[4.0] First time at 4.0 - Deva Wizard

[Thorin]

Hello GitP forumers

So, i`m going to play my very first 4th edition game. I must reckon that it is not (by far) of my predilection, but it would be very stupid of me to not try it (yeah, i just can`t get enought of 3.5).

So, we are going to be a 6 PC party, ideally two PC from every rol. I wanted to try a wizard and saw that deva was actually feting and I really liked the concept.

And then I realized that I have no idea what feat should I pick. Not just at level 1, but all levels i mean. The powers... i don`t know... I feel like I am quite good at optimizing the rol and I already have in mind most of powers wich I really like, but I can get suggestions.

-My chosen implement would be the orb of imposition

-My stats would be:

STR 10
DEX 12
CON 13
WIS 14 (+2 deva)
INT 16 (+2 deva)
CHA 11


I accept any suggestion. I already think that the numbers are set, but if someone has a solid argument on changing them I will gladly listen.

My DM has almost all the books printed son far (nothing from dragon magazine), so go nuts.

[dragoonsgone]

What level are yall starting at?

[Thorin]

yeah, duh me.

Starting form level 1 according to my last chat with the DM, but i want to have the charactetr a little planned, at last for level... 10ish

[RTGoodman]

Well, as a Controller, you ideally want feats that boost your ability to control. Those fall into two categories - things that make your spells better, and things that make you better at using them.

For the first category, see things like Enlarge Spell (PHB2, I believe, but it could be Arcane Power). For -2 damage per die, you can enlarge any burst or blast by one (so your thunderwave at-will covers a 4x4 area, and your scorching burst is a ranged AoE that'd cover a whopping 5x5 area AT WILL). Other stuff to look at would be Spell Focus at Paragon tier (though it'd require Cha 13 - just swap your starting Cha and Dex and you'd be set). Realistically, you could even just drop your Str down to 8 (you never really need it) to get an extra point for each.

As far as making you better at using your spells, take a look at Implement Expertise for whatever implement you choose (probably Orb). It's basically necessary by the time you get to Paragon and Epic tiers, so you'll need to pick it up eventually. I also like War Wizardry (Paragon tier, I believe), which gives you a -5 to hit against allies in your spell areas, and you can even retrain it to Spell Accuracy (I think that's the name) at Epic tier to leave areas out of your spells.


As far as spells, thunderwave and scorching burst are good at-wills with some control element (battlefield control for the first, and minion killing for the second). For other spells, just grab ones that sound good. In general, while some powers are better than others in 4E, most of them are at least usable.

[dragoonsgone]

-Enlarge Spell from arcane power(must)
-Familiar is nice for flavor from arcane power but not by any means necessary arcane power (bonus varies on familair)
-If you do familair id go with shielding familiar at level 6
-Remembered Wizardry if you like having options(gives you 3 daily spells to choose from instead of 2 and extra utility) requires Deva and arcane power
-Implement expertise orb is good
-Radiant Power - Power Attack
- Distant Advantage
- Mark Of Making if you can use Eberron feats
With Familar
1 Enlarge
2 Familiar
4 Remebered Wizardy
6 Shield Familar
8 Implement expertise - Orb
10 Radiant Power

Without Familar
1 Distant Advantage
2 Implement Expertise
4 Enlarge Spell
6 Remebered Wizardy
8 Mark of Making
10 Radiant Power

Those are what I would choose probably
Edit: Not knowing what kind of wizard your going for or what powers your taking. IE very general advice.

[erikun]

For your first time playing a Wizard, take a look at Leather Armor Proficiency. It technically isn't needed, but the +2 AC with no requirements can ensure you don't get killed too quickly. Defensive Mobility and Toughness can help with surviving, but are lower priorities - although you can always retrain them, if desired.

Improved Initiative is a decent choice, as is Implement Expertise for bonuses to hit - hitting should be a priority for you. Enlarge Spell is from Arcane Power, and is quite useful for increasing your AOE damage - shoving around or damaging large numbers on enemies is worth the small -2 to damage.

As a Wizard, damage is a secondary concern - you should be focused on hitting large groups (and killing minions), locking down large areas with immobile/difficult terrain, and trying to take out single individuals so the rest of the party can clean up. Orb Wizards (who like high Wis) are naturals at locking down one dangerous foe, so that the rest of the party can clean up the weaker threats without getting stabbed in the back.

At Paragon, your priorities should be Spell Focus (PHB, Cha 13), War Wizard (FRPG), and Paragon Defenses (PHB2). Multiclassing takes up a number of feats, but can be pretty good if you have the stats for it. For example, multiclassing into Cleric will give you the ability to heal an ally 1/day, along with Religion training - very nice with your Ritual book, as you may need to roll Religion for some of the rituals. Picking up a select utility power, such as Cure Moderate Wounds or Divine Aid, will be valuable when needed. (You can't get a multiclass utility until level 8, though, so that's a long term plan.)

