(4ed) Kender for 4ed?

[incubus5075]

Anyone know if they plan on releasing a Kender race for 4ed? It has always been a favorite race of mine and I feel that my group needs some humor thrown in to it. Any ideas on how I can alter the 4ed halfling to suit my kender ideas?

[Kurald Galain]

I suppose they would show up in the DragonLance campaign guide.

2008 - Forgotten Realms
2009 - Eberron
2010 - Dark Sun
2011 - ???


(edit) if you want a homebrew Kender, I'd suggest taking a 4E halfling, and replacing its Second Chance encounter power with this:

Taunt (encounter power) minor action.
Close burst 5
Target: one enemy in burst.
Attack: (your choice of int, wis or cha) vs will
Hit: on his next turn, the first action the target must take is charge you. If he is too close to you to charge, he must make a basic melee attack against you instead. If he can do neither, he may act normally.


(edit edit) oh yeah, and make it (stat)+2 at paragon, (stat)+4 at epic; and throw in a heroic feat that also makes it do 1d6+stat psychic damage on a hit, 2d6 at paragon, 3d6 at epic; a paragon feat that makes it use two targets; and an epic feat that makes it affect all enemies within burst.

[oxybe]

monster manual 2 i believe. i don't remember the exact book, but my buddy was playing one.

[Tiki Snakes]

monster manual 2 i believe. i don't remember the exact book, but my buddy was playing one.

You are thinking of Kenku, the totally awesome Crow-people, rather than Kender, the plot-armoured halfling kleptomaniacs. :)

[The J Pizzel]

You want a Kender in your game? Have you thought it through? Don't ge me wrong, Tass was great, but the spawns that have come out of that and onto the gaming tables have just been.....<shudders>

[oxybe]

ah. my bad. i know my roommate was playing a small race that started with a "K" who was very much a kleptomaniac. didn't properly remember whether it was Kenku or Kender

[incubus5075]

ABsolutely i want a kender! I use to play one when i first started playing. His name was Laven Deepwater (his favorite color was purple and he was born in Waterdeep) He was mechanically just an awesome thief but was mainly there for fun roleplaying and to get the other players into trouble. My DM loved him since if the players were having to easy of an time Laven would simple say 'oops' or 'i'm bored' and all hel would break lose. The other players found him hilarious and often risked their lives to save him. I took him all the way to lvl 20 and I want to bring him back for my new 4ed game.

[Lost Demiurge]

You WANT Kender in 4E? Gah.

Well, then I suggest taking a basic halfling, and making a simple adjustment. This'll make things work perfectly.

Lose the halfling defensive power, whatever it's called. Replace with the following.

Power: You Had this Coming!
Frequency: Encounter, Reaction (Special. Activated at choice of other party members.)
Effect: Whenever your character's actions annoy at least one other player to the point of anger, that player may punch you. No, not his character hitting your character, that PLAYER may punch YOU.
Secondary Effect: The first player to deliver a punch to you during the activation of this power gains an action point for his character.
Tertiary Effect: A valuable lesson is delivered, and hopefully more care is taken in the future to avoid spoiling other people's fun.

[Another_Poet]

I think you could easily homebrew a 4e kender. Start with halfling stats, but put a hammer next to the player at the gaming table. Every time somebody starts to actually focus on the game or accomplish something, the player grabs the hammer and wails on the table as hard as they can 20-30 times while yelling, "KENDER-KENDER-KENDER-KENDER-KENDER-KENDER!". Ta-daa, the full kender experience.

[incubus5075]

Oh and here is just one example out of pure awesomness of Laven. We finally confront the BBEG lich who we have spent several sessions trying to find/kill. He is using winged boots to stay out of range of our melee guys and is flying over a chasm where a lava river flows. ( i know cliche but we were like 15) So i'm playing Laven and have done nothing but taunt the lich to try and get him closer and tripped up some skeletons to help out my friends so the lich is pretty much ignoring me. I decide what the heck i REALLY want those boots! Run and jump (roll a 20!) make the 15 ft jump and grab the lich by the waist. I then suceed to untie his boots and put them on before we make the 100 ft fall to lava. Quite happy i got some cool new boots! Plus flying kender= mass chaos and very hard to keep out of your place of business!

[pasko77]

You WANT Kender in 4E? Gah.

Well, then I suggest taking a basic halfling, and making a simple adjustment. This'll make things work perfectly.

Lose the halfling defensive power, whatever it's called. Replace with the following.

Power: You Had this Coming!
Frequency: Encounter, Reaction (Special. Activated at choice of other party members.)
Effect: Whenever your character's actions annoy at least one other player to the point of anger, that player may punch you. No, not his character hitting your character, that PLAYER may punch YOU.
Secondary Effect: The first player to deliver a punch to you during the activation of this power gains an action point for his character.
Tertiary Effect: A valuable lesson is delivered, and hopefully more care is taken in the future to avoid spoiling other people's fun.

Lol, that's exactly how I would rule the kender.
The most hated race in the world.

[incubus5075]

Man I had no idea everyone hated Kenders! I always found them fun, entertaining and added a little humor to the table. Why are they so hated? Besides stealing EVERYONE's things?

[Kylarra]

Because kleptomaniac players are annoying, particularly when they can hide behind the fact "oh it's my race and not my fault ^____________^"

[incubus5075]

I guess it depends on the group you play with and how up tight they are. My group simply checked their items ever morning to make sure they still had there stuff and laughed when Laven would steal the minotaur's axe and it had to fight with its horns only etc

[BlackSheep]

Man I had no idea everyone hated Kenders! I always found them fun, entertaining and added a little humor to the table. Why are they so hated? Besides stealing EVERYONE's things?

Besides stealing? They're played as the type of character that goes:
"Hey, what's this button do?" *press*

"All this planning is boring. I'm going to see what's behind that door."

"I bet this deep chasm makes a cool echo. HELLOOOOOO!"

They're troublemakers that are oblivious to the consequences of their actions, and not everyone enjoys the company of perpetual children. That said, they're also supposed to be fearless, which is an underappreciated aspect of the race, I think.

[Mando Knight]

I think you could easily homebrew a 4e kender. Start with halfling stats, but put a hammer next to the player at the gaming table. Every time somebody starts to actually focus on the game or accomplish something, the player grabs the hammer and wails on the table as hard as they can 20-30 times while yelling, "KENDER-KENDER-KENDER-KENDER-KENDER-KENDER!". Ta-daa, the full kender experience.

That's pretty much what I thought. Kender are basically halflings with a funny name and a penchant for annoying everyone else at the game table.

[chiasaur11]

Besides stealing? They're played as the type of character that goes:
"Hey, what's this button do?" *press*

"All this planning is boring. I'm going to see what's behind that door."

"I bet this deep chasm makes a cool echo. HELLOOOOOO!"

They're troublemakers that are oblivious to the consequences of their actions, and not everyone enjoys the company of perpetual children. That said, they're also supposed to be fearless, which is an underappreciated aspect of the race, I think.

Courage is resistance to fear, mastery of fear - not absence of fear. Except a creature be part coward it is not a compliment to say it is brave. ~Mark Twain,

Overcoming fear makes you a brave man and a hero.

Being entirely without fear makes you a moron or a maniac.

Guess where Kender fall?

[Kylarra]

I guess it depends on the group you play with and how up tight they are. My group simply checked their items ever morning to make sure they still had there stuff and laughed when Laven would steal the minotaur's axe and it had to fight with its horns only etc

It's not even a matter of being uptight. It's a matter of a character with both kleptomaniac tendencies and the maturity of a child that is innately defined to be so and cannot be held responsible for their actions. Keep in mind that the players that choose to play kender generally do so at the expense of the rest of the party's fun, the ones that have the skill to play it well, don't need the racial crutch and thus don't play kender.

[Siosilvar]

"All this planning is boring. I'm going to see what's behind that door."

"LEEEEEROY JENKINS!"

[Tiki Snakes]

So, yeah. Basically Kender are Halflings, and don't need additional homebrew, just roleplay them accordingly (And be prepared to face the consequences.)

However, to properly model Kender that have somehow escaped the Dragonlance setting I reccommend giving them the following racial trait in addition to everything they get as halflings.

Universal Approval -
Any attacker who scores a critical hit against a Kender regains 3 hit points and an additional d6 per tier. Reality itself approves.

[incubus5075]

HMMMM well despite everyone's seeming hatred of the race i still find the race quite fun and entertaining. Perhaps everyone has had a bad experience with an annoying player that played a kender. I've played one and no one got annoyed so again it probably just depends on if the group you play with likes roleplaying or rollplaying and how up tight they are. Of course there will be those that take the kender antics to extremes but i'm not one of those. Maybe i'll just roll up a halfling rogue with kender-like tendancies.

[LibraryOgre]

Besides stealing? They're played as the type of character that goes:
"Hey, what's this button do?" *press*

"All this planning is boring. I'm going to see what's behind that door."

