what is chicken infested?

[taltamir]

I keep hearing about chicken infested commoners... what are those? where from?

PS. also where are the "vow of X" "anti feats" (give you extra feat when you take them) from?

[Vangor]

Chicken infested is a flaw for Commoners, I believe in one of the Dragon Magazines.

Vows are from Book of Exalted Deeds.

Not sure about the "anti feats" you are discussing. I know of spells which allow you to remove previous features and then replace those with feats, which are Shun the Dark Chaos and Embrace the Dark Chaos from Book of Vile Deeds (I think).

[Vizzerdrix]

Anti feats? Flaws are in Unearthed Arcana and sound like what you are looking for.

[taltamir]

anti feat is a name i made up... I just know that in some builds people take things like "vow of poverty, vow of non violence" etc and it gives them extra feats... flaws sound about right. I will look them up in UA
what does chicken infested actually do?

[SparkMandriller]

The Vows don't give you extra feats. They are feats.


Oh, wait, you must be thinking of Vow of Poverty. That gives you free feats. But it takes all your money, so it's not really all that free.

[Zombimode]

I think it gives a 50% chance to draw a chicken, when trying to draw something out of something.
Eg. when you reach into your pocket for a copper piece to tip the bartender you have a 50% chance to draw a chicken instead.
But I might be corrected.

[Serpentine]

Chicken infested was a joke commoner feat. Every time you draw, retrieve or other wise "take something out", there's a % chance that, instead of what you want, you'll draw a chicken. I believe it ends with something along the lines of "Where do all these chickens come from? How am I meant to know? They're your chickens."

>hurls a chicken at Zombimode<

[taltamir]

where do i find vow of poverty? the other vows?

as for flaws, some are really nice... -2 to melee attacks and -1 to ac for two extra feats on my wizard? yes please!

[taltamir]

I think it gives a 50% chance to draw a chicken, when trying to draw something out of something.
Eg. when you reach into your pocket for a copper piece to tip the bartender you have a 50% chance to draw a chicken instead.
But I might be corrected.

how much money is a chicken worth? on average 5 chickens per minute out of thin air sounds awesome... id corner the poultry market, feed everyone... maybe get myself declared a messiah...

[Vangor]

anti feat is a name i made up... I just know that in some builds people take things like "vow of poverty, vow of non violence" etc and it gives them extra feats... flaws sound about right. I will look them up in UA
what does chicken infested actually do?

Yes, those would be Flaws. You may take two and those give you instant feats for first level, however, not all DMs allow this as those are a variant from UA which can easily create balance issues.

Vow of Poverty from BoED does offer additional exalted feats first, second, and every two levels beyond this. Needs Sacred Vow feat to be able to take, and Vow of Poverty means you are allowed no equipment beyond a simple weapon and clothes, and no money. As well, you must be good to the extent of remaining exalted.

[taltamir]

so vow of poverty is for lawful good monks, or good druids basically?

[Eloel]

so vow of poverty is for lawful good monks, or good druids basically?

Unarmed Swordsages are better than Monks in every way, including being VoP'd.

Meldshapers pee all over the concept of not having magic items - they already filled their item slots with soulmelds... (So, they're the kick-ass VoP users)

[Vangor]

so vow of poverty is for lawful good monks, or good druids basically?

Anyone can make decent use, but yes monks and druids benefit the most. I believe the only people who need be truly concerned are Wizards and anyone else who uses a spellbook. VoP gives significant benefits, but the fact is with a little effort magic items could be chosen which far outmatch the benefits of VoP.

[Kobold-Bard]

where do i find vow of poverty? the other vows?

as for flaws, some are really nice... -2 to melee attacks and -1 to ac for two extra feats on my wizard? yes please!

Most DM's will make you take a Flaw that has an actual consequence to your character. eg. if you're building a Wizard they'll say not to Noncombatant, but will let you take Slow or Weak Willed. Remember the DM can say no to anything, regardless of how helpful it may be to you.


