IT'SATRAP! - Worst Spells Per Level [3.5]

[Jergmo]

The tome of Necromancy listed Ghoul Gauntlet as a trap, since it shares a control pool with Animate Dead, and creating ghouls is not particularly more effective than creating simple skeletons or zombies. It is also, of course, a sixth level spell with a rather poor dps.

But it doesn't really look all that bad, and ghouls aren't that much bad, for two HD they are better than zombies really. It's not like the LA factors into the control pool.

Plus no material component.

Now you want a trap? I will give you a trap. Player Handbook, page 231. Right bellow Firestorm.

My Necromancer in a villain campaign had his undead minions beat on a number of juvenile black dragons, then used Ghoul Gauntlet on them. It certainly isn't useless. I want to get an adult one via Ray of Enfeeblement + Curse + Contagion for Con drain, but I haven't found one yet.

Overpowered Villain Man needs an undead dragon mount!

[Jergmo]

Oh....summon monster 1. All summons have a range of one round per caster level, and take a full round to cast. In short, at level one, summon monster 1 is pretty much worthless. By the time it actually is vaguely worth casting, you could have summon monster two, which is just better in every way.

You're mostly right, though the cleric in my players party did make it useful once. She decided to make her character puny in the ways of combat and was just using a light crossbow, but she used Summon Monster I to summon a Giant Celestial Fire Beetle and it managed to critically hit and kill an enemy cleric. This was at level 1.

[Jergmo]

Fine, I'll leave cantrips out. How about daze monster then? The monster loses a single action but, oh wait, you just did too. But maybe the monster is strong enough so that, oh wait, 6 HD cap.

Fire trap is only 2nd level for druids, and often easier to trigger than explosive runes. But, yes, it's a trap .

Summon monster I is famous for being the wizard's trapfinder extraordinaire.

Are you kidding? At low levels, have the wizard cast Daze on an ogre. One less chance to smash the fighter's head in.

[ericgrau]

Gonna do my best to find holes in Saph's list; I don't actually think those spells are *usually* useful.

Flare: High level drow
Hold Portal: If the door wasn't locked before, now it is and the +5 is just icing. But it's still limited to things like fleeing b/c of the short duration.
Contagion: Glyph of warding + contagion = enemies softened for as long as they're in the dungeon. EDIT: Oh, wait, bestow curse is cleric 3. Contagion fails. Unless they stay overnight in the dungeon. Oh, wait, then they can prepare remove disease.

The case has already been made for mind fog and erase, but I'm not sure about them. Higher level summon monsters might have more utillity forms and they might be worth casting before the combat begins. For the other spells I found no way to salvage them.

Are you kidding? At low levels, have the wizard cast Daze on an ogre. One less chance to smash the fighter's head in.

I shall clarify, *again*, that I said daze monster, not daze. It's a 2nd level spell with a 6 HD cap. If you're extremely lucky you might neutralize a CR 5 creature at caster level 3, but more likely you'll be wasting both your own action and that of an equally (or less) powerful monster, not a stronger one. And your highest level spell slot. So 99% of the time the spell is a net loss. It blows chunks. Btw regular daze doesn't work on ogres anyway. You want a 4 HD humanoid.

[Jergmo]

Contagion - Wow, if the enemy fails a Fort save, they now have a disease. Quick everybody, let's retreat for a couple of weeks and wait for him to sicken to death!

Correct me if I read it wrong, but Contagion immediately does ability damage from disease, and then additional damage is done every minute thereafter. The secondary damage is easy to resist, but the additional isn't so much.

I shall clarify, *again*, that I said daze monster, not daze. It's a 2nd level spell with a 6 HD cap. If you're extremely lucky you might neutralize a CR 5 creature at caster level 3, but more likely you'll be wasting both your own action and that of an equally (or less) powerful monster, not a stronger one. And your highest level spell slot. So 99% of the time the spell is a net loss. It blows chunks. Btw regular daze doesn't work on ogres anyway. You want a 4 HD humanoid.

