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    Default [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    Context :
    A DM, on a PbP forum, is currently running a game that, by his own words, is going to be "more about strategy and large-scale battles than about your usual party of adventurers". So far, it's neat and I even found it cool.
    When he said "-Each player got 1.000.000 po to equip his army but you must spend it all", I found it REALLY cool : the guy was basically giving us a country's budget but, to avoid us just flooding the market with money, we had to justify ways the money had been spent over the course of the previous years. This was so going to rox...
    Then the DM announced "-You are all level 20. You can recruit troops up to the level 10 characters or CR10 monsters". I had a brain lag... What ?
    I tried to explain to him that even a single level 20 wizard could basically wipe out a whole army in a matter of minutes and that, with 1.000.000 gp to equip himself, the game was not going to be about armies waging an epic war but about demigods crushing ants.
    I even presented tactics (Wightpocalypse and its variants, an upgraded version of Xykon's bouncing symbol, air bombardment with 500lb iron balls in bags of holding, summoned Vrocks making the Dance of Ruin,...) that could ruin the game, expecting him to say something like "-...eeeh, no, you right, this won't do, let's power things down". His answer ? "-Now, that's what I'm expecting !!"

    So, from there, my goal is clear :
    I will make a 20th level wizard and (ab)use the rules as much as possible to see how far I can get before "the gods" (aka the DM) stop him from taking over the world.

    Self-imposed limits :
    I'm not Emperor Tippy, however. I do have ethic standards.
    My Wizard, while not an Angel, won't be evil. Actually, he's going to be Chaotic Good. This means :
    • No mind rape on whole population to make them more friendly. Similar spells such as Dominate Monsters are only ok as tactical, temporary tools, not as a social engineering strategy.
    • No wightpocalypse on innocent towns because "the end justifies the means". We want to rule the world but we want to rule PEOPLE, not their corpses or tortured souls.
    • No "scry-and-die" on people who "might" be a future threat. People should be punish for their past misdeeds, not the ones they haven't even plotted yet.

    Also, since I want to prove that a wizard of that level is, alone, worth several armies, I won't recruit troops with the 1 million gp. Of course, nothing prevents me from summoning, dominating, calling or even create my own troops once the game begin. This also means our little Tippy got 1 million gp worth of equipement. Enjoy.

    So, the rules are set.
    Ladies and Gentlemen, use your limitless imagination to give birth to Tippy before he became "Emperor Tippy". Try to use core only but beside that, RAW is the limit. Just remember : It's a 20th wizard, no multiclassing, just a full wizard.
    Last edited by Johel; 2009-11-11 at 07:43 PM.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    Good means no Tainted Sorcerer... instead of an army how about chain gated Solars? Goes well with a good theme
    Last edited by Wings of Peace; 2009-11-11 at 07:47 PM.
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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    Tippy actually said that it's entirely possible to run the Tippyverse in a good way, so it's not really against Tippyverse rules.

    As for the level 20 wizard thing... why no multiclassing? Does that include no PrCing?

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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Milskidasith View Post

    As for the level 20 wizard thing... why no multiclassing? Does that include no PrCing?
    Pretty sure, Straight Wizard 20 means just Wizard: unless he meant Level of Straightness.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Starbuck_II View Post
    Pretty sure, Straight Wizard 20 means just Wizard: unless he meant Level of Straightness.
    Could refer to intended caster level.
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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    Have a substantial colony in a plane you created with Genesis where time flows faster than in the "real" world.

    Also, get leadership.
    Last edited by Pharaoh's Fist; 2009-11-12 at 01:06 AM.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    I've heard good things about the animate dread warrior spell. Unlike animate dead there is no control limit, but you burn XP for casting the spell. So find some way of mitigating the cost (like making yourself necropolitan and spell-stitching it onto yourself) and you can raise an infinitely large army given enough time... then see above

    Of course as far as Wizard 20 shenanigans go, thats tame by comparison. But making yourself necropolitan might be a good idea anyway for the undead immunities.
    Last edited by JeminiZero; 2009-11-11 at 08:30 PM.
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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    Although if you're a straight Wizard 20 with no extra XP, necropolitan drops you 2 levels.
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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    Quote Originally Posted by industrious View Post
    Although if you're a straight Wizard 20 with no extra XP, necropolitan drops you 2 levels.
    One level actually. Necropolitan drops you by one level and 1000 xp when you perform the ritual. Now write into your backstory that you performed it on level 3, and it would have cost you 3000 xp. At ECL 20 with no extra XP, the 3k XP puts you at level 19, and 3k XP short of 20.

