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Thread: Stats for running through glass?
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2009-11-26, 02:30 PM (ISO 8601)
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Stats for running through glass?
I plan to have an NPC leap through a window from the second level of an inn. Do any of you know where I could find rules for this? Or can you suggest a homebrew interpretation?
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2009-11-26, 02:34 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Stats for running through glass?
I'd say the glass on the ground counts as Caltrops, with a Ref save DC 15 to avoid damage for jumping through the window itself(10 points, piercing and slashing). It's simple and effective.
Or you can ignore it utterly, that works as well.[/sarcasm]
FAQ is not RAW!Avatar by the incredible CrimsonAngel.
Saph:It's surprising how many problems can be solved by one druid spell combined with enough aggression.
I play primarily 3.5 D&D. Most of my advice will be based off of this. If my advice doesn't apply, specify a version in your post.
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2009-11-26, 08:29 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Stats for running through glass?
So if a commoner jumps through a glass window, he dies? That's far stronger than being burned or having a vial of acid dumped over you.
I'd peg it at 1 or 2 points of piercing/slashing damage and call it a day. He might lose 5 feet of movement for the energy required to break the glass, or it might be negligible. Unless he's jumping exactly 30 feet that doesn't make a difference anyway.
In general you wanna improv such stuff rather than spending so much time on it. DM's have a tendency to go way overboard on DCs and damage because they use heroes (PCs) as a baseline rather than commoners like us. Just make up some minor effect or easy check (assuming success isn't so trivial you don't need to roll) and move the story on.Last edited by ericgrau; 2009-11-26 at 08:33 PM.
So you never have to interrupt a game to look up a rule again:
My 3.5e Rules Cheat Sheets: Normal, With Consolidated Skill System
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2009-11-26, 08:33 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Stats for running through glass?
[/sarcasm]
FAQ is not RAW!Avatar by the incredible CrimsonAngel.
Saph:It's surprising how many problems can be solved by one druid spell combined with enough aggression.
I play primarily 3.5 D&D. Most of my advice will be based off of this. If my advice doesn't apply, specify a version in your post.
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2009-11-26, 08:39 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Stats for running through glass?
Necks are tough. It normally takes a good sharp knife to cut one. I doubt glass will do much if anything.
Broken glass is more like a thousand papercuts:
(slammed into broken glass)
I can verify the random googled image as I've cleaned up broken glass before. They don't make windows out of razors. 1 or 2 HP is generous. Again, in most odd situations just improv a trivial effect or challenge and move on with the game. Heroes should not need extreme training to handle the common annoyances of you and I. Or if it's a commoner he at the very least should not die from such.
EDIT: One more example. Guy actually tries to slit his wrist on purpose with a fresh shard of glass and fails: http://www.sixthseal.com/2006/08/Last edited by ericgrau; 2009-11-26 at 08:48 PM.
So you never have to interrupt a game to look up a rule again:
My 3.5e Rules Cheat Sheets: Normal, With Consolidated Skill System
TOGC's 3.5e Spell/etc Cards: rpgnow / drivethru rpg
Utilities: Magic Item Shop Generator (Req. MS Excel), Balanced Low Magic Item System
Printable Cardstock Dungeon Tiles and other terrain stuff (100 MB)
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2009-11-26, 09:15 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Stats for running through glass?
Dungeonscape has hardness and break DC for glass. Otherwise, just use the breaking objects in the SRD.
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2009-11-26, 09:15 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Stats for running through glass?
Also medieval glass was generally a lot thicker and clunkier than more modern glass. It wouldn't have shattered into as many small, sharp pieces. 1d2 slashing damage at most (and even then you should get a reflex save at maybe DC 15 to avoid it all together), then counting as caltrops seems fair. I would also make it a DC 12 or so Strength check to break through the glass in the first place. It's not as easy as it looks.
Planetkiller avatar by The Randomizer
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2009-11-26, 09:39 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Stats for running through glass?
This is high fantasy, people.
The half orc barbarian can't dislocate his shoulder ramming the oak door.
Don't cut people when they shatter glass. At best, treat the ground outside as caltrops.
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2009-11-26, 09:51 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Stats for running through glass?
I'm with the people who say that Rule of Cool justifies no damage.
Now, he's on the second floor, so the Rule of Gravity (...well, really, impulse and momentum) has other ideas.
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2009-11-26, 10:00 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Stats for running through glass?
For anyone at 1st level, defenstration should be dangerous, possibly lethal. Anyone above 2nd? Not so much.
IRL, punching through glass can seriously injure you. Jumping through it? Ususally fatal. Hollywood uses stunt glass for this reason, which is made from sugar and designed to shatter into millions of harmless shards the size of a pea.
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2009-11-26, 10:00 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Stats for running through glass?
Glass shouldn't be treated as trivial to smash through. Window glass is designed to be able to handle high speed winds and rain driven by high speed winds.
I'd be tempted to calculate ease of breakage using a combination of movement speed (for the runup), weight (of character and items), armour (plate will punch through glass better than leather) and strength (for that last bit of impact).
A lot modern glass will bead when shattered but old fashioned glass is a lot more jagged. I'd made several attacks vs AC to see if it hits an exposed bit of flesh.
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2009-11-26, 10:03 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Stats for running through glass?
I'd say base damage 5 minus 1 for each point of AC that is not derived from dexterity of dodge bonuses. Kinda like Wall of Thorns
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2009-11-26, 10:10 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Stats for running through glass?
Why is that? Because in Rule of Cool, people jump through windows and make it fine. It's only when windows fall on people that it's dangerous. That's because Awesome and IRL don't always match.
