3.5 DnD question: Use 2 shields?

[rezplz]

I was thinking of a possible fighter build that involved, instead of weilding conventional weapons, would just use two spiked shields and he'd go around shield bashing everything. I was looking in the rulebooks to see if this would be allowed - would the two shield bonuses stack, or would it be pointless do do a build like this?

[Mavian]

Bonuses of the same type never stack.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

I was thinking of a possible fighter build that involved, instead of weilding conventional weapons, would just use two spiked shields and he'd go around shield bashing everything. I was looking in the rulebooks to see if this would be allowed - would the two shield bonuses stack, or would it be pointless do do a build like this?

This makes the rounds every so often... it would be pointless.

Shield bonuses to AC do not stack. Therefore it is in every way inferior to using a weapon and shield combination.

[yilduz]

I've wondered about it in the past. I know that bonuses of the same type don't stack, but it doesn't make sense in this instance. If you're carrying two shields, you'll likely be harder to hit than if you're carrying one shield.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

I've wondered about it in the past. I know that bonuses of the same type don't stack, but it doesn't make sense in this instance. If you're carrying two shields, you'll likely be harder to hit than if you're carrying one shield.

Morbo Says Shield Not Work That Way!

[Siosilvar]

You could do it, but you'd only get one shield bonus at a time (either the one you didn't bash with, or the higher bonus).

[Zaq]

You can carry a spiked shield in your main hand and a tower shield in your off hand. Normally you'll only get the tower shield's bonus, but when you take the action to use the tower shield to get full cover, you lose its shield bonus to AC, so you get the spiked shield's bonus then.

Not really worth it, but it's as close to useful as you can come, really.

Well, I suppose one benefit of the two-shield approach is that you can load them both up with enhancements... the numerical plusses don't stack, but different magical properties would. If you care about that sort of thing, really feel like you need more of it, and are a high enough level to afford it, I guess that's an option.

[Riffington]

Therefore it is in every way inferior to using a weapon and shield combination.

In almost every way. There is one benefit: you can get your Weapon Focus/Specialization/etc to both.

[erikun]

Shield bonuses to AC do not stack. Therefore it is in every way inferior to using a weapon and shield combination.

Not quite: you could take Improved Critial and Two Weapon Fighting, and have it apply to both shields.

[Edit] Darn you ninjas!

But as said before, two shield bonuses do not stack; you would take the higher of the two. This also includes Two Weapon Defense - because TWD is a shield bonus, it would grant you no benefit if used with an actual shield.

[arguskos]

I had a player who used the aforementioned Tower Shield+Shield Bash technique. It was amazingly effective, even with the -2 on attacks from the Tower Shield. He was disturbingly hard to hit, made worse by the fact that he was a knight. o.O

Didn't do vast amounts of damage, but tanked amazingly well.

[Demons_eye]

You can enchant the two with different things. That might be fun.

[RandomNPC]

you're invited to my games, i'll allow the nonmagical part of the bonus, due to it actually being a large plate of metal or wood between you and the opponent. We could even work out some kind of dual strike feat with bull rush and two spiked shields, maybe a rend effect later on.

But RAW, no, you crazy person you.

i like the way you think.

[Frosty]

If you're gonna use two shield,s just go the two-weapon fighting route and shield bash 7 times a round. 8 with haste.

[Glyde]

http://sites.google.com/site/maptool...w/shiningaegis

Its a little prestige class I created for a friend of mine. A *lot* of the bonuses could end up being pre-reqs instead, and the class could easily be made into 10 level instead of 5. Also, the divine casting can easily be omitted.

It's far from truly balanced - Just a quick something.

[Shpadoinkle]

Bonuses of the same type never stack.

Liar. Dodge bonuses stack.

[Zain]

i like the tower shield/spiked shield idea... 50% miss chance and +2 to AC

[Mavian]

Liar. Dodge bonuses stack.

True, I should've stated that almost no bonuses of the same type stack.

[Glimbur]

You could enchant one shield for defense with lots of boring +enhancement to AC, and the other for offense with Bashing and shield spikes and such... then put other defensive things like Death Ward or even Time Buttress on it too. But that would be silly.

[Diamondeye]

It wouldn't work, and more to the point would be so absurd that if I were a DM I would disallow it on the basis that it's absurd. It's one of those characters that either is intended to slide some exploit in the rules by me or else is simply to get attention.

I don't allow characters that exist for no other reasont han to do something bizarre.

[arguskos]

It wouldn't work, and more to the point would be so absurd that if I were a DM I would disallow it on the basis that it's absurd. It's one of those characters that either is intended to slide some exploit in the rules by me or else is simply to get attention.

I don't allow characters that exist for no other reasont han to do something bizarre.