    At which point you might as well start using some other XP burning stuff since you will still be at level 19: Craft items, cast Genesis, the Spell Stitching craft process etc

    On the other hand, if you get 3k or more extra XP, you still get to be level 20.
    Last edited by JeminiZero; 2009-11-11 at 08:43 PM.
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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    If you take it at level three exactly it drops you only 3000 EXP, which is only one level. And besides, he's going to be Crafting Contingent Spells anyway.

    Ninja'd!
    Last edited by Milskidasith; 2009-11-11 at 08:43 PM.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pharaoh's Fist View Post
    Have a substantial colony in a plane you created with Genesis where time flows faster than in the "real" world.
    Make sure you've reached immortality, and milk this for all it's worth. Make yourself an elan, or a neraph (non-native outsiders don't die of old age), a human with Otherworldly, or just someone with a druid as a cohort with easy access to reincarnation to keep you young forever. Or use a wish. (Necropolitan works as well, of course.)

    Use lesser planar binding to bind an efreeti (dominate it, or offer to give it the next day's three wishes for itself for being a good sport and remaining in your service for a bit), and use its wishes to make freebie simulacrums of one illithid elder brain, one nightmare, two thousand versions of yourself, two thousand efreet, three thousand solars, ten tarrasques, and one thousand nine-hundred and ninety great wyrm gold dragons (do the efreet first, so you can use their wishes to produce more simulacrums; you should have all of these done within the first day), and ensure they're all completely loyal to you. Have the nightmare cast astral projection on itself, on you, and all of your simulacrums (do this from your demiplane to speed things up). Keep the original bodies of the simulacrums and yourself on your demiplane in orderly rows (the dragons should alter their bodies to become human-sized for easier storage). Make sure all of the solars, efreet, and dragons have the Flyby Attack feat via retraining and/or psychic reformation.

    Make one of your demiplanes (you've got more than one; and all have the fast-time trait) out of platinum, and use the sped-up time-frame to cast fabricate and transport the coinage out.

    Use the platinum to procure two thousand sets of ring gates (either directly or through various crafting minions you've got set away on your demiplane, such as dwarven ancestors); set up an underground keep somewhere well-defended (we'll get into that later). Split the solars into two groups; half to go out into the world, each riding a dragon or tarrasque and holding a ring gate, and half set to stay in your keep, with the the other halves to the first ring gates. The efreet are to stay in the keep as well. Also, wish for two rings of counterspelling for every simulacrum you've got, with greater dispel magic in each one.

    The ring gates at the keep are to be glued to the walls, entrance-side-out, in an orderly fashion in a single long 50' wide hallway, each attended by one of your simulacrums, a solar, or an efreeti. They are to watch the ring gates, and transmit important information back to the elder brain, which keeps track of everything that goes on, and stores and relays important information between you and them.

    Meanwhile, the solars riding the dragons and tarrasques go where you tell them to and do what you tell them to, keeping order in the world and smacking down any threats that come to your attention. The dragons can alter their shape to be smaller mounts, and the tarrasques can be saved for battles against serious threats that can't really hope to actually kill them.

    Whenever a serious threat pops up (say, a world-eating abomination or an army riding out to try to conquer you) that a single solar/dragon or solar/tarrasque combo can't fix, it's time to start getting serious; instruct your solars to fly past the proper ring gate, casting a spell via Flyby Attack. You can have any and all of the one thousand solars (as well as your personal simulacrums) cast one regular and one Quickened spell through the ring gate every single round until they're out of spells, with the dragons and solars out on the field aiming the ring gates to see as many foes as possible. If the threat still isn't eliminated, or if it's an epic-level threat, the efreet can cast their wish spells through the gates as well.

    The elder brain and you yourself can direct things as needed.

    If you've exhausted all of your resources and still need more firepower, feel free to have your forces use their last high-level spell and/or wish to plane shift to your fast-time demiplane to recharge, before heading out next round.

    And you still haven't touched YOUR spell-payload yet. Which you can bring to bear if you need quality over quantity (not that the spells of a 10th level caster aren't excessively awesome anyway).

    Any simulacrums that are destroyed will merely wake up in your demiplane. Have the nightmare astrally project them again. Meanwhile, another dragon and/or solar can simply teleport to where that one was downed to take up the fight again. If any are dispelled or 100% destroyed, simply make some more via wish.

