4e Charge vs. Compulsion

[cupkeyk]

Hi everyone,

i would like to ask for some ruling on the use of charge against the bard power compulsion.

If a bard(me) casts compulsion on a baddie, I can choose to slide him away from me before his turn but then he can charge me after; or I can choose to slide him after his turn and he can charge and his turn will end immediately thereby rendering my compulsion useless. Either way I lose.

So is this true: Charge trumps Compulsion?

[Tyger]

Yes, it trumps Compulsion in that the Charge action is a Standard action, and Compulsion specifically states that the target can not take Move actions... so yes, in your scenario, Charge renders Compulsion of less value.

Unless of course, you use Compulsion to force the target off a cliff, into difficult terrain so his movement is extremely hampered, or through several allies so that Charging you will incur multiple AoOs...

The bard in my campaign has used Compulsion to great effect a number of times. He's never used it as you are suggesting, to move someone that is already physically attacking him though, particularly as its a Ranged attack, and thus incurs an AoO to use in melee range.

[Sipex]

Yeah, as a bard your main concern is helping your allies perform better so compulsion is best used when aiding your allies deal with the monsters more effectively.

[cupkeyk]

The idea was mostly isolation. I thought a single target, save ends slide power's purpose would be to place a melee bad guy outside of melee, where their standard and minor would go to waste. but if they charge, wasted power. if you place the monster in the think of the fight, they can still use their melee attacks without penalty. A ranged powered monster in the same position would have more trouble. since you can only slide them 5, they can still charge back into position.

finding difficult terrain and a precipice is convenient but is rarely an option.

[Kurald Galain]

The idea was mostly isolation. I thought a single target, save ends slide power's purpose would be to place a melee bad guy outside of melee, where their standard and minor would go to waste.

So slide them behind an obstacle, so they don't have line of sight to anyone to charge.

[1of3]

Being slid is not an action on the target's part. So you can slide the target even after it has charged.

(In M:tG talk, the sliding occurs in the turn end segment which follows immediately after the charge.)

[Kurald Galain]

Being slid is not an action on the target's part. So you can slide the target even after it has charged.

That's not the point: the point is that this power can't prevent the target from attacking (through a charge).

[Yakk]

I think the fluff is that you consume their move action with your slide.

So clearly they cannot take their move action, because "you already did it".

They still get to take their standard action and minor action -- ie, most of their turn still occurs, you only have partial control over them. If that makes sense.