Vow's are in Book of Exalted Deeds. Most are a bit rubbish; a bonus to certain things in exchange for something eg. bonus to resist Poison as long as you never take drugs.

Poverty is the big one, especialy or Druids because you can use the free Exalted Feats it gives you to take Exalted Wild Shape (all your Wild Shape forms get the Celestial Template or something like that) and Exalted Animal Companion (get a Blink Dog and you/the Rogue have a permanent Flanking Partner).

[sonofzeal]

Vow of Nonviolence/Peace is pretty badass, as long as you don't rely on dealing actual damage yourself. Enchanter and Illusionists love this vow.

[taltamir]

Vow of Nonviolence/Peace is pretty badass, as long as you don't rely on dealing actual damage yourself. Enchanter and Illusionists love this vow.

I didn't kill him, i just made him unable to see the guy swinging the sword at him... what? i am still a pacifist!
pretty funny... kinda like how clerics get a mace because of the whole "don't shed blood" vow...

[Zeta Kai]

Since no one else has said it, I'll point out that the real fun of a chicken-infested Commoner begins when they get their hands on a spell component pouch. By RAW, a SCP has nigh-infinite items within it, & drawing from a SCP is a free action. Ergo, said Commoner can drown his enemies in chickens. Let the cheese commence.

[taltamir]

Since no one else has said it, I'll point out that the real fun of a chicken-infested Commoner begins when they get their hands on a spell component pouch. By RAW, a SCP has nigh-infinite items within it, & drawing from a SCP is a free action. Ergo, said Commoner can drown his enemies in chickens. Let the cheese commence.

he just fill a pouch with dirt... now draw "a pinch of dirt" every round... when you run out of dirt, just refill it. I assumed that when i suggested he make himself rich by selling all the chickens / starting a massive chicken range.

he might be a commoner, but he can afford +5 inherent bonuses to all attributes, +6 slotted items of same, and a bunch of specific magic items of choice.

[bosssmiley]

Chicken Infested is the reason we were given 4E.

It originated as a joke feat in an April Fool's issue of Dragon magazine, but people started using it as the basis of a few cheesy CO'ed builds. Having thus proved that a small subset of D&D players could not be trusted to get the joke WOTC responded by deleting f'ing everything!!!!! and giving people a 'no user-servicable parts' D&D game with less scope for tacky abuse.

Of course, being a bunch of semi-trained typewriter monkeys who fear mathematics intent on pursuing a GW/Blizzard-inspired inbuilt obsolescence model of game design, WOTC made an ungodly mess of their new release. That is why official D&D offers a world of Orbizards, Laser Clerics, Bullysauruses, AffectTerrain=0 character abilities, saves-per-round, constant "We have always been at war with Eurasia" errata and the like which bears no meaningful resemblance to what Gary Gygax wrote about.

And that is why people who use Chicken Infested in their builds are the spawn of the devil.

As for Vow of Poverty. That's a feat in the Book of Exalted Deeds which really shouldn't be a feat at all. It's actually a complete overhaul of the "wealth = power" mechanical model of 3E. Instead of getting magic items as they level up, VoP characters instead gain innate abilities in return for eschewing the power that comes from wealth.

If the Vow had been set up as a substantial alternative system mechanic, rather than just being a single feat in an "ok trending to awful" splatbook, the development of modern D&D might have taken a very different path. Picture something a little more like Mutants and Masterminds, but fantasy-flavoured, and you get the gist...

[taltamir]

there was one where a holloween version came up with a mage who cuts off his own head and replaces it with a pumpkin... i have seen it used as a dip in builds :)

I don't think it is a matter of trust, the system encouraged munchikenery... you cannot encourage something and then be upset when people utilize it. it will be stupid of them NOT to use it. that doesn't mean though that 4E actually solves things effectively :)

[Cyclocone]

he just fill a pouch with dirt... now draw "a pinch of dirt" every round... when you run out of dirt, just refill it. I assumed that when i suggested he make himself rich by selling all the chickens / starting a massive chicken range.