    And all it cost you was some XP from genesis; you didn't even have to spend the one million gp.

    [edit] Technically, you can wish for any non-artifact items you want, so you wouldn't have to even craft them. All a standard wish requires is additional XP-expenditure, and since the efreet don't require XP spent on their wishes for their full effects...

    On a similar note, you can wish for scrolls of genesis, meaning A.) you can do this when you first start this cycle at or about level 11 (sooner if you get a scroll of lesser planar binding), and B.) you don't have to spend any XP whatsoever.
    Last edited by Lycanthromancer; 2009-11-17 at 01:18 AM.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lycanthromancer View Post
    (pure, unadulterated awesomeness)
    I was going to offer a suggestion that revolved around a handful of bound efreeti and inherent bonuses to your stats, but Lycanthromancer has already gone several orders of magnitude beyond my level of ambition. I shall instead shave my head, sell all my worldly possessions, and devote the rest of my life to studying the awesomeness of his post.
    Last edited by jiriku; 2009-11-11 at 09:33 PM.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    Did I mention that once you have your genesis, you can have your army of solars/efreeti/yourselves/dragons/tarrasques in one round or less?

    And once you have your crafters in hand, that they can craft your ring gates (all of them) in a few minutes of real-time, at most?

    Yes. YES!!! MUAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!*

    ...Ahem.







    *Multiple exclamation marks are a sure sign of a diseased mind.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    I wonder how this DM would react to something like Team Solars (see sig).
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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    Quote Originally Posted by JeminiZero View Post
    I've heard good things about the animate dread warrior spell. Unlike animate dead there is no control limit, but you burn XP for casting the spell. So find some way of mitigating the cost (like making yourself necropolitan and spell-stitching it onto yourself) and you can raise an infinitely large army given enough time... then see above

    Of course as far as Wizard 20 shenanigans go, thats tame by comparison. But making yourself necropolitan might be a good idea anyway for the undead immunities.
    Did someone say mitigating xp costs? Look no further than the BoED for Ambrosia, a substance that can replace xp costs for crafting and is produced by the casting of the spell Distilled Joy. All you need is a bunch of people experiencing pure bliss and a whole bunch of spell slots (or an infinite item, magic trap, or wondrous architecture). Considering there are spells in the same book that produce the desired feelings (among other mundane methods), it's definitely the classy way to rule the world.

    That or you can just be like Lycanthomancer and win everything.
    Last edited by Fizban; 2009-11-11 at 10:02 PM.
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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    How come no one has recommended Leadership yet?

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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    ^: Archivist or Cleric Cohort? Those seem like the two best options aside from maybe a psionic character for easier access to psychic(psionic?) reformation to give the solars and such fly-by attack.

    The only other that comes to mind (Artificer) seems to be made obsolete by the crafting demiplane.

    <_< Psst, what are these Dwarven Ancestors you mentioned, Lycanthromancer?

    Now that we have an army that's been made available for a slight XP cost in less than 30 seconds time(give or take)...

    What do you we do with the gold? (other than setting up and furnishing said underground command center, preferably in advance of the start of play) (Yes, I know that once the platinum demi-plane mint starts churning he'll have theoretically infinite supplies of gold for crafting purposes and so on, but he's still gotta spend that initial gold stash).

    Other than buying up every single spell that a wizard can learn, that is. I can't even begin to think of stuff other than terror weapons or stuff like that guided missile Tippy described.

    Or creating a "flagship" for your enemies to be attracted to in the form of an airship with many, many traps of Fabricate on the bottom so that huge blocks of whatsit that's heavy falls and crushes things into oblivion, possibly while covered in alchemists' fire. Heck, could probably assemble such a structure out of solar simulacrums if one wanted to devote a few more rounds to creating them before setting up that command center.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fizban View Post
    Did someone say mitigating xp costs? Look no further than the BoED for Ambrosia, a substance that can replace xp costs for crafting and is produced by the casting of the spell Distilled Joy. All you need is a bunch of people experiencing pure bliss and a whole bunch of spell slots (or an infinite item, magic trap, or wondrous architecture). Considering there are spells in the same book that produce the desired feelings (among other mundane methods), it's definitely the classy way to rule the world.

    That or you can just be like Lycanthomancer and win everything.
    Why not do it all?

    The Lycanthromancer route is, essentially, free of the gp cost, so the set-up for the conveyor belt/prison/battery station/series of magical, self-resetting traps can be taken out of the initial gold value (1 million, wasn't it? Or was it 100 million?)

