Shadowrun 4E Vehicle Weapon Mounts

[The Random NPC]

The weapon mounts say they can hold LMG or smaller weapons, but I can't seem to find out what weapons are LMG sized. My current guess is that LMG stands for light machine gun, but then the specializations for gunnery doesn't make any sense, what with most of them being large weapons. Could anyone help me figure this out?

Also any advice on vehicles would be appreciated, I'm thinking about getting a GMC Bulldog Step-Van. It seems like the only vehicle that can seat 6 people, pilot included, and can stand up to a few rounds of combat.

The only book allowed so far is the core rulebook.

[Swordguy]

Weapons are technically listed in approximate order of size, by category, so it means you can mount any of the following weapon types on the mount:

Light machine Guns
Assault Rifles
Rifles
Shotguns
Submachineguns
Machine Pistols
Heavy Pistols
Light Pistols
Hold-out Pistols

You CANNOT mount:

Medium Machineguns
Heavy Machineguns
Assault Cannons
Rocket or Missile Launchers

It's a GM's call whether you can mount:
Grenade Launchers (I lean toward yes so the group can use smoke grenades to cover an escape, but YMMV. Back in 3e they had an equivalent concealability modifier to Assault Rifles, which was a rough indication of size, but 4e got rid of weapon-specific concealability modifiers.)

Generally speaking, though, you'll want automatic weapons, since the firmpoint mount gives you guaranteed recoil absorbtion for free. LMGs, Assault Rifles, and SMGs are the standard choices - with most people strapping AK-97 Assault Rifles to their ride because they're cheap and effective. Also, Assault Rifles are the smallest class of automatic weapon that is really going to do anything against another vehicle.

The Gunnery skill controls ANY weapon mounted on a vehicle, regardless of the size of the weapon. Once you dismount it, you use the appropriate weapon skill (Longarms, Heavy Weapons, etc). And yes, you're pretty much stuck with the Bulldog. Riggers (which it sounds like you're making) really need their appropriate splatbook for a variety of vehicles. IMO, they suffer from using only the core rulebook more than any other archetype.

[The Random NPC]

So that means, barring house rules, specializing in Gunnery:Rocket is a pretty stupid move. If you can tell me the name of the splat, I may be able to get my GM to allow it. Thank you for the prompt reply.

[Swordguy]

So that means, barring house rules, specializing in Gunnery:Rocket is a pretty stupid move. If you can tell me the name of the splat, I may be able to get my GM to allow it. Thank you for the prompt reply.

Not at all...assuming you have a vehicle that's capable of mounting rocket launchers and you have ready access to both the launchers and ammo. Of course, since you're talking about driving a Bulldog which can't mount rocket launchers, then yes, specializing in Gunnery (Rockets) is not an especially smart move.


The book you want is Arsenal, and you'll want to look specifically at the Ares Roadmaster and the Ford-Canada Buffalo. Both have room for at least 6 personnel. The Roadmaster is more heavily armored (it's essentially a military-grade APC) and usually comes with gunports, but it's pretty damn conspicuous. The Buffalo is a very common RV, so nobody pays much attentions to it. There's also a tractor-trailer rig, a city bus, and a delivery van, but in my experience the Roadmaster and the Buffalo are the best blend of cost/utility.

Just in case you can't get a copy of the book (they're between print runs right now, so it's kinda hard to find):

Roadmaster: (Handling -1; Accel: 10/30; Speed 120; Pilot 2; Body 16; Armor 16; Sensor 2; Availability 4; Cost 48k) Comes with Life Support 1; Personal Armor 6; 2 gun ports

Buffalo: (Handling -2; Accel: 10/20; Speed 80; Pilot 2; Body 16; Armor 10; Sensor 2; Availability - ; Cost 55k) Comes with Amenities (middle), Off-road Suspension


I'm still not sure why the Buffalo is more expensive than the Roadmaster, since it has, strictly speaking, a worse statline. Using 3e rules (the vehicle overall costs are identical between 3e and 4e) the Roadmaster, if built from "scratch", clocks in at 49k, and the Buffalo clocks in at 42k. That said, anonymity is worth a pretty penny in Shadowrun, and nobody'll really look at a low-grade RV twice. They'll DEFINITELY notice a military Armored Personnel Carrier rumbling down the street. And if you know a good mechanic, you can subtly upgrade the Buffalo to identical armor and handling specs as the Roadmaster, and a concealed weapon port or two, and nobody will be the wiser.

EDIT: Oh, and Arsenal also has the vehicle modification rules. You'll like those - the ones in 4e are MUCH nicer than in 3e.

[The Random NPC]

No worries about conspicuousness, my GM says the setting is post apocalyptic,(magical upheaval, new critters, everything reverting to its natural state) so worst case scenario, I'll have to park it in a garage while in the corporation-city. I'll definitely try to get that book, and beg my GM to allow it.
Once again, thank you for the info.

[Swordguy]

No worries about conspicuousness, my GM says the setting is post apocalyptic,(magical upheaval, new critters, everything reverting to its natural state) so worst case scenario, I'll have to park it in a garage while in the corporation-city. I'll definitely try to get that book, and beg my GM to allow it.
Once again, thank you for the info.

Oh, yeah, if you're post-apoc then certainly got for the Roadmaster. And definitely look into the vehicle modification rules. Let's see...

You'll want to hit it up with Off-road Suspension and Anemities (Middle) modifications at a minimum...but you've got 16 upgrade slots (equal to the Vehicle's Body score) and each of those only uses 1 slot, so you've got plenty of spare room. Heck Improved Economy (1 slot, doubles the time between refuelings) and/or a Suncell (1 slot, same thing if sunny) wouldn't hurt. And depending on HOW post-apoc the setting is, Life Support 2 (3 slots, grants a full chemical/radiation seal) wouldn't be amiss either. If you take all of those (Improved Econ OR Suncell), you'll have 10 upgrade slots left...which translates into 2-3 weapon mounts, size of weapon, weapon traverse range, and protection for the gunner depending.

If vehicles or drones are going to play a major role in your game, and you're worried about your GM's reaction to askign to use the sourcebook, try printing this out:

GM: As a Catalyst Demo Team member (#367, "Darrian Wolffe"), let me assure you that Arsenal is a close to a "mandatory" book for a vehicle-heavy game as you're likely to find. Since fully half of the purpose of having a Rigger is having a tricked-out ride, and since the vehicle modification rules are in this particular sourcebook, restricting the use of this book - if it is readily available, handicaps Vehicle and Drone-based characters unduly to a greater degree than restricting any other sourcebook would hurt any other archetype. Your guy isn't power-gaming by simply asking to use the book. While it is your game and your rules, I heartily endorse allowing The Random NPC to use, at least, the stock vehicles and vehicle modification rules from Arsenal.

[The Random NPC]

Awesome! Thank you and I'll be sure to direct my GM here to bolster my chances of getting to use the book.
EDIT: Turns out my GM was planning on using that book all along. I need to go giggle in joy now...

[kjones]

Although this probably isn't a problem for you in this case, weapon mounts have availability F, so be careful where you take your weapon-mounted van.