Silly questions about leadership

[AustontheGreat1]

Couple of silly questions about leadership and epic leadership.

1) do you get all the cohorts and followers. example; lets say I have a leadership score of 17, do i get a 12th level cohort, 30 1st level followers, 3 2nd level followers, 1 third level follower, and 1 4th level follower?

2) does leadership and epic leadership stack? as in if i have both do i get the maximum followers from leadership and the followers up to the amount my leadership score allows from epic leadership.

3) does legendary commander apply to epic leadership?

4) can legendary commander be taken more than once?

[Temotei]

Couple of silly questions about leadership and epic leadership.

1) do you get all the cohorts and followers. example; lets say I have a leadership score of 17, do i get a 12th level cohort, 30 1st level followers, 3 2nd level followers, 1 third level follower and 1 4th level follower?

2) does epic leadership and epic leadership, as in if i have both do i get the maximum followers from leadership and the followers up to the amount my leadership score allows from epic leadership.

3) does legendary commander apply to epic leadership?

[Xenogears]

Couple of silly questions about leadership and epic leadership.

1) do you get all the cohorts and followers. example; lets say I have a leadership score of 17, do i get a 12th level cohort, 30 1st level followers, 3 2nd level followers, 1 third level follower and 1 4th level follower?

2) does epic leadership and epic leadership, as in if i have both do i get the maximum followers from leadership and the followers up to the amount my leadership score allows from epic leadership.

3) does legendary commander apply to epic leadership?

4) can legendary commander be taken more than once?

1) yes you get all that (assuming your numbers are correct.
2) I believe Epic Leadership just continues the chart so youd only use that.
3) Yes
4) It doesn't say you can so you can't

[AustontheGreat1]

1) yes you get all that (assuming your numbers are correct.
2) I believe Epic Leadership just continues the chart so youd only use that.
3) Yes
4) It doesn't say you can so you can't

Thank you, Xenogears.

[InkEyes]

4) It doesn't say you can so you can't

The thing is, it doesn't say you can either. A rule of thumb with feats is that they'll tell you if they can be taken more than once and have cumulative bonuses. If Legendary Commander's effects were meant to stack, the designers would've ideally said so in the feat entry. Now, nothing is stopping someone from asking his or her DM about allowing this modification, except, you know... it's leadership and really doesn't need to be any more obscenely broken.

[Temotei]

The thing is, it doesn't say you can either. A rule of thumb with feats is that they'll tell you if they can be taken more than once and have cumulative bonuses. If Legendary Commander's effects were meant to stack, the designers would've ideally said so in the feat entry. Now, nothing is stopping someone from asking his or her DM about allowing this modification, except, you know... it's leadership and really doesn't need to be any more obscenely broken.

Read his post again.

[Yuki Akuma]

The thing is, it doesn't say you can either. A rule of thumb with feats is that they'll tell you if they can be taken more than once and have cumulative bonuses. If Legendary Commander's effects were meant to stack, the designers would've ideally said so in the feat entry. Now, nothing is stopping someone from asking his or her DM about allowing this modification, except, you know... it's leadership and really doesn't need to be any more obscenely broken.

That's exactly what he said. You agree with him.

[Sintanan]

Addendum to the O.P.'s questions:

5) Although a six-level follower is straight NPC class, could the follower take Leadership for their 6th-level feat to really get cheesy with Leadership? By RAW I can find nothing to counter this, but...

[Xenogears]

Addendum to the O.P.'s questions:

5) Although a six-level follower is straight NPC class, could the follower take Leadership for their 6th-level feat to really get cheesy with Leadership? By RAW I can find nothing to counter this, but...

Actually it says nothing about what classes the NPC followers can take. It also says nothing about who gets to stat them out. It is a very ill-defined feat.