    From what I've read it seems like we can spend that gold value in such a way that it's already been spent before start of play, so basically he could spend the gold to set it up as his prison system (or what basically amounts to the kingdom retirement home for everyone past middle age or whathaveyou)

    And then after the barracks and crafting demiplanes are set up, he could probably construct all of the relevant stuff with his free crafters for when he's not busy having them construct magical missiles and such.
    Last edited by Coidzor; 2009-11-11 at 10:14 PM.
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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Coidzor View Post

    Or creating a "flagship" for your enemies to be attracted to in the form of an airship with many, many traps of Fabricate on the bottom so that huge blocks of whatsit that's heavy falls and crushes things into oblivion, possibly while covered in alchemists' fire. Heck, could probably assemble such a structure out of solar simulacrums if one wanted to devote a few more rounds to creating them before setting up that command center.
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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fizban View Post
    Did someone say mitigating xp costs? Look no further than the BoED for Ambrosia, a substance that can replace xp costs for crafting and is produced by the casting of the spell Distilled Joy. All you need is a bunch of people experiencing pure bliss and a whole bunch of spell slots (or an infinite item, magic trap, or wondrous architecture). Considering there are spells in the same book that produce the desired feelings (among other mundane methods), it's definitely the classy way to rule the world.

    That or you can just be like Lycanthomancer and win everything.
    Oooh, good combination. You make a Brave New World, milk the people for Ambrosia for crafting items to improve their lives and make you more powerful.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Coidzor View Post
    ^: Archivist or Cleric Cohort? Those seem like the two best options aside from maybe a psionic character for easier access to psychic(psionic?) reformation to give the solars and such fly-by attack.

    The only other that comes to mind (Artificer) seems to be made obsolete by the crafting demiplane.

    <_< Psst, what are these Dwarven Ancestors you mentioned, Lycanthromancer?
    They're in the Monster Manual 4, though I'm not sure that it's the one I'm thinking of...

    Quote Originally Posted by Coidzor View Post
    Now that we have an army that's been made available for a slight XP cost in less than 30 seconds time(give or take)...

    What do you we do with the gold? (other than setting up and furnishing said underground command center, preferably in advance of the start of play) (Yes, I know that once the platinum demi-plane mint starts churning he'll have theoretically infinite supplies of gold for crafting purposes and so on, but he's still gotta spend that initial gold stash).
    Give it away in a campaign to get all the peasants in the world to like you. It's literally worthless to you at this point, so you might as well appear to be generous.

    Quote Originally Posted by Coidzor View Post
    Other than buying up every single spell that a wizard can learn, that is. I can't even begin to think of stuff other than terror weapons or stuff like that guided missile Tippy described.

    Or creating a "flagship" for your enemies to be attracted to in the form of an airship with many, many traps of Fabricate on the bottom so that huge blocks of whatsit that's heavy falls and crushes things into oblivion, possibly while covered in alchemists' fire. Heck, could probably assemble such a structure out of solar simulacrums if one wanted to devote a few more rounds to creating them before setting up that command center.
    You can make whatever you want with your spells, and buy whatever you like with your platinum. Toss the gold. You can even tell your DM that this is what you do with it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Coidzor View Post
    Why not do it all?

    The Lycanthromancer route is, essentially, free of the gp cost, so the set-up for the conveyor belt/prison/battery station/series of magical, self-resetting traps can be taken out of the initial gold value (1 million, wasn't it? Or was it 100 million?)

    From what I've read it seems like we can spend that gold value in such a way that it's already been spent before start of play, so basically he could spend the gold to set it up as his prison system (or what basically amounts to the kingdom retirement home for everyone past middle age or whathaveyou)

    And then after the barracks and crafting demiplanes are set up, he could probably construct all of the relevant stuff with his free crafters for when he's not busy having them construct magical missiles and such.
    Doesn't really matter what you do with it. You have the spells. You have the wishes. You have plenty of platinum.
    Last edited by Lycanthromancer; 2009-11-11 at 11:16 PM.

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    Last edited by Coidzor; 2009-11-11 at 10:59 PM.
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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    Hmm. Technically you don't need crafters. You've got the wishes, which, according to the spell description, can create magic items of any strength; it just requires a large XP expenditure.

    And since our wishes don't require any XP whatsoever...

    You can have one thousand efreet make three ring-gates per day.