Wizards tell the laws of physics to sit down and shut up. Give the swashbuckler his dramatic entrance. (or the Dashing Swordsman, in Elan's case)Last edited by PhoenixRivers; 2009-11-26 at 10:11 PM.
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2009-11-26, 10:19 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Stats for running through glass?
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2009-11-26, 10:28 PM (ISO 8601)
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2009-11-26, 10:28 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Stats for running through glass?
Well according to Mythbusters if you got slammed through a pane of glass, you wouldn't be getting back up. the lacerations would be really bad. Of course only if you talking about going all the way through. But depending on your style of Cinematics it could easily be seen that the Npc would only be scratched.
Oh and by the way hello Egiam, I'm in the tower game w/ you.HOW WOULD YOU LIKE TO TYPE LIKE THIS?
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2009-11-26, 10:55 PM (ISO 8601)
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2009-11-26, 11:34 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Stats for running through glass?
If a commoner lept through safety glass, they might get the minor lacerations, but anything earlier than a few decades ago would be very dangerous. Safety glass, as subtly hinted at in the name, is designed to be as harmless as it can be by shattering into lots of little rounded pieces. Older glass is thicker and more likely to form large sharp and jagged blades that, with the added momentum, will cut you quite badly. Commoners charging through any decently large piece would certainly be risking their lives.
That said, Rule of Awesome means you should imagine it as old glass and treat it as safety glass. Give'em a slap on the wrist for damage. Running through some with boots shouldn't do much if anything to hinder them - equal to caltrops at the most.
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2009-11-26, 11:50 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Stats for running through glass?
Personally, assuming it's pretty heavy glass, the worst I'd give would be a 1d4 in damage. And I'd probably waive that entirely if the guy was wearing medium or heavy armor. So it could be serious to a level 1 character, but to anyone else it's no more than a scratch.
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2009-11-27, 02:43 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Stats for running through glass?
Glass is hardness 1, 1 HP/inch of thickness. I'd say 2 points, save 15 for half, save 20 for none.
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2009-11-27, 03:52 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Stats for running through glass?
What Mark Hall said. Although I would make it hardness 2, and add +2 per inch. Glass is clear rock after all. For broken class hard soled boots negates penalties. sandles and soft shoes give a +2 to any movment checks to avoid damage. movment penalties as caltrops, add to difficulty depending on the amount of glass.
As for hitting things (deppending on size) adding a reflex save vs glass chips and splinters would be reasonable. What do you think would happen if you hit a glass golem with an axe?
I'm wondering if any one here has ever actualy went through a window or glass door? You have a high chance of getting cut, and cut badly. I've known several peaple that have done so. I've smashed my front door. The only reason I wasnt hurt was because I was wearing a levi jacket and pants.
Hollywood uses sugar glass. Any thing els would be dangerous to the actors and stunt men.
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2009-11-27, 05:27 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Stats for running through glass?
Mark quoted the RAW stats for glass. D&D "hardness" is really toughness/DR, so it makes sense even though scientifically glass is hard.
I don't doubt that shattered glass is painful, certainly enough for a 4 HP commoner to stop and scream for a doctor as he's covered in cuts. It's the "deadly" notion I'm skeptical about. Or even if it might be, as said it shouldn't be an issue past level 2.Last edited by ericgrau; 2009-11-27 at 05:29 AM.
So you never have to interrupt a game to look up a rule again:
My 3.5e Rules Cheat Sheets: Normal, With Consolidated Skill System
TOGC's 3.5e Spell/etc Cards: rpgnow / drivethru rpg
Utilities: Magic Item Shop Generator (Req. MS Excel), Balanced Low Magic Item System
Printable Cardstock Dungeon Tiles and other terrain stuff (100 MB)
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2009-11-27, 05:56 AM (ISO 8601)
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2009-11-27, 06:22 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Stats for running through glass?
Nothing serious happens.
Evgentually, if he's doing it without protection (no armor, no shield, not even a blanket to cover the arm and the face), give him one hp and be done with it.Do I contradict myself?
Very well then I contradict myself. I am large, I contain multitudes. (W.Whitman)
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2009-11-27, 10:38 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Stats for running through glass?
I've got a friend who ran through a double pane of glass in his home. He got cut, but not bad. That said, there's a lot of variation. With bad luck, you could end up hurt real bad, and if you're going through a scandinavian triple pane of glass, you're in trouble, if you get through at all. :)
The windows of yore were often set in lead, so you might not break through at all. Full sized window panes were rare, but always a single pane, so you won't have as many layers of glass to go through.
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2009-11-27, 10:47 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Stats for running through glass?
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2009-11-27, 02:46 PM (ISO 8601)
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2009-11-27, 02:53 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Stats for running through glass?
How about a standard action to "attack" the glass and (assuming you do enough damage to break it), you move through, just like any other material. That way, it slows the NPC down, is consistent with existing rules, doesn't require new rules, and adheres to the rule of cool. Seriously, if I'm jumping out of a second-story window, I'm much more concerned about the "second-story" part of that equation.
"We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be." Kurt Vonnegut
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2009-11-27, 02:58 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Stats for running through glass?
Sounds like a great hook for a character... He was a common man, until one day he ran through glass. He was unconscious, dying to the street, until he heard someone speak to him. After those words of wisdom, he stood up, fully recovered, and decided that he shall be an adventurer. And he always remembered those words.
"It's only a flesh wound!"A wise monk trains both mind and body, but a smart monk is actually a swordsage.