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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    BardGuy

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    Default [3.5] Yet another houserule balance

    Hi all,
    i'm trying to fix, with some simple rules, the basic ruleset of 3.5 (i don't think we will ever use these rules, it is just a personal exercise to myself).
    I'd like to know what do you think of this simple ideas:

    [notice: core only, characters start at level 3, level 1 is considered childhood and level 2 youth]

    - all primary casters have the Bard Spells-per-day table (also spells known, for sorcerers). A wizard triples the numbers in the table, a sorcerer simply has infinite spells (no problem, since they cannot cast healing, or permanent buffs).
    Motivations: clerics and druids become somewhat equal to bards, which are my baseline comparison. Wizards are heavily nerfed not having access to cheesy spells, but still have plenty of low level ammunition; same for sorcerers.

    - every class has +4 skill points per level. The x4 multiplier for level 1 is gone. Cross class skills cost 1, they simply retain the lower cap. A skill is considered class skill if you have at least one level in a class proficient in it.
    Skill cap: 10 + level/2 instead of 3+level (normally halved for crossclass)
    Motivations: now everyone can have skills, and the rogue class is somewhat less skill-monkeysh(since the modifier is additive and not multiplicative). Also, the INT factor is decreased. Finally, someone can be a GOOD specialist in something without the need to be level 10. Now a level 2 baker can have 11 points in craft:whatever.

    - Hit points: CON (not CON Bonus) at character birth, plus, instead of rolling hit dice: 1 for d4, 2 for d6, 3 for d8, 4 for d10, 5 for d12. CON bonus applied only for even levels.
    Motivations: less hit points total. Makes more meaningful the hit dice w.r.t. the CON bonus. Makes healing and damage spells more meaningful(since they are less powerful due to bard table progression).

    How will these three rules impact on game balance?

    I have some other minor changes in mind (for instance swap animal companion progression between ranger and druid), but they are less of interest.

    Thanks for the answers! :)
    Last edited by pasko77; 2009-08-03 at 01:02 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by That Schubert Guy What Wrote that Vampire Article
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    Titan in the Playground
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    Default Re: [3.5] Yet another houserule balance

    Nah, just force a Concentration check on every spell they cast, and on a nat-1, you get a Critical Fumble on a Fun Chart of Wierd Stuff.

    Then, force all wizards to be regular specialists, with an inherit 10% Arcane Spell Failure Chance on any spell not in their field of expertise, which cannot be mitigated or altered in any way. It stacks with any ASF you may acquire in any way. You still cannot cast from prohibited schools, of course. Thus a Conjurer who bans Evocation and Enchantment has a 10% ASF when trying to cast Haste, which is a Transmutation spell.

    Then ban any and all methods of reducing Metamagic spell level cost. Including Metamagic Rods and DMM.

    Then just use the Shapechange variant in PhB II for Druids.

    That ought to at least make things more inconvenient for Tier 1...
    Last edited by ShneekeyTheLost; 2009-08-01 at 07:29 PM.
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    BardGuy

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    Default Re: [3.5] Yet another houserule balance

    No one else interested in commenting? :(
    Quote Originally Posted by That Schubert Guy What Wrote that Vampire Article
    In the D&D game, so much of a character’s identity is expressed by the powers that character can use.

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    SolithKnightGuy

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    Default Re: [3.5] Yet another houserule balance

    I don't think this would really balance anything. You've weakened every melee by reducing hit points. You've changed the balance of skill monkeys by making everyone more skilled, reducing the ratio of difference.
    Sorcerers have infinite spells known? Now they're better than wizards because they always have the right spell for the situation.
    Arcane casters don't get there highest level spells, so that helps some, but blaster spells are more dangerous because everyone has less hit points.
    You've got some interesting ideas, but almost every change is weakening someone, including the classes that were already weak. If you want better balance you need to do something for the weak classes.
    DMs don't cheat, they just change the rules.

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    BardGuy

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    Default Re: [3.5] Yet another houserule balance

    I think this really hurts rogues. Their skill points are part of what makes up for their mediocre combat power (which can often be negated by fortification) and lack of spellcasting ability. They still have some of the most offensive skills, such as Tumble and Use Magic Device, but now it's harder for them to have those and the usual skillmonkey set (Search, Spot, Disable Device, Pick Lock).

