Iron Heart Surge

[Sharkman1231]

What does it do?
Also, if not immediately obvious, why is it so good?

[Starbuck_II]

What does it do?
Also, if not immediately obvious, why is it so good?

What doesn't it do by RAW? Answer: Very little.

It removes anything with a duration. It ends the effect as well for everyone (example Antimagic field on a Warblade ends it if IHS 's it).

[Dienekes]

Image you're stuned, asleep, dazed, whatever, for x amount of rounds.

1 Iron Heart Surge later, no, no you are not.

I think you can understand how useful this is.

[Foryn Gilnith]

You can't take actions while asleep/stunned/dazed, so by RAW you can't IHS your way out.

[Starbuck_II]

Actually, you can't use it wghen it would appropriate like stun, sleep, etc.

Because you can't use Standard actions to use it.

But you can end the sun if you are Drow or a Orc.

[Sinfire Titan]

But you can end the sun if you are Drow or a Orc.

One of these days the Mind Flayers will realize this and the prophecy printed in Lords of Madness shall begin.


Sadly, IHS can also end the Darkness if you're human. Sorry Rick James.

[Sharkman1231]

But you can end the sun if you are Drow or a Orc.

AWESOME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Douglas]

But you can end the sun if you are Drow or a Orc.

How many times am I going to have to refute this? Iron Heart Surge can end spells, effects, and conditions. The sun fits under none of these categories. If you are a drow or orc you could (depending on DM interpretation of the duration clause) use it to end the Dazzled condition caused by the sun and your race, but the sun would be completely unaffected by this. Claiming you can end the sun this way is like claiming that using Iron Heart Surge against a slow spell would make the caster of the spell die. If I have to explain why that doesn't work...

[Godskook]

But you can end the sun if you are Drow or a Orc.

Stop spreading that. The sun does not have a 'duration', and is thus not a valid target, even for munchkins who like to have a love-affair with RAW while jilting RAI.

[Starbuck_II]

Stop spreading that. The sun does not have a 'duration', and is thus not a valid target, even for munchkins who like to have a love-affair with RAW while jilting RAI.

Untrue if using logic or Physics. Suns are not infinite. They do burn out. Otherwise super novas wouldn't happen.

Here is a link explaining it: http://starchild.gsfc.nasa.gov/docs/...uestion41.html

[Douglas]

Untrue if using logic or Physics. Suns are not infinite. They do burn out.

Okay, now try refuting the serious problems I pointed out.

[Gorgondantess]

Untrue if using logic or Physics. Suns are not infinite. They do burn out.

Um... logic? Anyone arguing that IHS can end the sun left real logic a looooong time ago, buddy.

[industrious]

Technically, the sun has a duration of billions of years...but I'm just arguing for the sake of it.Ninja'd

That being said, IHS is great for setting watches against nighttime encounters. 1 watch, all night, no fatigue the next morning.

[Starbuck_II]

Technically, the sun has a duration of billions of years...but I'm just arguing for the sake of it.Ninja'd

That being said, IHS is great for setting watches against nighttime encounters. 1 watch, all night, no fatigue the next morning.

Not exactly, it depends on the size the sun. A sun 15 times our sun would have 1/2 of a billion life span.

Basically, the bigger you are the faster you die for a sun.

[Sharkman1231]

This is starting to sound like one adventure I DM'ed. I had an underwater cavern which was connected by a stairway to the surface. So my players tried to dig a trench to carry water and flood the place.
My response was "logic has not been invented yet."

[Godskook]

Untrue if using logic or Physics. Suns are not infinite. They do burn out. Otherwise super novas wouldn't happen.

Here is a link explaining it: http://starchild.gsfc.nasa.gov/docs/...uestion41.html

1.No, if you want to argue the logic 'properly', IHS used against the sun puts out all the fires on this side of the sun, which proceed to reignite on the sun's next turn, assuming IHS affects as you argue.

2.I wasn't referring to the sun itself, since that's not an effect relevant to the Warblade. The 'sun rays' are the effect, and they're instantaneous effects.

[Sir_Elderberry]

The sun is having an effect on me. That effect is heat, light, UV radiation, whatever.