    ...Each.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    Four steps
    1) Look at the Stronghold Builder's Guidebook (including the landlord feat).
    2) Look up Spell Turrets in the DMGII.
    3) Look up the exact text of the "lyre of building".
    4) Laugh maniacally.


    Just combine Legendary Artisan, Merchantile Background, and your XP mitigating method of choice (and note the huge discounts that you can accumulate on a stronghold - 20% off everything is easy, 50% is possible if you do the whole job yourself on your own time-accelerated plane.)
    Last edited by Ragven; 2009-11-12 at 12:05 AM.

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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    ^: Oh, are you talking about the borg cube idea?

    Another great terror weapon/target for your enemies to try to break themselves upon so that they come out into the open where your forces can decimate them.

    Ooo, and so you have something to pummel the lower planes(and upper for that matter) into submission, you can create the Emerald Legion of unkillable shock troops to tear down the gates of hell and lay waste to the eternal battlefield, and even probably destroy a couple of layers of abyss. (ok, so it's actually for fun and for making your hordes increasingly varied)

    ...

    Hell, you know what you should do.

    Steal the Pact Primeval.

    Or just rewrite the damned thing such that it benefits you as ruler of the universe.

    Any other suitably universe shattering/rewriting ideas?
    Last edited by Coidzor; 2009-11-12 at 12:19 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Keld Denar View Post
    +3 Girlfriend is totally unoptimized. You are better off with a +1 Keen Witty girlfriend and then appling Greater Magic Make-up to increase her enhancement bonus.
    Homebrew
    To Do: Reboot and finish Riptide

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    Banned
     
    Lycanthromancer's Avatar

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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ragven View Post
    Four steps
    1) Look at the Stronghold Builder's Guidebook (including the landlord feat).
    2) Look up Spell Turrets in the DMGII.
    3) Look up the exact text of the "lyre of building".
    4) Laugh maniacally.


    Just combine Legendary Artisan, Merchantile Background, and your XP mitigating method of choice (and note the huge discounts that you can accumulate on a stronghold - 20% off everything is easy, 50% is possible if you do the whole job yourself on your own time-accelerated plane.)
    Wishes mean you don't have to spend anything.

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    Lycanthromancer's Avatar

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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    Resetting Extended shapechange traps? Might be useful in mass battles, when you want to send your simulacrum'd troops via dimension door through those ring-gates...

    Though now that I think about it, you can use your wishes to get scrolls of genesis, meaning you don't have to spend XP whatsoever. Oh, and you can wish for various magical traps, too, since they're considered items.

    ...Traps of genesis to constantly expand your demiplanes and create new ones?
    Last edited by Lycanthromancer; 2009-11-12 at 12:27 AM.

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    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lycanthromancer View Post
    ...Traps of genesis to constantly expand your demiplanes and create new ones?
    Everything else you have said was just RAWesome. This? This physically hurt me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Alabenson
    Evil Intelligence is knowing the precise ritual that will allow you to destroy the peaceful kingdom that banished you.

    Evil Wisdom is understanding that you probably shouldn’t perform said ritual while you’re standing in the estimated blast radius.

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    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    BlueKnightGuy

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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pharaoh's Fist View Post
    How come no one has recommended Leadership yet?
    Because Lycanthromancer owned the thread before anyone got a chance?

  29. - Top - End - #29

    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    Thankfully, there is an edit button so someone did recommend it before Lycanthropmancer.

  30. - Top - End - #30
    Colossus in the Playground
     
    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: [3.5] Rise of Emperor Tippy : How ?

    Establish hospitals consisting of remove disease and fort-save boosting traps and what have you using your free crafting via wish.

    Form some kind of education system, possibly, even. I'd do it by just mind-raping all of the educated citizenry that would mind you tramping on their turf by setting up the hospitals to take the healings stuff out of the hands of religion.

    ...Ooo! Become the God Emperor by forming a state religion by having prayer to you being the vocal activation key/reset mechanism for your tippyverse traps?

    Hmm. Needs more ability to propagandize this to weaken the support/loyalty of other sides' peoples.

    Maybe a 17th level diplomancer/bluff bard cohort would be good for that in some part...
    Last edited by Coidzor; 2009-11-12 at 01:21 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Keld Denar View Post
    +3 Girlfriend is totally unoptimized. You are better off with a +1 Keen Witty girlfriend and then appling Greater Magic Make-up to increase her enhancement bonus.
    Homebrew
    To Do: Reboot and finish Riptide

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