    I'm not sure how the spellcasting will work out.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Yet another houserule balance

    Quote Originally Posted by Tallis View Post
    Sorcerers have infinite spells known?
    Infinite spells per day, not known.
    Kungaloosh!

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    Default Re: [3.5] Yet another houserule balance

    - every class has +4 skill points per level. The x4 multiplier for level 1 is gone. Cross class skills cost 1, they simply retain the lower cap. A skill is considered class skill if you have at least one level in a class proficient in it.
    Skill cap: 10 + level/2 instead of 3+level (normally halved for crossclass)
    You've just opened up every prestige class from level 1. As a level 1 human monk I can take shadowdancer prestige class at level 2. Hide in plain site at 2nd level.

    I'm sure you can see the problem with that.

    edit: Nevermind, I don't get the multiplier at level 1. In that case you've basically kicked skills in the groin by reducing the number characters can max out at level 1. With your rules, a high intelligence rogue loses more than half her possible skills.
    Last edited by jmbrown; 2009-08-03 at 01:51 PM.

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    BardGuy

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    Default Re: [3.5] Yet another houserule balance

    Quote Originally Posted by jmbrown View Post
    You've just opened up every prestige class from level 1. As a level 1 human monk I can take shadowdancer prestige class at level 2. Hide in plain site at 2nd level.

    I'm sure you can see the problem with that.
    I admit i did not take into account PrCs. I forgot the hard cap is given by skills.
    Let's say that PrCs are allowed "not earlier than what you could in basic rules."
    Quote Originally Posted by That Schubert Guy What Wrote that Vampire Article
    In the D&D game, so much of a character’s identity is expressed by the powers that character can use.

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    BardGuy

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    Default Re: [3.5] Yet another houserule balance

    The problem with the skill multiplier at level 1 is that a figther1/rogue1 has less skill than a rogue1/fighter1, which really does not make sense.

    I can suppose a "+20 skill points at character creation", then.
    Quote Originally Posted by That Schubert Guy What Wrote that Vampire Article
    In the D&D game, so much of a character’s identity is expressed by the powers that character can use.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Yet another houserule balance

    Quote Originally Posted by pasko77 View Post
    I admit i did not take into account PrCs. I forgot the hard cap is given by skills.
    Let's say that PrCs are allowed "not earlier than what you could in basic rules."
    I don't know what that means. PrCs have varying entry points. Like war weaver.
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    Default Re: [3.5] Yet another houserule balance

    Quote Originally Posted by pasko77 View Post
    The problem with the skill multiplier at level 1 is that a figther1/rogue1 has less skill than a rogue1/fighter1, which really does not make sense.

    I can suppose a "+20 skill points at character creation", then.
    That would work to an extent. The x4 is there because a character fresh out of "basic training" knows a lot to begin with and advances slowly. When you start at level 1 it makes sense but when you start at higher levels you have players that take advantage of it by beginning as the more skilled class first.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Yet another houserule balance

    Quote Originally Posted by pasko77 View Post
    The problem with the skill multiplier at level 1 is that a figther1/rogue1 has less skill than a rogue1/fighter1, which really does not make sense.
    that's not the case anymore if you give every class the same # of skills per level... everyone would get 16 at level 1.
    Kungaloosh!

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    BardGuy

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    Default Re: [3.5] Yet another houserule balance

    Quote Originally Posted by Jayabalard View Post
    that's not the case anymore if you give every class the same # of skills per level... everyone would get 16 at level 1.
    No, its +4 per class, not 4 each class. Thus a fighter has 6 points per level, and a rogue 12.
    Quote Originally Posted by That Schubert Guy What Wrote that Vampire Article
    In the D&D game, so much of a character’s identity is expressed by the powers that character can use.

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    BardGuy

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    Default Re: [3.5] Yet another houserule balance

    Quote Originally Posted by Tidesinger View Post
    I don't know what that means. PrCs have varying entry points. Like war weaver.
    It simply means the awkward but useful patch rule "if a PrC has a Skill at level X as a requisite, you cannot enter it before character level X-3".

    This ought to restore the entry levels in PrCs (for skills).
    Another workaround will be needed for PrCs that require spell levels, though.
    Quote Originally Posted by That Schubert Guy What Wrote that Vampire Article
    In the D&D game, so much of a character’s identity is expressed by the powers that character can use.

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