[Kurald Galain]

The first thing you have to do is decide whether you go primarily for damage, or primarily for hindering and debuffing your enemies. My personal preference is the latter, but a wizard can also be built for a lot of damage (although striker classes like the sorcerer tend to be better at that).

If you don't decide to go for damage, you should avoid any and all damage-boosting feats (like Radiant Power) simply because you have different priorities and not enough feat slots.

• Enlarge Spell is probably the best wizard feat in the game. Note that pretty much all your best spells are area attacks.
• Familiars are nice for flavor and scouting; however, they aren't worth investing more than one feat on, so you should avoid all the "boost familiar power" feats since they don't do all that much.
• Jack of all Trades is a nice boost to many skills, it depends on your DM how useful this is going to be
• Distant Advantage is not such a good idea because it is easier to use large area attacks
• Improved Initiative is very nice, considering how a wizard who goes first can seriously mess up combat for the enemies; as an alternative, Quickdraw lets you get a lot of mileage out of magical items.
• Eberron has the Mark of Lightning, which adds more control to all your thunder spells.
• It depends on your party whether you need to invest in defense, e.g. Leather Armor or Toughness. In a big party it probably won't be necessary.
• For your stats, I would drop strength and dex because you won't be using them, and boost your intelligence to 17 (so it becomes 18 at level 4). You don't even need constitution much if you can take a background from the PHB2 (that bases your hit points on intelligence)
• Thunderwave is the best wizard at-will, hands down.
• Remembered Wizardry is a trap. With the right power choice you will never need it.

[HMS Invincible]

The first thing you have to do is decide whether you go primarily for damage, or primarily for hindering and debuffing your enemies. My personal preference is the latter, but a wizard can also be built for a lot of damage (although striker classes like the sorcerer tend to be better at that).

If you don't decide to go for damage, you should avoid any and all damage-boosting feats (like Radiant Power) simply because you have different priorities and not enough feat slots.

• Enlarge Spell is probably the best wizard feat in the game. Note that pretty much all your best spells are area attacks.
• Familiars are nice for flavor and scouting; however, they aren't worth investing more than one feat on, so you should avoid all the "boost familiar power" feats since they don't do all that much.
• Jack of all Trades is a nice boost to many skills, it depends on your DM how useful this is going to be
• Distant Advantage is not such a good idea because it is easier to use large area attacks
• Improved Initiative is very nice, considering how a wizard who goes first can seriously mess up combat for the enemies; as an alternative, Quickdraw lets you get a lot of mileage out of magical items.
• Eberron has the Mark of Lightning, which adds more control to all your thunder spells.
• It depends on your party whether you need to invest in defense, e.g. Leather Armor or Toughness. In a big party it probably won't be necessary.
• For your stats, I would drop strength and dex because you won't be using them, and boost your intelligence to 17 (so it becomes 18 at level 4). You don't even need constitution much if you can take a background from the PHB2 (that bases your hit points on intelligence)
• Thunderwave is the best wizard at-will, hands down.
• Remembered Wizardry is a trap. With the right power choice you will never need it.

Ding ding ding, we have a winner. Then again, I'm biased.

[Tough_Tonka]

If your party has one or two strikers its probably best to focus on hindering spells. If you have Arcane Powers you should pick up on of the illusion at-wills. They target Will Defense, which is the lowest Defense for 70+% of anything you'll fight and there hindering and movement effects can easily save your strikers from nasty situations.

[Thorin]

Wow, great piece of advice guys, i appriciate it.

So, long made short, im re-adjusting the stats:

STR 8 (dump dump dump, dump your STR to the flor tune)
DEX 13 (so I can take dual implement spellcaster at level 6ish if i manage to have 2)
CON 13 (later will be 14, so one more healing surge and fort save)
WIS 14 (16 as a deva i think is realy good. +3 is great for wis i think)
INT 16 (18 as a deva, a normal start i say)
cha 12 (so I can take spell focus at 11th)

my implement remains to be the orb of imposition
my level 1 feat is enlarge spell
my at-will will be scorching burst and thunderous wave
my encounter/daily powers... actually i`ll wait to see what the other players choose, but i think that will include orbmaster incendiary detonation (yeay, something to use the orb on), slepp and probably grase, i`ll see.

any other suggestion?