Maybe I'm the only one who uses non-monster enemies, here, but you could use Daze Monster on a level 6 fighter or something.

[ericgrau]

Correct me if I read it wrong, but Contagion immediately does ability damage from disease, and then additional damage is done every minute thereafter. The secondary damage is easy to resist, but the additional isn't so much.

Every day. And you can heal 1 or 2 points per day too, even while the disease is in effect.

Maybe I'm the only one who uses non-monster enemies, here, but you could use Daze Monster on a level 6 fighter or something.

He's weaker than a level 6 character since he gets NPC wealth, and these circumstances - with exactly the right levels for both wizard and NPC - are even rarer.

[Woot Spitum]

With all the debate comparing Comprehend Languages and Tongues, I'm surprised no one has mentioned Speak With Plants. Seriously, what can a stationary organism that cannot see, hear, smell, touch, or taste tell you?

EDIT:Adding insult to injury, Treants, the one plant creature worth talking to, speak common.

[tyckspoon]

Correct me if I read it wrong, but Contagion immediately does ability damage from disease, and then additional damage is done every minute thereafter. The secondary damage is easy to resist, but the additional isn't so much.

You're wrong. Contagion only skips the initial incubation; after that the disease works as normal, and diseases only go off once a day. You're thinkig of poisons, perhaps.

[Jergmo]

With all the debate comparing Comprehend Languages and Tongues, I'm surprised no one has mentioned Speak With Plants. Seriously, what can a stationary organism that cannot see, hear, smell, touch, or taste tell you?

Don't you see? The trees communicate in a world-wide network.

[ericgrau]

With all the debate comparing Comprehend Languages and Tongues, I'm surprised no one has mentioned Speak With Plants. Seriously, what can a stationary organism that cannot see, hear, smell, touch, or taste tell you?

PC: Sir plant, has anything passed through here.
Plant: Yeah, he stepped on me and crushed me badly <cough> <cough>
PC: Okay thank you.
Plant: Please get the bastard for me, okay?
PC: Umm, okay. Actually we need to warn him about an ambush.
Plant: What?! I'm damaged. Look at me! Look at meeeee!!
PC: ...

[deuxhero]

The GOD handbook was rescued from Gleemax's Explosion.

Missing the rating smileys.

[Myrmex]

The only use I've ever seen resistance get is when someone gets poisoned, and they have to make their second save, at the very low levels.

or he could cast cure instead.
are you suggesting using it as a very low level buff pre combat from a wand? too expensive to be worth it

375 gp isn't that much, and if they found a partly filled wand in a treasure horde, even better.

[jiriku]

My Necromancer in a villain campaign had his undead minions beat on a number of juvenile black dragons, then used Ghoul Gauntlet on them. It certainly isn't useless. I want to get an adult one via Ray of Enfeeblement + Curse + Contagion for Con drain, but I haven't found one yet.

Overpowered Villain Man needs an undead dragon mount!

That pwns. When you find the adult, use an empowered or maximized shivering touch, a necromancy spell from Frostburn. It will render the dragon helpless, then you can cast ghoul gauntlet to your heart's content.

[Akal Saris]

I think the lower level summon monster spells are pretty poor choices unless you specialize in them with Augment Summoning and Rapid Summoning and the like, at which point they're fine. So for builds that intend to conjure stuff they're good, which is more than you can really say for Erase.

In PF, SM I is actually very good, since conjurers get extra duration to SM spells, there's a feat to reduce the casting time in 1 of the PF splatbooks, and the riding dog from SM II got bumped down to SM I.

[CheshireCatAW]

The only use I've ever seen resistance get is when someone gets poisoned, and they have to make their second save, at the very low levels.



375 gp isn't that much, and if they found a partly filled wand in a treasure horde, even better.

Wouldn't it be better to find a wand of cure light? For twice the price you're almost guaranteed to get more than twice the mileage.