[4e] Valorous bard in a three player group?

[Kiyona]

Hello all,

I have a little problem I was hoping you guys could help me with.
I am starting a new 4e campaign on tuesday and had a character all planned out. Thing is, one of the players have quit the group, the rogue to be exact, and now I am thinking that most of my character choices wont work in this groups setup.

The remaining characters are a dragonborn sword-and-board fighter, a drow sorcerer and my half elf bard.

When building my bard I got the impression that they work at their best when in a melee heavy group. And with a fighter and a brutal rogue I picked powers and feats that works the best in melee.

Now, left without a rogue I am starting to feel that maybe I need to rebuild my character a little. But I work all weekend, and dont have much time to go through all the books. Thats when you come in fellow playgrounders. I put my trust in you so to speak.

Any suggestions for feats and powers that work well in such a small group? Should I switch to cunning or the other (hard to spell) bard?

All suggestions are very welcome. I am not much of a powergamer. I mostly enjoy making the background and personality and that stuff ans so my ability to make effective characters is nit as good as it should be. But the other two in the group are real min- maxers so I would like to be able to atleast be helpful to them.

Lots of thanks in advance!

[Tengu_temp]

I see nothing wrong with this setup - in fact, a valorous bard is probably the best kind for such a small group, because it's much more sturdy than the other two builds. There are very few bard powers that help only melee characters and help more than one character at the same time, so you help a group with two melee characters as much as one with one melee and one ranged.

Feats I suggest? Things that boost your AC - you're one of the two frontliners in this group and you need to protect the much more fragile sorcerer, so you will get attacked. Armor Proficiency (Scale) and Shield Proficiency (Heavy) will make you as hard to hit as the fighter. On top of that, Weapon Expertise (Heavy Blades) if you don't have any implement powers, or Arcane Implement Mastery Proficiency (Heavy Blades) and Focused Expertise (Longsword, or whatever weapon are you using) if you have some - hitting stuff is important for every class.

[Kiyona]

You think so? Thats great! Now I feel a lot calmer.

I have both weapon expertise and arcane implement mastery (that is the one that gives you +1 wiith implements right?) but what is focused expertise?

I thought about scalemail, but I wasnt shure if its really worth it, bur now maybe it is. ^^ How much more AC is scale vs chain BTW? I dont have my books at work.

Thanks a lot for your input!

[Tengu_temp]

Focused Expertise

Benefit: Choose a weapon that you can wield
as an implement. You gain a +1 bonus to attack
rolls with any implement or weapon power you use
through that weapon. The bonus increases to +2 at
15th level and +3 at 25th level.
Special: You can take this feat more than once.
Each time you take this feat, choose a different
weapon that you can wield as an implement. This
bonus is not cumulative with the one provided by
Implement Expertise or Weapon Expertise.

Arcane Implement Proficiency (not Mastery, my bad) is from Arcane Power and lets you use the chosen implement of other arcane class for your implement powers. Taking Arcane Implement Proficiency (Heavy Blades) lets you use your weapon's enhancement bonus for both weapon and implement powers - you save money and don't have to waste actions swapping your weapon and implement around.
Scale is 1 AC over chain, and its specialization feat at paragon is much better. Same deal with heavy shields, although whether you should go with longsword/bastard sword + heavy shield or greatsword/fullblade is a matter of preference.

What are your current stats, powers, feats, level et cetera?

[mikeejimbo]

Arcane Implement Proficiency (not Mastery, my bad) is from Arcane Power and lets you use the chosen implement of other arcane class for your implement powers. Taking Arcane Implement Proficiency (Heavy Blades) lets you use your weapon's enhancement bonus for both weapon and implement powers - you save money and don't have to waste actions swapping your weapon and implement around.
Scale is 1 AC over chain, and its specialization feat at paragon is much better. Same deal with heavy shields, although whether you should go with longsword/bastard sword + heavy shield or greatsword/fullblade is a matter of preference.

What are your current stats, powers, feats, level et cetera?

What Arcane class lets you use Heavy Blades as an implement?

[Tengu_temp]

Swordmage.

[Burley]

Also, in very specific examples, the warlock. Pact Blades and Hammers. But, I don't think that would really apply with this feat, would it?

[Kiyona]

Originally Posted by Dragon Magazine 375
Focused Expertise

Benefit: Choose a weapon that you can wield
as an implement. You gain a +1 bonus to attack
rolls with any implement or weapon power you use
through that weapon. The bonus increases to +2 at
15th level and +3 at 25th level.
Special: You can take this feat more than once.
Each time you take this feat, choose a different
weapon that you can wield as an implement. This
bonus is not cumulative with the one provided by
Implement Expertise or Weapon Expertise.

Oh, that sounds like a really good feat. To bad Dragon Magazine is not allowed in this campaign.

I have a songblade already, it sounds like it effectivley does the same as the Arcane Implement Proficiency (Heavy Blades) feat. Am I right?

