Does Factotum really go well with Chameleon?

[gnomas]

So I'm making a factotum because i like the look of the class, and naturally I though chameleon might work well with it since it had a similar theme. but then i read through chameleon and well....

able learner entry requirement - all skills are class skills anyway, waste of a feat
aptitude focus
arcane - i guess the spellcasting is more focused, but lower level than i would get for being a factotum 20 (7th) also, if im not mistaken, spells cast as a chameleon incur arcane spell failure
combat - i already have martial weapon proficiency
devine - so i cant already cast devine spells, but i can already heal and turn undead. and with this i can only prepare at sunrise, kinda limiting
stealth - nice bonuses, but I already have trapfinding
wild - wild empathy and woodland stride are useful but situational
Bonus feat - it can change, which is nice, but it would just be replacing the feat i wasted to gain entry to the class
Mimic Class Feature - same as Cunning brilliance really, since they both add up too 3 times a day, and every ability on that list is extraordinary so i can use it with cunning brilliance. ('cept turn undead but i can do that anyway)CB gives more variety too.
ability boon - ok i like this one
ETC

I like this PrC, but i think factotum all the way would work just as well if not better. What do you playgrounders think?

[Eldariel]

As long as Font of Inspiration is allowed, Factotum//Chameleon is THE ultimate Do-It-All. Int to basically everything means you'll actually have the stats to pull it off and Factotum supports everything.

I personally like Factotum 8/Chameleon -> for the Extra Action-ability which helps EVERYTHING you can do. Factotum 11/Chameleon 9 also has things going on for it, and Factotum 20 isn't bad, but getting the dual casting from Chameleon kicks ass.

[Doc Roc]

Seconded. I'm with Eldariel here. I've seen it in action and it is indeed wondrous.

Human
I like Factotum 8/Chameleon 7/Iaijatsu Master 5 myself.
2xFlaws
Key Feats:
Font of Inspiration x 4
Travel Devotion
Quick draw
Good options maybe:
Martial Study: Emerald Razor?

[Frosty]

When you are a Chameleon, your skill list is small compared to Factotum (since it has ALL skills). So, if you wanted to continue advancing a skill NOT on the CHameleon skill list, you'd have to pay cross-skill costs. Able Learner combined with Factotum means all of your skills are class-skills forever.

[Melamoto]

Able Learner combined with Factotum means all of your skills are class-skills forever.

Which is a pretty powerful ability to have, if you're going to multiclass.

[Eldariel]

When you are a Chameleon, your skill list is small compared to Factotum (since it has ALL skills). So, if you wanted to continue advancing a skill NOT on the CHameleon skill list, you'd have to pay cross-skill costs. Able Learner combined with Factotum means all of your skills are class-skills forever.

Able Learner is a prerequisite for Chameleon so this is granted :P The whole reason Chameleon's skill list is so small is because it's supposed to be customizable depending on your entry.

[Pharaoh's Fist]

Seconded. I'm with Eldariel here. I've seen it in action and it is indeed wondrous.

Human
I like Factotum 8/Chameleon 7/Iaijatsu Master 5 myself.
2xFlaws
Key Feats:
Font of Inspiration x 4
Travel Devotion
Quick draw
Good options maybe:
Martial Study: Emerald Razor?

Obtain Familiar.

[Sinfire Titan]

Obtain Familiar.

IIRC, Chameleon has a clause that prevents it from taking feats/PrCs that require spellcasting abilities for some reason.

[Yuki Akuma]

IIRC, Chameleon has a clause that prevents it from taking feats/PrCs that require spellcasting abilities for some reason.

Aptitude Focus and Mimic Class Feature don't count for prerequisites because you don't really have those abilities - you're faking them.

Faking them very, very well, but what would happen to your familiar if you didn't pick Arcane Focus one day?

[Pharaoh's Fist]

What about Factotum?

[Yuki Akuma]

Unfortunately I don't have the book it's in. It's the one base class I don't have access to. :(

[gnomas]

thanks for clearing some of this up everyone!

so i guess I'll go with 10/10 then

what book is font of inspiration in? (i recently acquired a lot of book and haven't memorized the locations of everything like with my older books)

[Eldariel]

Font of Inspiration is in web enhancement. And technically Factotum has a caster level so he'd qualify for Obtain Familiar even though he cannot cast spells.

The only drawback is that it's not spelled out to be an arcane caster level so by RAW it doesn't work, but doesn't seem too unreasonable.

[kamikasei]

Would Factotum count as giving you an arcane caster level (the requirement for Obtain Familiar, not spellcasting ability per se) since it says your arcane dilettante spells use your Factotum level as your caster level?

The only drawback is that it's not spelled out to be an arcane caster level so by RAW it doesn't work, but doesn't seem too unreasonable.

It's your caster level to cast arcane spells using an ability called arcane dilettante. Given that I don't recall any core base class being stated to have either an arcane or divine caster level, I'd call it safe.

what book is font of inspiration in? (i recently acquired a lot of book and haven't memorized the locations of everything like with my older books)

It's online.

[gnomas]

just found it, must remember to search before asking.

Question: the feat says, "You can take this multiple times. Each time you take this feat after the first time, the number of inspiration points you gain increases by 1 (for example, you gain 2 inspiration points if you take the feat a second time)."

so if i take the feat twice, do i have 2 extra points or 3?

[Doc Roc]

I believe you could comfortably qualify for Obtain Familiar with Factotum.

Answer:
3

[Yuki Akuma]

just found it, must remember to search before asking.

Question: the feat says, "You can take this multiple times. Each time you take this feat after the first time, the number of inspiration points you gain increases by 1 (for example, you gain 2 inspiration points if you take the feat a second time)."

so if i take the feat twice, do i have 2 extra points or 3?

It would be an incredibly stupid way of putting it if each time you take the feat you gain 1 inspiration point - none of the other point-granting feats are worded like that.

So it's safe to assume if you take the feat twice, you have three extra inspiration points.

[olentu]

thanks for clearing some of this up everyone!

so i guess I'll go with 10/10 then

what book is font of inspiration in? (i recently acquired a lot of book and haven't memorized the locations of everything like with my older books)

Are levels 9 and 10 of the factotum really that great. I do not remember the class that well and so would have to look it up.

[gnomas]

Answer:
3

So it's safe to assume if you take the feat twice, you have three extra inspiration points.

good, though i might be reading it wrong!

Are levels 9 and 10 of the factotum really that great

level 9 gets you 4 spells instead of 3, and level 10 gets you 4th level spells and another use of opportunistic piety

i am now crashing for the evening, thanks for the help

[Doc Roc]

L 9/10 of Factotum are not as good as L 6/7 of Chameleon, nor L 2/5 of Iaijatsu master.

[Eldariel]

Chameleon gets you better casting. If you don't want Factotum 11, go Factotum 8/Chameleon 10/X 2. Factotum 10 isn't really bad, but you can do better by picking up abilities derived off Int or enhancing your Chameleon casting somehow.

Factotum 11 has an insane ability which is why I like Factotum 11/Chameleon 9 so, but I have to admit, Chameleon 10 is tasty too. But yeah, e.g. two levels in Warblade is a fine choice to round out a Factotum-build as Strikes work great with extra Standard Actions and you get some slight Int-synergies (though 3rd level would have a bigger one).

Two levels in Martial Rogue (for two feats and nutty skillpoints), one level in Master of Masks (for all Exotic Weapon Proficiencies), one-two levels in Exemplar (SKILL MASTERY! And some handy stuff) and such all present options which I'd prefer to Factotum 9 and 10. And yeah, Iaijutsu Master 2 is nice.

[Doc Roc]

Levels in crusader are also basically amazing, because you can just keep Striking.

Iai master serves a similar purpose.

[olentu]

Well that is useful information and now I do not need to dig up my copy of dungeonscape right at the moment.

Thanks for helping me be lazy.

[jagadaishio]

Where is the Iaijatsu Master from?

[Eldariel]

Where is the Iaijatsu Master from?

Iaijutsu Master. It's in Oriental Adventures where the whole Iaijutsu-mechanic originates.

[VirOath]

For all of your Factotum needs, check out the handbook!

One of the builds listed is in fact Fact 10/Cham 10, and there are alot of other twists you can pull with that.

Factotum does count as having a caster level for all purposes, but it can't be advanced through +1 to arcane caster PrCs since it's rather a class feature progression. They cast Arcane spells as SLAs.

For a different, more recent Factotum build, I point to Person_Man's Haberdasher (The Masked), quoted as being "The 3.5 Kitchen Sink."

If you have any more questions, just ask!