I do not get What?!

[quiet1mi]

Reading through the Beguiler and noticed that they do not get Craft and Use Rope... is there an errata somewhere?

[jokey665]

Not every class gets every skill!? BLASPHEMY!!

[Cedrass]

Not every class gets every skill!? BLASPHEMY!!

However, Craft is pretty much universal...

[Fenix_of_Doom]

There is indeed errata for the PH II, it gives the dragon shaman knowlage:arcana and fixes various other things, it does not however changes anything about the beguiler skill list.

So I guess you'll have to houserule it if you want it.

[Xallace]

Craft I understand, I think Beguilers should have craft (Alchemy, at least). Why would they need Use Rope?

[Kylarra]

For tying people up I guess.

[crazedloon]

Ah but they do it just is called dominate person... once you have selected your skilled target cast the spell and you have max ranks in whatever skill you need

[Asheram]

For tying people up I guess.

Yeah. First you charm them, then you sneak up on them, then you tie them up and throw them off a roof.

[Tengu_temp]

However, Craft is pretty much universal...

Have you ever seen a beguiler work a honest job?

[Dixieboy]

Yeah. First you charm them, then you sneak up on them, then you tie them up and throw them off a roof.

There's also the synergy bonus when trying to escape those pesky law officials who tied YOU up.

[Haven]

Ah but they do it just is called dominate person... once you have selected your skilled target cast the spell and you have max ranks in whatever skill you need

Not that kind of dominate!

[Sinfire Titan]

Could be worse. You could be a Favored Soul (Knowledge: Arcana, but not Religion?).

[Xallace]

Could be worse. You could be a Favored Soul (Knowledge: Arcana, but not Religion?).

"I channel the power of who now? You don't say."

Really makes me want to play a Favored Soul who doesn't even realize he has divine powers.

[Saph]

That's an interesting one, actually. Can anybody think of any other base PC class that doesn't get Craft?

[Sinfire Titan]

That's an interesting one, actually. Can anybody think of any other base PC class that doesn't get Craft?

PsiWars don't get Psicraft, Crusaders and Warblades don't get Profession, I'm sure there's others.

The Ardent gets Knowledge, but it doesn't say which ones (or all of them).

[oxinabox]

Fighter's don't get profesion, but do get craft.
I mean really, what sort of fighters are basket weaves or carpenters, or even blacksmiths.

As compared to Professions:
Seige engineer (HoB rules for aiming seige equiptment (though there is craft Seige engineer, this can't be used to aim, only to build)
Sailor (did you say Navy or Pirate?)
[other occupation for fighters]

What so we have experts in amoungs our soldier to opperate the siege engines?
It's as stupid as fighters not getting spot or listen: who needs to be able to spot more than the town guard (the rogue sneaking part the guard, clearly but still)

[Starscream]

There are people who actually put ranks into Use Rope? I think I'd take Profession (game show host) and Knowledge (value of Yu-Gi-Oh cards) first.

[daggaz]

For tying people up I guess.

Yeah, but use rope can be done untrained, and tying people up that have already surrendered gives a +10 circumstance bonus to your use rope check, so anybody can do a fairly semi-decent job of tying somebody up. Against a high dex, max ranked escape artist, well... you might want the rogue to tie him up, but otherwise, its not a big problem. That makes sense.

And yeah, I cant see why you need use rope otherwise on your class list. I agree with the others tho that missing craft is wierd... its probably just an oversight as craft (whatever) is often seen as something your character picked up before adventuring, in the very least. (which explains why fighters of all people get it... he was a carpenter's apprentice first)

[Oslecamo]

Have you ever seen a beguiler work a honest job?

Hey, some people claim that fighters should be master politicians by strenght of words alone, or even masters of the psionic arts, or the best scouts of the world. Asking the beguiler to have an honest job isn't that bad compared to it.

[Yora]

Craft (poison) and Craft (traps) are not honest jobs.

[waterpenguin43]

There are people who actually put ranks into Use Rope? I think I'd take Profession (game show host) first.

I'm sure Xykon would hire you.

[Violet Octopus]

Fighter's don't get profesion, but do get craft.
I mean really, what sort of fighters are basket weaves or carpenters, or even blacksmiths.

But then you get the fighters who are away at the front, spending their downtime whittling little figurines for their loved ones/kids. You need craft for that.

No toys for the beguiler children

[Zeta Kai]

Ah but they do it just is called dominate person... once you have selected your skilled target cast the spell and you have max ranks in whatever skill you need

...

You have a point, loon. That is indeed an... efficient use of a beguiler's abilities.