Dont have my character at work either unfortunatly. But I will post it when I get home. She is a level 11 half elf bard, with 20 con and 20 cha. Dont remember the other stats...

Any magic items that are must haves? Right now I have the +2 songblade (with the +3 at the top of my wishlist) a +3 imposters chainmail and a +2 amulet of some sort (dont remember). Plus a lot of cool low level stuff. Like the thing that summons a horse. And the reading spectacles. Thats just fun.

[Tengu_temp]

If you're using a songblade then there's no need for that feat, yes. When it comes to items, you should get at least a magic amulet as well - do not neglect defenses other than AC!
I'll give more specific advice once I see the character sheet. There are many good choices in 4e, and I prefer to concentrate on spotting the bad ones.

[Kiyona]

Ah, home sweet home.

Now I can post my character so far.

No Name (Any suggestions? I am completely stumped)
Hale-elf Valorous Bard 10
Former captain of the fastest trade ship in the whole of Dragon coast (or so she claims)
Theme song "Up is Down" Hans Zimmer

12 str
20 con
13 dex
10 int
8 wis
20 cha

feats
Ritual caster (bonus feat)
Implememt expertise (longsword)
Weapon expertise (heavy blade)
Rousing voice
Action surge
Human perserverance
Improved initiative

powers
at will
guiding strike lvl 1
vicious mockery lvl 1

encounter
eyebite (dilettante power)
shout of triumph lvl 1
song of the new dawn lvl 3
scorpion claw strike lvl 7

daily
slayers song lvl 1
song of discord lvl 5
rain of starlight lvl 9

utility
song of courage lvl 2
synchronicity lvl 6
word of life lvl 10

Rituals
song of sustenance
unseen servant
travelers chant

magic items
harsh songblade +2
imposters armor +3
cloak of distortion +2
bridle of conjuration
reading spectacles
floating shield
bag of holding

fochluran bandore (for song of sustenance, what is a bandore anyway?)

I think that is everything...

Any suggestions are greatly appreciated

[Mando Knight]

\what is a bandore anyway?

AKA a bandora, it is a stringed instrument with an article on Wikipedia.

[RTGoodman]

I would personally ask your DM to allow Focused Expertise. Dragon Magazine for 4E is not the same as it was in 3rd Edition - it's run by WotC, everything in it is playtested and reviewed by them, and, as far as I know, everything in it is supposed to be Core material. Either way, it's not actually a Dragon Magazine feat - it's a Player's Handbook 3 feat that happened to be PREVIEWED in Dragon.

[Kiyona]

rtg0922

Yeah, I'm gonna do that. But I dont think it will work unfortunatly... He never allows Dragon Magazine stuff since he doesnt own them.

AKA a bandora, it is a stringed instrument with an article on Wikipedia.

OH! THATS what it is. Thank you, my google-fu is far inferior to yours.

[Blackfang108]

... and Focused Expertise (Heavy Blade)

Remember, expertise also applies to weapon groups, not specific weapons.

[Gralamin]

Remember, expertise also applies to weapon groups, not specific weapons.

Focused Expertise is specific Weapon, not a whole group.

[Kiyona]

So, any suggestions?
Wich feat should I exchange for scale armor prof? Should I switch some powers? I am planning on going war chanter on 11th, any mc feats that would go with that?

Why yes, I am bumping my thread.
Please ignore me if bumping is not allowed.

[Sir Homeslice]

Rousing Voice is terrible. Ditch it and replace it with scale. Never look back.

[Kiyona]

Ok, I was considering dumping it, but thought that the more healing our little party can get the better. ^^ But I think your right, so scalemail it is then.

My DM approved Focused Expertise. Yay!
So that is replacing weapon and implement expertise, cause it doesnt stack, right?

This gives me one extra feat to play with. What would you suggest? Versatile master? Combat virtuoso? Jack of all trades? Somethingeven better?

[Tengu_temp]

Shouldn't you get +1 to all stats at level 11?

[Kiyona]

Yeah, But she is only level 10 so far. =)

I remembered wrong last time. We are starting at level 10, not level 11.

[DragonBaneDM]

I play a Valourous Bard currently, and for your Level 1 Daily, I think you could do better than Slayer's Song now that the Rogue is out.

Oh, and what multiclasses are you going with?

I went Warlord and Shaman, personally. The Shaman was storyline based, but you still get a lot for it. The Warlord just made sense to me. Extra skill and Word.

[Kiyona]

I play a Valourous Bard currently, and for your Level 1 Daily, I think you could do better than Slayer's Song now that the Rogue is out.

I was thinking on exchanging slayers song for stirring shout, what do you think? Would that be a good idea?

Now that 1 extra feat opened up from focused expertise I am planning on taking the warlord mc feat instead.

Shaman sounds like it would be a cool mc, what do you get from it? I am at work again so I dont have my books..