower

    It's called Knockback. I should know, I made a thread about it. The general consensus was "by RAW, you can't use melee feats, but it's too cool not to try". I got "no exceptions" from the fact that none were mentioned, though that was admittedly a hypocritical argument.
    Thank you for responding so politely, I expected much worse.
    (In case I am wrong, I am now building a character who activates Combat Rhythm by hitting enemies with a bag containing over 9000 Fine shuriken.)

  25. - Top - End - #25
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Frosty's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2006

    Default Re: Could use some advice on a thrower

    Quote Originally Posted by Faleldir View Post
    It's called Knockback. I should know, I made a thread about it. The general consensus was "by RAW, you can't use melee feats, but it's too cool not to try". I got "no exceptions" from the fact that none were mentioned, though that was admittedly a hypocritical argument.
    Thank you for responding so politely, I expected much worse.
    (In case I am wrong, I am now building a character who activates Combat Rhythm by hitting enemies with a bag containing over 9000 Fine shuriken.)
    I call bull on that consensus. It's fairly clear to me that for all intents and purposes you are now making melee attacks, so Knockback works perfectly.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •