3.X Merits of Using the BoEF ~shudder~

[Deth Muncher]

I shudder to even talk about this, for fear of incurring wrath of mods for discussing inappropriate topics, but I really do need your help. When I was telling my new group what books were and weren't allowed, I mentioned that the BoEF was amongst the "No. Nuh uh. Don't even ask." list. What did this make them do? Go and search out the book for themselves and look at it. And they liked what they saw. :/

See, here's my problem. I don't want to use the book. I just don't. I find it icky, and to be entirely honest, a little desperate. In fact, I actually said the following, which I will spoiler for decency:

Spoiler

Show

Look, half of you have significant others. Why have roleplay sex? Why not just ACTUALLY have sex with the person?

I haven't really looked through the book (mostly due to happening upon horrible horrible pictures), so I don't have any knowledge of anything in it other than random bits and pieces. I do, however, understand it to be intended for a mature audience - and I mean that in the "mature of thought" not the "mature of age" variety. Everyone in the group is legally old enough to view the contents, but are they mature enough? I don't think so. I think it's pretty much going to just degenerating into trying to get the paladin to bathe with enchanted soaps. O_o

Anyway, back to the real question: Does the book have anything of merit which could be brought to a game and not completely make the game switch focus from plot to sex?

[Pharaoh's Fist]

Alternative slots for items such as rings.

[Kylarra]

Tell them "that's great, but it's still not allowed in my campaigns."

OT: I believe there's also an overpowered caster prestige class, but I don't remember specifics

[Mystic Muse]

Alternative slots for items such as rings.

this is as dirty as I think it is isn't it?

[Pharaoh's Fist]

Toes. And earrings.

[Deth Muncher]

Tell them "that's great, but it's still not allowed in my campaigns."

I keep telling them that! They're adamant that they want stuff from it though. I hate to be a jerk and threaten to bump them from the group if they persist, but really? It's getting on my nerves.

this is as dirty as I think it is isn't it?

Likely.

[Mystic Muse]

tell them "no it weirds me out, it takes the game a place I'd rather not go and it shouldn't be necessary to make the game good. If you guys really want this somebody else is going to have to run the game because I'm not going there."

[Faleldir]

Because WOTC still hasn't provided enough rules for how babby is formed. Is it exactly like rolling a new character, or do its parents influence its ability scores?

[Shpadoinkle]

I keep telling them that! They're adamant that they want stuff from it though. I hate to be a jerk and threaten to bump them from the group if they persist, but really? It's getting on my nerves.

I'd respond to pretty much any request to include it with "Not happening."

If they present arguments about why it should be used, I'd say "That's nice. Still not happening."

If they try to use the material in it anyway, it would be met with "No, you don't/That doesn't happen, because we're not using the BoEF. Please stop."

If you REALLY don't want to use it, you're going to have to be at least as stubborn as the rest of them put together.

[Kylarra]

I keep telling them that! They're adamant that they want stuff from it though. I hate to be a jerk and threaten to bump them from the group if they persist, but really? It's getting on my nerves.

Tell them too bad.



Seriously, they're being jerks for pushing on an issue you've already stated you're not comfortable with.

[Mushroom Ninja]

Toes. And earrings.

Nice save. I nearly had to apply the good old Brain Bleach

[herrhauptmann]

Want that cloak of charisma, but don't want to give up your cloak of resistance? And you can't afford to pay to have stacked enchantments?

Well, BoEF has a new item slot that allows you to gain your charisma bonus, AND keep your cloak of resistance. :) Just call it 'boxers of charisma' and you won't need the bleach.

There's a prestige class or 3 which grants you better casting if you're able to go all night long, the night before.

As a downside, there's the 7th stat. Give tehm a normal point buy, and watch them weep as they try to distribute those points among 7 stats instead of 6.

If they really want to use BoEF, bear with it for a session, and ensure each one pays a nightworker for some fun. Then roll to see which diseases they get.

[Soras Teva Gee]

As a downside, there's the 7th stat. Give tehm a normal point buy, and watch them weep as they try to distribute those points among 7 stats instead of 6.

That's why the book tells you to add 13 points to account for that...

[herrhauptmann]

That's why the book tells you to add 13 points to account for that...

I know, but the DM is the final say on the pointbuy.

[Pharaoh's Fist]

Muhuhahaha.

[Godskook]

There's more than one way to deal with this.

[Mystic Muse]

do I want to know this seventh stat?

[Jergmo]

Yeah, if you don't feel comfortable with ERP, fade to black. They might not even intend to do that, y'know? It's generally accepted in my campaign world that stuff from the BoEF goes on, folks just don't hear about it because they're too busy doing what they're doing to hang out with depraved wizards in the Red Light District. And I had to give my Goddess of Love some domains, eh? There are actually a few nifty buff spells from the BoEF that aren't necessarily erotic. I think there was one that gave you and an ally a bonus to saves so long as you were within whatever distance of each other.

Edit: And yeah, I've been wondering about forming babby as well. I heard something about parental attributes affecting offspring's attributes, but I never saw it. It'd be kinda cool for statting out the children of significant NPC's.

[Kylarra]

do I want to know this seventh stat?

Appearance.

[Jalor]

There's this cool 3-level PrC for Diviners that's not designed with porking in mind, although it's flavored as a magical voyeur. Because what nerdy teenage Wizard hasn't snuck into the girls' locker room with Invisibility?

[Jergmo]

There's this cool 3-level PrC for Diviners that's not designed with porking in mind, although it's flavored as a magical voyeur. Because what nerdy teenage Wizard hasn't snuck into the girls' locker room with Invisibility?

While having every cantrip prepared as Grope.

[taltamir]

Is this a different name for the blue magic book, or did they actually publish more than one sex based book?

have they actually made any SPECIFIC requests for content? (And were those reasonable / unreasonable?) Or just insisted on using the entire book?

Regardless, the problem really is that the DM has to roleplay NPCs, and this can get inappropriate really fast when roleplaying sex between the NPC and the PC (aka DM and character)... I read the blue magic book cover to cover, it was awesome and I really loved it... BUT, I will be actually opposed to it as both a player OR a DM depending on the people involved because of that reason exactly.
I am not quite sure what is worse, roleplaying adult situation with a DM of my gender, or the opposite gender.

And the example of dealing it is gonna be as bad an idea as forcing a kid to smoke a pack of cigarettes because you cough him smoking (been observed to increase likelihood of them becoming a smoker). Sure, your PC gets a nasty STD... he goes to the cleric... pays some gold, and gets cured... now he is spiffy fresh again... you know what he will do next? he will get some method of disease immunity and get back in the game. Worse, he now has precedent of you allowing such things.

[Sstoopidtallkid]

First off, ignore the pictures. I ended up tracking down a PDF and converting it to text-only, but the pictures are the worst thing in there.

That said, I don't think you should use the mechanics from the book. They're just as balanced and well-thought out as anything from an official WotC source, meaning that the power ranges from 'useless' to 'god'. Rather, you should read the book, think about it, and then keep the issues it raises in the back of your mind. It's the only source IIRC to figure out any sort of consequences for Polymorph+pregnancy. Sex will come up in almost any game to some degree, and the book at least gives you an idea of how to handle it and the attendant effects.

[kamikasei]

When I was telling my new group what books were and weren't allowed, I mentioned that the BoEF was amongst the "No. Nuh uh. Don't even ask." list. What did this make them do? Go and search out the book for themselves and look at it. And they liked what they saw. :/

"What is your fascination with my Forbidden Closet of Mystery?"

Sounds to me like your players are probably just messing with you, at least in part.

I agree with Sstoopidtallkid. I bought the book in part because I'd heard its treatment of pregnancy, interspecies mating and fertility, and the sexual and reproductive habits of various races to be a useful resource or starting point in worldbuilding. The actual mechanics for most of the book, though, are fairly blah; either "sexy" versions of fairly standard items or spells, or variously crap or broken classes and feats. And the art is indeed not the best.

As to your group: well, it's a third-party book without much in the way of useful mechanics to import. You as DM have to be able to say what resources you're allowing for a game. Sexual content is a delicate issue at many tables for many obvious reasons and you as DM also have to be able to say that there are certain topics you're just not willing to go in to in your game. Most likely I expect your group will accept this once the amusement of making you blush wanes.

Want that cloak of charisma, but don't want to give up your cloak of resistance? And you can't afford to pay to have stacked enchantments?

...then use the Magic Item Compendium rules for stacking such enhancements without added cost!

[taltamir]

i am really curious as to what they actually want to import...
Ask them "are you saying you want to have roleplay cybersex with me, or that you want to bone a hooker in game and have me roll up on an STD and pregnancy chart?"

You could always just make up some of your OWN rules or suggest to them "freeform treatment" of adult situation as they come... aka, if two of the players are a couple and want to try and get pregnant, they can, without consulting a sourcebook made by people who have probably never had a significant other or a firm grasp on biology.

[Lyndworm]

I own the Book of Erotic Fantasy, and happen to think of it as rather useful. It has information on the courting and mating habits of several races, and even the potential for and viability of cross-breeds (including some that have no stats so far). In addition, it has a few semi-interesting base classes and a few of the PrC's are... OK. A bunch of the new spells are actually OK, and the alternate item slots range from cool to disturbing. If it weren't for all of those horribly doctored images, it would actually be a good book. It's about one point below mediocre, with them.

[PhoenixRivers]

Usually, I just go with,

"The tone and theme of the book don't fit the theme of the campaign I'd like to run, and would create a lot of extra work for me. Can you justify why it's worth making this a lot harder for me? What does it really bring that our gaming table needs?"

or

"I understand you like it, but I'm not allowing 3rd party material, regardless of source. I don't feel that it's met the bar for playtesting."

I find that this gets rid of any "it's cool" or "it's got abilities that are really useful for my class" arguments, and brings it back to D&D as a team sport.

You could also relay, instead, that you understand where they're coming from, but it needs to be fun for everyone, and, with that book included, you'll be way too uncomfortable to have fun. You can sympathize, but you're not gonna do it. If they submit a character to your game, it's without BoEF. If they insist on BoEF, they can find a different person to run the game. You won't hold it against them, but you won't run that game. End of discussion.

I think the important thing is to be understanding, but be firm, at least when it comes to your comfort zone and boundaries.

[Coidzor]

Well, I hope you've learned your lesson.

The BoEF is something which should not even be mentioned as biblio non grata in the first place.

[ShadowFighter15]

I'd be happy to have some of the spells (namely the more utilitarian spells that adventurers would probably use once in a blue moon at best) exist in the game-world, but mainly because some of them would fit for a society with access to magic. And it always struck me as odd that there was a reverse gender curse, but not a spell that it may've been based on.

Then again; my perception of spell creation of any sort is mainly from the Elder Scrolls games, where players can create their own cursed items by using any spells they know (or have made themselves) so some DnD settings probably wouldn't need their curses to be based on similar-acting spells.

I do agree with the courting information and so on being helpful; if only to help flesh out backstories and such.

[Emy]

Alternative slots for items such as rings.

It's unbalancing to simply throw on extra usable magic item slots though. You should force them to take the feat from Savage Species that lets you use more items if you have the anatomy to wear them.