[AustontheGreat1]

Actually it says nothing about what classes the NPC followers can take. It also says nothing about who gets to stat them out. It is a very ill-defined feat.

actually ELH p.36 says

OPTIONAL RULE: EXCEPTIONAL
FOLLOWERS
Though followers are normally warriors, experts, or
commoners, your DM might allow you to have characters
of other classes as followers. If you use this
optional rule, adept or aristocrat followers count as followers
of two levels higher than their actual character
level. A follower with any levels in a PC class counts as
a follower three levels higher than his character level.
A follower with any levels in a prestige class counts as a
follower five levels higher than his character level. This
reflects the fact that such characters are rarely followers
and are much more likely to be unique characters in
their own right.
For example, a 6th-level commoner, warrior, or
expert counts as a 6th-level follower. A 6th-level adept
or aristocrat would count as an 8th-level follower. A
6th-level fighter or 3rd-level aristocrat/3rd-level
wizard would count as an 9th-level follower. A 5thlevel
rogue/1st-level assassin would count as an 11thlevel
follower.

[Xenogears]

actually ELH p.36 says

........ damn they are schizophrenic on where they put stuff. Why couldn't they just put that info with the leadership feat? Well maybe it was in the DM's guide... I've only got the SRD to check. Technically the ELH is an optional book though so you could ignore that. Although why youd want o break the most broken feat is beyond me...

Still doesn't address wether you get to cherry pick your followers or not though.

[KillianHawkeye]

5) Although a six-level follower is straight NPC class, could the follower take Leadership for their 6th-level feat to really get cheesy with Leadership? By RAW I can find nothing to counter this, but...

Good luck finding a DM that will allow that.

[Sewblon]

Very insightful point, good sir.

[Kelb_Panthera]

I might allow a character with leadership to have a cohort or followers who also have leadership. I'd let the player know that he's founding an organization and that the more it grows the less time he'll have for adventuring, what with having to deal with logistics, politics, and all the other headaches that come with being the founder/leader of an organization.

Edit: to clarify, I'd probably have his character start to fall behind on WBL to make up for the fact that his brand new organization could end up generating quite a bit of power in the non-personal sense. Gotta spend money to run a business you know

[Stegyre]

actually ELH p.36 says

Add that to the list of obscure rules I didn't know. You just saved me from my efforts concocting houserules on how to deal with followers (so a PC does not "naturally" have a horde of psion followers).

[hamishspence]

Power of Faerun deals with Leadership in more detail-

being a military leader, religious leader, political leader, business leader, etc.

[Prime32]

actually ELH p.36 says

OPTIONAL RULE: EXCEPTIONAL
FOLLOWERS
Though followers are normally warriors, experts, or
commoners, your DM might allow you to have characters
of other classes as followers. If you use this
optional rule, adept or aristocrat followers count as followers
of two levels higher than their actual character
level. A follower with any levels in a PC class counts as
a follower three levels higher than his character level.
A follower with any levels in a prestige class counts as a
follower five levels higher than his character level. This
reflects the fact that such characters are rarely followers
and are much more likely to be unique characters in
their own right.
For example, a 6th-level commoner, warrior, or
expert counts as a 6th-level follower. A 6th-level adept
or aristocrat would count as an 8th-level follower. A
6th-level fighter or 3rd-level aristocrat/3rd-level
wizard would count as an 9th-level follower. A 5thlevel
rogue/1st-level assassin would count as an 11thlevel
follower.

What I don't understand is why that rule doesn't apply to cohorts as well. It's very possible for a character to have a cohort stronger than himself.

[tyckspoon]

What I don't understand is why that rule doesn't apply to cohorts as well. It's very possible for a character to have a cohort stronger than himself.

Because Cohorts are supposed to be near-equal adventuring partners. They wouldn't be particularly useful if they were stuck with extra level penalties in addition to never being able to climb higher than two levels below wherever you currently are. That 2-level gap alone should be quite sufficient to ensure a character's cohort is not more powerful than the character unless the character takes a cohort of a much higher tier than himself, like the Fighter who picks up a pocket Wizard. That's a flaw in the class design, not the Leadership rule.