BIG PS: One question about the multiclass feat initiate of the faith (for become a "cleric") it grants healing word as a daily power. So 1/day. But the power says that you can use the power twice in the encounter, 1/per round max.
So I get healing word 1/day which can be used twice in the encounter (max 1/round) or did i just miss something?

[erikun]

Incendiary Detonation? I know that Icy Terrain was one of the better 1st level encounter powers in PHB, because it can knock prone and cause hazardous terrain - or not, your choice. I'm not sure what Incendiary Detonation does, but you'll want it to have some kind of rider beyond damage.

A straight Cleric can use their Healing Word 2/encounter. The Initiate of The Faith feat, though, only gives you Healing Word 1/day.

[Excession]

BIG PS: One question about the multiclass feat initiate of the faith (for become a "cleric") it grants healing word as a daily power. So 1/day. But the power says that you can use the power twice in the encounter, 1/per round max.
So I get healing word 1/day which can be used twice in the encounter (max 1/round) or did i just miss something?

It's one single use per day, not two uses in one combat once per day.

[RTGoodman]

Incendiary Detonation? I know that Icy Terrain was one of the better 1st level encounter powers in PHB, because it can knock prone and cause hazardous terrain - or not, your choice. I'm not sure what Incendiary Detonation does, but you'll want it to have some kind of rider beyond damage.

Orbmaster's incendiary detonation is basically like icy terrain, but with fire a slightly different terrain effect. Burst 1 in 10 squares (so you can also apply Enlarge Spell to it), on a hit does FORCE DAMAGE and knocks targets prone. Also creates a zone of licking flames until the end of your next turn that autodamages enemies that enter the zone or start their turn there. ALSO, since it's one of "Orbmaster's" spells, you can use your Orb of Imposition class feature to extend its duration, even though it isn't an at-will power.

It's personally one of my favorite low-level Wizard powers. I'd probably rename it, though - it sounds like they tried to generic up a spell that had another name attached (Otiluke, Otto, whatever) and ended up picking something that sounded stupid.

[Yakk]

Use the standard 4e order for stats. It is worth it:

They are now grouped by resist! :)

STR 8 (dump dump dump, dump your STR to the flor tune)
CON 13 (later will be 14, so one more healing surge and fort save)

DEX 13 (so I can take dual implement spellcaster at level 6ish if i manage to have 2)
INT 16 (18 as a deva, a normal start i say)

WIS 14 (16 as a deva i think is realy good. +3 is great for wis i think)
CHA 12 (so I can take spell focus at 11th)

Dual Implement Spellcaster starts really getting worthwhile by paragon. At heroic, it is nice, but not amazing.

Note that your defences will be:
AC 14
Fort 11
Reflex 14
Will 13 (+wizard bonus)

So you'll be quite vulnerable to arrows.

MC Swordmage or Artificer are better choices for Wizards (even though you have a 16 wisdom). Your arcane feats apply to Swordmage and Artificer powers.

Note that if you choose power-swapping, Swordmage weapon powers can be used with staffs (!). But I'd be more tempted by Artificer.

[Burley]

I second the multiclass change. If you want some suplimentary healing, use the Artificer. Especially since, by RAW, nobody has to spend a healing surge when you heal them. You can't recharge it during a short rest, since its a daily. And, you don't have to spend a healing surge to make the infusion. Just to recharge it. It's nifty!

[Asbestos]

Orbmaster's incendiary detonation is basically like icy terrain, but with fire a slightly different terrain effect. Burst 1 in 10 squares (so you can also apply Enlarge Spell to it), on a hit does FORCE DAMAGE and knocks targets prone. Also creates a zone of licking flames until the end of your next turn that autodamages enemies that enter the zone or start their turn there. ALSO, since it's one of "Orbmaster's" spells, you can use your Orb of Imposition class feature to extend its duration, even though it isn't an at-will power.

It's personally one of my favorite low-level Wizard powers. I'd probably rename it, though - it sounds like they tried to generic up a spell that had another name attached (Otiluke, Otto, whatever) and ended up picking something that sounded stupid.

Doesn't the use of the Orbmaster encounter power also cause the burst to increase in size?

[RTGoodman]

Doesn't the use of the Orbmaster encounter power also cause the burst to increase in size?

Ooh, indeed. It seems the power is even BETTER than I first realized. If you use your Orb of Imposition class feature to extend the effect, it increases to a BURST 3 (or burst 4 with Enlarge Spell) that DOESN'T AFFECT YOU OR ALLIES.

Man, that IS a pretty great spell. In encounters with a Solo you can use the version of OoI that imposes saving throw penalties, and in ones without you can use your OoI to basically slaughter any minions in a 125 ft. square area!

[Thorin]

WOW, so even better.

Any advice for mid to high levels?