"I bet this deep chasm makes a cool echo. HELLOOOOOO!"

They're troublemakers that are oblivious to the consequences of their actions, and not everyone enjoys the company of perpetual children. That said, they're also supposed to be fearless, which is an underappreciated aspect of the race, I think.

We have a player who does that already. Right now, he's playing a Githzerai monk. I do not anticipate this aspect of the player changing, just because his character did.

That said, I think I would slightly change Kurald's response; leave kender as a slightly refluffed halflings, and make taunt a feat option, rather than a replacement for Second Chance... kender are extremely lucky, and tend to survive things they should not.

[Mando Knight]

Man I had no idea everyone hated Kenders! I always found them fun, entertaining and added a little humor to the table. Why are they so hated? Besides stealing EVERYONE's things?

Tasteful humor is not found in little pests. Especially when they're scrappy little Karma Houdinis that get to blame their misdeeds on it being a part of their nature that they can't control.

[Kylarra]

HMMMM well despite everyone's seeming hatred of the race i still find the race quite fun and entertaining. Perhaps everyone has had a bad experience with an annoying player that played a kender. I've played one and no one got annoyed so again it probably just depends on if the group you play with likes roleplaying or rollplaying and how up tight they are. Of course there will be those that take the kender antics to extremes but i'm not one of those. Maybe i'll just roll up a halfling rogue with kender-like tendancies.

I'm a bit tired of your insinuations as to the failings of everyone else's groups, so I'll leave it at this. Kender are all the issues people have with CN characters, added to the fact that are explicitly defined to be this way and cannot be held responsible for their actions. Can they played well? Maybe. Are the majority of them? No.

[hamishspence]

that reminds me strongly of the MM2 4E bullywugs.

Each time you score a critical hit on one of them, you regain a set amount of hit points- slightly more for more powerful bullywugs, because:

"nature itself is thanking you"

[incubus5075]

You guys/gals seem so angry :)

[LibraryOgre]

I'm a bit tired of your insinuations as to the failings of everyone else's groups, so I'll leave it at this. Kender are all the issues people have with CN/E characters, added to the fact that are explicitly defined to be this way and cannot be held responsible for their actions. Can they played well? Maybe. Are the majority of them? No.

CNs, yes, but not CEs. A poorly-played kender (i.e. the obnoxious klepto) is unlikely to stab you in the back or slaughter you in your sleep. He may indirectly cause your death, but he's seldom the one wielding the sword that kills you.

[Kylarra]

CNs, yes, but not CEs. A poorly-played kender (i.e. the obnoxious klepto) is unlikely to stab you in the back or slaughter you in your sleep. He may indirectly cause your death, but he's seldom the one wielding the sword that kills you.

Well true, I'll concede that they're less likely to end up CE-ing you. I'll just leave it at CN for the sake of being accurate.

[incubus5075]

An alignment+class+race combo will never make a good character. A well thought out concept and someone who enjoys roleplaying can make any character fun for the group. I don't think "oh its because i'm this race/alignment" has ever left my mouth, nor should it if you are decent with roleplaying. Falling back on a race crux is annoying but I don't feel like ALL ppl that play kenders do that. Not all dwarfs are alcoholics and not all elven are uptight. Not all kender are annoying and useless. A child like curiousity and a penchant for getting in to trouble, in my experience, only makes the game more fun. I did not start this thread to start an argument, far from it. I was mearly asking a simple question and it turns out everyone is racist :) and :) = i told a joke so chill out

[Tiki Snakes]

that reminds me strongly of the MM2 4E bullywugs.

Each time you score a critical hit on one of them, you regain a set amount of hit points- slightly more for more powerful bullywugs, because:

"nature itself is thanking you"

That's because it's stolen wholesale. Seems appropriate, no?


Also, Incubus; Kender are a really, really unbelievable race outside of their native setting, simply because they would get themselves ganked/genocided with unnatural speed if unleashed anywhere that the Gods Themselves weren't actively intervening to prevent this.

As someone who has never even had to play with a Kender, I can confirm that a lot of the hostility is purely for the race as written, and nothing infact to do with the way they are commonly played. It's just the way they are commonly played often makes things worse.

If your group are amused by Kender, and they have no problem with what you playing one will inevitably entail, then go for it, but remember that just because the Kender doesn't think it's stealing from it's allies, or deliberately trying to cause trouble, doesn't mean that isn't a perfectly reasonable assumption for the other characters to make. So if you get stabbed, you really have no room for complaint. It's a real possibility going in, especially if you aren't in a specifically good aligned group of tolerant, patient adventurers.