Explain why a person can't wield two shields, one for defense and one for hitting things?

[Diamondeye]

Explain why a person can't wield two shields, one for defense and one for hitting things?

Because they'd get in the way of each other. Yes, I know that they wouldn't according to RAW, but I don't run my games by strictly RAW. If it were a practical way to fight someone else would be doing it. It's just silly.

Moreover, I really don't owe you an explaination for why I don't allow absurd or silly characters in my games, but I'll give you one anyhow: characters built around stuff liek this inevitably cause problems. The player knows its weird and attention getting, and when the novelty of the 2-shield technique or whatever wears off, they're on to some other thing to get attention.

Either that or there's some weird rules exploit they've discovered using this technique and they intend to try to rules-lawyer me into allowing it. Since I take a dim view of rules-lawyering in the first place, I nip it in the bud on the basis of being absurd.

[arguskos]

Because they'd get in the way of each other. Yes, I know that they wouldn't according to RAW, but I don't run my games by strictly RAW. If it were a practical way to fight someone else would be doing it. It's just silly.

Moreover, I really don't owe you an explaination for why I don't allow absurd or silly characters in my games, but I'll give you one anyhow: characters built around stuff liek this inevitably cause problems. The player knows its weird and attention getting, and when the novelty of the 2-shield technique or whatever wears off, they're on to some other thing to get attention.

Either that or there's some weird rules exploit they've discovered using this technique and they intend to try to rules-lawyer me into allowing it. Since I take a dim view of rules-lawyering in the first place, I nip it in the bud on the basis of being absurd.

I didn't actually ask for the latter explanation, but thank you. I don't agree on any of your points, but hey, it works for you, right?

As for the shields, I can say from personal experience that yes, you can actually use two shields effectively. It's not as good as a sword and shield, but it can be done. I'll respect your right to not like it though.

[AstralFire]

I nip it in the bud on the basis of being absurd.

There's nothing wrong with trying to be a bit silly and attention-getting, so long as it does not significantly get in the way of other things you do; indeed, I'd offer that such people are the majority of what make life enjoyable.

[Lycanthromancer]

I like playing things that are different, but not for rules exploits, and not because I'm an attention-whore.

I just don't like the standard-issue character-fodder presented in the 3.5 core books (which has greatly annoyed a number of DMs I've played with, because they refused to accept that non-Tolkienesque fantasy was actually fantasy of any kind).

Maybe the person wanting to play the 2-shield fighter simply wants mechanical novelty, or maybe he saw a few abilities he thought would be cool if done just so.

I can think of a number of shield abilities that I'd think would be interesting alternatives to two weapons or a weapon and a shield.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Not quite: you could take Improved Critial and Two Weapon Fighting, and have it apply to both shields.

[Edit] Darn you ninjas!

But as said before, two shield bonuses do not stack; you would take the higher of the two. This also includes Two Weapon Defense - because TWD is a shield bonus, it would grant you no benefit if used with an actual shield.

Or you could do the same with two longswords and have better damage output

[Talic]

Actually, if you're going sword and board, A shield isn't a bad weapon to use as the sword.

You shield bas with it, and lose its bonus to AC... Which you still have otherwise from the other shield.

It does good damage, and, in a pinch, has several feats for throwing and the like. You can power attack with it... I mean, it's a good combination.

[Hat-Trick]

I had an idea for a prestige class that was pretty much a walking wall, allowing shield bonuses to stack. Shield Guardian. I didn't want to copy the construct, but that was the name I chose in the end. Masters of armor and defense. They couldn't be evil (at least to enter and gain levels), and could ad their AC to their allies'. They weren't supposed to be very realistic, but I like the idea.

[Admiral Squish]

I had an idea for a prestige class that was pretty much a walking wall, allowing shield bonuses to stack. Shield Guardian. I didn't want to copy the construct, but that was the name I chose in the end. Masters of armor and defense. They couldn't be evil (at least to enter and gain levels), and could ad their AC to their allies'. They weren't supposed to be very realistic, but I like the idea.

Aaaand now I have to make that. Thank you for taking up that much more of my time.

Anyway, Dwarven Defender allows shield bonuses to stack, but it's a horrible prestige class. If you want anything decent involving two shields, you need some sort of homebrew to be involved.

[Lycanthromancer]

One shield with the ranged enhancement for bashing and throwing, another for AC, and one animated tower shield?

What happens if you have a thri-kreen? Do you get four regular shields and one animated tower shield?

[Hat-Trick]

Aaaand now I have to make that. Thank you for taking up that much more of my time.

Don't forget to give them full movement in armor and lessened armor penalties. Oh, and they could bash with a tower shield. I think there was also something about them being able to knock opponents back, and usually prone.