Ahhh, but drawing dirt from a bag is not a free action; i see that
your cluck-fu is weak, who has trained you??

[kamikasei]

It originated as a joke feat in an April Fool's issue of Dragon magazine, but people started using it as the basis of a few cheesy CO'ed builds. Having thus proved that a small subset of D&D players could not be trusted to get the joke WOTC responded by deleting f'ing everything!!!!! and giving people a 'no user-servicable parts' D&D game with less scope for tacky abuse.
...
And that is why people who use Chicken Infested in their builds are the spawn of the devil.

I'm amused by the idea that it's the ones using Chicken Infested in TO builds who "didn't get the joke". Did it ever reach the point of anyone proposing using the feat in an actual at-table build with a straight face?

[Kaiyanwang]

"We have always been at war with Eurasia"

I like the whole post, but this one is particulary good.

[Curmudgeon]

Since no one else has said it, I'll point out that the real fun of a chicken-infested Commoner begins when they get their hands on a spell component pouch. By RAW, a SCP has nigh-infinite items within it, & drawing from a SCP is a free action.

It's only a free action as part of casting a spell with a material component. Otherwise, it's retrieving a stored item, which is a move action. Still, producing a chicken 5 times a minute on average should keep you in business.

[Cieyrin]

how much money is a chicken worth? on average 5 chickens per minute out of thin air sounds awesome... id corner the poultry market, feed everyone... maybe get myself declared a messiah...

I lol'd at the idea of a Chicken Mesiah. Silly commoner-only flaws.

[Foryn Gilnith]

It's only a free action as part of casting a spell with a material component. Otherwise, it's retrieving a stored item, which is a move action. Still, producing a chicken 5 times a minute on average should keep you in business.

Heward's Handy Haversack, as per DMG errata, allows indefinite free action retrieval. Since the item you're searching for (chicken) is always on top.

[Cieyrin]

Heward's Handy Haversack, as per DMG errata, allows indefinite free action retrieval. Since the item you're searching for (chicken) is always on top.

Wouldn't that override Chicken retrieval, as you aren't looking for a chicken, unless you're storing chickens in your Handy Haversack, which sounds like a good way to ruin it in my opinion. Either that or you're going to be carrying around a lot of dead chickens, which probably isn't desirable unless you want to open your own restaurant chain or something.

[Grey Watcher]

Heward's Handy Haversack, as per DMG errata, allows indefinite free action retrieval. Since the item you're searching for (chicken) is always on top.

Wait, does Chicken Infested actually work if you WANT to draw a Chicken?

"I can pull chickens out of thin air, but only if I don't want to!"

[Keshay]

Wouldn't that override Chicken retrieval, as you aren't looking for a chicken, unless you're storing chickens in your Handy Haversack, which sounds like a good way to ruin it in my opinion. Either that or you're going to be carrying around a lot of dead chickens, which probably isn't desirable unless you want to open your own restaurant chain or something.

Hmm, here's a new use for Chicken Infested: Convincing others you have healing powers. Put a dead chicken in a bag, reach for it to pull it out and you have a 50% chance of getting a live chicken instead. If you do manage to get the dead chicken, just put it back and try again. Chicken Messiah indeed.

Actually, does the flaw explicitly state that the chickens retreived are alive? If not, and you can pull dead chickens out of thin air, some of those Chicken Necromancer builds can skip a step.

[PhoenixRivers]

The trick lies in ammunition.

Said commoner buys a quiver of 20 arrows from the general store.
This quiver is placed on the counter.
He attempts to draw them all, one at a time, using a free action to place them on the sales counter, beside the quiver.

On average, he receives 10 chickens.
He sells the chickens and the arrows back. (at half value)

He buys 4 quivers with the profit.
Gets 40 chickens.

Then 16 quivers.
Feeds an entire town.