I use Iron Heart Surge. It ends effects on me.

I am no longer under the effects of that EM radiation. The sun's still there, but my heart's so iron I surge through it.

[Galileo]

As much as "I Iron Heart Surge the sun!" is a great line, if one of my players tried it, I'd rule that he only IHSed the particular rays that were hitting him at that moment. IHSing heatstroke, on the other hand...

[taltamir]

The sun is having an effect on me. That effect is heat, light, UV radiation, whatever.

I use Iron Heart Surge. It ends effects on me.

I am no longer under the effects of that EM radiation. The sun's still there, but my heart's so iron I surge through it.

best saying I heard... in a really long while. Very quote worthy

I like the analysis that suggested: ending the sun with IHS is like killing the wizard who cast a spell on you with IHS, the effect end, not its source

By the RAW, your lifespan is set in stone. even class abilities which grant immunity to aging only stop negative effects of aging and you still die when, and I quote "your time is up".
Hence I would say "your life" has a duration... you can IHS to end your life. :)
Cynide pills are for pansies.

[The Glyphstone]

Does anyone here honestly, seriously believe that they could get away with ending the sun via IHS, or would even try to do so in the first place? By strictly read RAW and enough distortion of logic, it is possible - but the entire reason for pointing that out is to demonstrate how poorly worded and written the ability is in the first place.

[taltamir]

Does anyone here honestly, seriously believe that they could get away with ending the sun via IHS, or would even try to do so in the first place? By strictly read RAW and enough distortion of logic, it is possible - but the entire reason for pointing that out is to demonstrate how poorly worded and written the ability is in the first place.

point.. one could argue that the sun has a creator, the gods. making the sun no different than AMF for purpose of ending its existence.

[Galileo]

I'd try to Iron Heart Surge the sun. Hell, I'd try to Iron Heart Surge the effect of being stabbed in the gut. Technically, he's gotta take his dagger out sometime, so it's got a duration, right?

[Tyndmyr]

best saying I heard... in a really long while. Very quote worthy

I like the analysis that suggested: ending the sun with IHS is like killing the wizard who cast a spell on you with IHS, the effect end, not its source

By the RAW, your lifespan is set in stone. even class abilities which grant immunity to aging only stop negative effects of aging and you still die when, and I quote "your time is up".
Hence I would say "your life" has a duration... you can IHS to end your life. :)
Cynide pills are for pansies.

Life is a condition, sure, but so is death.

Condition ended for EVERYONE.

[Paulus]

No, but you can Iron heart surge the Human Condition.

*runs and gets on the teetertotter* wheeee! ow! my butt!

[jcsw]

1.No, if you want to argue the logic 'properly', IHS used against the sun puts out all the fires on this side of the sun, which proceed to reignite on the sun's next turn, assuming IHS affects as you argue.

Suns do not work that way.

[Draz74]

I Iron Heart Surge away the sun's effects on me.

Good thing you still have Iron Heart Surge; you're going to need to use it every couple days for the rest of your life to remove the Conditions of Vitamin D Deficiency and clinical depression from your character ...

EDIT: Anyway, it's pretty simple and obvious to limit IHS to game-defined "conditions." If you do this, and follow RAW strictly, the maneuver is more likely to be underpowered than overpowered.

Since it doesn't work vs. paralysis (executing maneuvers requires movement), or stunning or dazed (requires a standard action) or charm/dominate (... yeah) ... there aren't very many common effects that it actually helps with.

[Tyndmyr]

No, but you can Iron heart surge the Human Condition.

*runs and gets on the teetertotter* wheeee! ow! my butt!

Exxxxcellent

[taltamir]

Life is a condition, sure, but so is death.

Condition ended for EVERYONE.

but life has a fixed duration... death does not have a duration... does it?
but if it did, you would have indeed ended the effects of death, for everyone.

[Killer Angel]

Suns do not work that way.

yeah, but think about it for a moment: "the dark side of the sun", a new great Pink Floyd's album...

[Ganurath]

...Can Iron Heart Surge apply to aging penalties if your of a race other than Elan or Warforged?